Let's Talk San Francisco - Taking Questions Forum

[Anonymous User]

Top 25% at Berkeley. Want to do commercial lit. in SF.

Bids to: MoFo, Latham, OMM, Jones Day, Bingham, Fenwick, Orrick, Sidley, DLA Piper, Baker, Keker, White&Case, Morgan Lewis, Ropes, Farella, Wilson Sonsini, Covington, Skadden, Cooley

Forgetting any major players/shooting too high?

Gibson, A&P, and Reed Smith are the larger offices I can think of that you've left off (>60 lawyers).

You also forgot K&E. You don't have any chance at Keker--you need to be at least top 10% to have any chance at a callback and probably top 5% to be in contention for an offer.

[Anonymous User]

Top 25% at Berkeley. Want to do commercial lit. in SF.

Bids to: MoFo, Latham, OMM, Jones Day, Bingham, Fenwick, Orrick, Sidley, DLA Piper, Baker, Keker, White&Case, Morgan Lewis, Ropes, Farella, Wilson Sonsini, Covington, Skadden, Cooley

Forgetting any major players/shooting too high?

Ropes pretty much has no commercial litigation practice in SF/SV (like one partner and two associates). They pretty much only do patent litigation, as a heads up.

[Anonymous User]

Rising 2L from S here. My grades should put me around median.
I want to do transactional work and stay in the Bay Area. I think I'd be equally happy in either SF or SV. Some practice areas that I'm potentially interested in include emerging companies, venture capital, technology transactions and IP licensing, trademark, media/entertainment, privacy, and M&A.

Firms I'm currently looking at for OCI bids include:
Cooley
WSGR
Fenwick & West
Gibson Dunn
Latham & Watkins
MoFo
Sheppard Mullin
Davis Polk

Obviously I'll be bidding on a lot more than just these firms, but these are the main firms on my radar that will likely be at the top of my bid list. Any other firms that I should strongly consider as I put together my bid list?

You can also do such work at Ropes. That's primarily what I did this past summer there.

[BFrankBYangC]

At two lower T14s, the median callback GPA for WSGR (as well as the other SV heavyweights) was around median.

From what I've seen, SA classes at SV firms have been around 80% people with ties or CA schools (this was very unscientifically calculated though and could be off). I know people have been able to overcome a lack of ties by demonstrating a significant interest in and being able to talk intelligently about startup/tech/emergingcompany work. I have also seen people who have IP creds and want to do IP be able to overcome a lack of ties. That being said, these people are definitely the minority.

What can I read/study to be able to talk intelligently about startup/tech/emerging company work?

[Anonymous User]

At two lower T14s, the median callback GPA for WSGR (as well as the other SV heavyweights) was around median.

From what I've seen, SA classes at SV firms have been around 80% people with ties or CA schools (this was very unscientifically calculated though and could be off). I know people have been able to overcome a lack of ties by demonstrating a significant interest in and being able to talk intelligently about startup/tech/emergingcompany work. I have also seen people who have IP creds and want to do IP be able to overcome a lack of ties. That being said, these people are definitely the minority.

What can I read/study to be able to talk intelligently about startup/tech/emerging company work?

TechCrunch is a good and accessible place to start for current SV events. It also helps to know how startups generally gain funding and interact with law firms. Things like angel investors, series seed, venture capital, M&A, IPOs, etc. KhanAcademy has a good overview.

[oblig.lawl.ref]

At two lower T14s, the median callback GPA for WSGR (as well as the other SV heavyweights) was around median.

From what I've seen, SA classes at SV firms have been around 80% people with ties or CA schools (this was very unscientifically calculated though and could be off). I know people have been able to overcome a lack of ties by demonstrating a significant interest in and being able to talk intelligently about startup/tech/emergingcompany work. I have also seen people who have IP creds and want to do IP be able to overcome a lack of ties. That being said, these people are definitely the minority.

What can I read/study to be able to talk intelligently about startup/tech/emerging company work?

TechCrunch is a good and accessible place to start for current SV events. It also helps to know how startups generally gain funding and interact with law firms. Things like angel investors, series seed, venture capital, M&A, IPOs, etc. KhanAcademy has a good overview.

