Semi-good news and relief

(On Campus Interviews, Summer Associate positions, Firm Reviews, Tips, ...)
Forum rules
Anonymous Posting

Anonymous posting is only appropriate when you are revealing sensitive employment related information about a firm, job, etc. You may anonymously respond on topic to these threads. Unacceptable uses include: harassing another user, joking around, testing the feature, or other things that are more appropriate in the lounge.

Failure to follow these rules will get you outed, warned, or banned.
Anonymous User
Posts: 273234
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Semi-good news and relief

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Mar 01, 2012 11:08 pm

Hi everyone,

I'm a 2L and have had a devil of a time nailing down a summer firm job. Top 30 school, top 1/3, a moot court team but no journal. A native of the state where my school is, but having gone to undergrad at a Yankee school seemed to hurt me a little bit in a Southern community where ties are crucial and the legal market is not big. I had better luck getting interviews at big mid-Atlantic firms, but didn't get any offers. Only having extended family in an area isn't always enough of a lock for ties. It's also just really tough out there. I sent out probably 100+ mass mails on top of OCI, but did it way too late.

Long story short, today I accepted a job at a five attorney firm that does a mix of representing municipal governments, civil litigation, personal injury and workers' comp, real estate, family and wills & trusts. I'll get to work on a few complex workers comp and tort cases which is good because I don't have any (real world) litigation experience. The job pays $12/hr and I'll have a crappy commute (over an hour, 70 miles) this summer. But there are some good things. One of the partners was a well-respected state politician and will be a great resource if I do want to stay in the state and do government or politics (worked in state government 1L summer). It doesn't feel like "shitlaw" by the standards of a rural community - beautiful office, good attorneys. Mostly, just being done with the sickening feeling that is a winter 2L job search feels amazing.

Knowing the shiny big firms that some of my friends are headed off to is still tough, of course. It's been a humbling (ok, soul crushing) experience. I don't have any chance of an offer at this small firm after graduation. But I'm prepared to start networking like crazy this spring and summer, do the write on journal competition this year and get onto a secondary journal if not law review, and do massive, massive targeted mass mailing starting in August. Any advice of things to do besides the above is welcome. My goal is to hustle and land mid- to biglaw before graduation.

So, this is I hope at least a small piece of good news for those who feel like there is NOTHING out there. I've learned that a lot of small firms really DON'T hire until March and part of me was tempted to keep exploring, but the temptation of an offer and being done was too great. But the jobs that will pay you a little rent and give you some private practice experience to talk about are still there.

STLMizzou
Posts: 386
Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2011 12:45 pm

Re: Semi-good news and relief

Postby STLMizzou » Thu Mar 01, 2012 11:19 pm

How is this good news? This is the single most soul crushing thing I have read on this site. A 2L at a decent-to-good school in top 3rd and still stuck working a job with no future and getting paid barely enough to support your giant commute. And still unrelentingly hopeful that you will be the special snow-flake the beats the odds and make connections he/she hasn't already managed to make by now to land a job that has probably already been filed by one of your peers with the sole stipulation of a non-fuckup summer.


I think I just died a little inside

User avatar
Richie Tenenbaum
Posts: 2162
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 6:17 am

Re: Semi-good news and relief

Postby Richie Tenenbaum » Fri Mar 02, 2012 2:04 am

Anonymous User wrote:How is this good news? This is the single most soul crushing thing I have read on this site. A 2L at a decent-to-good school in top 3rd and still stuck working a job with no future and getting paid barely enough to support your giant commute. And still unrelentingly hopeful that you will be the special snow-flake the beats the odds and make connections he/she hasn't already managed to make by now to land a job that has probably already been filed by one of your peers with the sole stipulation of a non-fuckup summer.


I think I just died a little inside


Dude, let the person have their moment.

Machine Spirit
Posts: 172
Joined: Sat Jun 12, 2010 7:36 pm

Re: Semi-good news and relief

Postby Machine Spirit » Fri Mar 02, 2012 2:54 am

Anonymous User wrote:How is this good news? This is the single most soul crushing thing I have read on this site. A 2L at a decent-to-good school in top 3rd and still stuck working a job with no future and getting paid barely enough to support your giant commute. And still unrelentingly hopeful that you will be the special snow-flake the beats the odds and make connections he/she hasn't already managed to make by now to land a job that has probably already been filed by one of your peers with the sole stipulation of a non-fuckup summer.


I think I just died a little inside


What I notice is that you didn't have the balls to post under your account name.

Also, congratulations OP. I hope you're able to advance well in the firm, and that the lead partner's connections benefit you in the future.

turbotong
Posts: 181
Joined: Thu Oct 28, 2010 12:53 am

Re: Semi-good news and relief

Postby turbotong » Fri Mar 02, 2012 3:53 am

In other good news, DOW sustains 13k and North Korea stops being bad in return for food aid

BeenDidThat
Posts: 704
Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2011 12:18 am

Re: Semi-good news and relief

Postby BeenDidThat » Fri Mar 02, 2012 4:42 am

Good work. Keep hustling. And thanks for sharing.

