2012 UVA OGI Thread

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Re: 2012 UVA OGI Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Jun 23, 2012 1:24 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:How suicidal is anything other than going all-out for New York? I have a 3.45 and am trying to construct my bidlist. As much as I know it's probably my best shot at biglaw, I just can't get myself over the fact that I really, really don't want to live in New York.

I'm from a small Midwestern market which I would definitely be fine ending up in, but has fewer than ten biglaw/midlaw firms, so that's not really something I can count on.

I feel like I can make a credible case for wanting to be in LA (dad grew up there, grandparents and aunt and uncle still live there, visited a lot, love it, etc.) and Dallas (wife has lots of family in North Texas, one other thing that would definitely out me), and I'm planning on doing the on-tour interview programs in both of these cities. But none of these things are evident from my résumé. So am I right in assuming that I'm going to get slaughtered if I bid these markets?

I'll suck it up and bid New York if it's the only way to ensure (as much as one can) not striking out, but I'd rather avoid it if there's any other way.

-Lane


Very interested in this as well. Similar grade (3.53), but basically no tie to LA. A few years of corporate-related work experience. Would Irell, GDC, and OMM be wasted bids?


Blood Bath -- making a credible case is fine, but it might be wasted if you don't convince them

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Re: 2012 UVA OGI Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Jun 24, 2012 1:03 am

I think I'll be going to the job fairs in Texas put on by the school. Should I be bidding on firms at those fairs that already show up to OGI or should I only be bidding on them through the OGI process or both? I couldn't find anything in the handbook about it. I am around top 15% and have strong Texas ties.

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Re: 2012 UVA OGI Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Jun 24, 2012 1:10 am

Anonymous User wrote:I think I'll be going to the job fairs in Texas put on by the school. Should I be bidding on firms at those fairs that already show up to OGI or should I only be bidding on them through the OGI process or both? I couldn't find anything in the handbook about it. I am around top 15% and have strong Texas ties.


I bid on a few firms both at the Loyola Patent Interview Program (in Chicago) and at OGI and, oddly enough, two firms pre-selected me at OGI which didn't pre-select me for the LPIP. If you really really want to work in Texas, I think it's best to double bid your top Texas firms, IMO.

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Re: 2012 UVA OGI Thread

Postby desertlaw » Sun Jun 24, 2012 10:27 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I think I'll be going to the job fairs in Texas put on by the school. Should I be bidding on firms at those fairs that already show up to OGI or should I only be bidding on them through the OGI process or both? I couldn't find anything in the handbook about it. I am around top 15% and have strong Texas ties.


I bid on a few firms both at the Loyola Patent Interview Program (in Chicago) and at OGI and, oddly enough, two firms pre-selected me at OGI which didn't pre-select me for the LPIP. If you really really want to work in Texas, I think it's best to double bid your top Texas firms, IMO.


Only concern would be that if the Job Fair is pre-OGI, and you end up getting callback/offer, you've wasted a bid at OGI. But I can't imagine there are 50 TX firms. So maybe doubling up is the safe, correct response. OP - you need to practice serious interviewing. Your grades are super impressive but probably not enough for a place like Gibson to auto-offer you. Get some charm and some people skills, and you'll be looking at 10+ offers. Practice, I'm talking about practice. Not a real interview, not a real interview. Just start with practice.

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Law Sauce
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Re: 2012 UVA OGI Thread

Postby Law Sauce » Tue Jun 26, 2012 3:33 pm

Law Sauce wrote:Is using my essay from journal tryouts for a writing sample a bad idea? It is ten full pages and it is not exactly case analysis in the same way that a memo from LRW is.


Thoughts on this versus using a research memo from lrw? Thoughts on writing sample generally?

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Re: 2012 UVA OGI Thread

Postby 5ky » Tue Jun 26, 2012 6:48 pm

Law Sauce wrote:
Law Sauce wrote:Is using my essay from journal tryouts for a writing sample a bad idea? It is ten full pages and it is not exactly case analysis in the same way that a memo from LRW is.


Thoughts on this versus using a research memo from lrw? Thoughts on writing sample generally?


I used my LRW memo and it wasn't a problem, although I cut it down to 10 pages and just used the analysis section. I would have been hesitant to use my write-on memo unless I wrote on to VLR, just because I wouldn't have any idea if it were SPS or not.

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Re: 2012 UVA OGI Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 26, 2012 8:39 pm

Any thoughts on using something done during the summer as a writing sample vs. my LRW memo? I've written what I think is a decent bench brief in support of a pre-trial motion during my PI gig. It's obviously going to be less of a biglaw type of issue than our LRW problem and it's not as polished, but my gut tells me that it might be better to use something "real."

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Re: 2012 UVA OGI Thread

Postby 5ky » Tue Jun 26, 2012 9:08 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Any thoughts on using something done during the summer as a writing sample vs. my LRW memo? I've written what I think is a decent bench brief in support of a pre-trial motion during my PI gig. It's obviously going to be less of a biglaw type of issue than our LRW problem and it's not as polished, but my gut tells me that it might be better to use something "real."