Also check out allthingsd, venturebeat, and the silicon valley business journal. A market analyst at my school said everyone reads the business journal in PA but it seems a little lacking compared to techcrunch. Love techcrunch.

[Anonymous User]

I'm a transfer at Berkeley. Top 2% at a T1 for my 1L year. Any feedback on my bidlist? The "(#)" is the expected SA class size according to NALP.

Morrison & Foerster (SF) (21)
Kirkland & Ellis (SF) (~22)
Fenwick & West (Mountain View) (25)
Wilson Sonsini (Palo Alto) (17)
Gibson Dunn & Crutcher (SF) (13)
Jones Day (SF) (9)
Ropes & Gray (SF) (8)
Cooley (Palo Alto) (15)
Latham & Watkins (SF) (11)
Simpson Thatcher & Bartlett (Palo Alto) (9)
Morgan, Lewis & Bocklus (SF) (7)
Covington & Burling (SF) (6)
Pillsbury Winthrow Shaw Pittman (SF) (5)
O’Melveny & Myers (SF)
Skadden, Arps, Slate, Meagher & Flom (NY) (73)
Paul, Weiss, Rifkind, Wharton & Garrison (NY) (81)
Davis Polk & Wardwell (NY)
Cadwalader, Wickersham & Taft (NY) (25)
WilmerHale (NY) (23)
Dechert (NY)
Cleary, Gottlieb, Steen & Hamilton (NY) (98)
Sidley Austin (Chi) (42)
Jenner & Block (Chi) (20)
Mayer Brown (Chi) (27)
Reed Smith (SF) (4)
Perkins Coie (Palo Alto) (7)
Arnold & Porter (SF) (6)
Paul Hastings (Palo Alto) (8)
Orrick, Herrington & Sutcliffe (Menlo Park) (7)
Altshuler Berzon (5)
DLA Piper (Palo Alto)
Sheppard, Mullin, Richter & Hampton (LA)
Irell & Manella (LA)
Munger, Tolles & Olsen (LA)
Proskauer Rose (LA) (8)
White & Case (LA) (7)
Milbank, Tweed, Hadley & McCloy (LA) (5)
Troutman Sanders (Irvine)
O’Melveny & Myers (Newport Beach)
Rutan & Tucker (Costa Mesa)
Curtis, Mallet-Prevost, Colt & Mosle (NY) (8)
Kramer, Levin Naftalis & Frankel (NY) (18)
Kaye Scholer (NY) (21)
mckool smith (NY) (7)
Schiff Hardin (NY) (5)
Foley & Lardner (NY) (3)
Gunderson Dettmer Stough Villenuve Franklin & Hachigian (NY) (3)
King & Spalding (NY) (5)
Vinson & Elkins (NY) (2)
Fish & Richardson (NY) (1)
Farella Braun + Martel (SF) (2)
Baker & McKenzie (SF) (2)
Nixon Peabody (SF) (3)
Shearman & Sterling (SF) (2)
Keker & Van Nest (SF) (3)
Holland & Knight (SF) (1)
Drinker Biddle & Reath (SF)
Crowell & Moring (SF) (2)
Shartsis Friese (SF) (1)
Winston & Strawn (SF) (1)

[Anonymous User]

To the above Berkeley Transfer:

I'd probably drop the Chicago firms. They're taking up prime bid real estate that will likely be needed to get some of the SF firms you rank below them (A&P was really popular this past year, for example, and I think 3-4 of their summer class were Cal kids; Orrick and Reed Smith will both likely need to be higher to get).

I'd move down the NYC firms if you can; I'm unsure how highly bid they'll be, but firms like Cleary, Simpson and Paul Weiss, which are targets for you based on your stats, probably will still be around lower, and you'll need those higher spots for SF firms.

Firms I think are wasted bids, since you won't get them due to your grades: Covington, Keker, Altschuler.

Firms I think are wasted bids, because you won't get them that low: Reed Smith, Perkins, Paul Hastings, A&P, Orrick, Sheppard, Farella, Shearman, Shartsis, Crowell. Basically, you'll be lucky to get any of these SF offices bid in the 20s.

