The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls) Forum

hungryjumps · Post by **hungryjumps** » Wed May 14, 2014 10:01 pm

Hey guys, I've been a big lurky reader of the Vale for the past year or so and you guys have been a really invaluable source of support for me. I went from JD straight to LLM as a final gamble on getting a paying job and just received an offer from a V50 paying market rate. I graduate on Friday and this was my only shot at Biglaw... actually my only shot at a job. Even non-paying or low-paying jobs did not respond to my applications. What an effing miracle. Just want to say that good things can happen to those who hang in there and they can happen at the very last minute. Keep your heads up and I am sending my best wishes to all of you. Thanks for the support guys.

Danger Zone · Post by **Danger Zone** » Wed May 14, 2014 10:04 pm

hungryjumps wrote:Hey guys, I've been a big lurky reader of the Vale for the past year or so and you guys have been a really invaluable source of support for me. I went from JD straight to LLM as a final gamble on getting a paying job and just received an offer from a V50 paying market rate. I graduate on Friday and this was my only shot at Biglaw... actually my only shot at a job. Even non-paying or low-paying jobs did not respond to my applications. What an effing miracle. Just want to say that good things can happen to those who hang in there and they can happen at the very last minute. Keep your heads up and I am sending my best wishes to all of you. Thanks for the support guys.

If you don't mind answering, what kind of LLM did you go for? Was it tax from NYU?

hungryjumps · Post by **hungryjumps** » Wed May 14, 2014 10:06 pm

Danger Zone wrote:
hungryjumps wrote:Hey guys, I've been a big lurky reader of the Vale for the past year or so and you guys have been a really invaluable source of support for me. I went from JD straight to LLM as a final gamble on getting a paying job and just received an offer from a V50 paying market rate. I graduate on Friday and this was my only shot at Biglaw... actually my only shot at a job. Even non-paying or low-paying jobs did not respond to my applications. What an effing miracle. Just want to say that good things can happen to those who hang in there and they can happen at the very last minute. Keep your heads up and I am sending my best wishes to all of you. Thanks for the support guys.
If you don't mind answering, what kind of LLM did you go for? Was it tax from NYU?

Don't mind at all. Not tax at NYU. It was a generalist LLM from a T1 school, but to be perfectly honest the entire program has been a joke, we take classes with the JDs and it is essentially a 4L year.

Bikeflip · Post by **Bikeflip** » Wed May 14, 2014 10:23 pm

Either way, you're out of teh Vale. Congrats!

Danger Zone · Post by **Danger Zone** » Wed May 14, 2014 10:44 pm

Damn, congrats are definitely in order for that.

hungryjumps · Post by **hungryjumps** » Wed May 14, 2014 11:06 pm

Danger Zone wrote:Damn, congrats are definitely in order for that.

Thanks a lot buddy, and Bikeflip above too. I don't know how many stars had to align for this to work out but shit if it can happen to me it could happen to anyone of you too. I owe so much of it to you guys posting about interview technique and how law firms work and all that. My summers were spent tying up loose ends for a solo practitioner and I really had no clue how law firms work at all. You guys really teed me up for this. I am eager to return the favor so feel free to PM me anytime. Stay positive and good shit will happen to you.

spleenworship · Post by **spleenworship** » Thu May 15, 2014 9:27 am

Danger Zone wrote:Damn, congrats are definitely in order for that.

Anonymous User · Post by **Anonymous User** » Thu May 15, 2014 9:33 am

Bikeflip wrote:Eh, I knew I was a Valer as a rising 3L. So I can sympathize. That said, if you have a good SA or similar type jerb coming up, GTFO until you need the Vale. And here's to hoping those of you who may enter the Vale don't enter the Vale.

Yup... I didn't get summer gig until recently and I know going in that there won't be a post-LS jerb offer waiting for me at end of the summer. Feels like Vale-status but I don't wanna admit it yet

Druid · Post by **Druid** » Thu May 15, 2014 10:50 am

rad lulz wrote:Yeah, it's really more for people as of the first day of their third year.

I'm not sure there's any meaningful distinction between a 3L on their first day of 3L and a rising 3L going into a summer job that has no chance of turning into an offer. Unless you missed the biglaw boat and you're going to get an offer mid-summer to start post-bar. But nobody going into govt/PI is getting that.

