The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls) Forum

[jmhendri]

Maybe this would be useful for more than just me. Wise people, TEACH ME HOW TO CONTACT AN ALUM.

I was given a list of Oregon alums (to my surprise, there are more than 2) by the CSO. How should I use this? I suck at cold-contacting someone to schmooze them. Do I ask if I can buy them a coffee when I get to town (in 6 weeks or so) and humbly ask for any advice they might have for a fledgling grad? Do I more bluntly ask whether they know anyone who's hiring?
How do I target alums? The retired ones I assume are mostly pointless unless I know they're a retired partner or judge, right? Too recent of a grad won't have any contacts or hiring pull.

I got my current position by contacting an alumnus. Here's what my emails generally said:

Dear [alum];

My name is [my name] and I am a recent graduate of Washington & Lee School of Law. About a year ago (prior to graduation), I reached out to you for insight on my impending job hunt. You were generous enough to offer some of your time. Since then, I've moved back to [my city], passed the [state] Bar, and obtained a fellowship with [organization]. As the fellowship position ends in May, I am once again exploring career options for new attorneys in [city]. I am primarily interested in further developing my background in [practice areas]. I would love to speak with you briefly if you have a moment. Any input you have on my job hunt would be greatly appreciated. Do you have space in your schedule to meet with me for coffee, or for a phone call? Feel free to contact me via email [email addy] or phone [number]. I have attached a resume for reference. Thank you in advance for your time.

Best,

[name]

This may have been more helpful to me that it would be to others given the fact that alums from my school tend to be extremely proud and helpful, and there aren't a lot of them where I am now (outside the mid Atlantic). Also, it helps to keep checking back. I contacted the alum who ultimately hired me prior to graduation and once I got serious about the job hunt. I didn't ask him to hire me, just for advice on the legal market in the area. It was pretty fortuitous that they were looking right at that time.

[dresden doll]

Fortuitous things happen to those who job search diligently. I 'd get to contacting people.

[zot1]

Just snagged a local judicial clerkship!

Believe me, I'm beyond excited about this and I'm going to do something to celebrate tonight, but guys, maybe it's lingering Vale effects and months upon months of stress or something, but at the same time, I cannot stop worrying about what happens when the clerkship is over. Someone please tell me the worrying eventually stops...

Congrats, bro. Don't worry about the next thing already. Allow yourself to be happy about this first.

[Anonymous User]

I had a call-back a few weeks back and they told me they were hoping to have a decision soon and that they would be in touch. I have yet to hear anything. Is it out of line to email and ask when they expect to have a decision even though they never suggested I would hear something quickly? Or is that too pushy? I only ask because I have already emailed them before (inquiring about the position, thanking them for the first interview, inquiring about a decision after the first interview, and then another thank you after the call-back).

[AreJay711]

Just snagged a local judicial clerkship!

Believe me, I'm beyond excited about this and I'm going to do something to celebrate tonight, but guys, maybe it's lingering Vale effects and months upon months of stress or something, but at the same time, I cannot stop worrying about what happens when the clerkship is over. Someone please tell me the worrying eventually stops...

Just a heads up: Some firms bring 3Ls on for SA positions. IDK how competitive you'd be for biglaw, but some midlaw firms do this as well. It's worth a shot.

[Anonymous User]

.

[bro2baseball]

Finally deciding to check into the Vale, now that graduation month is officially upon me.

Was the only SA at a mid-sized firm in a secondary market--but got no-offered (I choose to believe their explanation that the firm needed to bring on mid-level associates instead and couldn't do both).

After months of nothing I landed a callback at a NLJ350 firm in another secondary market, nailed the interviews... and got a ding last week.

How I wish I had listened to career services when they told us all to network, network, network. By far the best way someone in our position will find something now, and I have such a late start.

[Anonymous User]

Graduating soon, still in the Vale. I can't find a legal job. I hear about other people finding jobs and how the legal market's picking up and sometimes I wonder if there's something in my application that specifically turns employers off.
I feel like my law school experience has been an utter failure - three years of stress and deep self-loathing to culminate in graduating jobless while the rest of my T14 class sails off to rewarding careers. I don't think I even want to be a lawyer anymore.

My family's somewhat sympathetic but none of them are lawyers so they don't understand how deeply I feel like I've failed. I can't talk to any of my friends about this because they all have jobs and I feel ashamed. I'm going to see a therapist when finals are over but I just had to get this off my chest.

[UnamSanctam]

Graduating soon, still in the Vale. I can't find a legal job. I hear about other people finding jobs and how the legal market's picking up and sometimes I wonder if there's something in my application that specifically turns employers off.
I feel like my law school experience has been an utter failure - three years of stress and deep self-loathing to culminate in graduating jobless while the rest of my T14 class sails off to rewarding careers. I don't think I even want to be a lawyer anymore.

