The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

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zot1
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby zot1 » Wed Nov 02, 2016 10:07 pm

PotLuck wrote:Fwiw, I currently clerk with them part time while I am job hunting. They are looking to fill the position with a JD (if possible) and basically would want me to do the same type of work I'm doing now, in addition to the paralegal duties. Going from paralegal to attorney at this agency is basically impossible. It might be too early for this, but it's that fear of missing out when the market seems so sparse that has me worried.


Clerk as in for free or getting paid? I forgot to mention that as a brand new employee, you don't immediately have leave. Instead, you have to accrue it. So if you're gonna go to interviews and such, you might be restricted.

Do you see yourself doing what you're doing now plus assistant work for about a year? Two?

Honestly only you can answer the question of what's best for you. This is precisely why I didn't apply to jobs I knew I didn't want to do. I never wanted to be in a position of taking a job just because it was the only thing available. But really, this is a vey personal decision. Many people find jobs within a year of graduation. Many don't and you see them hanging out here. There's no way of telling who you'll be.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby PotLuck » Thu Nov 03, 2016 4:15 pm

edit, duplicate posts
Last edited by PotLuck on Thu Nov 03, 2016 4:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby PotLuck » Thu Nov 03, 2016 4:16 pm

I am paid, but it is part time. Basically I see me doing what I do now with the added assistant type work. I'm still on the fence. I mean I really love the job I do, but I understand that I am probably considering too much of what is going on in the present. I'm not sure this job would help me in the long run.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Nov 03, 2016 7:09 pm

Just got dinged from a firm I had a second interview with. Honestly, I feel like garbage right now. Scouring every online site I can for jobs in my area. I don't even care what field it's in anymore. I just want an attorney job that pays at least 45k in my area.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby zot1 » Thu Nov 03, 2016 9:48 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Just got dinged from a firm I had a second interview with. Honestly, I feel like garbage right now. Scouring every online site I can for jobs in my area. I don't even care what field it's in anymore. I just want an attorney job that pays at least 45k in my area.


No point in losing hope right now. Be disappointed, sure, but this is in no way a reflection of your worth. Legal hiring is often arbitrary AF and sometimes we end up on the wrong side of the coin. Just keep sending apps, maintain a positive attitude, and try as best you can to enjoy the free time you have.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Nov 04, 2016 10:21 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Just got dinged from a firm I had a second interview with. Honestly, I feel like garbage right now. Scouring every online site I can for jobs in my area. I don't even care what field it's in anymore. I just want an attorney job that pays at least 45k in my area.

I'm with you there man. This sucks so much ass right now. My classmates are all studying abroad or doing bs externships instead of going to class or not giving a shit in general. I feel like I'm the only one without an offer. I got dinged by a firm today after making it to the final rounds. I couldn't stomach it and I just went home to gather my thoughts to apply to other ones. I still haven't been dinged (yet) from my #1, so there's that...

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Nov 07, 2016 4:43 pm

3L. No offer. Top 25% grades, Law Review (committee position as well), president of a new student organization, legal experience throughout law school (none of them hire out of law school, unfortunately). Stuck without a paddle and losing sleep every night.

I am honestly considering joining the army at this point lol. No, not JAG, I mean front-line infantry.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Nov 07, 2016 6:31 pm

Anonymous User wrote:3L. No offer. Top 25% grades, Law Review (committee position as well), president of a new student organization, legal experience throughout law school (none of them hire out of law school, unfortunately). Stuck without a paddle and losing sleep every night.

I am honestly considering joining the army at this point lol. No, not JAG, I mean front-line infantry.


Comrade, that's probably not the worst idea. Benefits are good and the pay probably beats most midlaw firms......and you can do something that's cool.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Nov 07, 2016 6:44 pm

Anonymous User wrote:3L. No offer. Top 25% grades, Law Review (committee position as well), president of a new student organization, legal experience throughout law school (none of them hire out of law school, unfortunately). Stuck without a paddle and losing sleep every night.

I am honestly considering joining the army at this point lol. No, not JAG, I mean front-line infantry.


