Let's Talk San Francisco - Taking Questions

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Re: Let's Talk San Francisco - Taking Questions

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Mar 10, 2016 8:40 pm

KiltedKicker wrote:Hey, I'm a 0L considering my options and am hoping those with some insights into the Bay Area market can give some advice. I was born and raised in SV, and my dad was an IP litigator and GC here for 30 years (it's been awhile since he was at a firm, so his knowledge on all this is a bit dated). I went to school out of state, but worked for the past year at a tech start up and have a good amount of entrepreneurship related experiences on my resume. I'm keeping an open mind, but I love startups and entrepreneurship and am thinking that I'd like to do general corporate tech law at a firm like WSGR, Cooley, MoFo, etc.

Because of my career interests and personal preferences (and financial aid offers I've received thus far), I'm probably most seriously considering Berkeley, NYU, and Duke. Would my chances of getting into Bay Area biglaw be much worse at Duke (I would also have an LLM in entrepreneurship) than at other T-10 schools? Would my chances be as good or better at Berkeley than at any of CCN? So far the advice I have received is that these firms hire from all of these schools and I just have to do well, but that it would be a bit easier from NYU than Duke, and slightly easier from Berkeley than NYU.

If you want more details send a PM. Any advice that might help me with this decision would certainly be much appreciated. Thanks!


You can take my advice with a grain of salt (and with knowledge of potential bias), I'm only a 2L (who wasn't born in California and is at Duke). But if you were born and raised in NorCal, that would seem to be a pretty strong connection, and if people know your dad, that might be even stronger. With that kind of connection to the area, plus your having worked in the area, I think NYU and Duke may be at less of a disadvantage (if any) compared to Berkeley in terms of getting you to NorCal than they might have been for other people without those connections. However, I don't know how things work at Berkeley, but it seems possible that some firms that go to OCI at Berkeley may not travel to NY or Durham. Though I don't know if there any big firms that would go to Berkeley OCI and skip NYU and Duke.

I guess it depends quite a bit on how attractive the financial aid offers are from NYU and Duke compared to Berkeley. I suspect the reason you're considering Duke over Berkeley and NYU for the Bay Area is the aid offer is attractive (though quite a few people seem to think Duke is a quality school that has had some nice employment numbers)? To be honest, how attractive each school's offer is is something that can differ based on how risk/debt averse you are, but I would also note that if you like Duke's offer I think it warrants serious consideration.

Also, as a Duke 2L I may be biased, but it might be worth noting that Durham can be a very cheap place to live (whereas NorCal and NY seem not so cheap). Might be the cheapest COL in the T14. Maybe not as much stuff going on as Berkeley or New York, but I pay less than 500 bucks a month in rent (though that may be a good deal even by Durham standards). Maybe that's why 1-2k a month for a place in San Francisco seems so expensive...

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A. Nony Mouse
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Re: Let's Talk San Francisco - Taking Questions

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Thu Mar 10, 2016 11:08 pm

Just a reminder that this is the legal employment forum, and 0Ls are not allowed to ask questions here. The questions about schools for SF are probably best addressed further in the Choosing a Law School forum or Ask a Law Student/Graduate. Thanks.

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Re: Let's Talk San Francisco - Taking Questions

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Mar 11, 2016 2:38 pm

Anybody here have experience going from SF litigation to SF in-house? I'm considering the openings for which I'll be most attractive, and thinking it would be things like (1) compliance positions relating to statutes I've litigated, (2) heavily-litigated industries, like insurance or financial services, (3) tech companies with lots of patents, given IP lit experience.

Not interested in hearing, "that's going to be really hard." Interested in hearing from people who actually made the transition.

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Re: Let's Talk San Francisco - Taking Questions

Postby ballouttacontrol » Sat Mar 12, 2016 4:29 pm

HmmmOkay wrote:What do people usually expect to pay monthly for a place in San Francisco, like a 2 bedroom 1 bathroom place? is anything under $2000 a month (per person) a solid deal?


$2500 each is the pretty standard going rate in any decent location. $2k or less is very cheap

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ExBiglawAssociate
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Re: Let's Talk San Francisco - Taking Questions

Postby ExBiglawAssociate » Sat Mar 12, 2016 8:06 pm

SF is shit. Thank god I escaped.

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Micdiddy
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Re: Let's Talk San Francisco - Taking Questions

Postby Micdiddy » Sun Mar 13, 2016 10:23 pm

Biglaw_Associate_V20 wrote:SF is shit. Thank god I escaped.


Anymore details on that?

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Emma.
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Re: Let's Talk San Francisco - Taking Questions

Postby Emma. » Mon Mar 14, 2016 5:04 pm

Micdiddy wrote:
Biglaw_Associate_V20 wrote:SF is shit. Thank god I escaped.


