ITT: Summer Associates Post About Their Anxiety (2012)

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Big Shrimpin
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Re: ITT: Summer Associates Post About Their Anxiety (2012)

Postby Big Shrimpin » Wed May 30, 2012 7:19 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Just finished my first assignment. Proofread the shit out of it but still made some small bluebook errors. now feeling anxious.


Start researching firms for 3L LOLOCI.

Bluebooking is important, but some assigning associates/partners are more concerned about substance. So long as you work with the assignor to ensure they're needs are met re: the assignment, you better your chances at a good review, notwithstanding a bump or two along the way. I'd be surprised if anyone would give a bad review for a few typographical/formatting/etc. errors.

I've heard myriad stories of assigning associates/partners literally telling the SA to scrap their entire assignment and start over. I have yet to hear of anyone getting dinged as a result. HTH.

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Re: ITT: Summer Associates Post About Their Anxiety (2012)

Postby Anonymous User » Wed May 30, 2012 7:21 pm

Big Shrimpin wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Just finished my first assignment. Proofread the shit out of it but still made some small bluebook errors. now feeling anxious.


Start researching firms for 3L LOLOCI.

Bluebooking is important, but some assigning associates/partners are more concerned about substance. So long as you work with the assignor to ensure they're needs are met re: the assignment, you better your chances at a good review, notwithstanding a bump or two along the way. I'd be surprised if anyone would give a bad review for a few typographical/formatting/etc. errors.

I've heard myriad stories of assigning associates/partners literally telling the SA to scrap their entire assignment and start over. I have yet to hear of anyone getting dinged as a result. HTH.


Glad to hear this. I think my writing and research was otherwise solid so we'll see.

If they actually care about small typos I'm probably screwed. Throughout my life I've never been able to completely eliminate them.

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Detrox
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Re: ITT: Summer Associates Post About Their Anxiety (2012)

Postby Detrox » Wed May 30, 2012 9:47 pm

My first assignment was pretty much entirely rewritten/reformatted + corrected for bluebooking errors. Still got good reports on it since they said all the substance was there and they gave me more work on the project so I'm a bit relieved.

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Re: ITT: Summer Associates Post About Their Anxiety (2012)

Postby Anonymous User » Wed May 30, 2012 10:21 pm

I'm summarizing a massive deposition transcript page-by-page for one of my first assignments - not rocket science but hey. The model that the assigning partner asked me to follow (one that she wrote herself) was written very informally, mostly for brevity's sake... to the point of not having subject-verb sentence structure. It will be used only by that partner for reference purposes, but I am really hesitant about modeling my writing based on that kind of quality. Thoughts? Should I complete my assignment for this particular matter in the same manner, or do it in more formal/proper English? I feel even weirder asking this question of another attorney (let alone the partner): "Hey, should I write mine just as sloppily?"

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5ky
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Re: ITT: Summer Associates Post About Their Anxiety (2012)

Postby 5ky » Wed May 30, 2012 10:35 pm

Are all of these bluebooking sticklers in litigation?

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D-hops
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Re: ITT: Summer Associates Post About Their Anxiety (2012)

Postby D-hops » Wed May 30, 2012 10:36 pm

5ky wrote:Are all of these bluebooking sticklers in litigation?


If it weren't for journal, I think I would have burned my bluebook by now. Don't plan on needing it unless I pick up a pro bono lit assignment.

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sunynp
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Re: ITT: Summer Associates Post About Their Anxiety (2012)

Postby sunynp » Wed May 30, 2012 10:39 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I'm summarizing a massive deposition transcript page-by-page for one of my first assignments - not rocket science but hey. The model that the assigning partner asked me to follow (one that she wrote herself) was written very informally, mostly for brevity's sake... to the point of not having subject-verb sentence structure. It will be used only by that partner for reference purposes, but I am really hesitant about modeling my writing based on that kind of quality. Thoughts? Should I complete my assignment for this particular matter in the same manner, or do it in more formal/proper English? I feel even weirder asking this question of another attorney (let alone the partner): "Hey, should I write mine just as sloppily?"

The point isn't sloppy writing, the point is brevity. I think you could write in sentences. If not sure, do a couple of pages and then just run them by her to see if you are doing it the way she wants it as you are unsure of the format.

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Re: ITT: Summer Associates Post About Their Anxiety (2012)

Postby Anonymous User » Wed May 30, 2012 10:43 pm

Big Shrimpin wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Just finished my first assignment. Proofread the shit out of it but still made some small bluebook errors. now feeling anxious.


Start researching firms for 3L LOLOCI.

Bluebooking is important, but some assigning associates/partners are more concerned about substance. So long as you work with the assignor to ensure they're needs are met re: the assignment, you better your chances at a good review, notwithstanding a bump or two along the way. I'd be surprised if anyone would give a bad review for a few typographical/formatting/etc. errors.

