The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

(On Campus Interviews, Summer Associate positions, Firm Reviews, Tips, ...)
Forum rules
Anonymous Posting

Anonymous posting is only appropriate when you are revealing sensitive employment related information about a firm, job, etc. You may anonymously respond on topic to these threads. Unacceptable uses include: harassing another user, joking around, testing the feature, or other things that are more appropriate in the lounge.

Failure to follow these rules will get you outed, warned, or banned.
Anonymous User
Posts: 273128
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Apr 29, 2013 2:20 pm

So I officially struck out today after waiting to hear back from the big law firm that I interviewed with over a month ago. Can't say I was really surprised. Anyways, hopefully things'll change after I take the bar. Good luck to those still waiting to hear back....my new advice to 0Ls considering law school: "abandon all hope ye who enter here." This place is worse than the inferno for those with big hopes and dreams.

Anonymous User
Posts: 273128
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Apr 29, 2013 10:37 pm

I don't know what employers want anymore. No matter what I do, I get challenged on lack of connection to a particular geography (i'm fucking single and have moved around the US, what the hell do I need a connection for at this age), my resume not showing a "demonstrated" interest in one field, and the botiques seem to punish me for not having worked in big law, yet want to hire new associates. The partners at this firm seem to go out of their way to make you admit that you struck out, and that's why you worked in govt. But then don't like that answer b/c not positive or showing initiative. Even having a current internship seems to be my detriment since it is different than what I may be applying for at the moment. Fucking partners are so out of touch w/ our generation that they are unaware of the current legal market, how much the legal practice has changed since their time, and seem to use this as an excuse to beat on applicants looking outside big law.

Anonymous User
Posts: 273128
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Apr 30, 2013 1:46 am

I don't know what to do. Kind of freaking the fuck out right now. I'm about to finish my law school exams and all I can think is, what if I fucked up and my grades go lower? Oh god. I don't have a job yet and I'm fucking done with law school. Fuck me.

On a side note, I can't pick what BAR exam to take. I signed up for one that a deadline was approaching and I'm considering just keeping that and going with it. It's not like I'm finding work in my current location. Might as well run.

rad lulz
Posts: 9844
Joined: Sun Feb 19, 2012 10:53 pm

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby rad lulz » Tue Apr 30, 2013 2:02 am

Anonymous User wrote:I don't know what to do. Kind of freaking the fuck out right now. I'm about to finish my law school exams and all I can think is, what if I fucked up and my grades go lower? Oh god. I don't have a job yet and I'm fucking done with law school. Fuck me.

On a side note, I can't pick what BAR exam to take. I signed up for one that a deadline was approaching and I'm considering just keeping that and going with it. It's not like I'm finding work in my current location. Might as well run.

On the plus side, unless you're a transfer, it's gonna be harder to change your GPA in any meaningful way unless you just PILED on the credits

Also I've found that small firms and local govt tend not to care about grades as much, so that's a plus

Anonymous User
Posts: 273128
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Apr 30, 2013 9:57 am

So I turned down a call back at a tiny ID firm in a tiny town (see no where near primary market), where I was pretty much told in the interview I would be paid extremely low, be expected to put in a ton of hours, and would not get to see the inside of a courtroom for at least two years (I'm interested in lit, thus courtroom experience is what interested me in the first place).

No other jerb prospects on the horizon though. I have excellent grades, top regional school, and work experience both before and during law school. Additionally I'm lucky enough to have no real debt to speak of (spent every cent I earned before and during law school/lived like a pauper last 3 years).

All the same, I'm starting to feel like that was a dumb proverbial "special flower" student move. I'm sure there are people piled around the block that would want an ID jerb no matter the location or situation.

Had someone tell me that "this is not just a job your starting, its your career." That advice is all well and good but it seems out of place in this Hunger Games market we live in.

Anonymous User
Posts: 273128
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Apr 30, 2013 11:12 am

Anonymous User wrote:So I turned down a call back at a tiny ID firm in a tiny town (see no where near primary market), where I was pretty much told in the interview I would be paid extremely low, be expected to put in a ton of hours, and would not get to see the inside of a courtroom for at least two years (I'm interested in lit, thus courtroom experience is what interested me in the first place).