Norwood
Posts: 345
Joined: Wed Jan 28, 2009 10:13 pm

Re: Semi-good news and relief

Postby Norwood » Fri Mar 02, 2012 6:24 am

I feel ya. although not the ideal situation we all hoped for, i would be so glad to have any sort of certainty for my summer. good job op, now you can relax a bit.

Sm Firm Hiring P
Posts: 119
Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2012 4:14 pm

Re: Semi-good news and relief

Postby Sm Firm Hiring P » Fri Mar 02, 2012 8:08 am

Congrats. Having that law firm experience on your resume is invaluable and many times at smaller firms you get more experience than just pouring over piles of documents and working on one tiny piece of a huge multi-year project. Without it, you would be in a very difficult position next year for law firm jobs.

lawschoolftw
Posts: 338
Joined: Wed Oct 21, 2009 2:34 pm

Re: Semi-good news and relief

Postby lawschoolftw » Fri Mar 02, 2012 9:03 am

Dude don't listen to any haters, especially on this board. Congrats, seriously. You landed a pau job a a firm and that's all there is to it. I worked at a small firm as a 1L and got phenomenal experience ( I didn't get paid). Best of luck and way to keep hustling. Great job.

Anonymous User
Posts: 273234
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Semi-good news and relief

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Mar 02, 2012 10:44 am

Dude, congrats!

Don't listen to the pretentious a-holes who will put you down for working in a small firm. ITE, anything is far, far better than nothing. Also, you'll probably get more practical legal experience than people working in a high rise with 30 other SAs and gain connections that actually mean something.

I love when people on here forget that in America we have these things called towns, and in those towns there are lawyers who aren't starving to death and who actually do something beneficial for their community...

User avatar
2LsAPlenty
Posts: 156
Joined: Tue Feb 21, 2012 11:20 am

Re: Semi-good news and relief

Postby 2LsAPlenty » Fri Mar 02, 2012 1:27 pm

Woo hoo! You have no idea how many people would like to be in your shoes. Be happy and enjoy the experience! There are lots of 2Ls in schools not T20 with grades in the upper half with nothing and barely any interviews.

lawschoolftw
Posts: 338
Joined: Wed Oct 21, 2009 2:34 pm

Re: Semi-good news and relief

Postby lawschoolftw » Fri Mar 02, 2012 7:27 pm

2LsAPlenty wrote:Woo hoo! You have no idea how many people would like to be in your shoes. Be happy and enjoy the experience! There are lots of 2Ls in schools not T20 with grades in the upper half with nothing and barely any interviews.


Seriously, more than half of my friends at a T20 are doing unpaid internships or are unemployed still for 2L.

User avatar
FeelTheHeat
Posts: 5203
Joined: Tue Jan 18, 2011 2:32 am

Re: Semi-good news and relief

Postby FeelTheHeat » Fri Mar 02, 2012 7:29 pm

STLMizzou wrote:How is this good news? This is the single most soul crushing thing I have read on this site. A 2L at a decent-to-good school in top 3rd and still stuck working a job with no future and getting paid barely enough to support your giant commute. And still unrelentingly hopeful that you will be the special snow-flake the beats the odds and make connections he/she hasn't already managed to make by now to land a job that has probably already been filed by one of your peers with the sole stipulation of a non-fuckup summer.


I think I just died a little inside


Hi 0L

Younger Abstention
Posts: 335
Joined: Sun Dec 19, 2010 2:36 pm

Re: Semi-good news and relief

Postby Younger Abstention » Tue Mar 06, 2012 5:38 pm

Personally, I wouldn't have taken this job offer. I did something like this 1L summer with a commute of an hour, around this time, because I panicked and thought I wouldn't get anything else. The commute ended up sucking, as did the job, especially when my car transmission broke and I had to rent a car. Plenty of stuff will come available regarding small firms, agencies, in house counsel, etc. within the next few months. Probably too late for OP, but for anyone contemplating such a situation, it's too early to panic. But 12 dollars an hour 70 miles a way reeks of desperation, especially when there is no chance of a permanent offer.

Anonymous User
Posts: 273234
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Semi-good news and relief

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Mar 06, 2012 6:09 pm

depends in part on the calibre of the firm and the people at the firm.
I know for instance a firm that has a co-op program with a local law school and pays lowly hourly rate/ co-op rate. yet its lawyers have top notch credentials and it's not a shit law firm. my T30 friend (also in top 1/3) summered there and continued to work with the firm as a 3L. she's now working there as a full time attorney.