My family's somewhat sympathetic but none of them are lawyers so they don't understand how deeply I feel like I've failed. I can't talk to any of my friends about this because they all have jobs and I feel ashamed. I'm going to see a therapist when finals are over but I just had to get this off my chest.

Man, this is like 100% my situation. I think the best thing you can do is embrace the truth. That's going to be different for you than it is for me (because I find comfort in pseudo-nihilism and that's a little weird). I would tell you that the majority of your friends are going to unrewarding jobs and that your impression of the grass being greener is really just a case of the grass being yellow in a different way than it is for us. But that doesn't help unless you're the kind of ultra-competitive asshole who gets off on schadenfreude, and I won't assume that of you. The real answer is that dealing with personal failure is important. And it's equally important to realize that this isn't the end of the road. I don't think anyone can really grant you that perspective, but you'll get there eventually. Give yourself time to grieve and then make a plan of action and don't stop.

Also, I'm sorry this happened to you. You expected the median outcome at a T14, and your expectations got fucked.

[zot1]

Graduating soon, still in the Vale. I can't find a legal job. I hear about other people finding jobs and how the legal market's picking up and sometimes I wonder if there's something in my application that specifically turns employers off.
I feel like my law school experience has been an utter failure - three years of stress and deep self-loathing to culminate in graduating jobless while the rest of my T14 class sails off to rewarding careers. I don't think I even want to be a lawyer anymore.

My family's somewhat sympathetic but none of them are lawyers so they don't understand how deeply I feel like I've failed. I can't talk to any of my friends about this because they all have jobs and I feel ashamed. I'm going to see a therapist when finals are over but I just had to get this off my chest.

Man, this is like 100% my situation. I think the best thing you can do is embrace the truth. That's going to be different for you than it is for me (because I find comfort in pseudo-nihilism and that's a little weird). I would tell you that the majority of your friends are going to unrewarding jobs and that your impression of the grass being greener is really just a case of the grass being yellow in a different way than it is for us. But that doesn't help unless you're the kind of ultra-competitive asshole who gets off on schadenfreude, and I won't assume that of you. The real answer is that dealing with personal failure is important. And it's equally important to realize that this isn't the end of the road. I don't think anyone can really grant you that perspective, but you'll get there eventually. Give yourself time to grieve and then make a plan of action and don't stop.

Also, I'm sorry this happened to you. You expected the median outcome at a T14, and your expectations got fucked.

So it's not easy and maybe not what y'all want to hear, but I saw a lot of the previous class get jobs during bar prep and after the bar. Yeah, it's stressful, but it ain't over until it's over.

[UnamSanctam]

Graduating soon, still in the Vale. I can't find a legal job. I hear about other people finding jobs and how the legal market's picking up and sometimes I wonder if there's something in my application that specifically turns employers off.
I feel like my law school experience has been an utter failure - three years of stress and deep self-loathing to culminate in graduating jobless while the rest of my T14 class sails off to rewarding careers. I don't think I even want to be a lawyer anymore.

My family's somewhat sympathetic but none of them are lawyers so they don't understand how deeply I feel like I've failed. I can't talk to any of my friends about this because they all have jobs and I feel ashamed. I'm going to see a therapist when finals are over but I just had to get this off my chest.

Man, this is like 100% my situation. I think the best thing you can do is embrace the truth. That's going to be different for you than it is for me (because I find comfort in pseudo-nihilism and that's a little weird). I would tell you that the majority of your friends are going to unrewarding jobs and that your impression of the grass being greener is really just a case of the grass being yellow in a different way than it is for us. But that doesn't help unless you're the kind of ultra-competitive asshole who gets off on schadenfreude, and I won't assume that of you. The real answer is that dealing with personal failure is important. And it's equally important to realize that this isn't the end of the road. I don't think anyone can really grant you that perspective, but you'll get there eventually. Give yourself time to grieve and then make a plan of action and don't stop.

Also, I'm sorry this happened to you. You expected the median outcome at a T14, and your expectations got fucked.

So it's not easy and maybe not what y'all want to hear, but I saw a lot of the previous class get jobs during bar prep and after the bar. Yeah, it's stressful, but it ain't over until it's over.

Agreed. I actually haven't been super upset since I missed the boat 2L OCI, except every now and then. But I understand the despair.

[Anonymous User]

So I notified Barbri I wouldn't be taking them (Themis instead). They said they're going to send it to collection agency. Wtf? What does that even mean? Will it affect moral character?

[El Pollito]

JFC that's grimy

[Tanicius]

So I notified Barbri I wouldn't be taking them (Themis instead). They said they're going to send it to collection agency. Wtf? What does that even mean? Will it affect moral character?

Get in touch with Student Services. Your law school will shut that shit down if BarBri wants to continue suckering students on campus.

