HLS 2012 EIP Thread Forum

[ph14]

HLS 2011 EIP Thread

Important Dates

Bidding: Jul 23, 8:00am to Jul 30, 12:00pm
Class Schedules/Conflicts Review: Jul 31, 12:00pm to Aug 01, 12:00pm
Cancellations: Aug 02, 8:00am to Aug 03, 11:59pm
Resume Review: Aug 02, 8:00am to Aug 03, 12:00pm
Open Sign-Up: Aug 02, 8:00am to Aug 03, 11:59pm

[Anonymous User]

Important Dates

Bidding: Jul 23, 8:00am to Jul 30, 12:00pm
Class Schedules/Conflicts Review: Jul 31, 12:00pm to Aug 01, 12:00pm
Cancellations: Aug 02, 8:00am to Aug 03, 11:59pm
Resume Review: Aug 02, 8:00am to Aug 03, 12:00pm
Open Sign-Up: Aug 02, 8:00am to Aug 03, 11:59pm

Thanks for starting, though it's a little early. just jumping in to suggest that people who comment in this thread anonymously adopt a specific "anonymous identity" so that we (and future classes) will be able to track the same people from Bid Lists through Call Backs. Last year, a few people asked about particular chances, and then the topic progressed to callbacks and offers, but observers can't figure out what the answers to the questions were. Obviously the more info you give out, the more your anonymity is in question, but there should be a balance within which the thread will be more informative and you will still be safe.
I suggest that people who post anonymously sign their posts with a particular word (number? Color? animal?) each time they post. I will start.

Love,

Vengeful

[Anonymous User]

Great idea. Calling dibs on Taco Cabana.

Love,
Taco Cabana.

[Anonymous User]

Starting to think about bids... There's a decent sized firm with offices in a secondary market to which I have really strong ties and would love to move back. They have interviewed heavily in the past, but have barely any slots this year and worse, the interviews are for multiple offices. My grades are probably not in their wheelhouse, but the ties might overcome that. Should I:

1. Bid really high and hope to snag one of the rare slots?
2. Bid where they belong strategically and contact them outside of OCI if I don't get a slot?
3. Don't waste a bid at all, and explain that slots were scarce but I want to interview?
4. Give up because they're not hiring - they're only showing up because they need to.

Vengeful

[Anonymous User]

Starting to think about bids... There's a decent sized firm with offices in a secondary market to which I have really strong ties and would love to move back. They have interviewed heavily in the past, but have barely any slots this year and worse, the interviews are for multiple offices. My grades are probably not in their wheelhouse, but the ties might overcome that. Should I:

1. Bid really high and hope to snag one of the rare slots?
2. Bid where they belong strategically and contact them outside of OCI if I don't get a slot?
3. Don't waste a bid at all, and explain that slots were scarce but I want to interview?
4. Give up because they're not hiring - they're only showing up because they need to.

Vengeful

It's hard to say without seeing the rest of your bid list. 1. if you aren't too reach-heavy. 2. if you have a reach-heavy list. Don't do 4--no reason to give up unless their time slots somehow overlap with other firms that you have much better odds at and that you also enjoy.

Cheers,
Taco Cabana

[Anonymous User]

Anyone have an idea of what kind of grades you need to be competetive at W&C and Covington D.C.?

Grip it and rip it,
John Daly

[Anonymous User]

Anyone know of really non-selective firms that are still reputable?

[Anonymous User]

Anyone know of really non-selective firms that are still reputable?

Define reputable.

Hearts, stars, and horseshoes,
Taco Cabana

[Anonymous User]

Anyone know of really non-selective firms that are still reputable?

Define reputable.

Hearts, stars, and horseshoes,
Taco Cabana

I guess all big law is reputable.

- Jumping Jack

[Anonymous User]

Any thoughts on the riskiness of going strictly SF/DC (ties to both towns, IP focus) with 9H/1P?

I don't really want NY, but I also don't want to get shut out by the unpredictability of these markets...

-chaos muppet

[Anonymous User]

Any thoughts on the riskiness of going strictly SF/DC (ties to both towns, IP focus) with 9H/1P?

I don't really want NY, but I also don't want to get shut out by the unpredictability of these markets...

