bay area firms

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Anonymous User
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Re: bay area firms

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Jun 16, 2012 3:02 am

david_niedrauer wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
david_niedrauer wrote:Of the large firms, what is the best firm for bankruptcy in the SF area? I bid very high on Jones Day and Kirkland & Ellis for the so-called diversity fair in SF. I'll have to check out MoFo. I don't remember seeing it on the list for the career fair. I bid on most of the others on OP's list, except for Gibson Dunn.

I am interested in bankruptcy and, possibly, M&A or something else, but bankruptcy was my 1L summer job. I like it, and it's the only area of law with which I'm even vaguely familiar.

How about boutiques in bankruptcy? Or tax? I do not have an accounting background.


Have you looked into Shartsis Friese? One-office firm with strong transactional practice. Pays market (i.e. $160K). Very reputable in SF.


Looks really good. Do you think I could get them to interview me in late July when I'm in the area for the SF diversity fair? How should I go about doing this?


Are you talking about BADCF? If so, then yes. I interviewed with Shartsis last year and I got that interview and callback via BADCF. I ended up going to another firm because I wanted to do litigation, but had a great impression of Shartsis.

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Lasers
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Re: bay area firms

Postby Lasers » Sat Jun 16, 2012 4:53 am

englawyer wrote:
Lasers wrote:can someone give me an estimate of which is the least grade selective big law firm in SF/CA so i can make them my #1 bid? :D


the problem is, least grade selective is somewhat proportional to the most ties-focused. the more local SF firms care less about grades but more about deep SF ties.

hm, interesting.

can you name any less grade selective firms? i've got strong ties to the region and am interested.

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Re: bay area firms

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Jun 16, 2012 11:02 am

Lasers wrote:
englawyer wrote:
Lasers wrote:can someone give me an estimate of which is the least grade selective big law firm in SF/CA so i can make them my #1 bid? :D


the problem is, least grade selective is somewhat proportional to the most ties-focused. the more local SF firms care less about grades but more about deep SF ties.

hm, interesting.

can you name any less grade selective firms? i've got strong ties to the region and am interested.


Hanson Bridgett is one of these. They don't pay market (~$125K) but they have a great presence in SF.

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Re: bay area firms

Postby jarofsoup » Sat Jun 16, 2012 12:19 pm

How grade conscious is Shartsis Friese? I am a SF native and I want to target midsized firms and this is my desired practice area.

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Re: bay area firms

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Jun 16, 2012 1:47 pm

GDC def laid off people.

I really like Howard Rice, which is now Arnold and Porter.

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Re: bay area firms

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Jun 16, 2012 3:44 pm

jarofsoup wrote:How grade conscious is Shartsis Friese? I am a SF native and I want to target midsized firms and this is my desired practice area.


I was top 20% from Hastings and I got an interview and callback, so I wouldn't say they're too grade-selective.

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Re: bay area firms

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Jun 16, 2012 3:44 pm

Anonymous User wrote:GDC def laid off people.

I really like Howard Rice, which is now Arnold and Porter.


Agreed. Howard Rice is great, as is Farella. Both are very very grade-selective though.

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ilovesf
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Re: bay area firms

Postby ilovesf » Sat Jun 16, 2012 4:28 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Are you talking about BADCF? If so, then yes. I interviewed with Shartsis last year and I got that interview and callback via BADCF. I ended up going to another firm because I wanted to do litigation, but had a great impression of Shartsis.

Does Shartsis not do a lot of lit? I want lit, but I have a lunch set up with a friend of a friend who works there, I was hoping to turn that into something.

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Re: bay area firms

Postby lowereastside » Sat Jun 16, 2012 8:01 pm

ilovesf wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Are you talking about BADCF? If so, then yes. I interviewed with Shartsis last year and I got that interview and callback via BADCF. I ended up going to another firm because I wanted to do litigation, but had a great impression of Shartsis.

Does Shartsis not do a lot of lit? I want lit, but I have a lunch set up with a friend of a friend who works there, I was hoping to turn that into something.


Shartsis is definitely a lit firm. In fact, I think of it as primarily a lit firm, with a corporate practice too. If you look at the founding partners there, they are all litigators, and they talk a lot about their lit practice in their "about us."

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Re: bay area firms

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Jun 17, 2012 2:14 am

ilovesf wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Are you talking about BADCF? If so, then yes. I interviewed with Shartsis last year and I got that interview and callback via BADCF. I ended up going to another firm because I wanted to do litigation, but had a great impression of Shartsis.

Does Shartsis not do a lot of lit? I want lit, but I have a lunch set up with a friend of a friend who works there, I was hoping to turn that into something.


Oh no, Shartsis definitely has a litigation practice. It's just that it also has a strong focus on transactional work as well. Good luck! :)

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Re: bay area firms

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Jun 17, 2012 2:20 am

Anonymous User wrote:GDC def laid off people.