It's waaaaaaaaaay early to hit this level of despondency. I get it. I do. I got no-offered and it sucks balls. Everything about it is terrible, from talking to classmates with offers lined up to explaining to potential employers why you're looking for a job. It's awful.

That being said, all is not lost, and its a little early to be joining the army. Suck it up, mass-mail, network, and keep at it. I have a great job now (waaay better than the firm that no-offered me), and I didn't even meet anyone from this firm until Christmas break of 3L. That didn't turn into an interview until July. Looking back, as fucked up as it sounds, I am grateful to my former employer for putting me in that position because otherwise I never would have ended up here.

If you pass the bar and 6 months after graduation you're still fucked, then maybe it's time to take a look at the army, but you're not there yet.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Nov 07, 2016 6:46 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:3L. No offer. Top 25% grades, Law Review (committee position as well), president of a new student organization, legal experience throughout law school (none of them hire out of law school, unfortunately). Stuck without a paddle and losing sleep every night.

I am honestly considering joining the army at this point lol. No, not JAG, I mean front-line infantry.


Comrade, that's probably not the worst idea. Benefits are good and the pay probably beats most midlaw firms......and you can do something that's cool.


Sorry, that was me, accidental anonymous.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby zot1 » Mon Nov 07, 2016 9:01 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:3L. No offer. Top 25% grades, Law Review (committee position as well), president of a new student organization, legal experience throughout law school (none of them hire out of law school, unfortunately). Stuck without a paddle and losing sleep every night.

I am honestly considering joining the army at this point lol. No, not JAG, I mean front-line infantry.


Comrade, that's probably not the worst idea. Benefits are good and the pay probably beats most midlaw firms......and you can do something that's cool.


A lot of military jobs are menial.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Nov 07, 2016 11:59 pm

zot1 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:3L. No offer. Top 25% grades, Law Review (committee position as well), president of a new student organization, legal experience throughout law school (none of them hire out of law school, unfortunately). Stuck without a paddle and losing sleep every night.

I am honestly considering joining the army at this point lol. No, not JAG, I mean front-line infantry.


Comrade, that's probably not the worst idea. Benefits are good and the pay probably beats most midlaw firms......and you can do something that's cool.


A lot of military jobs are menial.


But the Infantry isn't one of them....

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby zot1 » Tue Nov 08, 2016 12:03 am

Anonymous User wrote:
zot1 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:3L. No offer. Top 25% grades, Law Review (committee position as well), president of a new student organization, legal experience throughout law school (none of them hire out of law school, unfortunately). Stuck without a paddle and losing sleep every night.

I am honestly considering joining the army at this point lol. No, not JAG, I mean front-line infantry.


Comrade, that's probably not the worst idea. Benefits are good and the pay probably beats most midlaw firms......and you can do something that's cool.


A lot of military jobs are menial.


But the Infantry isn't one of them....


Sure, but my understanding is that you don't always get the job you want. More needs of the military, if you know what I mean.

Even if you were to get what you wanted, with modern warfare, there's no true front line per se, but a lot of pointless convoys with sand everywhere in you, and getting blown up by IEDs.

I guess if that sounds fun to people then that's cool. I'm more of biking and hiking on the weekends kind of person.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Nov 08, 2016 12:08 am

zot1 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
zot1 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:3L. No offer. Top 25% grades, Law Review (committee position as well), president of a new student organization, legal experience throughout law school (none of them hire out of law school, unfortunately). Stuck without a paddle and losing sleep every night.

I am honestly considering joining the army at this point lol. No, not JAG, I mean front-line infantry.


Comrade, that's probably not the worst idea. Benefits are good and the pay probably beats most midlaw firms......and you can do something that's cool.


A lot of military jobs are menial.


I mean, you can get your occupational specialty in your contract.

But the Infantry isn't one of them....


Sure, but my understanding is that you don't always get the job you want. More needs of the military, if you know what I mean.

Even if you were to get what you wanted, with modern warfare, there's no true front line per se, but a lot of pointless convoys with sand everywhere in you, and getting blown up by IEDs.

I guess if that sounds fun to people then that's cool. I'm more of biking and hiking on the weekends kind of person.