Right now I think you have too many markets, and aren't maximizing bids. From this list, I can't really tell where you want to be, whether SF or NYC. My guess is that you'd like to be in the Bay, but are bidding NYC heavily to ensure you get a job. This is smart, but I think you should take a different tack.

1. Bid 1-15 almost exclusively SF firms. You're going to have to prioritize. Get rid of the super-reaches. Firms like Gibson and MoFo are good reaches. Covington and Keker have a lot less utility (unless Covington started liking transfers). Pick the 10-12 firms you like most and think you have the best odds at turning into callbacks.
2. Bid the next few NYC firms that you need in the top 20 to ensure you get a few of the hard-to-get offices.
3. Bid the easier-to-get SF offices in the low 20s.
4. Bid the big NYC offices that are still around in the late 20s in the late 20s.
5. Bid historically underbid firms that you might feasibly be interested in working for in the 30s. You might get lucky and get a couple.

Best of luck!

-BW's Beard.

[Anonymous Associate]

I'm a transfer at Berkeley. Top 2% at a T1 for my 1L year. Any feedback on my bidlist? The "(#)" is the expected SA class size according to NALP.

Morrison & Foerster (SF) (21)
Kirkland & Ellis (SF) (~22)
Fenwick & West (Mountain View) (25)
Wilson Sonsini (Palo Alto) (17)
Gibson Dunn & Crutcher (SF) (13)
Jones Day (SF) (9)
Ropes & Gray (SF) (8)
Cooley (Palo Alto) (15)
Latham & Watkins (SF) (11)
Simpson Thatcher & Bartlett (Palo Alto) (9)
Morgan, Lewis & Bocklus (SF) (7)
Covington & Burling (SF) (6)
Pillsbury Winthrow Shaw Pittman (SF) (5)
O’Melveny & Myers (SF)
Skadden, Arps, Slate, Meagher & Flom (NY) (73)
Paul, Weiss, Rifkind, Wharton & Garrison (NY) (81)
Davis Polk & Wardwell (NY)
Cadwalader, Wickersham & Taft (NY) (25)
WilmerHale (NY) (23)
Dechert (NY)
Cleary, Gottlieb, Steen & Hamilton (NY) (98)
Sidley Austin (Chi) (42)
Jenner & Block (Chi) (20)
Mayer Brown (Chi) (27)
Reed Smith (SF) (4)
Perkins Coie (Palo Alto) (7)
Arnold & Porter (SF) (6)
Paul Hastings (Palo Alto) (8)
Orrick, Herrington & Sutcliffe (Menlo Park) (7)
Altshuler Berzon (5)
DLA Piper (Palo Alto)
Sheppard, Mullin, Richter & Hampton (LA)
Irell & Manella (LA)
Munger, Tolles & Olsen (LA)
Proskauer Rose (LA) (8)
White & Case (LA) (7)
Milbank, Tweed, Hadley & McCloy (LA) (5)
Troutman Sanders (Irvine)
O’Melveny & Myers (Newport Beach)
Rutan & Tucker (Costa Mesa)
Curtis, Mallet-Prevost, Colt & Mosle (NY) (8)
Kramer, Levin Naftalis & Frankel (NY) (18)
Kaye Scholer (NY) (21)
McKool Smith (NY) (7)
Schiff Hardin (NY) (5)
Foley & Lardner (NY) (3)
Gunderson Dettmer Stough Villenuve Franklin & Hachigian (NY) (3)
King & Spalding (NY) (5)
Vinson & Elkins (NY) (2)
Fish & Richardson (NY) (1)
Farella Braun + Martel (SF) (2)
Baker & McKenzie (SF) (2)
Nixon Peabody (SF) (3)
Shearman & Sterling (SF) (2)
Keker & Van Nest (SF) (3)
Holland & Knight (SF) (1)
Drinker Biddle & Reath (SF)
Crowell & Moring (SF) (2)
Shartsis Friese (SF) (1)
Winston & Strawn (SF) (1)

What kind of law are you looking to do? It is a bit hard to tell from this list.

[chem]

I was able to wrangle a SF SA relatively early. Any advice on where to live? I'd like to keep the rent sub 3k if possible. Firm is in the financial district, right next the embarcadero BART stop

[Anonymous User]

I was able to wrangle a SF SA relatively early. Any advice on where to live? I'd like to keep the rent sub 3k if possible. Firm is in the financial district, right next the embarcadero BART stop

Suck it up and sublet from someone with a roommate and you can keep it under 1k/mo, esp. in the mission which is right by bart. Nightlife in the mission is dive-awesome, too.

