How to handle Dewey (or similar firms)

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Re: How to handle Dewey (or similar firms)

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Apr 27, 2012 11:37 pm

IAFG wrote:
f7 wrote:I don't understand the weird sense of loyalty these former SAs have to a firm that utterly fucked them over.

How about, to a firm that almost certainly soon won't be an entity to show loyalty towards?


First, it has nothing to do with loyalty. I don't like gossip and I'm *especially* not going to take any action during an emotional time - such decisions are more often than not a mistake. Once I've relaxed a little and can think, I may well change my mind about disclosing the letter, but at that point it will be moot.

Second, though the firm may be disappearing, a firm is only as good as its partners. Some of the top lawyers in my area of interest are still at Dewey and I have good information that they are actively trying to get me in particular and us in general new positions. No reason to burn a bridge prematurely.

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Re: How to handle Dewey (or similar firms)

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Apr 27, 2012 11:46 pm

f7 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
IAFG wrote:
f7 wrote:I don't understand the weird sense of loyalty these former SAs have to a firm that utterly fucked them over.

How about, to a firm that almost certainly soon won't be an entity to show loyalty towards?


First, it has nothing to do with loyalty. I don't like gossip and I'm *especially* not going to take any action during an emotional time - such decisions are more often than not a mistake. Once I've relaxed a little and can think, I may well change my mind about disclosing the letter, but at that point it will be moot.

Second, though the firm may be disappearing, a firm is only as good as its partners. Some of the top lawyers in my area of interest are still at Dewey and I have good information that they are actively trying to get me in particular and us in general new positions. No reason to burn a bridge prematurely.

I thought you didn't like gossip.


I don't and I'm not quite sure I get your meaning.

It's not the letter itself that I consider gossip, its the trolling by mystal and lat that are gossip and perpetuate gossip. Gossip generally connotes talking about other people's situations (in addition to being unconfirmed). Here, I'm talking about my situation and I have personal knowledge (and confirmation) about it.

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Re: How to handle Dewey (or similar firms)

Postby Guchster » Sat Apr 28, 2012 12:26 am

Anonymous User wrote:It's not the letter itself that I consider gossip, its the trolling by mystal and lat that are gossip and perpetuate gossip. Gossip generally connotes talking about other people's situations (in addition to being unconfirmed). Here, I'm talking about my situation and I have personal knowledge (and confirmation) about it.


Why the hell are you in this thread then if you don't like gossip?

Are you looking for a former Dewey pity circle jerk where you can cry together?

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Re: How to handle Dewey (or similar firms)

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Apr 28, 2012 12:47 am

Anonymous User wrote:
IAFG wrote:
f7 wrote:I don't understand the weird sense of loyalty these former SAs have to a firm that utterly fucked them over.

How about, to a firm that almost certainly soon won't be an entity to show loyalty towards?


First, it has nothing to do with loyalty. I don't like gossip and I'm *especially* not going to take any action during an emotional time - such decisions are more often than not a mistake. Once I've relaxed a little and can think, I may well change my mind about disclosing the letter, but at that point it will be moot.

Second, though the firm may be disappearing, a firm is only as good as its partners. Some of the top lawyers in my area of interest are still at Dewey and I have good information that they are actively trying to get me in particular and us in general new positions. No reason to burn a bridge prematurely.


FYI, many, many associates at the firm were promised and assured by their partners they would go with them when they moved. They were left behind.

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Re: How to handle Dewey (or similar firms)

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Apr 28, 2012 12:49 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:It's not the letter itself that I consider gossip, its the trolling by mystal and lat that are gossip and perpetuate gossip. Gossip generally connotes talking about other people's situations (in addition to being unconfirmed). Here, I'm talking about my situation and I have personal knowledge (and confirmation) about it.


Why the hell are you in this thread then if you don't like gossip?

Are you looking for a former Dewey pity circle jerk where you can cry together?


