Another Depressed (URM) Law Student Here...

(On Campus Interviews, Summer Associate positions, Firm Reviews, Tips, ...)
Forum rules
Anonymous Posting

Anonymous posting is only appropriate when you are revealing sensitive employment related information about a firm, job, etc. You may anonymously respond on topic to these threads. Unacceptable uses include: harassing another user, joking around, testing the feature, or other things that are more appropriate in the lounge.

Failure to follow these rules will get you outed, warned, or banned.
lifehopeful
Posts: 12
Joined: Fri May 18, 2012 2:32 pm

Another Depressed (URM) Law Student Here...

Postby lifehopeful » Fri May 18, 2012 2:38 pm

I once hit rock bottom. I graduated at the bottom of my high school class, had minor legal trouble (false accusations of threats and DTP which I think are on my record) my parents couldn't stand me, bombed my SAT, and (surprisingly) got into one college. Even more embarrassing, I told myself I was going to get into law school-somehow, someway.

During the summer between my senior of high school and freshman year of college, I had an epiphany of sorts. Change was the motto and I was determined to end the next chapter of my life on a good note. My college career ended with a 3.5 gpa, numerous awards and honor societies, finally made my parents proud and received acceptances into a considerable amount top law schools.

I matriculated to a law school in the T20-T30 range with renewed faith in myself once again. But, again, I hit rock bottom. I studied hard (honestly) and ended my first year well below median. I sent hundreds of job applications but did not receive one interview. Ultimately, I did end up working for a smaller law firm and that was as a result of a desperation attempt in emailing random attorneys that I had absolutely no connections too.

During the summer, I had a great experience and decided to take life into my hands again and tried to secure a better/more prestigious job for my 2L summer. I read books, networked with a shitload of attorneys from all aspects of life, and did a lot of research. The result? One interview with a medium-sized firm at one of the minority law fairs. No, I didn't get the job. I sent more applications last semester but, still, no interviews albeit with slightly better grades.

This semester I've sent an abundance of applications to all sorts of companies, firms, and other organizations; from paid to unpaid. Of course, I still can not seem to secure an interview. Its almost June and I do not seem to know what to do. I mean, is it possible to only be able to only secure one lone interview from an employer this deep in one's law school career? I don't know. At my school, it seems to be a prestige game, the students who have secured firm jobs hang out with each other constantly and, in a sense, belittle us less unfortunate (even some black urms). At the moment, I feel the same way that I did in high school but just like back then I don't want to give up; I can't. I battled through so much adversity back during my adolescent years that just the thought of dropping out would be adversity kicking me in the ass. I recently just started my summer break and I'm stuck with no jobs at this point. I've even applied to random unpaid and paid graduate and undergraduate level internships/jobs with absolutely no luck. WTF is going on?

So, all in all, i'm in state of mind that involves confusion, depression, and helplessness. This post is more of a vent but all comments and/or advice is appreciated. Thanks.
Last edited by lifehopeful on Fri May 18, 2012 2:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

premier2t
Posts: 19
Joined: Tue Jun 08, 2010 1:00 pm

Re: Another Depressed (URM) Law Student Here...

Postby premier2t » Fri May 18, 2012 2:45 pm

Hang in there. I know this will sound trite, but the most successful people in life are those who fall 7 times, but get up 8. Keep ya head up.

User avatar
DCDuck
Posts: 242
Joined: Mon Apr 06, 2009 4:27 pm

Re: Another Depressed (URM) Law Student Here...

Postby DCDuck » Fri May 18, 2012 2:46 pm

Quote: "Its almost April"

This might be part of your problem; It's mid-May.
Yeah, the job market is bad. Sounds like you are doing everything right. Keep sending out resumes to broader and broader kinds of jobs. Good luck, and hang in there. You are definitely not alone.

lifehopeful
Posts: 12
Joined: Fri May 18, 2012 2:32 pm

Re: Another Depressed (URM) Law Student Here...

Postby lifehopeful » Fri May 18, 2012 3:12 pm

Its all just frustrating. I mean, I've snagged way more interviews during undergrad. Now, getting an interview is virtually impossible and it seems like I may be overqualified when it comes to more 'inferior' non-law related work.