There's never really been a "front line" that's a myth. But you can get your occupational specialty in your contract. And IEDs do suck, but it's not dull. But I'm not sure dudes are even driving around getting blown up anymore either

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby zot1 » Tue Nov 08, 2016 12:13 am

Anonymous User wrote:
zot1 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
zot1 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:3L. No offer. Top 25% grades, Law Review (committee position as well), president of a new student organization, legal experience throughout law school (none of them hire out of law school, unfortunately). Stuck without a paddle and losing sleep every night.

I am honestly considering joining the army at this point lol. No, not JAG, I mean front-line infantry.


Comrade, that's probably not the worst idea. Benefits are good and the pay probably beats most midlaw firms......and you can do something that's cool.


A lot of military jobs are menial.


I mean, you can get your occupational specialty in your contract.

But the Infantry isn't one of them....


Sure, but my understanding is that you don't always get the job you want. More needs of the military, if you know what I mean.

Even if you were to get what you wanted, with modern warfare, there's no true front line per se, but a lot of pointless convoys with sand everywhere in you, and getting blown up by IEDs.

I guess if that sounds fun to people then that's cool. I'm more of biking and hiking on the weekends kind of person.



There's never really been a "front line" that's a myth. But you can get your occupational specialty in your contract. And IEDs do suck, but it's not dull. But I'm not sure dudes are even driving around getting blown up anymore either


If there isn't an active war then what would they be doing? My buddy who was deployed a year ago was literally guarding prisoners. He said it was awful and got out as soon as he could after he came back. Said he'd rather die than go back to Afghanistan.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Nov 08, 2016 12:37 am

zot1 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
zot1 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
zot1 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:3L. No offer. Top 25% grades, Law Review (committee position as well), president of a new student organization, legal experience throughout law school (none of them hire out of law school, unfortunately). Stuck without a paddle and losing sleep every night.

I am honestly considering joining the army at this point lol. No, not JAG, I mean front-line infantry.


Comrade, that's probably not the worst idea. Benefits are good and the pay probably beats most midlaw firms......and you can do something that's cool.


A lot of military jobs are menial.


Sounds terrible. I bounced around Africa and Europe and parts of Central Asia doing random stuff (after a bunch of deployments and stuff)

I mean, you can get your occupational specialty in your contract.

But the Infantry isn't one of them....


Sure, but my understanding is that you don't always get the job you want. More needs of the military, if you know what I mean.

Even if you were to get what you wanted, with modern warfare, there's no true front line per se, but a lot of pointless convoys with sand everywhere in you, and getting blown up by IEDs.

I guess if that sounds fun to people then that's cool. I'm more of biking and hiking on the weekends kind of person.



There's never really been a "front line" that's a myth. But you can get your occupational specialty in your contract. And IEDs do suck, but it's not dull. But I'm not sure dudes are even driving around getting blown up anymore either


If there isn't an active war then what would they be doing? My buddy who was deployed a year ago was literally guarding prisoners. He said it was awful and got out as soon as he could after he came back. Said he'd rather die than go back to Afghanistan.


Sounds terrible, I did a bunch of deployments and then bounced around various places in the developing world doing random things. I had dudes I worked with that visited almost 30 countries in their four-year enlistments and got out with cash in the bank and free college/masters/law school wherever they wanted to go.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby zot1 » Tue Nov 08, 2016 9:27 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Sounds terrible, I did a bunch of deployments and then bounced around various places in the developing world doing random things. I had dudes I worked with that visited almost 30 countries in their four-year enlistments and got out with cash in the bank and free college/masters/law school wherever they wanted to go.


That's definitely true. Three people in my class were vets and got law school for free. Which makes sense when you consider how disabled they were from their service.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Nov 08, 2016 2:10 pm

zot1 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Sounds terrible, I did a bunch of deployments and then bounced around various places in the developing world doing random things. I had dudes I worked with that visited almost 30 countries in their four-year enlistments and got out with cash in the bank and free college/masters/law school wherever they wanted to go.


That's definitely true. Three people in my class were vets and got law school for free. Which makes sense when you consider how disabled they were from their service.