I'm here - and have been following now for a while - for advice. The thread is indeed titled "How to handle Dewey (or similar firms)" and before today, I got some pretty good advice despite the occasional trolling.

Today, its mostly trolls.

[Reply with your inflammatory nonsense below]

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Re: How to handle Dewey (or similar firms)

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Apr 28, 2012 12:54 am

FYI, many, many associates at the firm were promised and assured by their partners they would go with them when they moved. They were left behind.


Yes, I realize this. I'm not being pollyannaish about this - I know the chances are extremely low. I'd like to think my circumstance is somewhat unique, but I'd probably be fooling myself. I am pursuing other opportunities as well and already have a worst case scenario back-up (internship with in-house counsel at large corporation - not ideal, but at least its something to get on the resume).

That said, though many were left behind, some were not.

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Re: How to handle Dewey (or similar firms)

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Apr 28, 2012 1:00 am

Anonymous User wrote:
FYI, many, many associates at the firm were promised and assured by their partners they would go with them when they moved. They were left behind.


Yes, I realize this. I'm not being pollyannaish about this - I know the chances are extremely low. I'd like to think my circumstance is somewhat unique, but I'd probably be fooling myself. I am pursuing other opportunities as well and already have a worst case scenario back-up (internship with in-house counsel at large corporation - not ideal, but at least its something to get on the resume).

That said, though many were left behind, some were not.



I know for a fact that more were left behind than not. Some of the stories are pretty sad. Consider that these associates closely worked with the partners on numerous deals/cases and on a lot of late nights. There's only so much that partners can do. Everyone is trying to figure out their own Plan B right now. Smart move to have a back-up lined up already.

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Re: How to handle Dewey (or similar firms)

Postby nygrrrl » Sat Apr 28, 2012 10:52 am

Morning, all.
Just a kindly reminder that the Mod Squad is feeling for all folks involved in this mess. Taunting and/or baiting of (former) Dewey SAs and Associates will not be tolerated.
Little bit of empathy, OK gang?

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Re: How to handle Dewey (or similar firms)

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Apr 28, 2012 1:44 pm

im so screwed. glad i got the news morning before a huge final. what i love most about the situation is the second degree level of fcked over going on here. gotta get good grades. so gotta study. but as of yesterday, gotta look for a job. maybe good can come out of it? as in, maybe ill get something else instead where at least i wont not get an offer? or maybe i wont.

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Re: How to handle Dewey (or similar firms)

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Apr 28, 2012 2:45 pm

Anonymous User wrote:im so screwed. glad i got the news morning before a huge final. what i love most about the situation is the second degree level of fcked over going on here. gotta get good grades. so gotta study. but as of yesterday, gotta look for a job. maybe good can come out of it? as in, maybe ill get something else instead where at least i wont not get an offer? or maybe i wont.


This is definitely one of those unforeseeable, awful turn of events that nobody should have to deal with, especially during finals. But keep in mind that there's a lot of goodwill out there for Dewey summers. I was able to find an alternative. Assuming you land on your feet soon, this is something you'll forever cite as an example of overcoming adversity.

I hope you are actively reaching out to every v100 firm and hounding your career office people for any leads. This strategy paid off for me.

That said, even if things don't work out for this summer (and I am confident they can/will), it doesn't sound like a consolation now but you will go into 3L recruiting with a leg up on most others (I don't care what anybody says, this sentiment was communicated to me by many unrelated sources, including partners, before I found another firm).

Good luck to all.

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Re: How to handle Dewey (or similar firms)

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Apr 28, 2012 3:44 pm

Anyone know if Dewey is still paying 3L bar fees and salary stipends?


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Re: How to handle Dewey (or similar firms)

Postby sunynp » Sat Apr 28, 2012 4:41 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Anyone know if Dewey is still paying 3L bar fees and salary stipends?


I have been searching all the information out there and haven't heard anything regarding 3Ls except the deferral. I read a comment from ATL that SAs were given some financial compensation, but I haven't seen that verified anywhere else.