Agent
Posts: 340
Joined: Thu Nov 24, 2011 2:03 pm

Re: Another Depressed (URM) Law Student Here...

Postby Agent » Fri May 18, 2012 3:12 pm

More info about your networking strategy might improve the quality of responses here. And which books did you read?

User avatar
piccolittle
Posts: 1118
Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2008 4:16 pm

Re: Another Depressed (URM) Law Student Here...

Postby piccolittle » Fri May 18, 2012 3:17 pm

Don't have any advice for you except not to give up. You've gotten where you are because you are talented, intelligent, and most of all, persistent. The qualities that got you to your LS will get you through this too. I may be a silly optimist, but I always find that when one bad thing happens, it's because it's opening another door and preparing you for the better stuff to come.

Stay strong, and good luck <3

JJDancer
Posts: 1564
Joined: Sun Jul 26, 2009 7:41 pm

Re: Another Depressed (URM) Law Student Here...

Postby JJDancer » Fri May 18, 2012 3:19 pm

Where's your CSO in all this?

lifehopeful
Posts: 12
Joined: Fri May 18, 2012 2:32 pm

Re: Another Depressed (URM) Law Student Here...

Postby lifehopeful » Fri May 18, 2012 3:22 pm

I don't have a totally structured networking strategy. Been emailing alumni from my law school in the area that I want to be in as well as alumni from my undergrad. I usually meet with them and chat over email. I've also attended several networking receptions, got some business cards, and do the same thing.

Also, I read Guerrilla Tactics...and frequented sites like this one for more advice and tips

lifehopeful
Posts: 12
Joined: Fri May 18, 2012 2:32 pm

Re: Another Depressed (URM) Law Student Here...

Postby lifehopeful » Fri May 18, 2012 3:24 pm

JJDancer wrote:Where's your CSO in all this?


The CSO office at my school is absolute BS. Really targeted to the top 10. For the rest of us, they tell us to 'network'.

JJDancer
Posts: 1564
Joined: Sun Jul 26, 2009 7:41 pm

Re: Another Depressed (URM) Law Student Here...

Postby JJDancer » Fri May 18, 2012 3:27 pm

lifehopeful wrote:
JJDancer wrote:Where's your CSO in all this?


The CSO office at my school is absolute BS. Really targeted to the top 10. For the rest of us, they tell us to 'network'.

That sucks. May I ask which school/range?

Maybe you can approach any previous professors for advice (in person). At this point it may even be ok to ask if they know of any positions/avenues you can try. Normally I would recommend asking for advice but since it's the summer, you need something so being more direct is ok. Share your interests/passions and your predicament with them.

lifehopeful
Posts: 12
Joined: Fri May 18, 2012 2:32 pm

Re: Another Depressed (URM) Law Student Here...

Postby lifehopeful » Fri May 18, 2012 3:32 pm

JJDancer wrote:
lifehopeful wrote:
JJDancer wrote:Where's your CSO in all this?


The CSO office at my school is absolute BS. Really targeted to the top 10. For the rest of us, they tell us to 'network'.

That sucks. May I ask which school/range?

Maybe you can approach any previous professors for advice (in person). At this point it may even be ok to ask if they know of any positions/avenues you can try. Normally I would recommend asking for advice but since it's the summer, you need something so being more direct is ok. Share your interests/passions and your predicament with them.


Range is 20-30...not out west.

Unfortunate part about that is that I do not have any real connections with any of my professors. I don't even think most know my name. So, I'm not sure how much that will help.

JJDancer
Posts: 1564
Joined: Sun Jul 26, 2009 7:41 pm

Re: Another Depressed (URM) Law Student Here...

Postby JJDancer » Fri May 18, 2012 3:59 pm

lifehopeful wrote:
JJDancer wrote:
lifehopeful wrote:
JJDancer wrote:Where's your CSO in all this?


The CSO office at my school is absolute BS. Really targeted to the top 10. For the rest of us, they tell us to 'network'.

That sucks. May I ask which school/range?

Maybe you can approach any previous professors for advice (in person). At this point it may even be ok to ask if they know of any positions/avenues you can try. Normally I would recommend asking for advice but since it's the summer, you need something so being more direct is ok. Share your interests/passions and your predicament with them.


Range is 20-30...not out west.