Other places that tend to be cheap, nightlifey, but semi-close to public transport are lower haight, sometimes you can find something on the lower pac heights/nopa border since there are a lot of students that live in that area. But seriously, live in the mission, you'll be at work in like 10 minutes and the rent is decent.

Didn't mean to post anon, my bad misclick.

[chem]

I was able to wrangle a SF SA relatively early. Any advice on where to live? I'd like to keep the rent sub 3k if possible. Firm is in the financial district, right next the embarcadero BART stop

Suck it up and sublet from someone with a roommate and you can keep it under 1k/mo, esp. in the mission which is right by bart. Nightlife in the mission is dive-awesome, too.

Other places that tend to be cheap, nightlifey, but semi-close to public transport are lower haight, sometimes you can find something on the lower pac heights/nopa border since there are a lot of students that live in that area. But seriously, live in the mission, you'll be at work in like 10 minutes and the rent is decent.

Didn't mean to post anon, my bad misclick.

Wow, better than expected. How would you suggest finding a sublet? These forums/craigslist I guess?

[Anonymous User]

I was able to wrangle a SF SA relatively early. Any advice on where to live? I'd like to keep the rent sub 3k if possible. Firm is in the financial district, right next the embarcadero BART stop

Suck it up and sublet from someone with a roommate and you can keep it under 1k/mo, esp. in the mission which is right by bart. Nightlife in the mission is dive-awesome, too.

Other places that tend to be cheap, nightlifey, but semi-close to public transport are lower haight, sometimes you can find something on the lower pac heights/nopa border since there are a lot of students that live in that area. But seriously, live in the mission, you'll be at work in like 10 minutes and the rent is decent.

Didn't mean to post anon, my bad misclick.

Wow, better than expected. How would you suggest finding a sublet? These forums/craigslist I guess?

I've always had luck on CL, often you'll find a student subletting out for the summer, and USF/Hastings students are also probably looking to ditch their places over the summer quite frequently. I transferred from USF and I know a few people who had sublets available this summer.

...goddamnit, I really need to get more sleep at night and stop clicking anon.

[sundance95]

check airbnb and vrbo too, sometimes you can hit the jackpot for summer sublets there. you'd have to find your own roommate though I guess.

If I were in your shoes (no fam etc) I'd try to be in the Mission. Commuting via BART is tso tso tso much better than Muni.

[jasonbound]

I was able to wrangle a SF SA relatively early. Any advice on where to live? I'd like to keep the rent sub 3k if possible. Firm is in the financial district, right next the embarcadero BART stop

You can commute from the East Bay to SF. The area around Lake Merritt in Oakland has been going up in price, but I believe that the general thought is that you can get much more space for less in the East Bay compared to SF. Worth considering imo.

[Anonymous User]

I was able to wrangle a SF SA relatively early. Any advice on where to live? I'd like to keep the rent sub 3k if possible. Firm is in the financial district, right next the embarcadero BART stop

Suck it up and sublet from someone with a roommate and you can keep it under 1k/mo, esp. in the mission which is right by bart. Nightlife in the mission is dive-awesome, too.

Other places that tend to be cheap, nightlifey, but semi-close to public transport are lower haight, sometimes you can find something on the lower pac heights/nopa border since there are a lot of students that live in that area. But seriously, live in the mission, you'll be at work in like 10 minutes and the rent is decent.

Didn't mean to post anon, my bad misclick.

Wow, better than expected. How would you suggest finding a sublet? These forums/craigslist I guess?

If you know any students at Stanford/Berkeley/Hastings, ask one of them later on in the term (March or so) to put out a message on their listservs to see if anyone has open rooms in apartments in SF.