Anonymous User · Post by **Anonymous User** » Thu May 15, 2014 12:39 pm

For those of you in the Vale that have gone to therapy, how did you go about it? My lack of a job has begun to affect my relationships and my mental well being.

bjsesq · Post by **bjsesq** » Thu May 15, 2014 12:39 pm

Anonymous User wrote:For those of you in the Vale that have gone to therapy, how did you go about it? My lack of a job has begun to affect my relationships and my mental well being.

Do you have insurance?

rad lulz · Post by **rad lulz** » Thu May 15, 2014 1:05 pm

spleenworship · Post by **spleenworship** » Thu May 15, 2014 1:38 pm

Anonymous User wrote:For those of you in the Vale that have gone to therapy, how did you go about it? My lack of a job has begun to affect my relationships and my mental well being.

I went through my school. Now that I'm out I still have access to my antidepressants, but no counseling unless I figure out who Medicaid in my craptastic state will cover.

BlueLotus · Post by **BlueLotus** » Thu May 15, 2014 1:43 pm

rad lulz wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:For those of you in the Vale that have gone to therapy, how did you go about it? My lack of a job has begun to affect my relationships and my mental well being.
The state where I went to school had free lawyers and law students counseling services, and I used that. It was very good, and I recommended highly

I second rad. Just about every state has some sort of lawyer's assistance program, which offer services like free support groups, crisis hotlines, 1-on-1 counseling, etc.

I freakin' despise the ABA, but they did put together a nice directory here: http://www.americanbar.org/groups/lawye ... state.html

sandcastle45 · Post by **sandcastle45** » Fri May 16, 2014 1:57 pm

How are you guys dealing with studying for the bar/being jobless? On the one hand, I don't have a job, so I'll literally have 12 hours a day to study for the bar like my bar review course expects/want me to. On the other hand, because I'm jobless and don't understand how/if my situation will improve in 2 months, I have no motivation to do that.

On yet another hand, I'm going to run out of money soon. I would much rather be working than studying for the bar (even in a non-law position)… but seriously, I expect some of you are also in the same position, how are you dealing with this? Career services told me I'll be in a better position once bar exam results come out (job-wise) - - I don't think my money is going to last another 2 months, let alone 5-6?!?!?!?

Anonymous User · Post by **Anonymous User** » Fri May 16, 2014 2:04 pm

sandcastle45 wrote:How are you guys dealing with studying for the bar/being jobless? On the one hand, I don't have a job, so I'll literally have 12 hours a day to study for the bar like my bar review course expects/want me to. On the other hand, because I'm jobless and don't understand how/if my situation will improve in 2 months, I have no motivation to do that.

On yet another hand, I'm going to run out of money soon. I would much rather be working than studying for the bar (even in a non-law position)… but seriously, I expect some of you are also in the same position, how are you dealing with this? Career services told me I'll be in a better position once bar exam results come out (job-wise) - - I don't think my money is going to last another 2 months, let alone 5-6?!?!?!?

Just do your bar prep and then after you take the test you can go get a non-law job. A contract law job would be even better, check craigslist everyday.

It is well documented that employers email/call you back much more frequently when you can actually put your bar license number on your resume. Be prepared to skim by until then, at least.

JoanSloan · Post by **JoanSloan** » Fri May 16, 2014 7:31 pm

On yet another hand, I'm going to run out of money soon. I would much rather be working than studying for the bar (even in a non-law position)… but seriously, I expect some of you are also in the same position, how are you dealing with this?

The Stanford Marshmallow Experiment.

It is well documented that employers email/call you back much more frequently

Hopefully the marshmallow will be more than a polite phone call...

spleenworship · Post by **spleenworship** » Sat May 17, 2014 10:16 am

sandcastle45 wrote:How are you guys dealing with studying for the bar/being jobless? On the one hand, I don't have a job, so I'll literally have 12 hours a day to study for the bar like my bar review course expects/want me to. On the other hand, because I'm jobless and don't understand how/if my situation will improve in 2 months, I have no motivation to do that.

On yet another hand, I'm going to run out of money soon. I would much rather be working than studying for the bar (even in a non-law position)… but seriously, I expect some of you are also in the same position, how are you dealing with this? Career services told me I'll be in a better position once bar exam results come out (job-wise) - - I don't think my money is going to last another 2 months, let alone 5-6?!?!?!?