LawIdiot86
Posts: 1159
Joined: Tue Nov 15, 2011 5:21 pm

Re: Semi-good news and relief

Postby LawIdiot86 » Tue Mar 06, 2012 6:25 pm

Younger Abstention wrote:Personally, I wouldn't have taken this job offer. I did something like this 1L summer with a commute of an hour, around this time, because I panicked and thought I wouldn't get anything else. The commute ended up sucking, as did the job, especially when my car transmission broke and I had to rent a car. Plenty of stuff will come available regarding small firms, agencies, in house counsel, etc. within the next few months. Probably too late for OP, but for anyone contemplating such a situation, it's too early to panic. But 12 dollars an hour 70 miles a way reeks of desperation, especially when there is no chance of a permanent offer.

Why did you rent a car for a job like this? Why not quit, get a local job at Starbucks, and list the firm as "Summer 2011" on your resume?

Anonymous User
Posts: 273234
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Semi-good news and relief

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Mar 06, 2012 8:42 pm

Anonymous User wrote:depends in part on the calibre of the firm and the people at the firm.
I know for instance a firm that has a co-op program with a local law school and pays lowly hourly rate/ co-op rate. yet its lawyers have top notch credentials and it's not a shit law firm. my T30 friend (also in top 1/3) summered there and continued to work with the firm as a 3L. she's now working there as a full time attorney.


I had friends that did this and turned out to be a nightmare due to the summer commuting costs (what is gas, like 4 dollars now?). None of them received offers from these firms despite the almost unpaid internship.

The whole exercise shows how screwed up the legal profession is.

User avatar
romothesavior
Posts: 14772
Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2009 4:29 pm

Re: Semi-good news and relief

Postby romothesavior » Tue Mar 06, 2012 8:54 pm

I congratulate the OP and hope that (s)he can land something good. I certainly don't want to rain on anyone's parade, and I think if OP does the right things (does good work this summer, builds his network, hustles with applications, etc.), (s)he will land a good job of some sort for after graduation.

On the other hand, while STLMizzou's post was unnecessarily rude, he isn't wrong. This thread is more of a cautionary tale than a celebratory one. 0Ls, please take heed. This is the current job market. I know people in OP's position, and it is truly scary. If you think it can't happen to you, think again.

User avatar
sunynp
Posts: 1899
Joined: Tue May 24, 2011 2:06 pm

Re: Semi-good news and relief

Postby sunynp » Tue Mar 06, 2012 9:15 pm

OP: how are you going to make this job work? What are you getting out of it? You need to figure out a way to come out of this job with another job. You need to be honest with the partners that if they won't hire you, you expect/need want them to help you find a job.(well, not that directly, but you know what I mean)If they are well connected, they need to help you make connections. If they can't help you get a job, you are not getting biglaw. The only way you get biglaw now is if you find someone who will get you in the door.

You need to pick a specialty and start being an expert in it, going to meetings about it, knowing everyone in your state who practices it. I don't know if a secondary journal is worth it at this point. I can't advise on this point - but do you really think your lack of secondary journal has kept you from getting a job?

Finding your next job is your real job this summer.

User avatar
cantaboot
Posts: 204
Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2007 3:12 am

Re: Semi-good news and relief

Postby cantaboot » Tue Mar 06, 2012 9:26 pm

cautionary tale but celebratory in some way. Of all the people who finally managed to find something decent, they all interned at law firms at some point at law school or right after law school. Those who have never got anything yet and whom I doubt will ever find anything are those who've never set feet in a law firm (as law clerk/intern/summer associate)

Younger Abstention
Posts: 335
Joined: Sun Dec 19, 2010 2:36 pm

Re: Semi-good news and relief

Postby Younger Abstention » Tue Mar 06, 2012 9:27 pm

LawIdiot86 wrote:
Younger Abstention wrote:Personally, I wouldn't have taken this job offer. I did something like this 1L summer with a commute of an hour, around this time, because I panicked and thought I wouldn't get anything else. The commute ended up sucking, as did the job, especially when my car transmission broke and I had to rent a car. Plenty of stuff will come available regarding small firms, agencies, in house counsel, etc. within the next few months. Probably too late for OP, but for anyone contemplating such a situation, it's too early to panic. But 12 dollars an hour 70 miles a way reeks of desperation, especially when there is no chance of a permanent offer.

Why did you rent a car for a job like this? Why not quit, get a local job at Starbucks, and list the firm as "Summer 2011" on your resume?


Because I was stupid and naive re: the value of a summer job. But it was a mistake to take a job with a small firm far away for low pay in the first place.

User avatar
cantaboot
Posts: 204
Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2007 3:12 am

Re: Semi-good news and relief

Postby cantaboot » Tue Mar 06, 2012 9:33 pm

in my 1L summer I spent a few weeks at a small firm in LA. I did not even drive. I reserved a room in a run-down hotel (which isn't exactly bad but my standard was low anyway). I ended up saving close to 2K (after airfaire and living expenses) for that summer because of the job. Can't say whether it's worth it. I found out that I hate LA and its people.




Return to “Legal Employment”

Who is online

The online users are hidden on this forum.