Unfortunate part about that is that I do not have any real connections with any of my professors. I don't even think most know my name. So, I'm not sure how much that will help.


I understand. It may still be useful and you probably don't have much to lose. I would email those you think are the most approachable/connected/remember you the most/are in fields you have some (even remote) interest in and schedule an appointment to meet in person. Even if they don't know you, they may be able to offer some guidance, even if it's not a job.

Reprisal
Posts: 105
Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2011 12:51 am

Re: Another Depressed (URM) Law Student Here...

Postby Reprisal » Fri May 18, 2012 4:11 pm

You should redact any hyper personal information and post your re'sume' and cover letter here.

My guess is that you have a glaring problem with one or the other that is turning people off before they meet you. The most common problem I've seen among law students without jobs is a cover letter that's more like a novella of personal history and ambition than what it should be, i.e., an extremely brief statement of ties to a market and internet in a practice area based on a work or school experience.

User avatar
BarcaCrossesTheAlps
Posts: 408
Joined: Wed May 11, 2011 11:43 am

Re: Another Depressed (URM) Law Student Here...

Postby BarcaCrossesTheAlps » Fri May 18, 2012 4:22 pm

I'm a 0L, but I still think I have some sound advice as I used to do some hiring (not for law firms).

Do not allow your depressed state to show. I know you already know this. But once you get beat down by life, it tends to show unconsciously. That is like a plague to employers. It could also make you come off as desperate, if even only in body language.

My advice, as silly as it may sound, is to consciously make an effort to be enthusiastic and smile. It is easy for me to say because I am not going through the process right now, but part of a good interview strategy includes making the interviewer believe they have special person sitting in front of them. Words only account for about 50% of that at most. The rest, and probably more powerful, is the body language and nuanced gestures that humans exhibit when they are truly confident.

I know it is hard, but sometimes we need to fake it. First step: believe in yourself, and actually tell yourself that. Even top students go on 50+ interviews with a majority rejections. Acceptance will always play a minority role in your life, just like everyone else, only it doesn't appear that way to you know.

But, yeah, work on that confidence. Body language IS presentation. The interviewer must believe he sees a confident man before him, or all is truly lost. Make it happen, man! You can do it.

rad lulz
Posts: 9844
Joined: Sun Feb 19, 2012 10:53 pm

Re: Another Depressed (URM) Law Student Here...

Postby rad lulz » Fri May 18, 2012 4:34 pm

Reprisal wrote:You should redact any hyper personal information and post your re'sume' and cover letter here.

My guess is that you have a glaring problem with one or the other that is turning people off before they meet you. The most common problem I've seen among law students without jobs is a cover letter that's more like a novella of personal history and ambition than what it should be, i.e., an extremely brief statement of ties to a market and internet in a practice area based on a work or school experience.

Yeah this. Poast that shit.

JJDancer
Posts: 1564
Joined: Sun Jul 26, 2009 7:41 pm

Re: Another Depressed (URM) Law Student Here...

Postby JJDancer » Fri May 18, 2012 4:35 pm

BarcaCrossesTheAlps wrote:I'm a 0L, but I still think I have some sound advice as I used to do some hiring (not for law firms).

Do not allow your depressed state to show. I know you already know this. But once you get beat down by life, it tends to show unconsciously. That is like a plague to employers. It could also make you come off as desperate, if even only in body language.

My advice, as silly as it may sound, is to consciously make an effort to be enthusiastic and smile. It is easy for me to say because I am not going through the process right now, but part of a good interview strategy includes making the interviewer believe they have special person sitting in front of them. Words only account for about 50% of that at most. The rest, and probably more powerful, is the body language and nuanced gestures that humans exhibit when they are truly confident.

I know it is hard, but sometimes we need to fake it. First step: believe in yourself, and actually tell yourself that. Even top students go on 50+ interviews with a majority rejections. Acceptance will always play a minority role in your life, just like everyone else, only it doesn't appear that way to you know.

But, yeah, work on that confidence. Body language IS presentation. The interviewer must believe he sees a confident man before him, or all is truly lost. Make it happen, man! You can do it.


Good advice but I think OP said he had only gotten one interview despite all the hustling.

Reprisal
Posts: 105
Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2011 12:51 am

Re: Another Depressed (URM) Law Student Here...

