The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Apr 22, 2016 8:25 pm

zot1 wrote:
TooManyLoans wrote:
zot1 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Feeling lost right now. I had a job and a life I really enjoyed but lost my job due to medical reasons (former JAG and we can be discharged for medical things a civilian would never lose a job over). My disability is service-connected, so I have veterans' preference for federal government positions, but I don't know how much that helps since most attorney positions only consider it a "positive factor" and don't give a straight 10 points.

Been applying to only fed gov jobs since I don't know about returning to the state where I am licensed. Could go back but I might be better off living in a state closer to family due to my health issues. It's probably not a good idea to apply only to fed gov jobs since it is competitive and also the process is so slow, but I don't know where else I should apply.


I'm so very sorry to hear that. I think someone may have given you misinformation. You will get preference--this is statutory, not something just some agencies can follow.

Keep applying and if possible, consider getting licensed in a more desirable state.

If you need to vent, feel free to PM me. Good luck!


Agencies have to follow it to the extent feasible when hiring attorneys. Attorneys are excepted service so there aren't formal requirements like competitive service. In essence vet preference is just a positive factor for attorney hiring.


https://www.fedshirevets.gov/job/vetpref/


Anon from above. Thanks for your posts. Excepted service positions have to follow the point system unless exempt. Attorney positions are specifically exempt from having to use the point system and are only required to view vet preference as a positive factor. https://www.opm.gov/policy-data-oversig ... vet-guide/

Anyhow, I will just keep applying, and hopefully, something will stick.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Apr 24, 2016 11:18 am

I am a 3L and had final round interviews at a big law firm SEVEN weeks ago. I met with partners and a few associates and the interview seemed to go very well. They all had great things to say about my resume and experience and I felt that we connected pretty well. I sent Thank You notes to all of them and also the recruiter. It has been 7 weeks since and I have sent a follow-up email to the recruiter and also left her a phone message (spaced out between the 7 weeks) asking about the status of my application and also offering to answer any questions they may have. They haven't asked for my transcript or anything else. I haven't gotten a ding letter. I haven't heard from the recruiter at all. Should I just consider this a ding? Typically, how long can it take to hear back from firms about an associate position after the interview? We're not on an OCI timeline so I heard it could take longer than normal...but this seems much longer than normal.

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baal hadad
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby baal hadad » Sun Apr 24, 2016 12:31 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I am a 3L and had final round interviews at a big law firm SEVEN weeks ago. I met with partners and a few associates and the interview seemed to go very well. They all had great things to say about my resume and experience and I felt that we connected pretty well. I sent Thank You notes to all of them and also the recruiter. It has been 7 weeks since and I have sent a follow-up email to the recruiter and also left her a phone message (spaced out between the 7 weeks) asking about the status of my application and also offering to answer any questions they may have. They haven't asked for my transcript or anything else. I haven't gotten a ding letter. I haven't heard from the recruiter at all. Should I just consider this a ding? Typically, how long can it take to hear back from firms about an associate position after the interview? We're not on an OCI timeline so I heard it could take longer than normal...but this seems much longer than normal.

keep following up at regular intervals but keep on interviewing of course. not a ding til its a ding

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Apr 25, 2016 11:38 am

Possibly stupid question, but no point in applying to IMMEDIATE OPENINGS when I'm not even sitting for the bar until July. I mean, they are gonna get plenty of applications from attorneys.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby zot1 » Mon Apr 25, 2016 11:49 am

Anonymous User wrote:Possibly stupid question, but no point in applying to IMMEDIATE OPENINGS when I'm not even sitting for the bar until July. I mean, they are gonna get plenty of applications from attorneys.


If a firm, yes, apply. If they like your credentials, they may be willing to hire you anyway.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Apr 25, 2016 12:07 pm

zot1 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Possibly stupid question, but no point in applying to IMMEDIATE OPENINGS when I'm not even sitting for the bar until July. I mean, they are gonna get plenty of applications from attorneys.


If a firm, yes, apply. If they like your credentials, they may be willing to hire you anyway.


Alright thanks.

Follow-up, if a posting doesn't ask for a cover letter specifically, and is by e-mail, do you just put a short cover letter in the body of the e-mail?

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby zot1 » Mon Apr 25, 2016 1:53 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
zot1 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Possibly stupid question, but no point in applying to IMMEDIATE OPENINGS when I'm not even sitting for the bar until July. I mean, they are gonna get plenty of applications from attorneys.


If a firm, yes, apply. If they like your credentials, they may be willing to hire you anyway.