-chaos muppet

Chaos Muppet, PLEASE PLEASE tell me your secret. (9P 1H)

-JumpingJack

[Anonymous User]

Any thoughts on the riskiness of going strictly SF/DC (ties to both towns, IP focus) with 9H/1P?

I don't really want NY, but I also don't want to get shut out by the unpredictability of these markets...

-chaos muppet

Chaos Muppet, PLEASE PLEASE tell me your secret. (9P 1H)

-JumpingJack

Luck? An aesthetically pleasing exam ID number?

-Chaos Muppet

[englawyer]

Any thoughts on the riskiness of going strictly SF/DC (ties to both towns, IP focus) with 9H/1P?

I don't really want NY, but I also don't want to get shut out by the unpredictability of these markets...

-chaos muppet

you will absolutely get something in SF/SV and in DC. i'd also mass mail Finnegan DC because they oddly do not participate in EIP but have a great IP practice.

[Anonymous User]

Any thoughts on the riskiness of going strictly SF/DC (ties to both towns, IP focus) with 9H/1P?

I don't really want NY, but I also don't want to get shut out by the unpredictability of these markets...

-chaos muppet

Do you have an IP background? If so, you are definitely employment secure. If not, you probably are employment secure anyways.

Grip it and rip it,
John Daly

[Anonymous User]

Starting to think about bids... There's a decent sized firm with offices in a secondary market to which I have really strong ties and would love to move back. They have interviewed heavily in the past, but have barely any slots this year and worse, the interviews are for multiple offices. My grades are probably not in their wheelhouse, but the ties might overcome that. Should I:

1. Bid really high and hope to snag one of the rare slots?
2. Bid where they belong strategically and contact them outside of OCI if I don't get a slot?
3. Don't waste a bid at all, and explain that slots were scarce but I want to interview?
4. Give up because they're not hiring - they're only showing up because they need to.

Vengeful

If it's a firm you really want to be at and not a lot of slots, I would bid them high, and then mass mail if you don't get an interview.

Grip it and rip it,
John Daly

[snailio]

Any thoughts on the riskiness of going strictly SF/DC (ties to both towns, IP focus) with 9H/1P?

I don't really want NY, but I also don't want to get shut out by the unpredictability of these markets...

-chaos muppet

You're a lock, I know someone with 7H's with two deans scholars, your equivalent, only bid California, got 23/25 call backs took his first pick and was done before fly out week.

[ph14]

Any thoughts on the riskiness of going strictly SF/DC (ties to both towns, IP focus) with 9H/1P?

I don't really want NY, but I also don't want to get shut out by the unpredictability of these markets...

-chaos muppet

You're a lock, I know someone with 7H's with two deans scholars, your equivalent, only bid California, got 23/25 call backs took his first pick and was done before fly out week.

How come you have no pm button? Can you pm me?

[Anonymous User]

Any thoughts on the riskiness of going strictly SF/DC (ties to both towns, IP focus) with 9H/1P?

I don't really want NY, but I also don't want to get shut out by the unpredictability of these markets...

-chaos muppet

you will absolutely get something in SF/SV and in DC. i'd also mass mail Finnegan DC because they oddly do not participate in EIP but have a great IP practice.

How about only 6H/4P? Imprudent to apply almost entirely to DC (not IP)? Ties there, none to NY (never even been there).

- Jensen's Inequality

[englawyer]

Any thoughts on the riskiness of going strictly SF/DC (ties to both towns, IP focus) with 9H/1P?

I don't really want NY, but I also don't want to get shut out by the unpredictability of these markets...

-chaos muppet

you will absolutely get something in SF/SV and in DC. i'd also mass mail Finnegan DC because they oddly do not participate in EIP but have a great IP practice.

How about only 6H/4P? Imprudent to apply almost entirely to DC (not IP)? Ties there, none to NY (never even been there).

- Jensen's Inequality

i know people that got DC with similar or slightly worse grades, but i can't speak to the riskiness of the strategy. i think at a minimum you would be fine with mostly dc and a little ny to be on the safe side

[094320]

..

[Anonymous User]

Okay, here's the tentative bid list I am putting together in no particular order yet. I suspect it may be too ambitious. I have three H/7P, though one P is from a seminar. Strong upward trend in that all the Hs were from the spring. Hoping for Boston, NY for safety.