Postby Reprisal » Fri May 18, 2012 4:40 pm

The other elephant in the room is personal appearance and hygeine.

If you're 5'8 and 300 pounds it might not matter how baller you are, your poor choices would show in your waist-line.

Being ugly isn't a big deal. Can't control facial geometry genetics and being uggo can help reinforce the stereotype of intelligence. Being super huge or smelly is not acceptable for most people, though. Attorneys definitely plump up as they sit, eat, and work 60 hour weeks for 20 years, but starting off that way wouldn't bode well for their perception of your energy levels.

User avatar
newyorker88
Posts: 614
Joined: Fri Dec 11, 2009 7:32 pm

Re: Another Depressed (URM) Law Student Here...

Postby newyorker88 » Fri May 18, 2012 5:49 pm

Reprisal wrote:The other elephant in the room is personal appearance and hygeine.

If you're 5'8 and 300 pounds it might not matter how baller you are, your poor choices would show in your waist-line.

Being ugly isn't a big deal. Can't control facial geometry genetics and being uggo can help reinforce the stereotype of intelligence. Being super huge or smelly is not acceptable for most people, though. Attorneys definitely plump up as they sit, eat, and work 60 hour weeks for 20 years, but starting off that way wouldn't bode well for their perception of your energy levels.


How would someone know that you're ugly by looking at your resume? I doubt that's what is preventing OP from getting interviews.

User avatar
TTTLS
Posts: 430
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2012 2:09 am

Re: Another Depressed (URM) Law Student Here...

Postby TTTLS » Fri May 18, 2012 6:03 pm

Have you talked to career services about your resume? Although they suck at making connections, working on your resume with them can really help.

Reprisal wrote:The other elephant in the room is personal appearance and hygeine.

If you're 5'8 and 300 pounds it might not matter how baller you are, your poor choices would show in your waist-line.

Being ugly isn't a big deal. Can't control facial geometry genetics and being uggo can help reinforce the stereotype of intelligence. Being super huge or smelly is not acceptable for most people, though. Attorneys definitely plump up as they sit, eat, and work 60 hour weeks for 20 years, but starting off that way wouldn't bode well for their perception of your energy levels.
Brutal post, bro.

User avatar
roaringeagle
Posts: 200
Joined: Fri Apr 13, 2012 7:11 pm

Re: Another Depressed (URM) Law Student Here...

Postby roaringeagle » Fri May 18, 2012 6:22 pm

BarcaCrossesTheAlps wrote:I'm a 0L, but I still think I have some sound advice as I used to do some hiring (not for law firms).

Do not allow your depressed state to show. I know you already know this. But once you get beat down by life, it tends to show unconsciously. That is like a plague to employers. It could also make you come off as desperate, if even only in body language.

My advice, as silly as it may sound, is to consciously make an effort to be enthusiastic and smile. It is easy for me to say because I am not going through the process right now, but part of a good interview strategy includes making the interviewer believe they have special person sitting in front of them. Words only account for about 50% of that at most. The rest, and probably more powerful, is the body language and nuanced gestures that humans exhibit when they are truly confident.

I know it is hard, but sometimes we need to fake it. First step: believe in yourself, and actually tell yourself that. Even top students go on 50+ interviews with a majority rejections. Acceptance will always play a minority role in your life, just like everyone else, only it doesn't appear that way to you know.

But, yeah, work on that confidence. Body language IS presentation. The interviewer must believe he sees a confident man before him, or all is truly lost. Make it happen, man! You can do it.



+10000000000000

My Sugar Uncle is a type-A shark of a man. He can be mean and tough as nails. If you don't come in to his office confident and smiling, you'll get nowhere with him. These types can smell fear and lack of confidence. Don't wake up desperate. Get a non-law related job so you can pay your bills/feel good waking up. PM me for ideas for you.

For the guy who said being fat or ugly won't get you anywhere, the fattest ugliest guy i know is worth somewhere between 140-175 million. Seriously he looks like a beet and has a big fat belly+no style sense whatsoever. He wears suspenders, ugly cheap shirt, Dockers and beat up Mephistos. He did not inherit his money. Being really smart and a good businessman (i.e. total bastard) +luck will get you far in this country. No he's not Sugar Uncle.

rad lulz
Posts: 9844
Joined: Sun Feb 19, 2012 10:53 pm

Re: Another Depressed (URM) Law Student Here...