No other jerb prospects on the horizon though. I have excellent grades, top regional school, and work experience both before and during law school. Additionally I'm lucky enough to have no real debt to speak of (spent every cent I earned before and during law school/lived like a pauper last 3 years).

All the same, I'm starting to feel like that was a dumb proverbial "special flower" student move. I'm sure there are people piled around the block that would want an ID jerb no matter the location or situation.

Had someone tell me that "this is not just a job your starting, its your career." That advice is all well and good but it seems out of place in this Hunger Games market we live in.


That could have been a good move. I had a friend who turned down a gig with a child welfare services state agency. A couple weeks later, he got an offer with the state AG in a general litigation bureau. Obviously turning down a job worked out for him.

rad lulz
Posts: 9844
Joined: Sun Feb 19, 2012 10:53 pm

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby rad lulz » Tue Apr 30, 2013 12:50 pm

,
Last edited by rad lulz on Thu Sep 22, 2016 7:33 am, edited 1 time in total.

Agent
Posts: 340
Joined: Thu Nov 24, 2011 2:03 pm

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Agent » Tue Apr 30, 2013 1:18 pm

^ +1.

User avatar
snowpeach06
Posts: 2426
Joined: Thu Apr 16, 2009 5:32 am

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby snowpeach06 » Tue Apr 30, 2013 1:36 pm

Anonymous User wrote:So I turned down a call back at a tiny ID firm in a tiny town (see no where near primary market), where I was pretty much told in the interview I would be paid extremely low, be expected to put in a ton of hours, and would not get to see the inside of a courtroom for at least two years (I'm interested in lit, thus courtroom experience is what interested me in the first place).

No other jerb prospects on the horizon though. I have excellent grades, top regional school, and work experience both before and during law school. Additionally I'm lucky enough to have no real debt to speak of (spent every cent I earned before and during law school/lived like a pauper last 3 years).

All the same, I'm starting to feel like that was a dumb proverbial "special flower" student move. I'm sure there are people piled around the block that would want an ID jerb no matter the location or situation.

Had someone tell me that "this is not just a job your starting, its your career." That advice is all well and good but it seems out of place in this Hunger Games market we live in.

I think it's easy to get off your chosen career path if your first job doesn't follow that path - you simply won't have the experience upper-level litigation jobs are looking for, and you'll have to convince someone to give you an entry-level litigation job when you should be in the middle of your career. If you are dedicated to litigation, it makes sense to look for all litigation jobs. Perhaps if you are a few months out of graduation and starving to death due to the lack of income, you can take whatever comes your way, but, for now, I would've done the same thing in your shoes.

FSCU25
Posts: 10
Joined: Wed Mar 27, 2013 8:55 am

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby FSCU25 » Tue Apr 30, 2013 6:55 pm

rad lulz wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:So I turned down a call back at a tiny ID firm in a tiny town (see no where near primary market), where I was pretty much told in the interview I would be paid extremely low, be expected to put in a ton of hours, and would not get to see the inside of a courtroom for at least two years (I'm interested in lit, thus courtroom experience is what interested me in the first place).

No other jerb prospects on the horizon though. I have excellent grades, top regional school, and work experience both before and during law school. Additionally I'm lucky enough to have no real debt to speak of (spent every cent I earned before and during law school/lived like a pauper last 3 years).

All the same, I'm starting to feel like that was a dumb proverbial "special flower" student move. I'm sure there are people piled around the block that would want an ID jerb no matter the location or situation.

Had someone tell me that "this is not just a job your starting, its your career." That advice is all well and good but it seems out of place in this Hunger Games market we live in.

Sounds like a shitmill dude. I would not say that's a bad call


How hard would it be to transfer from a good firm in a smaller market to a larger city? For example, if this was a good firm and he took the opportunity, how hard would it have been to lateral out after a couple years?

rad lulz
Posts: 9844
Joined: Sun Feb 19, 2012 10:53 pm

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby rad lulz » Tue Apr 30, 2013 7:31 pm

FSCU25 wrote:
rad lulz wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:So I turned down a call back at a tiny ID firm in a tiny town (see no where near primary market), where I was pretty much told in the interview I would be paid extremely low, be expected to put in a ton of hours, and would not get to see the inside of a courtroom for at least two years (I'm interested in lit, thus courtroom experience is what interested me in the first place).