[zot1]

So I notified Barbri I wouldn't be taking them (Themis instead). They said they're going to send it to collection agency. Wtf? What does that even mean? Will it affect moral character?

Get in touch with Student Services. Your law school will shut that shit down if BarBri wants to continue suckering students on campus.

Seriously. This does not seem like good business practice at all.

[NorCalLaw]

So I notified Barbri I wouldn't be taking them (Themis instead). They said they're going to send it to collection agency. Wtf? What does that even mean? Will it affect moral character?

I would email one of your school's deans directly. I know at our school, Barbri's threats were taken very seriously by our academic dean and addressed appropriately.

[BlueLotus]

So I notified Barbri I wouldn't be taking them (Themis instead). They said they're going to send it to collection agency. Wtf? What does that even mean? Will it affect moral character?

JFC. I was brainwashed into paying the $50 deposit my 1L year, and then decided to switch to Themis to cop dat public interest discount. Will Barbri go after me?

[UnamSanctam]

So I notified Barbri I wouldn't be taking them (Themis instead). They said they're going to send it to collection agency. Wtf? What does that even mean? Will it affect moral character?

JFC. I was brainwashed into paying the $50 deposit my 1L year, and then decided to switch to Themis to cop dat public interest discount. Will Barbri go after me?

Hello there, it looks like you're trying to make yet another post about you. Let me aid you in your quest to rid yourself of your neuroses - it's going to be a tall order! Might I recommend any and all of the following:

>Next time, try a little empathy before turning the situation back on yourself. You see, the poster you quoted has an actual problem. You waited all of a blasphemy to make it about you. Well-adjusted humans would have responded with, for example, "I'm sorry" or "I can't believe they did that to you!"

>Practice interest in other people. In this thread, that may entail asking others how their job search is going. A novel concept, but I promise you that risking it will bring a great return on investment. People will warm up to you, instead of deciding whether or not your post is worth reading. And no, friend, "sharing is caring" doesn't apply here!

>Read the room! If you think people want you to interject mundane details about your life, you're probably wrong! After all, look how quickly you ignored somebody's predicament and highlighted your own, more attenuated consternation.

With these changes in mind, you'll be an appreciated asset to this thread in no time!

*Also, this is a time for recognition. It appears you haven't used the term "jerb" or a variant in over a month!



¡Olé!

[El Pollito]

yesss

[sd5289]

So I notified Barbri I wouldn't be taking them (Themis instead). They said they're going to send it to collection agency. Wtf? What does that even mean? Will it affect moral character?

JFC. I was brainwashed into paying the $50 deposit my 1L year, and then decided to switch to Themis to cop dat public interest discount. Will Barbri go after me?

Assuming you didn't sign their ridiculous "contract" last fall and put the $500 deposit down to get whatever discount they "offered" to students who signed, then no, Barbri's not coming after you.

To anyone facing this Barbri contract dilemma (including the anon above), get in touch with your Student Services offices (some schools went so far as to ban Barbri from campus if they intended to enforce these contracts) as well as the Themis rep who got you to switch. I know our rep has gotten several people in your situation out of it so far. The contract is unenforceable, and it's clear Barbri's counting on fear of C&F and whatnot to force students to pay up the remainder of their tuition bill.

[BlueLotus]

For public interest gunners, this fellowship just opened up. Don't think it's going to get too many applicants since it's so late in the game compared to the other big fellowships. Good luck.

APPLICANTS SOUGHT FOR NEW ATTORNEY FELLOWSHIPS

Boston, MA
Application Deadline: 06/30/2015

GREATER BOSTON LEGAL SERVICES (GBLS) - MAIN OFFICE
http://www.gbls.org
Date Posted: 04/22/2015
Job Type: LAW RELATED POSITIONS
Schedule Type: Full Time

Practice Areas: Non-Profit

Job Description
The GBLS Welfare Law Unit seeks candidates for two attorney fellowship positions for September 2015. Priority will be given to 2015 graduates and to candidates with relevant work and course experience.

Mass. Legal Assistance Corp. Bart Gordon Fellowship

The fellowship will focus on women of color living in deep poverty while raising children with little or no support from the other parent. The fellow’s work would address cultural competency, behaviors, and attitudes of the agency staff charged with assuring timely access to entitlement benefits needed for food, rent, healthcare, and child care.

The fellow will represent low income mothers of color who need cash, nutritional, and child care during pregnancy or to care for their minor children to secure the benefits to which they are entitled and insist on treatment that is both respectful of their legal rights and of their individual dignity. Many more would be impacted improved treatment by DTA or EEC and its agents in at least in one of the local service offices of the agency. The fellow’s work plan will include research using academic and social science sources regarding the race and welfare programs, learning about and investigating relevant DTA and EEC practices, including through client interviews. With the consent of the client, the fellow will explore the impact of racism on the client’s circumstances – historically and in her current dealings with DTA and EEC. Systemic advocacy would include attainable incremental outcomes, such as persuading the agencies to engage in training for and work among their staffs on the stereotypes they bring and how to avoid harming the clients they are publicly funded to serve.