Alright thanks.

Follow-up, if a posting doesn't ask for a cover letter specifically, and is by e-mail, do you just put a short cover letter in the body of the e-mail?


That's what I would do but really keep it short--only important stuff.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Easy-E » Mon Apr 25, 2016 1:58 pm

I'm putting together a list of references for a very late clerkship opening, and I've got the usual stuff (judge I interned for, former supervisor, clinic supervisor, all with permission). It's a family law judge, and I was considering including an attorney who was opposing counsel on a divorce I worked in the clinic (with permission). Is that crazy? We had a good relationship, probably one of the more amicable divorces (not much to fight about), she said some very nice things to be at the end of the matter, Considering its a family law judge, I thought this might be a good reference. Or is this just stupid?

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Apr 25, 2016 1:59 pm

zot1 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
zot1 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Possibly stupid question, but no point in applying to IMMEDIATE OPENINGS when I'm not even sitting for the bar until July. I mean, they are gonna get plenty of applications from attorneys.


If a firm, yes, apply. If they like your credentials, they may be willing to hire you anyway.


Alright thanks.

Follow-up, if a posting doesn't ask for a cover letter specifically, and is by e-mail, do you just put a short cover letter in the body of the e-mail?


That's what I would do but really keep it short--only important stuff.


Yeah, I've been keeping it super basic. Who I am, what I'm applying for, when I sit for the bar and where, documents enclosed, thanks for your time etc.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Apr 25, 2016 2:31 pm

Got excited when I saw that an employer had viewed my LinkedIn profile, less excited when I saw it was three weeks ago and haven't heard a thing. :cry:

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baal hadad
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby baal hadad » Wed Apr 27, 2016 12:17 pm

Easy-E wrote:I'm putting together a list of references for a very late clerkship opening, and I've got the usual stuff (judge I interned for, former supervisor, clinic supervisor, all with permission). It's a family law judge, and I was considering including an attorney who was opposing counsel on a divorce I worked in the clinic (with permission). Is that crazy? We had a good relationship, probably one of the more amicable divorces (not much to fight about), she said some very nice things to be at the end of the matter, Considering its a family law judge, I thought this might be a good reference. Or is this just stupid?

Sure why not

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby BVest » Wed Apr 27, 2016 4:34 pm

In case there's anyone here with clerkship-ish numbers, here's my cross-post from the clerkship forum:

Bumping to say that Judge Barbara Lynn (ND Tex) in Dallas just got named chief, so she gets an extra clerk. She's hiring ASAP for the 2016-17 term, and taking apps for 2017-18 as well. It's on OSCAR, but since it's so late in the game, I thought I'd post it here.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Apr 27, 2016 8:52 pm

Almost a year out and still in the vale :( Does anyone have any links to job boards that are Pennsylvania specific? I passed the Pa bar and would like to move there.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Apr 27, 2016 11:47 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Almost a year out and still in the vale :( Does anyone have any links to job boards that are Pennsylvania specific? I passed the Pa bar and would like to move there.


Randomly saw this today on my NY school's Symplicity:

We are seeking a non-partnership track attorney to join the Labor and Employment Practice Group of the Litigation Department in our Philadelphia office. Experience in municipal labor law is preferred. Our Public Sector Practice is one of the largest in Pennsylvania and the successful candidate will be involved in research, writing, collective bargaining, arbitrations, unfair labor practices and litigation before administrative agencies, federal and state courts. Active bar license in PA is required. This is an excellent opportunity for professional growth in a collegial environment of a national firm. Superior academic credentials and strong communication skills are required.

Please apply via link:

http://www.ballardspahr.com/careers/att ... ities.aspx

Not sure from your post whether you have an active license, but can't hurt to apply. Otherwise, I'm sure you already know of indeed.com but I always found it to have the highest number of actually legit jobs when I was searching. Good luck.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby cowgirl_bebop » Thu Apr 28, 2016 10:52 am

Anonymous User wrote:Almost a year out and still in the vale :( Does anyone have any links to job boards that are Pennsylvania specific? I passed the Pa bar and would like to move there.

If you check the BYU Job Bank, you can get the login info for Temple and Villanova's Symplicity boards. They both (obviously) post a lot of Pennsylvania openings.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby ballouttacontrol » Thu Apr 28, 2016 11:52 am

zot1 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Possibly stupid question, but no point in applying to IMMEDIATE OPENINGS when I'm not even sitting for the bar until July. I mean, they are gonna get plenty of applications from attorneys.


If a firm, yes, apply. If they like your credentials, they may be willing to hire you anyway.