If you're looking to save money and easy to get to work, you could try Glen Park, which is right on the BART line (and 9 minutes from Embarcadero by train). Anything near 24th St. Mission is great, too. I've lived in this area and, even with recent price increases, it's pretty solid. If you don't mind the unpredictabilty of Muni, maybe try Noe Valley around 24th and Church St, or the Duboce Triange/Castro/Lower Haight area - Castro sublets can be had fairly cheaply, so long as you don't mind some loud gays on Friday and Saturday nights, some Sunday afternoons, and the week on either end of PRIDE weekend. I think that neighborhood is pretty fun, but some don't like living there even if they do like going out there.

You could also, I suppose, sublet in SoMa and walk to work, though I don't think SoMa is particularly fun nor does it seem to be cheap enough to justify missing out on the fun of the rest of the city.

You could also live in Rockridge or Lake Merritt over in Oakland, if you don't mind a slightly longer BART commute and want to check out the East Bay for post-grad living options.

Congrats on getting an SA this early!

-BW's Beard.

[Anonymous User]

any non-SF Bay natives (and non-CA) that scored SA/CB/Offers/Jobs care to share how you answered the "Why SF/PA/SV" type of question if it was asked?

[chem]

any non-SF Bay natives (and non-CA) that scored SA/CB/Offers/Jobs care to share how you answered the "Why SF/PA/SV" type of question if it was asked?

First time in San Francisco was the for the interview that landed me the offer. I played up IP (I was an engineer) and the fact that my fiancée was from Lodi, Ca

[Anonymous User]

I'm a transfer at Berkeley. Top 2% at a T1 for my 1L year. Any feedback on my bidlist? The "(#)" is the expected SA class size according to NALP.

Morrison & Foerster (SF) (21)
Kirkland & Ellis (SF) (~22)
Fenwick & West (Mountain View) (25)
Wilson Sonsini (Palo Alto) (17)
Gibson Dunn & Crutcher (SF) (13)
Jones Day (SF) (9)
Ropes & Gray (SF) (8)
Cooley (Palo Alto) (15)
Latham & Watkins (SF) (11)
Simpson Thatcher & Bartlett (Palo Alto) (9)
Morgan, Lewis & Bocklus (SF) (7)
Covington & Burling (SF) (6)
Pillsbury Winthrow Shaw Pittman (SF) (5)
O’Melveny & Myers (SF)
Skadden, Arps, Slate, Meagher & Flom (NY) (73)
Paul, Weiss, Rifkind, Wharton & Garrison (NY) (81)
Davis Polk & Wardwell (NY)
Cadwalader, Wickersham & Taft (NY) (25)
WilmerHale (NY) (23)
Dechert (NY)
Cleary, Gottlieb, Steen & Hamilton (NY) (98)
Sidley Austin (Chi) (42)
Jenner & Block (Chi) (20)
Mayer Brown (Chi) (27)
Reed Smith (SF) (4)
Perkins Coie (Palo Alto) (7)
Arnold & Porter (SF) (6)
Paul Hastings (Palo Alto) (8)
Orrick, Herrington & Sutcliffe (Menlo Park) (7)
Altshuler Berzon (5)
DLA Piper (Palo Alto)
Sheppard, Mullin, Richter & Hampton (LA)
Irell & Manella (LA)
Munger, Tolles & Olsen (LA)
Proskauer Rose (LA) (8)
White & Case (LA) (7)
Milbank, Tweed, Hadley & McCloy (LA) (5)
Troutman Sanders (Irvine)
O’Melveny & Myers (Newport Beach)
Rutan & Tucker (Costa Mesa)
Curtis, Mallet-Prevost, Colt & Mosle (NY) (8)
Kramer, Levin Naftalis & Frankel (NY) (18)
Kaye Scholer (NY) (21)
McKool Smith (NY) (7)
Schiff Hardin (NY) (5)
Foley & Lardner (NY) (3)
Gunderson Dettmer Stough Villenuve Franklin & Hachigian (NY) (3)
King & Spalding (NY) (5)
Vinson & Elkins (NY) (2)
Fish & Richardson (NY) (1)
Farella Braun + Martel (SF) (2)
Baker & McKenzie (SF) (2)
Nixon Peabody (SF) (3)
Shearman & Sterling (SF) (2)
Keker & Van Nest (SF) (3)
Holland & Knight (SF) (1)
Drinker Biddle & Reath (SF)
Crowell & Moring (SF) (2)
Shartsis Friese (SF) (1)
Winston & Strawn (SF) (1)

What kind of law are you looking to do? It is a bit hard to tell from this list.