I hate to tell you this, but I think you should prepare for the worst. I hope I'm wrong but I don't see Dewey overcoming the issues with the lenders right now. I think they are in default, and unable to draw down, or why would they be negotiating and looking for a pre-pack.

As I mentioned a few times this DA investigation seems to have been started at the worst possible time for Dewey, I don't think lenders will want to proceed with this investigation going on. On the other hand, Dewey might have a close enough relationship with the lenders to get a further extension - though it seems like they need cash, and may not be getting more cash outside of a bankruptcy situation.

I really hope I am wrong, but expecting the worst might be your best plan right now.

I guess more information will be available Monday.

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Re: How to handle Dewey (or similar firms)

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Apr 28, 2012 5:23 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:im so screwed. glad i got the news morning before a huge final. what i love most about the situation is the second degree level of fcked over going on here. gotta get good grades. so gotta study. but as of yesterday, gotta look for a job. maybe good can come out of it? as in, maybe ill get something else instead where at least i wont not get an offer? or maybe i wont.


This is definitely one of those unforeseeable, awful turn of events that nobody should have to deal with, especially during finals. But keep in mind that there's a lot of goodwill out there for Dewey summers. I was able to find an alternative. Assuming you land on your feet soon, this is something you'll forever cite as an example of overcoming adversity.

I hope you are actively reaching out to every v100 firm and hounding your career office people for any leads. This strategy paid off for me.

That said, even if things don't work out for this summer (and I am confident they can/will), it doesn't sound like a consolation now but you will go into 3L recruiting with a leg up on most others (I don't care what anybody says, this sentiment was communicated to me by many unrelated sources, including partners, before I found another firm).

Good luck to all.


I feel like I'm in a rut. I've contacted most of the V100 over the past weeks to no avail. What did you say that helped you land something?

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Re: How to handle Dewey (or similar firms)

Postby Sup Kid » Sat Apr 28, 2012 5:34 pm

This was recently posted on ATL's comment boards. No idea if it's legitimate though.

TO: Global Personnel

First, we want to express our appreciation to all of the staff and lawyers who have made this firm great and who continue to support the firm. We know how stressful the current uncertainty can be for everyone involved. We are continuing to do everything we can to help the firm continue with the great work that we are still doing every day.

We are writing to let everyone know that they should not be alarmed by recent press speculation about any imminent plan for any type of filing. The firm remains in business, continues to serve its clients with the highest level of quality and has made no decision to go in any different direction.

As you have undoubtedly read, we are exploring possible transactions with other firms and other alternatives for moving forward. We will continue to do so and will let people know if anything definitive is agreed to. For now, please continue to do all of our work as you always have as that is the best thing we can all do to help the firm at this difficult time.

Martin, Steve, Jeff, Charley and Rich

The Office of the Chairman

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Re: How to handle Dewey (or similar firms)

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Apr 28, 2012 5:52 pm

Re: SAs. Does anyone think (hope) that other firms may have been somewhat reluctant to poach Dewey SAs while the program was uncertain, whereas now that the program has been officially cancelled, next week Firms will be more willing/open to add a person or two?

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Re: How to handle Dewey (or similar firms)

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Apr 28, 2012 6:44 pm

Younger Abstention wrote:
MrAnon wrote:This is essentially a no offer.

Ask the Howrey SAs.

or the Latham SAs.


It's certainly not looked at, as far as future hiring goes, the same way.


Depends. If you find something else, it's better than being no-offered. Otherwise, it's worse. Lots of quality people got no-offered from the class of '10 and '11. At least they got to work for a summer, but their lives were shattered just as badly. Dewey SAs can now know what it would feel like to be a 2011 law grad... there's still time to find other paths and other opportunities. But like many '11ers, ... they got fucked.