They did, but not nearly as much as most firms. Their layoffs were more of a trimming the fat type than a we must lay people off to survive type. In general, the firm killed it during the recession and they are still killing it now. It's a very conservative firm financially, no debt, etc.

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Re: bay area firms

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Jun 17, 2012 12:39 pm

Hi there - stopping in with a little info about lit firms in SF. Based on your posts my understanding is that you're more interested in transactional but maybe this info would be helpful for someone else.

Quinn SF/SV - SF is bigger than SV and they are looking to grow it. SF office is heavily occupied Android patent wars. Crazy hours rear their head when you're put on a case before the International Trade Commission, of which there are many at the firm. I heard the firm is handling eleven trials this summer - like, woah. Other thing is that the firm has a strong white collar practice because of John Potter - guy has his hands in a LOT of white collar bay area stuff. someone also mentioned the problem of too rapid expansion - yeah, firm has grown a lot. like, what happens if/when Apple and Samsung settle? that said, one reason to choose a firm might be that they've given 100% offers for years and have surging profitability; they're about as healthy as they come for now.

MoFo - has a huge summer class like Quinn but is already huge. great deal of diversity in their lit practice, partners with clients in a ton of bay area things; an SF institution. they're involved in a smaller piece of the Android litigation. only problem is that in my experience the culture is a little staid. lotta married folks. it's my impression that they're doing better than Orrick these days - seems to be that way with respect to summer associate hiring this summer at least.

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Re: bay area firms

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Jun 17, 2012 12:52 pm

Can anyone offer me some advice on bidding CA?

CCN rising 2L, 3.05 gpa (puts me fairly low in the class, bottom 1/3 for sure, perhaps lower)
3 years CA WE at EY (big4 accounting firm)
CA CPA license
URM (MA)
Practice interviewing skills rated highly across the board by OCS

I am very risk averse, so I am bidding heavily on NY for my OCI bids, however were I given my choice, I would rather return to the bay area. For the BADCF I want to bid as realistically as possible to maximize success, can anyone recommend firms I should be bidding on and firms I definitely should not?

I have eliminated anything ranked higher than V50 (numerically lower)

Thanks
Last edited by Anonymous User on Sun Jun 17, 2012 1:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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bk1
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Re: bay area firms

Postby bk1 » Sun Jun 17, 2012 12:55 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I am very risk averse, so I am bidding heavily on NY for my OCI bids, however were I given my choice, I would rather return to the bay area...

I have eliminated anything lower than V50


These two sentences don't make a whole lot of sense in combination.

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Re: bay area firms

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Jun 17, 2012 1:20 pm

bk1 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I am very risk averse, so I am bidding heavily on NY for my OCI bids, however were I given my choice, I would rather return to the bay area...

I have eliminated anything lower than V50


These two sentences don't make a whole lot of sense in combination.


Numerically lower? Is that not the right way of looking at it? V40 is numerically lower than V50, should I use higher as in higher ranking instead?

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Re: bay area firms

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Jun 17, 2012 1:21 pm

*edit*

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bk1
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Re: bay area firms

Postby bk1 » Sun Jun 17, 2012 1:25 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Numerically lower? Is that not the right way of looking at it? V40 is numerically lower than V50, should I use higher as in higher ranking instead?


Oh you mean you've eliminated Vault firms ranked 1-50? I see what you meant, my mistake. I understand that you want to not go after more selective firms since you have a lower GPA, but Vault ranking isn't the way to do that, especially for CA. You should be focused on class sizes and median callback GPAs rather than Vault rankings (or any rankings at this stage).

For examples: looking at callback data I have for CA, WilmerHale and OMM are ranked right next to each other in Vault but have wildly differing callback medians. I'm also seeing Orrick with a median-ish callback median.

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Re: bay area firms

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Jun 17, 2012 1:27 pm

bk1 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Numerically lower? Is that not the right way of looking at it? V40 is numerically lower than V50, should I use higher as in higher ranking instead?


Oh you mean you've eliminated Vault firms ranked 1-50? I see what you meant, my mistake. I understand that you want to not go after more selective firms since you have a lower GPA, but Vault ranking isn't the way to do that, especially for CA. You should be focused on class sizes and median callback GPAs rather than Vault rankings (or any rankings at this stage).

For examples: looking at callback data I have for CA, WilmerHale and OMM are ranked right next to each other in Vault but have wildly differing callback medians. I'm also seeing Orrick with a median-ish callback median.


No problem, I was going back and forth on how to phrase that haha. Right on, how do you look up callback data, is that something you need to get through your school or is that publicly available? Thanks for the help!