Whatever kind a firm is willing to hire me to do (semi-serious). I am drawn to transactional work due to the exit options but I'm a competitive guy and would have no qualms about working in a litigation department. Plus, SF is pretty lit-heavy, so I put the big transactional firms high on my list (K&E, Sonsini, etc.), but really just went by class size in making my list. I know I've got a better shot at landing an SA with a firm that hires 20 SAs than a firm that hires 2...

[Anonymous Associate]

I'm a transfer at Berkeley. Top 2% at a T1 for my 1L year. Any feedback on my bidlist? The "(#)" is the expected SA class size according to NALP.

Morrison & Foerster (SF) (21)
Kirkland & Ellis (SF) (~22)
Fenwick & West (Mountain View) (25)
Wilson Sonsini (Palo Alto) (17)
Gibson Dunn & Crutcher (SF) (13)
Jones Day (SF) (9)
Ropes & Gray (SF) (8)
Cooley (Palo Alto) (15)
Latham & Watkins (SF) (11)
Simpson Thatcher & Bartlett (Palo Alto) (9)
Morgan, Lewis & Bocklus (SF) (7)
Covington & Burling (SF) (6)
Pillsbury Winthrow Shaw Pittman (SF) (5)
O’Melveny & Myers (SF)
Skadden, Arps, Slate, Meagher & Flom (NY) (73)
Paul, Weiss, Rifkind, Wharton & Garrison (NY) (81)
Davis Polk & Wardwell (NY)
Cadwalader, Wickersham & Taft (NY) (25)
WilmerHale (NY) (23)
Dechert (NY)
Cleary, Gottlieb, Steen & Hamilton (NY) (98)
Sidley Austin (Chi) (42)
Jenner & Block (Chi) (20)
Mayer Brown (Chi) (27)
Reed Smith (SF) (4)
Perkins Coie (Palo Alto) (7)
Arnold & Porter (SF) (6)
Paul Hastings (Palo Alto) (8)
Orrick, Herrington & Sutcliffe (Menlo Park) (7)
Altshuler Berzon (5)
DLA Piper (Palo Alto)
Sheppard, Mullin, Richter & Hampton (LA)
Irell & Manella (LA)
Munger, Tolles & Olsen (LA)
Proskauer Rose (LA) (8)
White & Case (LA) (7)
Milbank, Tweed, Hadley & McCloy (LA) (5)
Troutman Sanders (Irvine)
O’Melveny & Myers (Newport Beach)
Rutan & Tucker (Costa Mesa)
Curtis, Mallet-Prevost, Colt & Mosle (NY) (8)
Kramer, Levin Naftalis & Frankel (NY) (18)
Kaye Scholer (NY) (21)
McKool Smith (NY) (7)
Schiff Hardin (NY) (5)
Foley & Lardner (NY) (3)
Gunderson Dettmer Stough Villenuve Franklin & Hachigian (NY) (3)
King & Spalding (NY) (5)
Vinson & Elkins (NY) (2)
Fish & Richardson (NY) (1)
Farella Braun + Martel (SF) (2)
Baker & McKenzie (SF) (2)
Nixon Peabody (SF) (3)
Shearman & Sterling (SF) (2)
Keker & Van Nest (SF) (3)
Holland & Knight (SF) (1)
Drinker Biddle & Reath (SF)
Crowell & Moring (SF) (2)
Shartsis Friese (SF) (1)
Winston & Strawn (SF) (1)

What kind of law are you looking to do? It is a bit hard to tell from this list.

Whatever kind a firm is willing to hire me to do (semi-serious). I am drawn to transactional work due to the exit options but I'm a competitive guy and would have no qualms about working in a litigation department. Plus, SF is pretty lit-heavy, so I put the big transactional firms high on my list (K&E, Sonsini, etc.), but really just went by class size in making my list. I know I've got a better shot at landing an SA with a firm that hires 20 SAs than a firm that hires 2...