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Re: How to handle Dewey (or similar firms)

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Apr 28, 2012 11:15 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:im so screwed. glad i got the news morning before a huge final. what i love most about the situation is the second degree level of fcked over going on here. gotta get good grades. so gotta study. but as of yesterday, gotta look for a job. maybe good can come out of it? as in, maybe ill get something else instead where at least i wont not get an offer? or maybe i wont.


This is definitely one of those unforeseeable, awful turn of events that nobody should have to deal with, especially during finals. But keep in mind that there's a lot of goodwill out there for Dewey summers. I was able to find an alternative. Assuming you land on your feet soon, this is something you'll forever cite as an example of overcoming adversity.

I hope you are actively reaching out to every v100 firm and hounding your career office people for any leads. This strategy paid off for me.

That said, even if things don't work out for this summer (and I am confident they can/will), it doesn't sound like a consolation now but you will go into 3L recruiting with a leg up on most others (I don't care what anybody says, this sentiment was communicated to me by many unrelated sources, including partners, before I found another firm).

Good luck to all.


I feel like I'm in a rut. I've contacted most of the V100 over the past weeks to no avail. What did you say that helped you land something?


If you can elaborate on how you were successful in getting another summer associate we would grealty appreciate it. When did you start looking? Did you get an offer or rejection from the firm during OCI? Did you contact HR or partners directly? Anything else that might be helpful is very much appreciated.

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Re: How to handle Dewey (or similar firms)

Postby acrossthelake » Sun Apr 29, 2012 12:03 am

If some of you with like two post would post non-anon with your questions, people would probably be willing to PM you replies. I understand the need to be anon, but considering that most of these anon posts are coming from completely anonymous names that are probably alts, I thought I'd point out that that might help in garnering useful more personal responses.

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Re: How to handle Dewey (or similar firms)

Postby dream » Sun Apr 29, 2012 12:22 am

thanks
Last edited by dream on Sun Apr 29, 2012 1:22 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: How to handle Dewey (or similar firms)

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Apr 29, 2012 12:33 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:im so screwed. glad i got the news morning before a huge final. what i love most about the situation is the second degree level of fcked over going on here. gotta get good grades. so gotta study. but as of yesterday, gotta look for a job. maybe good can come out of it? as in, maybe ill get something else instead where at least i wont not get an offer? or maybe i wont.


This is definitely one of those unforeseeable, awful turn of events that nobody should have to deal with, especially during finals. But keep in mind that there's a lot of goodwill out there for Dewey summers. I was able to find an alternative. Assuming you land on your feet soon, this is something you'll forever cite as an example of overcoming adversity.

I hope you are actively reaching out to every v100 firm and hounding your career office people for any leads. This strategy paid off for me.

That said, even if things don't work out for this summer (and I am confident they can/will), it doesn't sound like a consolation now but you will go into 3L recruiting with a leg up on most others (I don't care what anybody says, this sentiment was communicated to me by many unrelated sources, including partners, before I found another firm).

Good luck to all.


I feel like I'm in a rut. I've contacted most of the V100 over the past weeks to no avail. What did you say that helped you land something?


If you can elaborate on how you were successful in getting another summer associate we would grealty appreciate it. When did you start looking? Did you get an offer or rejection from the firm during OCI? Did you contact HR or partners directly? Anything else that might be helpful is very much appreciated.


I started putting feelers out shortly after the February Above the Law article ran. I was cautious about it, but I had a bad feeling about things based on the initial reporting.

I had three callback-like interviews with firms, all in the same week. These were firms I had not interviewed with in any capacity previously.

I don't think it matters if you reach out to the recruiting staff or the hiring partner directly because the communication will likely be funneled to the hiring partner in any event.

First, I recommend (if you have not already) going to talk your career office. Hound them. Ask them what firms they have spoken to recently and if they have communicated any possibility of taking another SA. If they haven't already been making these calls, ask why. This is their job. If you don't get anywhere with one counselor, go to the next. And so on. Go to office hours and talk to professors (I had two professors offer to give me names of partners I could call). Talk to your lawyer friends at firms. Talk to any and everybody who might possibly have a meaningful connection and ask if they would not mind at least passing along your resume. In my experience, it can be difficult to stand out without some sort of connection that makes you a real person. Now is the best time to be proactive because the Dewey wounds are fresh, and given the exceptional circumstances people will probably be willing to do more for you than they would normally.