AmeriCorps Fellowship

This fellowship involves an advocacy project focused on education and training issue for low income parents. The fellow will represent low income parents in need of adult basic education, ESOL, high school equivalency programs to prepare for the HiSET (f/k/a GED) exam, or post-secondary education or training to attain skills and credentials necessary for family-sustaining employment. TAFDC rules, as revised by a 2014 welfare reform law (as yet, largely not implemented), contradictorily present both barriers to and supports for assessment of education and training needs and pursuit of programs. The Fellow also will participate in policy advocacy, by helping document unmet needs for programs and likely continued barriers at DTA and EEC to participation and child care benefits.
The AmeriCorps placements at GBLS are part of the Legal Assistance for Self-Sufficiency Program, run under the auspices of the South Coastal Counties Legal Services, Inc. The program is funded through the Corporation for National Community and Service, and administered through the Massachusetts Service Alliance.
GBLS is an AA/EO/Handicapped accessible employer, committed to diversity in the workforce and regards differences as assets.
Qualifications
-

Application Instructions:
To apply for either or both Fellowships, please submit a cover letter and resume and to Sonia Marquez, Director of Human Resources by email at jobs@gbls.org. Those applying for AmeriCorps must also send a signed application which may be downloaded at http://www.mlassp.org. Please use the job code “Bart Gordon” and/or “AmeriCorps” when applying. For more information, contact Ms. Marquez at jobs@gbls.org.

Contact Information:
Sonia Marquez
Fax: 617-371-1222
jobs@gbls.org
197 Friend Street
Boston, MA 02114

Application Deadline: 06/30/2015

[TheFutureLawyer]

x

[Anonymous User]

3L in the midst of finals. Managed to score an interview at my dream firm (think small-mid-sized boutique type firm) thanks in part to the recommendation of a judge I externed for. Interview went well and they called me back to "meet the rest of the partners" the following week, at 4pm on a Friday.

I also talked to one of the partners on the phone right after the first interview and he had positive things to say, told me there were actually two openings and asked which I would be more interested in.

What should I expect out of this? I have no idea if they're treating this as a "callback" style interview or what; the first one was already with 5 of the firm's partners.

I NEED to get this job.

Anonymous because I'm giving out a lot of details in this post.

Same anon here, still waiting to hear back from these folks (interview went well, but they operate on a consensus system so they have to hold a meeting with all the partners to make the final decision). Almost all the partners seemed to love me, but I think one of them may be questionable. I should hear back any day now. Going nuts waiting. This is definitely my last chance at graduating with a job; nothing else even on the horizon at this point.

[shredderrrrrr]

3L in the midst of finals. Managed to score an interview at my dream firm (think small-mid-sized boutique type firm) thanks in part to the recommendation of a judge I externed for. Interview went well and they called me back to "meet the rest of the partners" the following week, at 4pm on a Friday.

I also talked to one of the partners on the phone right after the first interview and he had positive things to say, told me there were actually two openings and asked which I would be more interested in.

What should I expect out of this? I have no idea if they're treating this as a "callback" style interview or what; the first one was already with 5 of the firm's partners.

I NEED to get this job.

Anonymous because I'm giving out a lot of details in this post.

Same anon here, still waiting to hear back from these folks (interview went well, but they operate on a consensus system so they have to hold a meeting with all the partners to make the final decision). Almost all the partners seemed to love me, but I think one of them may be questionable. I should hear back any day now. Going nuts waiting. This is definitely my last chance at graduating with a job; nothing else even on the horizon at this point.

Same position here. Good luck!

[Anonymous User]

3L in the midst of finals. Managed to score an interview at my dream firm (think small-mid-sized boutique type firm) thanks in part to the recommendation of a judge I externed for. Interview went well and they called me back to "meet the rest of the partners" the following week, at 4pm on a Friday.

I also talked to one of the partners on the phone right after the first interview and he had positive things to say, told me there were actually two openings and asked which I would be more interested in.

What should I expect out of this? I have no idea if they're treating this as a "callback" style interview or what; the first one was already with 5 of the firm's partners.

I NEED to get this job.

Anonymous because I'm giving out a lot of details in this post.

Same anon here, still waiting to hear back from these folks (interview went well, but they operate on a consensus system so they have to hold a meeting with all the partners to make the final decision). Almost all the partners seemed to love me, but I think one of them may be questionable. I should hear back any day now. Going nuts waiting. This is definitely my last chance at graduating with a job; nothing else even on the horizon at this point.

Same position here. Good luck!

[Same person as before] Curious -- Area of practice?