The Boston firms are basically all of them, except ones that do only IP and some that don't pay market. The New York firms were chosen somewhat haphazardly, based on my gut feelings on a selectivity/quality ratio. I suspect that since NY is generally the safety market for me, the NY picks are too high. I welcome - nay, urge - feedback. What firms am I missing? What should I not bother bidding on?

Signed,

Justice Homes

Boston firms
Bingham McCutchen
Brown Rudnick
Choate, Hall & Stewart
Cooley
Dechert
Fish & Richardson
Foley & Lardner
foley hoag
Goodwin Procter
Goulston & Storrs
Gunderson Dettmer
Jones Day
K&L Gates
Latham & Watkins
Mintz, Levin, Cohn, Ferris, Glovsky and Popeo
Nutter, McClennen & Fish
Proskauer Rose
Ropes & Gray
Skadden, Arps, Slate, Meagher & Flom
Weil Gotshal & Manges
WilmerHale

New York Firms
Kirkland & Ellis
Weil Gotshal
Debevoise
Cleary
White & Case
Boies
MoFo
Fried Frank
Jones Day

[Anonymous User]

Okay, here's the tentative bid list I am putting together in no particular order yet. I suspect it may be too ambitious. I have three H/7P, though one P is from a seminar. Strong upward trend in that all the Hs were from the spring. Hoping for Boston, NY for safety.

The Boston firms are basically all of them, except ones that do only IP and some that don't pay market. The New York firms were chosen somewhat haphazardly, based on my gut feelings on a selectivity/quality ratio. I suspect that since NY is generally the safety market for me, the NY picks are too high. I welcome - nay, urge - feedback. What firms am I missing? What should I not bother bidding on?

Signed,

Justice Homes

Boston firms
Bingham McCutchen
Brown Rudnick
Choate, Hall & Stewart
Cooley
Dechert
Fish & Richardson
Foley & Lardner
Foley Hoag
Goodwin Procter
Goulston & Storrs
Gunderson Dettmer
Jones Day
K&L Gates
Latham & Watkins
Mintz, Levin, Cohn, Ferris, Glovsky and Popeo
Nutter, McClennen & Fish
Proskauer Rose
Ropes & Gray
Skadden, Arps, Slate, Meagher & Flom
Weil Gotshal & Manges
WilmerHale

New York Firms
Kirkland & Ellis
Weil Gotshal
Debevoise
Cleary
White & Case
Boies
MoFo
Fried Frank
Jones Day

I don't know much about the Boston market but I think ties are really important for them. Even if they like Harvard students, they want to make sure you won't ditch them for NYC. I think it's fine to bid on all the Boston firms, just make sure they're not all on campus the same day.

If you're using NY as a safety net, I'd say Boies, Cleary and Weil should not be considered "safeties," but if you have the extra bids go ahead. Depending on what practice area you're interested in I'd consider places like Milbank, Cadwalader, Sherman & Sterling, and Freshfields.

I've also come up with a list that I'd love feedback on. 4H/6P and am bidding exclusively in NY. Interested in corporate work.

1. Weil
2. Latham
3. Jones Day
4. Akin Gump
5. Kirkland & Ellis
6. Sidley Austin
7. White & Case
8. Paul Weiss
9. Gibson Dunn
10. Simpson Thacher
11. Shearman & Sterling
12. Fried, Frank
13. Cleary
14. Davis Polk
15. Cadwalader
16. Milbank
17. Proskauer
18. Debevoise
19. Willkie
20. Linklaters
21. Skadden
22. Sullivan & Cromwell
23. Cravath
24. Ropes
25. clifford chance

Thoughts?

Signed,
Hula Hoop

[englawyer]

Okay, here's the tentative bid list I am putting together in no particular order yet. I suspect it may be too ambitious. I have three H/7P, though one P is from a seminar. Strong upward trend in that all the Hs were from the spring. Hoping for Boston, NY for safety.

The Boston firms are basically all of them, except ones that do only IP and some that don't pay market. The New York firms were chosen somewhat haphazardly, based on my gut feelings on a selectivity/quality ratio. I suspect that since NY is generally the safety market for me, the NY picks are too high. I welcome - nay, urge - feedback. What firms am I missing? What should I not bother bidding on?