I've heard myriad stories of assigning associates/partners literally telling the SA to scrap their entire assignment and start over. I have yet to hear of anyone getting dinged as a result. HTH.


What are you bluebooking for? If you're writing an interoffice memo, are u serious that they actually care that its bluebooked correctly?

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Re: ITT: Summer Associates Post About Their Anxiety (2012)

Postby Anonymous User » Wed May 30, 2012 10:49 pm

I don't think my office cares much about bluebooking because one of my first assignments was to update an old memo and the cites were almost all wrong. I fixed them anyway but since this memo was like 5 years old, apparently nobody ever noticed or cared

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Re: ITT: Summer Associates Post About Their Anxiety (2012)

Postby Anonymous User » Wed May 30, 2012 10:56 pm

Anonymous User wrote:What are you bluebooking for? If you're writing an interoffice memo, are u serious that they actually care that its bluebooked correctly?


I've been bluebooking for the most part, but not obsessively. It depends on who the assignments for. An interoffice memo I turned in Tuesday got returned to me today. The guy redlined quite a bit, but told me that he does it for all the summers because he actually wants to teach us something. He did want perfect cites and redlined every single thing I screwed up. Kind of demoralizing, but really helpful.

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ExAnt3
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Re: ITT: Summer Associates Post About Their Anxiety (2012)

Postby ExAnt3 » Wed May 30, 2012 11:20 pm

Detrox wrote:My first assignment was pretty much entirely rewritten/reformatted + corrected for bluebooking errors. Still got good reports on it since they said all the substance was there and they gave me more work on the project so I'm a bit relieved.


+1. This made me feel better since this happened to me last week.

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Re: ITT: Summer Associates Post About Their Anxiety (2012)

Postby Anonymous User » Wed May 30, 2012 11:38 pm

Why the hell wouldn't they want an interoffice memo cited correctly? Those memos are generally going to be saved on a server with the rest of the case file.

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Re: ITT: Summer Associates Post About Their Anxiety (2012)

Postby Anonymous User » Wed May 30, 2012 11:54 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Why the hell wouldn't they want an interoffice memo cited correctly? Those memos are generally going to be saved on a server with the rest of the case file.


It's not that they don't care if it's cited correctly, it's just that the attorneys want a substantive answer that they can use for whatever they are working on (at least for the interoffice memos I have been working on). Every time I discuss an assignment with an attorney after I've submitted, we usually just discuss the content and then they explain how they are going to use it, either in a memo to a client, a pleading, or whatever. As with everything, it probably depends on the firm and the assigning attorney.

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Re: ITT: Summer Associates Post About Their Anxiety (2012)

Postby sunynp » Thu May 31, 2012 12:01 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Why the hell wouldn't they want an interoffice memo cited correctly? Those memos are generally going to be saved on a server with the rest of the case file.


It's not that they don't care if it's cited correctly, it's just that the attorneys want a substantive answer that they can use for whatever they are working on (at least for the interoffice memos I have been working on). Every time I discuss an assignment with an attorney after I've submitted, we usually just discuss the content and then they explain how they are going to use it, either in a memo to a client, a pleading, or whatever. As with everything, it probably depends on the firm and the assigning attorney.


They care about the content and the substance, it doesn't have to be blue-book perfect to allow them to find the cases again. I'm not saying don't worry about blue-booking, but your focus has to be primarily on getting the right answer to the question with the sources and analysis to back it up. Perfect bluebooking won't get you extra brownie points and it won't save you if you miss a case or do shitty analysis.

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Detrox
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Re: ITT: Summer Associates Post About Their Anxiety (2012)

Postby Detrox » Thu May 31, 2012 12:13 am

Bluebooking can get you brownie points in the sense that if you're writing a memo in preparation for a trial, certain parts of your memo may be able to be cut an pasted into a brief, and it helps shorten review time if your cites are already in the proper format.

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Old Gregg
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Re: ITT: Summer Associates Post About Their Anxiety (2012)

Postby Old Gregg » Thu May 31, 2012 12:13 am

You won't get brownie points for blue booking just like you won't get brownie points for coming into work every day. Both are a basic expectation of the job.

Blue book everything and blue book everything correctly. Unless the associate or partner tells you explicitly to disregard, don't just assume that they don't care.

Being a successful lawyer is not just about getting the substance right, it's also about attention to detail.

I'm an associate, so I know very little, but the above is something I know very well.

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Guchster
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Re: ITT: Summer Associates Post About Their Anxiety (2012)

Postby Guchster » Thu May 31, 2012 1:31 am

First assignment due tomorrow. But really happy I went to get drunk with my fellow SAs.

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Re: ITT: Summer Associates Post About Their Anxiety (2012)

Postby Reprisal » Thu May 31, 2012 2:49 am

Anonymous User wrote:Anyone else finding it challenging to balance the following priorities?