Not a likely outcome......but a possible one. But the "sand everywhere pointless convoy" stuff is more like a mass-typification of deployment experiences.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Nov 09, 2016 11:44 am

New BYU Job Bank password is cougs16

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Nov 13, 2016 6:11 pm

Fair warning to those in the veil: Don't always take your first offer for a job. I was in the veil of tears for ~ 9 months and interviewed with a shitlaw firm. During the interview, I got a sense of the two partner's personality and a great big red-flag when the male partner asked how old I was. I knew what I was getting in to, but the veil masked that and I took the offer despite knowing better. Its been three months and I'm not happy. While I'm grateful I have a job, I am not particularly fond of the work environment. Its a small firm that has had multiple associates quit after a couple months. It's borderline toxic and certainly not the traditional asshole partner deal. I can't see myself lasting more than a few more months. I'm trying to tough it out to gain experience, but FML.

Be careful. Sometimes it is better to wait for a better option.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Nov 15, 2016 2:08 pm

A firm (mid-law) I really want to work out reached out to me asking for times to interview - I e-mailed them back with some times that fit my schedule, and they never got back to me. Its been three days - it feels pretty weird. Should I reach out to them or follow-up? Has anyone been in this situation before? I'm worried they don't want to interview me anymore :(

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Nov 15, 2016 3:54 pm

Anonymous User wrote:A firm (mid-law) I really want to work out reached out to me asking for times to interview - I e-mailed them back with some times that fit my schedule, and they never got back to me. Its been three days - it feels pretty weird. Should I reach out to them or follow-up? Has anyone been in this situation before? I'm worried they don't want to interview me anymore :(


I have been in that situation many times and 3 days is nothing. If 2 weeks go by, then maybe consider reaching out to them again. Just sit back, they haven't forgot about you. It's entirely possible that the group got really busy or hiring is just not a priority at the moment. One firm I interviewed with took a month to get back to me after I gave them my availability. I had another firm that sent me my interview schedule the night before the interview (this was an outlier, though. Also, a very strange and disorganized firm).

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Nov 15, 2016 4:19 pm

^ Thanks - I appreciate your reply.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby rinkrat19 » Wed Nov 16, 2016 6:55 pm

I am about 80% sure I'm going to take the job I was referring to in the Ask TLS thread the other day. I have until tomorrow morning to let them know.

It's about a 5.5 hour drive (in good weather) into eastern Oregon (not the county where the Malheur Refuge occupation happened. Even smaller.) The town is about 1750 people, the county is under 8000. Beautiful country, mostly owned by BLM and NFS. 3 hours to the nearest Costco and small commercial airport; 3.5 hours to the nearest actual city (Boise). No movie theater in the county. (I have confirmed the availability of passable DSL service in town.)

The job is good. It's a VAWA grant-funded DDA position that prosecutes all domestic violence, sex abuse, child abuse, and child dependency in the county. Felonies basically immediately. Just me and the DA and 4 staff. Duties include community and law enforcement education and outreach on DV/abuse topics. In charge of applying to get the VAWA grant renewed at some point (currently in the middle of a 3-year grant). One police officer is partially funded by the grant, so 1/4 of his time is required to be at my disposal (in addition to whatever arises in the usual course of things).

I've interviewed with a bunch of other counties in the state and gotten no love for DDA jobs, even at Multnomah (Portland) where I worked for a year on a fellowship, because I didn't have enough experience. Got no response at all for the State DOJ jobs I applied for. I feel like this is too good of a job to turn down, even if it means living in the absolute middle of fucking nowhere for 18 months before I can consider leaving.

I literally feel sick to my stomach when I think about moving out there and being so far from everything. I can't play hockey there, and snowboarding will be limited to a few weekends at home or in Bend. I have a (mostly) irrational fear that Rinkdad is going to have a health crisis and die before I can get to him. It's DEEP Trumpkin country, with a crazy anti-Fed sheriff.

Convince me I can survive it, TLS! Pump me up to make the call to the DA to accept!

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby zot1 » Wed Nov 16, 2016 7:03 pm

Dude. You can so freaking do this. Time flies. It'll go by before you know it. And then you'll have this weird experience to talk about at dinner parties. And since you have nothing to do, you will essentially save money like crazy. You got this!




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