Anymore details on that?

http://mashable.com/2014/11/21/public-p ... _S40KMrEql

Image

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sundance95
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Re: Let's Talk San Francisco - Taking Questions

Postby sundance95 » Mon Mar 14, 2016 5:32 pm


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Redamon1
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Re: Let's Talk San Francisco - Taking Questions

Postby Redamon1 » Tue Mar 15, 2016 4:35 am

ballouttacontrol wrote:
HmmmOkay wrote:What do people usually expect to pay monthly for a place in San Francisco, like a 2 bedroom 1 bathroom place? is anything under $2000 a month (per person) a solid deal?


$2500 3500 each is the pretty standard going rate in any decent location. $2k or less is very cheap

ballouttacontrol
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Re: Let's Talk San Francisco - Taking Questions

Postby ballouttacontrol » Tue Mar 15, 2016 7:30 am

Redamon1 wrote:
ballouttacontrol wrote:
HmmmOkay wrote:What do people usually expect to pay monthly for a place in San Francisco, like a 2 bedroom 1 bathroom place? is anything under $2000 a month (per person) a solid deal?


$2500 3500 each is the pretty standard going rate in any decent location. $2k or less is very cheap


$2500 is totally reasonably doable man. Maybe not in PRIME locations but you can get some extremely nice 2 beds for $2500 if you're fine being in a slightly less prime block. I lived in a super nice 2 bed 2 bath in Soma one block off of mission for $4900 for the whole thing.

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Re: Let's Talk San Francisco - Taking Questions

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Mar 15, 2016 8:46 am

Question for the SF vets on here:

I'm a 1L at a lower T14 (not Berkeley), and have been starting to think about OCI bids/ strategy. We've got a spreadsheet at my school that shows the average CB GPA by firm office. Many of the SF/ SV CB GPAs, even at the well-known Bay Area offices are somewhat lower than what we see in the other large markets. What do I make of this when bidding? Are you guys just a different "type" of selective there?

I don't really have connects to the Bay Area (worked in consulting and often travelled to SF for clients, so that's my best sell on why I ~love~ the city more than others might).

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Redamon1
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Re: Let's Talk San Francisco - Taking Questions

Postby Redamon1 » Tue Mar 15, 2016 11:24 am

ballouttacontrol wrote:
Redamon1 wrote:
ballouttacontrol wrote:
HmmmOkay wrote:What do people usually expect to pay monthly for a place in San Francisco, like a 2 bedroom 1 bathroom place? is anything under $2000 a month (per person) a solid deal?


$2500 3500 each is the pretty standard going rate in any decent location. $2k or less is very cheap


$2500 is totally reasonably doable man. Maybe not in PRIME locations but you can get some extremely nice 2 beds for $2500 if you're fine being in a slightly less prime block. I lived in a super nice 2 bed 2 bath in Soma one block off of mission for $4900 for the whole thing.


I guess you're right about the 2BR price, but the price per room is not proportional, i.e. you'll have to pay more, per room, if you want a 1BR. Those go for 3500 and up.

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ilovesf
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Re: Let's Talk San Francisco - Taking Questions

Postby ilovesf » Tue Mar 15, 2016 12:23 pm

You guys are living in some absurdly expensive apartments

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Emma.
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Re: Let's Talk San Francisco - Taking Questions

Postby Emma. » Tue Mar 15, 2016 12:27 pm

ballouttacontrol wrote:
Redamon1 wrote:
ballouttacontrol wrote:
HmmmOkay wrote:What do people usually expect to pay monthly for a place in San Francisco, like a 2 bedroom 1 bathroom place? is anything under $2000 a month (per person) a solid deal?


$2500 3500 each is the pretty standard going rate in any decent location. $2k or less is very cheap


$2500 is totally reasonably doable man. Maybe not in PRIME locations but you can get some extremely nice 2 beds for $2500 if you're fine being in a slightly less prime block. I lived in a super nice 2 bed 2 bath in Soma one block off of mission for $4900 for the whole thing.


The awesome $4900 2br/2ba places are disappearing. Lived in one last year and it was by far the best deal we'd found when apartment hunting. When we moved out, the landlord increased the rent to $5600.

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Re: Let's Talk San Francisco - Taking Questions

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Mar 15, 2016 12:31 pm

Emma. wrote:
ballouttacontrol wrote:
Redamon1 wrote:
ballouttacontrol wrote:
HmmmOkay wrote:What do people usually expect to pay monthly for a place in San Francisco, like a 2 bedroom 1 bathroom place? is anything under $2000 a month (per person) a solid deal?


$2500 3500 each is the pretty standard going rate in any decent location. $2k or less is very cheap


$2500 is totally reasonably doable man. Maybe not in PRIME locations but you can get some extremely nice 2 beds for $2500 if you're fine being in a slightly less prime block. I lived in a super nice 2 bed 2 bath in Soma one block off of mission for $4900 for the whole thing.