FYI , I got my ultimate offer at an amlaw firm from sending materials to a position from a job posting like this even though it was only 1st semester 3L

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Easy-E » Thu Apr 28, 2016 12:56 pm

Question about applying to jobs on Indeed. I'm seeing postings where they ask for a writing sample, but then no option to import a writing sample, and no other contact info.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Apr 28, 2016 1:47 pm

3.6 from T14 who didn't get an offer from V50 summer.

I know I should start mass mailing, but should I be on OSCAR too? Is a clerkship possible?

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby BVest » Thu Apr 28, 2016 4:34 pm

Anonymous User wrote:3.6 from T14 who didn't get an offer from V50 summer.

I know I should start mass mailing, but should I be on OSCAR too? Is a clerkship possible?


There are a handful of late-appearing clerkships (see my prior post). People drop out; judges get confirmed (maybe not too many more though); judges move up to get extra clerkship slot.

As to whether you have numbers for them, I don't know. What's a 3.6? Top 30%; 25%; 20%? Is that something that gets clerkships from your school? The CW on late clerkships is that they will be a little more flexible in who they take.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby zot1 » Thu Apr 28, 2016 5:36 pm

Easy-E wrote:Question about applying to jobs on Indeed. I'm seeing postings where they ask for a writing sample, but then no option to import a writing sample, and no other contact info.


I would just apply and then wait for them to ask for your writing sample.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Apr 29, 2016 2:52 am

anyone been told "good luck with the job search!" by a 2L and still mustered will to live?

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby lawschoolwoohoo » Fri Apr 29, 2016 4:41 pm

3L, T-20, Top 20%, published on Law Review, no job (though also no debt). Should I just wait until after the bar this summer to even bother applying to stuff? I wanted a job in crim, but no one hires until results come out. No idea what to do, just got dinged by what I thought was my best chance because I won't get bar results until the end of October. Feeling very hopeless, I don't even want to celebrate graduation b/c I'm going to be broke/unemployed forever. I'm humiliated to tell my family that I failed so terribly.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Apr 29, 2016 9:21 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I am a 3L and had final round interviews at a big law firm SEVEN weeks ago. I met with partners and a few associates and the interview seemed to go very well. They all had great things to say about my resume and experience and I felt that we connected pretty well. I sent Thank You notes to all of them and also the recruiter. It has been 7 weeks since and I have sent a follow-up email to the recruiter and also left her a phone message (spaced out between the 7 weeks) asking about the status of my application and also offering to answer any questions they may have. They haven't asked for my transcript or anything else. I haven't gotten a ding letter. I haven't heard from the recruiter at all. Should I just consider this a ding? Typically, how long can it take to hear back from firms about an associate position after the interview? We're not on an OCI timeline so I heard it could take longer than normal...but this seems much longer than normal.


The truth hurts. For a V50, it took them over 3 months to mail the ding.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Puttanesca » Sat Apr 30, 2016 10:31 am

lawschoolwoohoo wrote:3L, T-20, Top 20%, published on Law Review, no job (though also no debt). Should I just wait until after the bar this summer to even bother applying to stuff? I wanted a job in crim, but no one hires until results come out. No idea what to do, just got dinged by what I thought was my best chance because I won't get bar results until the end of October. Feeling very hopeless, I don't even want to celebrate graduation b/c I'm going to be broke/unemployed forever. I'm humiliated to tell my family that I failed so terribly.


Unless the job announcement specifically says something indicating that only licensed candidates should apply or will be considered, I would go ahead and apply. I know most crim jobs won't hire until results come out, but I don't think it would hurt to apply, and you never know. Some offices might be willing to hire.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Apr 30, 2016 10:52 am

Anonymous User wrote:Feeling lost right now. I had a job and a life I really enjoyed but lost my job due to medical reasons (former JAG and we can be discharged for medical things a civilian would never lose a job over). My disability is service-connected, so I have veterans' preference for federal government positions, but I don't know how much that helps since most attorney positions only consider it a "positive factor" and don't give a straight 10 points.

Been applying to only fed gov jobs since I don't know about returning to the state where I am licensed. Could go back but I might be better off living in a state closer to family due to my health issues. It's probably not a good idea to apply only to fed gov jobs since it is competitive and also the process is so slow, but I don't know where else I should apply.


Same anon. Any suggestions on how to address the question in an interview of why I left the military? The issue came up in an interview, and it was pretty awkward. It was a fedgov interview too, so they had my vet preference documents indicating a disability retirement, but they still asked the question.




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