Signed,

Justice Homes

Boston firms
Bingham McCutchen
Brown Rudnick
Choate, Hall & Stewart
Cooley
Dechert
Fish & Richardson
Foley & Lardner
Foley Hoag
Goodwin Procter
Goulston & Storrs
Gunderson Dettmer
Jones Day
K&L Gates
Latham & Watkins
Mintz, Levin, Cohn, Ferris, Glovsky and Popeo
Nutter, McClennen & Fish
Proskauer Rose
Ropes & Gray
Skadden, Arps, Slate, Meagher & Flom
Weil Gotshal & Manges
WilmerHale

New York Firms
Kirkland & Ellis
Weil Gotshal
Debevoise
Cleary
White & Case
Boies
MoFo
Fried Frank
Jones Day

Speaking on Boston picks:

fish and richardson is IP only.

The only top tier GP firms with large offices in Boston are Ropes, Wilmer, Goodwin, and Bingham. Mintz/Nutter/Choate/foley hoag/Brown/K&L are second tier GP firms, and you can probably get a better firm in NY if you are so inclined. That said, they are reasonable choices if geography is your main priority.

Most of the other firms are satellite offices in Boston with few practice groups, so make sure you are SURE you want the practice groups they offer or else they are bad choices (ie Gunderson is great for startup corporate work, but almost non-existent for anything else).

[AllTheLawz]

How are you guys going about coming up with a coherent bid order strategy? Most of the firms I am looking at have had so many slots that they interviewed nearly everybody that bid (according to last year's EIP stats).. I basically only have 4-5 firms that need to be in my top 10 and at least one of those is a place that is fairly unlikely to hire me. Does bid order even matter for people not bidding NYC?

[concurrent fork]

Okay, here's the tentative bid list I am putting together in no particular order yet. I suspect it may be too ambitious. I have three H/7P, though one P is from a seminar. Strong upward trend in that all the Hs were from the spring. Hoping for Boston, NY for safety.

The Boston firms are basically all of them, except ones that do only IP and some that don't pay market. The New York firms were chosen somewhat haphazardly, based on my gut feelings on a selectivity/quality ratio. I suspect that since NY is generally the safety market for me, the NY picks are too high. I welcome - nay, urge - feedback. What firms am I missing? What should I not bother bidding on?

Signed,

Justice Homes

Boston firms
Bingham McCutchen
Brown Rudnick
Choate, Hall & Stewart
Cooley
Dechert
Fish & Richardson
Foley & Lardner
Foley Hoag
Goodwin Procter
Goulston & Storrs
Gunderson Dettmer
Jones Day
K&L Gates
Latham & Watkins
Mintz, Levin, Cohn, Ferris, Glovsky and Popeo
Nutter, McClennen & Fish
Proskauer Rose
Ropes & Gray
Skadden, Arps, Slate, Meagher & Flom
Weil Gotshal & Manges
WilmerHale

New York Firms
Kirkland & Ellis
Weil Gotshal
Debevoise
Cleary
White & Case
Boies
MoFo
Fried Frank
Jones Day

Speaking on Boston picks:

Fish and Richardson is IP only.

The only top tier GP firms with large offices in Boston are Ropes, Wilmer, Goodwin, and Bingham. Mintz/Nutter/Choate/Foley Hoag/Brown/K&L are second tier GP firms, and you can probably get a better firm in NY if you are so inclined. That said, they are reasonable choices if geography is your main priority.

Most of the other firms are satellite offices in Boston with few practice groups, so make sure you are SURE you want the practice groups they offer or else they are bad choices (ie Gunderson is great for startup corporate work, but almost non-existent for anything else).

I think you'll easily get something in Boston with median. Bidlist looks pretty good -- my year the larger firms didn't fill their schedule (and Ropes interviewed anyone who was interested regardless of bids), so you don't need to have them anywhere near the top.

I generally agree with the above. For "first tier" I would put Bingham slightly below the other three. They slashed their class size after 2008 and have not brought it back up. For "second tier" foley hoag and Choate have a slightly better rep than the others, although it could just be because they pay market.

Re: the other Boston satellite offices, Weil is almost exclusively PE, Skadden is a mix of lit and M&A, Latham and JD are both brand new offices so I don't know anything about them. It's hard to rank any of these based on tiers or desirability, but I know a couple of people who took them over the big Boston offices for various reasons.