The awesome $4900 2br/2ba places are disappearing. Lived in one last year and it was by far the best deal we'd found when apartment hunting. When we moved out, the landlord increased the rent to $5600.


That said, you can get a pretty decent 2BR place in solid neighborhoods in Oakland (Temescal, Adams Point, parts of Rockridge) for under $3000, and your commute isn't too much longer into the city on BART. I moved across the bay last year after rents got untenable even in the outer neighborhoods, and haven't regretted it.

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Re: Let's Talk San Francisco - Taking Questions

Postby ilovesf » Tue Mar 15, 2016 12:56 pm

You don't have to go to Oakland. Just go to the Richmond. The older I get the more I like the neighborhood and commuting to FiDi is super easy if you live near the 1AX or something.

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Re: Let's Talk San Francisco - Taking Questions

Postby bruinfan10 » Tue Mar 15, 2016 4:02 pm

ilovesf wrote:You don't have to go to Oakland. Just go to the Richmond. The older I get the more I like the neighborhood and commuting to FiDi is super easy if you live near the 1AX or something.

I think this is credited. I don't understand why people are pushing further and further into the East Bay when the Richmond and Sunset offer *some* 1 bedrooms with parking for $2500 (and up). That said, those areas are also going up in price, not everyone wants to commute on the bus, and $2500 for a 1 bedroom still isn't great. I'm heading down to LA, this city is getting unliveable.

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Re: Let's Talk San Francisco - Taking Questions

Postby rpupkin » Tue Mar 15, 2016 4:32 pm

bruinfan10 wrote:
ilovesf wrote:You don't have to go to Oakland. Just go to the Richmond. The older I get the more I like the neighborhood and commuting to FiDi is super easy if you live near the 1AX or something.

I think this is credited. I don't understand why people are pushing further and further into the East Bay when the Richmond and Sunset offer *some* 1 bedrooms with parking for $2500 (and up).

Perhaps it's because the further you go into the East Bay, the warmer and sunnier it gets; while the further you go west in San Francisco, the colder and foggier it gets. I'm talking about the summer, of course, when it's often in the 50s in the Sunset and in the 80s in the East Bay.

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bruinfan10
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Re: Let's Talk San Francisco - Taking Questions

Postby bruinfan10 » Tue Mar 15, 2016 7:34 pm

rpupkin wrote:
bruinfan10 wrote:
ilovesf wrote:You don't have to go to Oakland. Just go to the Richmond. The older I get the more I like the neighborhood and commuting to FiDi is super easy if you live near the 1AX or something.

I think this is credited. I don't understand why people are pushing further and further into the East Bay when the Richmond and Sunset offer *some* 1 bedrooms with parking for $2500 (and up).

Perhaps it's because the further you go into the East Bay, the warmer and sunnier it gets; while the further you go west in San Francisco, the colder and foggier it gets. I'm talking about the summer, of course, when it's often in the 50s in the Sunset and in the 80s in the East Bay.

That's a good point. If there were parking passes still available for rockridge bart, or if the apartments weren't so crazy expensive, I'd love to live around that area and commute in to FiDi.

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Re: Let's Talk San Francisco - Taking Questions

Postby patentlitigatrix » Tue Mar 15, 2016 9:04 pm

Biglaw_Associate_V20 wrote:SF is shit. Thank god I escaped.


+1

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Re: Let's Talk San Francisco - Taking Questions

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Apr 13, 2016 1:20 pm

It's quite a slow day in the office, so I figured I'd bump this.

Original OP here. Now a third year litigator at a firm in the city, which is where I summered. Generally like my gig. I'll check in periodically today if folks have any new questions.

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Re: Let's Talk San Francisco - Taking Questions

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Apr 14, 2016 3:46 pm

I'll be moving to SF this summer (looking for an apartment with a July 1 lease date, or somewhere in that range). Should I be frantically looking for places already? I'm away on business until the end of May, and I was originally thinking I would just visit for a few days in June and find a place, but someone advised me that I better start looking now. If that's the case, should I just look up July 1st apartments on craigslist/padmapper? My initial searches seem to indicate that there are plenty of apartments still available, even for April. Wondering if I was misinformed, or if it really is time to start making calls and sending e-mails to potential landlords.

Also, I'll be working in the financial district. What's a reasonable price for a studio with an okay commute (45 mins or less) in a non-terrifying neighborhood? $2200ish appears to get some hits in the Richmond & Pac Heights neighbordhoods. Does that sound doable? Preferring not to live in Oakland, but would also consider some less popular neighborhoods if it meant saving a few hundred $. Places to avoid? Tenderloin sounds like an easy one, any others?