1 - it's super important to go to all the social events

2 - don't look like the weird guy who stays late to do work

3 - get your work done on time and make it be error-free.


This is why you should have done all your law school studying next to a bottle of red wine. Training for real life.

Anonymouse User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Just finished my first assignment. Proofread the shit out of it but still made some small bluebook errors. now feeling anxious.


Start researching firms for 3L LOLOCI.

Bluebooking is important, but some assigning associates/partners are more concerned about substance. So long as you work with the assignor to ensure they're needs are met re: the assignment, you better your chances at a good review, notwithstanding a bump or two along the way. I'd be surprised if anyone would give a bad review for a few typographical/formatting/etc. errors.

I've heard myriad stories of assigning associates/partners literally telling the SA to scrap their entire assignment and start over. I have yet to hear of anyone getting dinged as a result. HTH.


This is what paralegals are for. I can't believe a partner would scrutinize this, honestly. It's not like you rocket straight into their appellate group where every comma matters.

Anonymous User wrote:The guy redlined quite a bit, but told me that he does it for all the summers because he actually wants to teach us something. He did want perfect cites and redlined every single thing I screwed up. Kind of demoralizing, but really helpful.


Ok, this is cool, but it's basically the only excuse to hammer a summer over bluebooking. Judges and court clerks don't give a shit about Harvard's arbitrary citation rules. They care about consistency.

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bceagles182
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Re: ITT: Summer Associates Post About Their Anxiety (2012)

Postby bceagles182 » Thu May 31, 2012 3:38 am

ITT OCD-types (i.e. at least 50% of the people who go to law school) spout off about their irrational fears of rejection.

The hard parts-- 1L + OCI-- are over. Just don't be an aspie, demonstrate that you are trying to put forth good work, and don't get wasted at the events. That = profit. It really is that simple.

HTH

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fatduck
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Re: ITT: Summer Associates Post About Their Anxiety (2012)

Postby fatduck » Thu May 31, 2012 7:48 pm

the head lit guy at my firm said they have one format for memos, it goes: email subject, email body.

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Re: ITT: Summer Associates Post About Their Anxiety (2012)

Postby Anonymous User » Thu May 31, 2012 10:29 pm

At this point I have now done several internal memos on both transactional and lit projects and bluebooking correctly has been a necessity. Why do something wrong when your work will be scrutinized after you are gone?

Maybe it is aspie fear but I don't want to leave any chance that a partner might forget his or her instructions on a project and weeks later look at a project with incorrect citations and hold it against me.

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Re: ITT: Summer Associates Post About Their Anxiety (2012)

Postby r6_philly » Thu May 31, 2012 10:50 pm

fatduck wrote:the head lit guy at my firm said they have one format for memos, it goes: email subject, email body.


But if you send a memo with the proper heading and format, he is not going to tell you that you did it wrong.

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Re: ITT: Summer Associates Post About Their Anxiety (2012)

Postby Anonymous User » Thu May 31, 2012 11:36 pm

Working much harder than I assumed that summers work. In just a week and a half, I've stayed past 10 three times. And no, its not because I was being an overzealous loser. Associate I was working with said she had been putting something off for 2 months, and that she wont get it in on time without help. Stayed real late to help bail her out. Then yesterday I emailed around to find some steady assignment in my group of interest. Someone calls me in at 6, says he could use me on the conference call the next morning, but that I gotta prep lots of docs and forms for it, and get totally up to speed that night, so I was there until 11 or 12.

Not complaining since I know this isn't the pre-ITE summerlong party people used to have. And the assignments are in areas that interest me, but I was under the impression that summers don't usually get roped into so many late nights. I work in NY V25 btw.

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Stanford4Me
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Re: ITT: Summer Associates Post About Their Anxiety (2012)

Postby Stanford4Me » Fri Jun 01, 2012 1:15 am

Constantly reaffirming my happiness about deciding not to work in NYC. Tomorrow, Friday of all days, will be a long day for me though.

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Re: ITT: Summer Associates Post About Their Anxiety (2012)

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 01, 2012 1:17 am

Anonymous User wrote:Working much harder than I assumed that summers work. In just a week and a half, I've stayed past 10 three times. And no, its not because I was being an overzealous loser. Associate I was working with said she had been putting something off for 2 months, and that she wont get it in on time without help. Stayed real late to help bail her out. Then yesterday I emailed around to find some steady assignment in my group of interest. Someone calls me in at 6, says he could use me on the conference call the next morning, but that I gotta prep lots of docs and forms for it, and get totally up to speed that night, so I was there until 11 or 12.

Not complaining since I know this isn't the pre-ITE summerlong party people used to have. And the assignments are in areas that interest me, but I was under the impression that summers don't usually get roped into so many late nights. I work in NY V25 btw.


Same. Think will be consistently working until 10 or midnight all summer. Seems like we are being treated like first year associates. I like it.




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