No other jerb prospects on the horizon though. I have excellent grades, top regional school, and work experience both before and during law school. Additionally I'm lucky enough to have no real debt to speak of (spent every cent I earned before and during law school/lived like a pauper last 3 years).

All the same, I'm starting to feel like that was a dumb proverbial "special flower" student move. I'm sure there are people piled around the block that would want an ID jerb no matter the location or situation.

Had someone tell me that "this is not just a job your starting, its your career." That advice is all well and good but it seems out of place in this Hunger Games market we live in.

Sounds like a shitmill dude. I would not say that's a bad call


How hard would it be to transfer from a good firm in a smaller market to a larger city? For example, if this was a good firm and he took the opportunity, how hard would it have been to lateral out after a couple years?

A job at an ID mill with barely any trial experience?

That's not "good"

You're only qualified to work in other ID mills

FSCU25
Posts: 10
Joined: Wed Mar 27, 2013 8:55 am

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby FSCU25 » Tue Apr 30, 2013 7:47 pm

rad lulz wrote:
FSCU25 wrote:
rad lulz wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:So I turned down a call back at a tiny ID firm in a tiny town (see no where near primary market), where I was pretty much told in the interview I would be paid extremely low, be expected to put in a ton of hours, and would not get to see the inside of a courtroom for at least two years (I'm interested in lit, thus courtroom experience is what interested me in the first place).

No other jerb prospects on the horizon though. I have excellent grades, top regional school, and work experience both before and during law school. Additionally I'm lucky enough to have no real debt to speak of (spent every cent I earned before and during law school/lived like a pauper last 3 years).

All the same, I'm starting to feel like that was a dumb proverbial "special flower" student move. I'm sure there are people piled around the block that would want an ID jerb no matter the location or situation.

Had someone tell me that "this is not just a job your starting, its your career." That advice is all well and good but it seems out of place in this Hunger Games market we live in.

Sounds like a shitmill dude. I would not say that's a bad call


How hard would it be to transfer from a good firm in a smaller market to a larger city? For example, if this was a good firm and he took the opportunity, how hard would it have been to lateral out after a couple years?

A job at an ID mill with barely any trial experience?

That's not "good"

You're only qualified to work in other ID mills


I apologize I wasn't specific enough, how hard would it be to lateral from a good firm that would provide trial experience on valuable cases, but is not near a primary market, to a firm that does similar work in a primary market?

Anonymous User
Posts: 273128
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Wed May 01, 2013 3:08 am

Sincere question. Say I don't find a job by July after I take the BAR. I pretty much am funded to survive the summer through August thanks to savings and shit. So I need a job in august so I can make money to spend in September.

So say I don't find a job by July. And I decide to take whatever job I can (for example, store manager at an office depot...lol). How bad is that going to be for my career?

Anonymous User
Posts: 273128
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Wed May 01, 2013 7:39 am

Anonymous User wrote:Sincere question. Say I don't find a job by July after I take the BAR. I pretty much am funded to survive the summer through August thanks to savings and shit. So I need a job in august so I can make money to spend in September.

So say I don't find a job by July. And I decide to take whatever job I can (for example, store manager at an office depot...lol). How bad is that going to be for my career?

An Office Depot GM probably gets paid pretty well. I'd keep that position.

User avatar
2LsAPlenty
Posts: 156
Joined: Tue Feb 21, 2012 11:20 am

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby 2LsAPlenty » Wed May 01, 2013 8:49 am

One of my former bosses always said shit begets shit. Meaning once you start doing little crap work, it is very difficult to get out of it and move to something more meaningful or challenging.

User avatar
snowpeach06
Posts: 2426
Joined: Thu Apr 16, 2009 5:32 am

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby snowpeach06 » Wed May 01, 2013 8:49 am

Anonymous User wrote:Sincere question. Say I don't find a job by July after I take the BAR. I pretty much am funded to survive the summer through August thanks to savings and shit. So I need a job in august so I can make money to spend in September.