I don't know about all these statistics and such, but as someone who conducts interviews at one of the places on your list, expressing an interest in a certain practice is really helpful in hiring decisions. Transactional work and litigation are really different. If you are interested in transactional, I would look into different areas within transactional on these firms' websites, as M&A is different than start-up work, etc. Not that you need to limit yourself to the type of transactional work, but that would give you a better idea of what firms do what and may impact your list if you have preferences.

If you want an interview from Boalt with the big transactional SV firms (Wilson, Fenwick, Gunderson), put them even higher on your list. (I know these places do other things besides transactional.)

Your geography is all over the map. Where do you want to work?

[Anonymous User]

I'm a transfer at Berkeley. Top 2% at a T1 for my 1L year. Any feedback on my bidlist? The "(#)" is the expected SA class size according to NALP.

Morrison & Foerster (SF) (21)
Kirkland & Ellis (SF) (~22)
Fenwick & West (Mountain View) (25)
Wilson Sonsini (Palo Alto) (17)
Gibson Dunn & Crutcher (SF) (13)
Jones Day (SF) (9)
Ropes & Gray (SF) (8)
Cooley (Palo Alto) (15)
Latham & Watkins (SF) (11)
Simpson Thatcher & Bartlett (Palo Alto) (9)
Morgan, Lewis & Bocklus (SF) (7)
Covington & Burling (SF) (6)
Pillsbury Winthrow Shaw Pittman (SF) (5)
O’Melveny & Myers (SF)
Skadden, Arps, Slate, Meagher & Flom (NY) (73)
Paul, Weiss, Rifkind, Wharton & Garrison (NY) (81)
Davis Polk & Wardwell (NY)
Cadwalader, Wickersham & Taft (NY) (25)
WilmerHale (NY) (23)
Dechert (NY)
Cleary, Gottlieb, Steen & Hamilton (NY) (98)
Sidley Austin (Chi) (42)
Jenner & Block (Chi) (20)
Mayer Brown (Chi) (27)
Reed Smith (SF) (4)
Perkins Coie (Palo Alto) (7)
Arnold & Porter (SF) (6)
Paul Hastings (Palo Alto) (8)
Orrick, Herrington & Sutcliffe (Menlo Park) (7)
Altshuler Berzon (5)
DLA Piper (Palo Alto)
Sheppard, Mullin, Richter & Hampton (LA)
Irell & Manella (LA)
Munger, Tolles & Olsen (LA)
Proskauer Rose (LA) (8)
White & Case (LA) (7)
Milbank, Tweed, Hadley & McCloy (LA) (5)
Troutman Sanders (Irvine)
O’Melveny & Myers (Newport Beach)
Rutan & Tucker (Costa Mesa)
Curtis, Mallet-Prevost, Colt & Mosle (NY) (8)
Kramer, Levin Naftalis & Frankel (NY) (18)
Kaye Scholer (NY) (21)
McKool Smith (NY) (7)
Schiff Hardin (NY) (5)
Foley & Lardner (NY) (3)
Gunderson Dettmer Stough Villenuve Franklin & Hachigian (NY) (3)
King & Spalding (NY) (5)
Vinson & Elkins (NY) (2)
Fish & Richardson (NY) (1)
Farella Braun + Martel (SF) (2)
Baker & McKenzie (SF) (2)
Nixon Peabody (SF) (3)
Shearman & Sterling (SF) (2)
Keker & Van Nest (SF) (3)
Holland & Knight (SF) (1)
Drinker Biddle & Reath (SF)
Crowell & Moring (SF) (2)
Shartsis Friese (SF) (1)
Winston & Strawn (SF) (1)

What kind of law are you looking to do? It is a bit hard to tell from this list.

Whatever kind a firm is willing to hire me to do (semi-serious). I am drawn to transactional work due to the exit options but I'm a competitive guy and would have no qualms about working in a litigation department. Plus, SF is pretty lit-heavy, so I put the big transactional firms high on my list (K&E, Sonsini, etc.), but really just went by class size in making my list. I know I've got a better shot at landing an SA with a firm that hires 20 SAs than a firm that hires 2...

I don't know about all these statistics and such, but as someone who conducts interviews at one of the places on your list, expressing an interest in a certain practice is really helpful in hiring decisions. Transactional work and litigation are really different. If you are interested in transactional, I would look into different areas within transactional on these firms' websites, as M&A is different than start-up work, etc. Not that you need to limit yourself to the type of transactional work, but that would give you a better idea of what firms do what and may impact your list if you have preferences.