Personally, I would use something from a 1L summer if you've got it, and know it isn't bad. I have heard that sometimes firms will prefer writing they know has not been as polished and coated as a 1L LRW memo. But, as I said, that's what I used, and it was fine for me.

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Re: 2012 UVA OGI Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 26, 2012 10:27 pm

Law Sauce wrote:Is using my essay from journal tryouts for a writing sample a bad idea? It is ten full pages and it is not exactly case analysis in the same way that a memo from LRW is.


I would not use the essay from journal tryouts. Even a good tryout that got you onto VLR is not at the quality of writing that I would want to use as a writing sample.

-'12 Grad

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Re: 2012 UVA OGI Thread

Postby Law Sauce » Wed Jun 27, 2012 10:02 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Law Sauce wrote:Is using my essay from journal tryouts for a writing sample a bad idea? It is ten full pages and it is not exactly case analysis in the same way that a memo from LRW is.


I would not use the essay from journal tryouts. Even a good tryout that got you onto VLR is not at the quality of writing that I would want to use as a writing sample.

-'12 Grad


Ok thanks guys

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Re: 2012 UVA OGI Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 27, 2012 10:46 am

Any suggestions for the many of us who are 3.5ish and interested in NY to help narrow down the bid list?

Eliminate the ones with the highest GPA callbacks (above mine) or eliminate ones with really small class sizes? It seems like I wouldn't have a great shot at either of those categories, but any thoughts about if I have a marginally better shot at one than the other?

-A. Wintour

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Re: 2012 UVA OGI Thread

Postby RVP11 » Wed Jun 27, 2012 11:41 am

Anonymous User wrote:Any suggestions for the many of us who are 3.5ish and interested in NY to help narrow down the bid list?


Hasn't most of this thread been devoted to people who are 3.5ish and interested in NY?

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Re: 2012 UVA OGI Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 27, 2012 12:17 pm

RVP11 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Any suggestions for the many of us who are 3.5ish and interested in NY to help narrow down the bid list?


Hasn't most of this thread been devoted to people who are 3.5ish and interested in NY?


Sort of? But other than noting that Cravath/S&C are probably wasted bids I haven't seen much in the way of narrowing down, but I'll go back and read through again. From what I've read most of the advice has generally been about ordering/what firms to put in the top 10 and not so much which firms to take off the list entirely.

So my question isn't at all limited to 3.5ish people, I was just noting that I fall in that category. Really its more general. With 80ish NY firms how do I make up a list of only 50?

-A. Wintour

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Re: 2012 UVA OGI Thread

Postby RVP11 » Wed Jun 27, 2012 1:20 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
RVP11 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Any suggestions for the many of us who are 3.5ish and interested in NY to help narrow down the bid list?


Hasn't most of this thread been devoted to people who are 3.5ish and interested in NY?


Sort of? But other than noting that Cravath/S&C are probably wasted bids I haven't seen much in the way of narrowing down, but I'll go back and read through again. From what I've read most of the advice has generally been about ordering/what firms to put in the top 10 and not so much which firms to take off the list entirely.

So my question isn't at all limited to 3.5ish people, I was just noting that I fall in that category. Really its more general. With 80ish NY firms how do I make up a list of only 50?

-A. Wintour


At some point, you might have to research firms yourself, and maybe even take a risk. I, and many others, managed to do it two years ago without the aid of having throngs of OGI veterans on TLS.

This thread has provided just about all of the institutional knowledge it can for someone who is ~3.5 going for NYC. To summarize:

"Hey bro, don't bother bidding on Cravath and S&C. Paul Weiss is probably off the table, too. Every other NYC firm that comes to OGI is reasonably game. It is best to bid on firms with historically big class sizes."

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Re: 2012 UVA OGI Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 27, 2012 2:37 pm

RVP11 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
RVP11 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Any suggestions for the many of us who are 3.5ish and interested in NY to help narrow down the bid list?


Hasn't most of this thread been devoted to people who are 3.5ish and interested in NY?


Sort of? But other than noting that Cravath/S&C are probably wasted bids I haven't seen much in the way of narrowing down, but I'll go back and read through again. From what I've read most of the advice has generally been about ordering/what firms to put in the top 10 and not so much which firms to take off the list entirely.

So my question isn't at all limited to 3.5ish people, I was just noting that I fall in that category. Really its more general. With 80ish NY firms how do I make up a list of only 50?

-A. Wintour


At some point, you might have to research firms yourself, and maybe even take a risk. I, and many others, managed to do it two years ago without the aid of having throngs of OGI veterans on TLS.

This thread has provided just about all of the institutional knowledge it can for someone who is ~3.5 going for NYC. To summarize:

"Hey bro, don't bother bidding on Cravath and S&C. Paul Weiss is probably off the table, too. Every other NYC firm that comes to OGI is reasonably game. It is best to bid on firms with historically big class sizes."


My apologies, I will do some research myself.

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Re: 2012 UVA OGI Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 29, 2012 12:00 pm

So I have a little over a 3.6 and I am bidding a couple markets including Denver, Chicago, and NY. I am looking at my bid list and I am realizing that all of my top ten bids are firms whose callback average is above a 3.5 (or in other words, in the most selective category that CSO broke the firms down into). I have almost all of my NY V50 type firms in the middle and bottom of my bid list. Is this being too aggressive? Is it a bad idea to rely on PS so heavily or should I bid some safer firms higher?