Have you looked into bar loans?

Also, counseling and medication if necessary will help with motivation, as will going out and getting some exercise.

sandcastle45 · Post by **sandcastle45** » Mon May 19, 2014 3:33 pm

Ahhhh guys, I got an interview tomorrow.

Anonymous User · Post by **Anonymous User** » Mon May 19, 2014 4:47 pm

I love when I get an interview then a rejection for a job I applied to six months ago arrives in my inbox. Really kills the mood.

ditch digger · Post by **ditch digger** » Tue May 20, 2014 6:24 pm

I am a recent law school graduate who ended up just slightly above median at the 45th percentile. I still cannot find a suitable answer to the inevitable "what was your class rank?" interview question. Does anyone have tips as to the best way to answer this question?

My usual response is something like "I was ranked Xth out of Y students," and then follow up with a firm-specific question to ask my interviewer. Unfortunately, the I can always sense that the interview has made up his/her mind once it has become clear that I am not one of the top students in my class.

Anonymous User · Post by **Anonymous User** » Tue May 20, 2014 7:51 pm

Hello all. Long-time lurker here. Graduated in December from top 50 law school with average grades. Recently passed the NY Bar and am actively seeking employment. I was offered an unpaid internship at an immigration firm that might lead to a salaried position once I am admitted. For awhile I told myself that I would never work for free post-grad, but now I feel like I may as well do something, even if it is unpaid, so that I can market myself better once I get admitted to the bar. Any advice? Should I take the offer and hope they make me an offer once i'm admitted? Or should I pass on the offer, risk being unemployed, and seek another paying position.

Also, does anyone have leads for JD doc review? I'm finding it really difficult to find positions because I am not admitted yet. This sucks.

worldtraveler · Post by **worldtraveler** » Tue May 20, 2014 7:52 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Hello all. Long-time lurker here. Graduated in December from top 50 law school with average grades. Recently passed the NY Bar and am actively seeking employment. I was offered an unpaid internship at an immigration firm that might lead to a salaried position. For awhile I told myself that I would never work for free post-grad, but now I feel like I may as well do something, even if it is unpaid, so that I can market myself better once I pass. Any advice? Should I take the offer and hope they make me an offer once i'm admitted? Or should I pass on the offer, risk being unemployed, and seek another paying position.

How is it legal to not pay a postgraduate intern at a firm?

Anonymous User · Post by **Anonymous User** » Tue May 20, 2014 7:57 pm

worldtraveler wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Hello all. Long-time lurker here. Graduated in December from top 50 law school with average grades. Recently passed the NY Bar and am actively seeking employment. I was offered an unpaid internship at an immigration firm that might lead to a salaried position. For awhile I told myself that I would never work for free post-grad, but now I feel like I may as well do something, even if it is unpaid, so that I can market myself better once I pass. Any advice? Should I take the offer and hope they make me an offer once i'm admitted? Or should I pass on the offer, risk being unemployed, and seek another paying position.
How is it legal to not pay a postgraduate intern at a firm?

It's ridiculous, I know. Apparently, from what I have heard from other young NY attorneys, it is common practice. They label it as a post-grad internship and apparently get away with it. It's BS

Anonymous User · Post by **Anonymous User** » Tue May 20, 2014 9:29 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
worldtraveler wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Hello all. Long-time lurker here. Graduated in December from top 50 law school with average grades. Recently passed the NY Bar and am actively seeking employment. I was offered an unpaid internship at an immigration firm that might lead to a salaried position. For awhile I told myself that I would never work for free post-grad, but now I feel like I may as well do something, even if it is unpaid, so that I can market myself better once I pass. Any advice? Should I take the offer and hope they make me an offer once i'm admitted? Or should I pass on the offer, risk being unemployed, and seek another paying position.
How is it legal to not pay a postgraduate intern at a firm?
It's ridiculous, I know. Apparently, from what I have heard from other young NY attorneys, it is common practice. They label it as a post-grad internship and apparently get away with it. It's BS

Does it matter what they label it? Pretty sure it's illegal.

The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls) Forum

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Register now to search topics and post comments!

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Register for access!

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Resources to assist law school applicants, students & graduates.

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Register now!

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Register now, it's still FREE!

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Seriously? What are you waiting for?