I think it's smart to reach out to every firm under the sun right now, but your cover letters need to stand out. I have always had better luck with well written, thoughtful, carefully tailored cover letters. This is annoying and something you doubtfully have time for right now, but securing a SA has to be a major priority right now. The more generic the cover letter, the less it will seem like you are desperately clinging to any possibility. While this is probably the case, adding another SA is a major investment for most firms, and they don't want to spend $30K this summer if they think you might hop ship in the Fall. If you can, I would try to convey that you would be committed to them for the long haul.

If you do get the opportunity to interview, I have a few recommendations (sorry if they're obvious):
- Stay positive. People get that the situation sucks, but you don't want to seem desperate.
- Emphasize how fortunate you feel that the firm is considering adding you to their program so close to summer. Talk about what a great fit you think it would be for specific reasons.
- The truth is, it might not happen right away, but these situations do work out for most people (contrary to what the sensationalists/flamers on this board might say). Remember this, and you might even say as much in your interviews.
-Be aggressive. Nobody is going to look down on you for being aggressive asking about timing, sending thank you letters, following up, checking in, etc. Obviously do so with disclaimers and don't go overboard, but make it clear that you're on it, into it, and they'd be lucky to have you.

I hope at least something in here helps. Good luck.

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Re: How to handle Dewey (or similar firms)

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Apr 29, 2012 12:46 am

Anonymous User wrote:I started putting feelers out shortly after the February Above the Law article ran. I was cautious about it, but I had a bad feeling about things based on the initial reporting.

I had three callback-like interviews with firms, all in the same week. These were firms I had not interviewed with in any capacity previously.

I don't think it matters if you reach out to the recruiting staff or the hiring partner directly because the communication will likely be funneled to the hiring partner in any event.

First, I recommend (if you have not already) going to talk your career office. Hound them. Ask them what firms they have spoken to recently and if they have communicated any possibility of taking another SA. If they haven't already been making these calls, ask why. This is their job. If you don't get anywhere with one counselor, go to the next. And so on. Go to office hours and talk to professors (I had two professors offer to give me names of partners I could call). Talk to your lawyer friends at firms. Talk to any and everybody who might possibly have a meaningful connection and ask if they would not mind at least passing along your resume. In my experience, it can be difficult to stand out without some sort of connection that makes you a real person. Now is the best time to be proactive because the Dewey wounds are fresh, and given the exceptional circumstances people will probably be willing to do more for you than they would normally.

I think it's smart to reach out to every firm under the sun right now, but your cover letters need to stand out. I have always had better luck with well written, thoughtful, carefully tailored cover letters. This is annoying and something you doubtfully have time for right now, but securing a SA has to be a major priority right now. The more generic the cover letter, the less it will seem like you are desperately clinging to any possibility. While this is probably the case, adding another SA is a major investment for most firms, and they don't want to spend $30K this summer if they think you might hop ship in the Fall. If you can, I would try to convey that you would be committed to them for the long haul.

If you do get the opportunity to interview, I have a few recommendations (sorry if they're obvious):
- Stay positive. People get that the situation sucks, but you don't want to seem desperate.
- Emphasize how fortunate you feel that the firm is considering adding you to their program so close to summer. Talk about what a great fit you think it would be for specific reasons.
- The truth is, it might not happen right away, but these situations do work out for most people (contrary to what the sensationalists/flamers on this board might say). Remember this, and you might even say as much in your interviews.
-Be aggressive. Nobody is going to look down on you for being aggressive asking about timing, sending thank you letters, following up, checking in, etc. Obviously do so with disclaimers and don't go overboard, but make it clear that you're on it, into it, and they'd be lucky to have you.