So say I don't find a job by July. And I decide to take whatever job I can (for example, store manager at an office depot...lol). How bad is that going to be for my career?

Just don't list it on your resume. It shouldn't further nor hinder your career. It'll be just like being unemployed (although I'm sure that doesn't look great).

Also, I keep freaking out about this one Fellowship I applied to. It required three confidential letters of rec (how obnoxious is that?), and my boss said "No problem, I'll mail it tomorrow" when I e-mailed him about it. And I just keep thinking that he forgot to mail it - but, I got preoccupied with finals and forgot to check in on it, and now it is well past the deadline. Other than this letter not getting in, I think I had a good shot at this job. It's fairly tailored to my career goals and the application was so complicated, I doubt too many people applied.

Anonymous User
Posts: 273128
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Fri May 03, 2013 10:24 am

Honestly, honestly. How has THIS not been posted up until now?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GFKMEvsARzw

Perfectly sums up how I feel when people tell me how excited I must be about graduating from law school (just outside of the top 10% from the best regional school in the market whilst still jerbless mind you).

Yes, my future is so bright I and those around me are obligated to wear shades.

Pictured: CSO, faculty, members of legal profession unwilling to help
Image

Pictured: My career prospects
Image

Olive83
Posts: 15
Joined: Sun Apr 28, 2013 10:46 am

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Olive83 » Sat May 04, 2013 12:28 am

I've been following this thread for a while. Last year, I should have been writing on this thread too (had I known of it then).

I'm sure that there have been a handful of posts like this, but if you're still a 3L now - keep trucking. I was top 1/3 from a T25 with Law Review and thought I'd be fine, but then I had no job at graduation, despite hustling like a mad woman.

I moved to the city in which I would take the bar (with my husband, who had a job in that city), and I started networking. And I met a lot of attorneys I clicked with, but nothing worked out. And then I took the bar. And still nothing. August, September, October... all crept by. I felt like a loser. I would randomly panic. I got really close to taking doc review work. And then, in November, an attorney I had spoken with before I took the bar called me. And she remembered me from just meeting and chatting over the summer, and she had recently lost an associate, and had a need to fill. I love the work (litigation, and I get to go to court a lot), the money is really good (not big law good, but I'm really happy with it), I enjoy my coworkers.

I'm coming on six months now, and it's hard to think about how fucked up, depressed and upset I felt just six months ago. So, I want to share my random, wayward success story and say, you never know what will happen and something will eventually work out, no matter how shitty you feel about it now.

(Also, as a side note, my husband started in mid law, and moved to big law within the first six months of his work. So where you start is not always where you are doomed to remain. I.e., if you do have something but you're unhappy with it, know that it's possible out there to move on more quickly than you might think.)

Anyways, sorry if this was cheesy, but I remember having all of the same thoughts and worries and questions, etc. that everyone on this thread seems to have, and something eventually worked out for me, and it will for you too.

rad lulz
Posts: 9844
Joined: Sun Feb 19, 2012 10:53 pm

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby rad lulz » Sat May 04, 2013 12:45 am

Olive83 wrote:I've been following this thread for a while. Last year, I should have been writing on this thread too (had I known of it then).

I'm sure that there have been a handful of posts like this, but if you're still a 3L now - keep trucking. I was top 1/3 from a T25 with Law Review and thought I'd be fine, but then I had no job at graduation, despite hustling like a mad woman.

I moved to the city in which I would take the bar (with my husband, who had a job in that city), and I started networking. And I met a lot of attorneys I clicked with, but nothing worked out. And then I took the bar. And still nothing. August, September, October... all crept by. I felt like a loser. I would randomly panic. I got really close to taking doc review work. And then, in November, an attorney I had spoken with before I took the bar called me. And she remembered me from just meeting and chatting over the summer, and she had recently lost an associate, and had a need to fill. I love the work (litigation, and I get to go to court a lot), the money is really good (not big law good, but I'm really happy with it), I enjoy my coworkers.

I'm coming on six months now, and it's hard to think about how fucked up, depressed and upset I felt just six months ago. So, I want to share my random, wayward success story and say, you never know what will happen and something will eventually work out, no matter how shitty you feel about it now.