If you want an interview from Boalt with the big transactional SV firms (Wilson, Fenwick, Gunderson), put them even higher on your list. (I know these places do other things besides transactional.)

Your geography is all over the map. Where do you want to work?

Wilson and Fenwick are 3 and 4 right now. MoFo and K&E are more highly bid and so I put them at 1 and 2.

M&A sounds like something I'd be interested in, but how do I convincingly say that's what I want to do with my life when I have zero experience in it now? I don't even know that it's what I want to do, it just seems like something of like based on the reading I've done. I like the idea of working closely with a business, helping it expand, and dealing with all of the complexities and of the considerations that go along with it. I also like the idea of working with a startup for similar reasons.

I'm from Southern California, want to end up in the Bay (but don't have any real ties there), have a ton of family in Chicagp (and did my 1L year out there), and figured I'd bid NY because that's the place to be for transactional work.

[Anonymous Associate]

M&A sounds like something I'd be interested in, but how do I convincingly say that's what I want to do with my life when I have zero experience in it now? I don't even know that it's what I want to do, it just seems like something of like based on the reading I've done. I like the idea of working closely with a business, helping it expand, and dealing with all of the complexities and of the considerations that go along with it. I also like the idea of working with a startup for similar reasons.

Some of these things are things you can say in your interview. I'm not transactional, but I am aware that my transactional colleagues so a variety of things, esp. as jr. assoc. Not sure if it is like that everywhere.

I'm from Southern California, want to end up in the Bay (but don't have any real ties there), have a ton of family in Chicagp (and did my 1L year out there), and figured I'd bid NY because that's the place to be for transactional work.

I am sure someone will disagree with me here, but if you want to end up in the bay for sure, then get LA, NY, and Chicago outta there. Your grades alone will make you very competitive from Boalt. Transfers at Boalt get lots of love.

Your tie to the bay area is that you go to school here, like living here and have established a life and network ehre, and decided you don't want to go back to Chicago after spending a summer there.

[Anonymous User]

For those who still are tweaking bid lists: for the smaller, more selective firms (Altshuler, Keker, Leiff, Farella), you pretty much have to bid them in your top three (if not your #1 or #2) to get a screening interview. At least that's how it was my year.

[BTS1576]

I'm a Berkeley transfer student. Any feedback on my bid list would be great!


1. Morrison & Foerster
2. Keker & Van Nest LLP
3. cooley llp
4. Ropes & Gray LLP
5. Baker & McKenzie
6. Kirkland & Ellis LLP
7. Pillsbury Withrop Shaw Pittman LLP
8. Jones Day
9. Morgan, Lewis & Bockius LLP
10. Gibson Dunn & Crutcher LLP
11. Fenwick & West
12. O'Melveney & Meyers
13. Reed Smith
14. Orrick, Herrington & Sutcliffe
15. Latham & Watkins
16. Arnold & Porter
17. Skadden, Arps, Slate, Meagher & Flom
18. Bingham McCutchen
19. paul hastings llp
20. Simpson Thacher & bartlett llp
21. Covington & Burling LLP
22. nixon peabody llp
23. White & Case LLP
24. Weil, & Gotshal & Magnes LLP
25. Quinn Emmanuel
26. Davis Polk & Wardwell LLP
27. WilmerHale LLP
28. DLA Piper
29. goodwin procter llp (Sillicon Valley)
30. mayer brown llp
31. King & Spalding
32. Crowell & Moring LLP
33. Holland & Knight
34. Sheppard, Mullin, Richrer & Hampton
35. Lieff, Cabraser, Heimann & Bernstein LLP
36. Shearman & Sterling LLP
37. Greenberg Traurig LLP
38. shartsis friese llp
39. Farella Braun + Martel LLP
40. Foley & Larder
41. Gunderson ettmer Stough…
42. hogan lovells
43. Dechert LLP
44. Cleary, Gottlieb, Steen & Hamilton
45. Willson Sonsini
46. Fox Rothschild
47. Drinker Biddle & Reath
48. Littler Mendelson

[bk1]

Definitely don't put Keker second as a transfer student.