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bk1
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Re: bay area firms

Postby bk1 » Sun Jun 17, 2012 1:33 pm

Anonymous User wrote:No problem, I was going back and forth on how to phrase that haha. Right on, how do you look up callback data, is that something you need to get through your school or is that publicly available? Thanks for the help!


Through my school. They provided median/high/low GPA callback data for each firm office and divided it by class year (we have 4 years of data, iirc). I'd talk to your OCS about getting something like that.

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Re: bay area firms

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Jun 17, 2012 3:17 pm

englawyer wrote:
Lasers wrote:can someone give me an estimate of which is the least grade selective big law firm in SF/CA so i can make them my #1 bid? :D


the problem is, least grade selective is somewhat proportional to the most ties-focused. the more local SF firms care less about grades but more about deep SF ties.


What exactly would constitute "deep ties"? My father grew up in San Jose. I lived in San Jose till I was 12. My grandmother still lives there. I have lived all over the place in my over-18 life, but not in SF or SJ.

Is this sufficient? I've probably got the grades to at least have a shot (top 20% at a top 20 outside CA).

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Re: bay area firms

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Jun 17, 2012 5:44 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
englawyer wrote:
Lasers wrote:can someone give me an estimate of which is the least grade selective big law firm in SF/CA so i can make them my #1 bid? :D


the problem is, least grade selective is somewhat proportional to the most ties-focused. the more local SF firms care less about grades but more about deep SF ties.


What exactly would constitute "deep ties"? My father grew up in San Jose. I lived in San Jose till I was 12. My grandmother still lives there. I have lived all over the place in my over-18 life, but not in SF or SJ.

Is this sufficient? I've probably got the grades to at least have a shot (top 20% at a top 20 outside CA).

Top 20% from a non-CA T20 is probably going to be tough for SF, given how competitive the legal market in the Bay is. You're saying you've done pretty well, at a pretty good school in a different state, and you want a job in one of the two tightest legal markets in the country that is also one of the hardest hit ITE and one of the most highly desired across the board.

You probably need to really play up those ties and hope SF firms are very well represented at your OCI.

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Re: bay area firms

Postby jarofsoup » Sun Jun 17, 2012 6:22 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
englawyer wrote:
Lasers wrote:can someone give me an estimate of which is the least grade selective big law firm in SF/CA so i can make them my #1 bid? :D


the problem is, least grade selective is somewhat proportional to the most ties-focused. the more local SF firms care less about grades but more about deep SF ties.


What exactly would constitute "deep ties"? My father grew up in San Jose. I lived in San Jose till I was 12. My grandmother still lives there. I have lived all over the place in my over-18 life, but not in SF or SJ.

Is this sufficient? I've probably got the grades to at least have a shot (top 20% at a top 20 outside CA).

Top 20% from a non-CA T20 is probably going to be tough for SF, given how competitive the legal market in the Bay is. You're saying you've done pretty well, at a pretty good school in a different state, and you want a job in one of the two tightest legal markets in the country that is also one of the hardest hit ITE and one of the most highly desired across the board.

You probably need to really play up those ties and hope SF firms are very well represented at your OCI.


What about significant ties to the bay area....like grew up there, entire family lives there, etc. I may be out of state for a two years at a top 20 as a transfer would it be hard to get back into the market? How about SoCal to NorCal? I am not in the market right now, but its where I would like to be.

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Neatrends
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Re: bay area firms

Postby Neatrends » Sun Jun 17, 2012 9:57 pm

If someone attends B, but has no other ties otherwise, would these firms considet that enough of a tie? (Emphasizing desire to setyle in CA long term and emphasizing school choice was made with this in mind)

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Re: bay area firms

Postby gotmilk? » Sun Jun 17, 2012 10:59 pm

Re: ties, here's a repost of something I wrote in the "Cracking San Francisco" thread that may help:

Like most things, "ties" isn't a black or white thing. It's not like there's a line between "sufficient ties" and "insufficient ties." The goal is to convince the interviewer/firm that this is the market you want to be in, so you don't run off somewhere else with their offer or training after a year or two as an associate. Someone in another somewhat recent thread (don't remember who or where) put it very well, saying that it also depends where else you have stronger ties. If you grew up in Fresno and otherwise spent your time there, then undergrad + two years of working is a great tie to SF, because it's your best tie to any major legal market. On the other hand, if you grew up in NYC, you're going to have a harder time convincing them you want SF, even if you really do.

"Ties" isn't some magical opaque thing (like grade cutoffs often are, for example) that you need tons of advice on. Just think of it from the employer's perspective. Listen to your story, and ask yourself whether it sounds like X city is your 1st choice location (and mind you, interviewers will ask where else you're looking and what ties you have to those markets). If not, re-tool your answer so that it does (or does as much as you can without stretching the truth).

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Re: bay area firms

Postby sundance95 » Mon Jun 18, 2012 4:44 pm

Any thoughts on Sheppard Mullin?




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