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Re: Let's Talk San Francisco - Taking Questions

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Apr 14, 2016 6:39 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I'll be moving to SF this summer (looking for an apartment with a July 1 lease date, or somewhere in that range). Should I be frantically looking for places already? I'm away on business until the end of May, and I was originally thinking I would just visit for a few days in June and find a place, but someone advised me that I better start looking now. If that's the case, should I just look up July 1st apartments on craigslist/padmapper? My initial searches seem to indicate that there are plenty of apartments still available, even for April. Wondering if I was misinformed, or if it really is time to start making calls and sending e-mails to potential landlords.

Also, I'll be working in the financial district. What's a reasonable price for a studio with an okay commute (45 mins or less) in a non-terrifying neighborhood? $2200ish appears to get some hits in the Richmond & Pac Heights neighbordhoods. Does that sound doable? Preferring not to live in Oakland, but would also consider some less popular neighborhoods if it meant saving a few hundred $. Places to avoid? Tenderloin sounds like an easy one, any others?


I'd start looking in late May, early June. You might wind up paying an extra few weeks' rent if you find a good spot for a mid-June date, but that'd be worth it.

Great inexpensive neighborhoods with a reasonable commute are basically (1) Glen Park and (2) End of List. That said, I've lived in Pac Heights and my commute was well under 30 minutes, plus there's at least some stuff to do at night. I love the Richmond, but don't care for the 38 bus, so that's a tradeoff. The Sunset has really jumped in price recently, especially anywhere near Muni.

I would try Corona Heights/Twin Peaks, where there still seem to be reasonable 1 BR places and can be a quick bus/muni train to work, or maybe further out to West Portal if you can find a spot close to the train.

That said, I was the person who always said "I won't move to Oakland," and here I am in Oakland, with a shorter commute during the work week and a 2 BR place for what I would've paid for a studio in neighborhoods I really liked in the city.

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Re: Let's Talk San Francisco - Taking Questions

Postby ilovesf » Thu Apr 14, 2016 7:13 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I'll be moving to SF this summer (looking for an apartment with a July 1 lease date, or somewhere in that range). Should I be frantically looking for places already? I'm away on business until the end of May, and I was originally thinking I would just visit for a few days in June and find a place, but someone advised me that I better start looking now. If that's the case, should I just look up July 1st apartments on craigslist/padmapper? My initial searches seem to indicate that there are plenty of apartments still available, even for April. Wondering if I was misinformed, or if it really is time to start making calls and sending e-mails to potential landlords.

Also, I'll be working in the financial district. What's a reasonable price for a studio with an okay commute (45 mins or less) in a non-terrifying neighborhood? $2200ish appears to get some hits in the Richmond & Pac Heights neighbordhoods. Does that sound doable? Preferring not to live in Oakland, but would also consider some less popular neighborhoods if it meant saving a few hundred $. Places to avoid? Tenderloin sounds like an easy one, any others?


I'd start looking in late May, early June. You might wind up paying an extra few weeks' rent if you find a good spot for a mid-June date, but that'd be worth it.

Great inexpensive neighborhoods with a reasonable commute are basically (1) Glen Park and (2) End of List. That said, I've lived in Pac Heights and my commute was well under 30 minutes, plus there's at least some stuff to do at night. I love the Richmond, but don't care for the 38 bus, so that's a tradeoff. The Sunset has really jumped in price recently, especially anywhere near Muni.

I would try Corona Heights/Twin Peaks, where there still seem to be reasonable 1 BR places and can be a quick bus/muni train to work, or maybe further out to West Portal if you can find a spot close to the train.

That said, I was the person who always said "I won't move to Oakland," and here I am in Oakland, with a shorter commute during the work week and a 2 BR place for what I would've paid for a studio in neighborhoods I really liked in the city.

I wouldn't take this advice about the Richmond. The 38 is not the only bus there. It depends on where you live in the Richmond. The 1AX is a pretty good commuter bus and option. From 22/Clement it takes me about 25 minutes to get downtown.

If you found a studio for 2200 that would seem to be a pretty good price - but I bet that studio would end up being VERY small. IDK how much that matters if you are working in big law and don't even spend much time at home though.

I found my first apartment in 2 days and my second one in 5 days, so I would not say you have to start looking super early.

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sundance95
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Re: Let's Talk San Francisco - Taking Questions

Postby sundance95 » Thu Apr 21, 2016 2:27 pm

You might also check out Chariot, which is a commuter shuttle app, to see if that might help with a commute from the North of Market neighborhoods. https://www.chariot.com/tracking While many apps are pretty worthless, Chariot seems to provide good service for about twice the cost of riding Muni. (I say seems because I live in Noe Valley, and their one route nearby heads to SOMA, which is not where I work.) Also, b/c it's a commuter shuttle, you can use pretax dollars on the service. Friends have used it and liked it.




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