Postby rad lulz » Sat May 19, 2012 9:39 am

newyorker88 wrote:
Reprisal wrote:The other elephant in the room is personal appearance and hygeine.

If you're 5'8 and 300 pounds it might not matter how baller you are, your poor choices would show in your waist-line.

Being ugly isn't a big deal. Can't control facial geometry genetics and being uggo can help reinforce the stereotype of intelligence. Being super huge or smelly is not acceptable for most people, though. Attorneys definitely plump up as they sit, eat, and work 60 hour weeks for 20 years, but starting off that way wouldn't bode well for their perception of your energy levels.


How would someone know that you're ugly by looking at your resume? I doubt that's what is preventing OP from getting interviews.

Interests: fat acceptance, exotic cheeses, Call of Duty

Eco
Posts: 325
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 2010 11:37 pm

Re: Another Depressed (URM) Law Student Here...

Postby Eco » Sun May 20, 2012 2:50 pm

Trust me, keep applying. Once you get that job, all the stress etc... will be a distant memory.

Anonymous User
Posts: 273186
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Another Depressed (URM) Law Student Here...

Postby Anonymous User » Sun May 20, 2012 3:43 pm

you'll probably regret stressing too much when you finally succeed.

Reprisal
Posts: 105
Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2011 12:51 am

Re: Another Depressed (URM) Law Student Here...

Postby Reprisal » Mon May 21, 2012 2:40 am

Either I called it or the OP is a race-bait fishing excursion that failed to get anyone to bite.

Anonymous User
Posts: 273186
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Another Depressed (URM) Law Student Here...

Postby Anonymous User » Mon May 21, 2012 2:50 am

lifehopeful wrote:I once hit rock bottom. I graduated at the bottom of my high school class, had minor legal trouble (false accusations of threats and DTP which I think are on my record) my parents couldn't stand me, bombed my SAT, and (surprisingly) got into one college. Even more embarrassing, I told myself I was going to get into law school-somehow, someway.

During the summer between my senior of high school and freshman year of college, I had an epiphany of sorts. Change was the motto and I was determined to end the next chapter of my life on a good note. My college career ended with a 3.5 gpa, numerous awards and honor societies, finally made my parents proud and received acceptances into a considerable amount top law schools.

I matriculated to a law school in the T20-T30 range with renewed faith in myself once again. But, again, I hit rock bottom. I studied hard (honestly) and ended my first year well below median. I sent hundreds of job applications but did not receive one interview. Ultimately, I did end up working for a smaller law firm and that was as a result of a desperation attempt in emailing random attorneys that I had absolutely no connections too.

During the summer, I had a great experience and decided to take life into my hands again and tried to secure a better/more prestigious job for my 2L summer. I read books, networked with a shitload of attorneys from all aspects of life, and did a lot of research. The result? One interview with a medium-sized firm at one of the minority law fairs. No, I didn't get the job. I sent more applications last semester but, still, no interviews albeit with slightly better grades.

This semester I've sent an abundance of applications to all sorts of companies, firms, and other organizations; from paid to unpaid. Of course, I still can not seem to secure an interview. Its almost June and I do not seem to know what to do. I mean, is it possible to only be able to only secure one lone interview from an employer this deep in one's law school career? I don't know. At my school, it seems to be a prestige game, the students who have secured firm jobs hang out with each other constantly and, in a sense, belittle us less unfortunate (even some black urms). At the moment, I feel the same way that I did in high school but just like back then I don't want to give up; I can't. I battled through so much adversity back during my adolescent years that just the thought of dropping out would be adversity kicking me in the ass. I recently just started my summer break and I'm stuck with no jobs at this point. I've even applied to random unpaid and paid graduate and undergraduate level internships/jobs with absolutely no luck. WTF is going on?

So, all in all, i'm in state of mind that involves confusion, depression, and helplessness. This post is more of a vent but all comments and/or advice is appreciated. Thanks.


Do u mind telling us the state where your school is located?
Also, many experts are optimistic that the economy will strengthen within the next couple of years so don't give up just yet.




Return to “Legal Employment”

Who is online

The online users are hidden on this forum.