I hope at least something in here helps. Good luck.


One more thing: if you had other offers, it goes without saying that you should reach out to these firms first.

I know others have suggested reaching out to firms where former Dewey partners are going, which is definitely a good idea, although I fear current associates might be higher on many of these partners' priority lists.

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Re: How to handle Dewey (or similar firms)

Postby The Pen Is Mightier » Sun Apr 29, 2012 1:27 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I started putting feelers out shortly after the February Above the Law article ran. I was cautious about it, but I had a bad feeling about things based on the initial reporting.

I had three callback-like interviews with firms, all in the same week. These were firms I had not interviewed with in any capacity previously.

I don't think it matters if you reach out to the recruiting staff or the hiring partner directly because the communication will likely be funneled to the hiring partner in any event.

First, I recommend (if you have not already) going to talk your career office. Hound them. Ask them what firms they have spoken to recently and if they have communicated any possibility of taking another SA. If they haven't already been making these calls, ask why. This is their job. If you don't get anywhere with one counselor, go to the next. And so on. Go to office hours and talk to professors (I had two professors offer to give me names of partners I could call). Talk to your lawyer friends at firms. Talk to any and everybody who might possibly have a meaningful connection and ask if they would not mind at least passing along your resume. In my experience, it can be difficult to stand out without some sort of connection that makes you a real person. Now is the best time to be proactive because the Dewey wounds are fresh, and given the exceptional circumstances people will probably be willing to do more for you than they would normally.

I think it's smart to reach out to every firm under the sun right now, but your cover letters need to stand out. I have always had better luck with well written, thoughtful, carefully tailored cover letters. This is annoying and something you doubtfully have time for right now, but securing a SA has to be a major priority right now. The more generic the cover letter, the less it will seem like you are desperately clinging to any possibility. While this is probably the case, adding another SA is a major investment for most firms, and they don't want to spend $30K this summer if they think you might hop ship in the Fall. If you can, I would try to convey that you would be committed to them for the long haul.

If you do get the opportunity to interview, I have a few recommendations (sorry if they're obvious):
- Stay positive. People get that the situation sucks, but you don't want to seem desperate.
- Emphasize how fortunate you feel that the firm is considering adding you to their program so close to summer. Talk about what a great fit you think it would be for specific reasons.
- The truth is, it might not happen right away, but these situations do work out for most people (contrary to what the sensationalists/flamers on this board might say). Remember this, and you might even say as much in your interviews.
-Be aggressive. Nobody is going to look down on you for being aggressive asking about timing, sending thank you letters, following up, checking in, etc. Obviously do so with disclaimers and don't go overboard, but make it clear that you're on it, into it, and they'd be lucky to have you.

I hope at least something in here helps. Good luck.


One more thing: if you had other offers, it goes without saying that you should reach out to these firms first.

I know others have suggested reaching out to firms where former Dewey partners are going, which is definitely a good idea, although I fear current associates might be higher on many of these partners' priority lists.


Seriously good advice.

If I might add, hit up your alumni networks as well. Both ug and ls. And don't be shy about contacting multiple people within firms. Where you lack a personal connection, showing some sort of common tie will engender sympathy and make you stand out much more than a generic cover letter.

And I personally think it's a good idea to mention your situation and tie right in the subject line of your cover email, eg "seeking advice - former Dewey & leboeuf summer associate, Princeton law student"

Good luck guys

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Re: How to handle Dewey (or similar firms)

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Apr 29, 2012 2:42 am

tls folk - any thoughts on how junior (1st or 2nd year associates) should handle this situation? too junior to find many lateral opportunities, too senior to take advantage of law school career services offices...some haven't been working at d&l for even a year yet, and hardly have any real experience to put on the resume.

how would you guys advise getting out there and finding places to land?

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Re: How to handle Dewey (or similar firms)

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Apr 29, 2012 10:02 am

There is a surprising number of places looking for first years.




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