(Also, as a side note, my husband started in mid law, and moved to big law within the first six months of his work. So where you start is not always where you are doomed to remain. I.e., if you do have something but you're unhappy with it, know that it's possible out there to move on more quickly than you might think.)

Anyways, sorry if this was cheesy, but I remember having all of the same thoughts and worries and questions, etc. that everyone on this thread seems to have, and something eventually worked out for me, and it will for you too.

More success stories is always better.

Really appreciate you sharing

User avatar
TTH
Posts: 10378
Joined: Mon May 04, 2009 1:14 am

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby TTH » Mon May 06, 2013 12:49 am

Graduating this week. Anyone else dreading the dozens of "So what's next?" conversations you'll have to have this month?

User avatar
kalvano
Posts: 11720
Joined: Mon Sep 07, 2009 2:24 am

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby kalvano » Mon May 06, 2013 2:36 am

Just say "bar study" and leave it at that.

Anonymous User
Posts: 273128
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Mon May 06, 2013 12:45 pm

Big luls firm said they'd let me know about an interview sometime this week. She remembered my name, which was nice, so I'm hoping that they don't send a lol thanks but no thanks letter my way. Lack of positive news on that front is making me jittery.

User avatar
Bikeflip
Posts: 1833
Joined: Fri Jul 11, 2008 3:01 pm

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Bikeflip » Mon May 06, 2013 2:38 pm

rad lulz wrote:
Olive83 wrote:I've been following this thread for a while. Last year, I should have been writing on this thread too (had I known of it then).

I'm sure that there have been a handful of posts like this, but if you're still a 3L now - keep trucking. I was top 1/3 from a T25 with Law Review and thought I'd be fine, but then I had no job at graduation, despite hustling like a mad woman.

I moved to the city in which I would take the bar (with my husband, who had a job in that city), and I started networking. And I met a lot of attorneys I clicked with, but nothing worked out. And then I took the bar. And still nothing. August, September, October... all crept by. I felt like a loser. I would randomly panic. I got really close to taking doc review work. And then, in November, an attorney I had spoken with before I took the bar called me. And she remembered me from just meeting and chatting over the summer, and she had recently lost an associate, and had a need to fill. I love the work (litigation, and I get to go to court a lot), the money is really good (not big law good, but I'm really happy with it), I enjoy my coworkers.

I'm coming on six months now, and it's hard to think about how fucked up, depressed and upset I felt just six months ago. So, I want to share my random, wayward success story and say, you never know what will happen and something will eventually work out, no matter how shitty you feel about it now.

(Also, as a side note, my husband started in mid law, and moved to big law within the first six months of his work. So where you start is not always where you are doomed to remain. I.e., if you do have something but you're unhappy with it, know that it's possible out there to move on more quickly than you might think.)

Anyways, sorry if this was cheesy, but I remember having all of the same thoughts and worries and questions, etc. that everyone on this thread seems to have, and something eventually worked out for me, and it will for you too.

More success stories is always better.

Really appreciate you sharing



Agreed. Thanks for the share.

TTH wrote:Graduating this week. Anyone else dreading the dozens of "So what's next?" conversations you'll have to have this month?


In addition to what Kalvano said, I've told people "bar prep and shaking hands." People seem to like it when you say bullshit like "networking," and they may help you out. I actually had my aunt get me in touch with a person hiring attys that way. Didn't get a jerb, but a lead is a lead.

What sucks is that you can't show your depression/disappointment/frustration, as no one likes helping out people who appear depressed/disappointed/frustrated. Chin up. You'll get through it. Just refine that fake smile and poker face.

Anonymous User
Posts: 273128
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Mon May 06, 2013 5:23 pm

Also graduating in a week.

Has anyone else found their law degree to analogous to THIS?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/04/30/henry-gribbohm-carnival-loses-savings-wins-banana_n_3184954.html

Anonymous User
Posts: 273128
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Mon May 06, 2013 5:44 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Also graduating in a week.

Has anyone else found their law degree to analogous to THIS?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/04/30/henry-gribbohm-carnival-loses-savings-wins-banana_n_3184954.html


That would require law school to be "Tubs of Fun," no?




Return to “Legal Employment”

Who is online

The online users are hidden on this forum.