Any advice on interviewing for Denver or Chicago would also be helpful.

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Re: 2012 UVA OGI Thread

Postby Reinschmicker » Fri Jun 29, 2012 12:11 pm

Anonymous User wrote:So I have a little over a 3.6 and I am bidding a couple markets including Denver, Chicago, and NY. I am looking at my bid list and I am realizing that all of my top ten bids are firms whose callback average is above a 3.5 (or in other words, in the most selective category that CSO broke the firms down into). I have almost all of my NY V50 type firms in the middle and bottom of my bid list. Is this being too aggressive? Is it a bad idea to rely on PS so heavily or should I bid some safer firms higher?

Any advice on interviewing for Denver or Chicago would also be helpful.


For Denver, clearly you should just highlight your desire to ride bikes, hike, drink microbrews and smoke medical weed all day every day. That all we do here, firm attorneys too I'm pretty sure.

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Re: 2012 UVA OGI Thread

Postby RVP11 » Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:50 pm

Anonymous User wrote:So I have a little over a 3.6 and I am bidding a couple markets including Denver, Chicago, and NY. I am looking at my bid list and I am realizing that all of my top ten bids are firms whose callback average is above a 3.5 (or in other words, in the most selective category that CSO broke the firms down into). I have almost all of my NY V50 type firms in the middle and bottom of my bid list. Is this being too aggressive? Is it a bad idea to rely on PS so heavily or should I bid some safer firms higher?

Any advice on interviewing for Denver or Chicago would also be helpful.


You're going to get the max number of interviews just from your preselects. I don't think you should waste much time worrying about your bid order.

If anything, it's easier to pick up lottery spots with V10s (and similar firms looking for 3.5+) because they tend to get fewer bids than firms like White & Case who get every NYC-interested person with a 3.2+ (over 100 people) bidding on them.

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Re: 2012 UVA OGI Thread

Postby 5ky » Sat Jun 30, 2012 12:17 am

RVP11 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:So I have a little over a 3.6 and I am bidding a couple markets including Denver, Chicago, and NY. I am looking at my bid list and I am realizing that all of my top ten bids are firms whose callback average is above a 3.5 (or in other words, in the most selective category that CSO broke the firms down into). I have almost all of my NY V50 type firms in the middle and bottom of my bid list. Is this being too aggressive? Is it a bad idea to rely on PS so heavily or should I bid some safer firms higher?

Any advice on interviewing for Denver or Chicago would also be helpful.


You're going to get the max number of interviews just from your preselects. I don't think you should waste much time worrying about your bid order.

If anything, it's easier to pick up lottery spots with V10s (and similar firms looking for 3.5+) because they tend to get fewer bids than firms like White & Case who get every NYC-interested person with a 3.2+ (over 100 people) bidding on them.


+1 to that.

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Re: 2012 UVA OGI Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Jun 30, 2012 1:52 pm

Hi Guys, I am probably bottom 15% and have the beginning of my list solidified with a secondary market. Can someone help with the bottom of my list (or bid list in general)? If so let me know and I will PM you, since I do not want to overburden this thread. I am looking at CA for the top of the list.

Thanks guys!

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Re: 2012 UVA OGI Thread

Postby jawsthegreat » Sat Jun 30, 2012 2:03 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Hi Guys, I am probably bottom 15% and have the beginning of my list solidified with a secondary market. Can someone help with the bottom of my list (or bid list in general)? If so let me know and I will PM you, since I do not want to overburden this thread. I am looking at CA for the top of the list.

Thanks guys!


You can PM me.

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Re: 2012 UVA OGI Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jul 02, 2012 3:54 am

Trying to figure out this Preselect system. Say there's a firm that I think I have a good shot at getting Preselected by (let's say Willkie: I have a 3.5, they have a median callback range of 3.4-3.5, and they have 60 interview slots this year). Should I be putting them really high because they have a big class size and I think I have a good chance at an offer there? Or should I be putting them really low because I think I have a good chance at being Preselected there and should use high slots to try to lottery my way into firms with only 20 interview slots?

ETA: Also, what kind of grades are needed for Boies? I'm assuming really high?

Carly Rae J

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Re: 2012 UVA OGI Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jul 02, 2012 4:11 pm

If I already accepted the interview at Loyola, is it a "waste" to use another bid on the same firm, even for a different office? As you know, obviously we can't expect anything about the interview one way or the other before 7/15.

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Re: 2012 UVA OGI Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jul 03, 2012 5:22 pm

To 2Ls and 3Ls, any idea what is the lowest you can put a popular firm (NYC, 100+ bids historically) and still hope for a lottery?

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Re: 2012 UVA OGI Thread

Postby Law Sauce » Tue Jul 03, 2012 7:49 pm

Anonymous User wrote:To 2Ls and 3Ls, any idea what is the lowest you can put a popular firm (NYC, 100+ bids historically) and still hope for a lottery?


CSO said around 5. Seems about right.




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