How many 2Ls at a t10 are still jobless?

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Re: How many 2Ls at a t10 are still jobless?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Feb 22, 2012 1:57 am

Guchster wrote:Things seems back to pre-disaster times at CLS.

From earlier CLS posts, getting jobs before the recession was like “shooting fish in a barrel.” Are you saying things are heading in that direction or are presently at that level? CLS is a few notches up from my school ranking―hoping for a trickledown effect!

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Re: How many 2Ls at a t10 are still jobless?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Feb 22, 2012 2:21 am

while it is sensible that things have gotten better, but i would have a hard time believing that things are back to pre-recessions times.

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Detrox
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Re: How many 2Ls at a t10 are still jobless?

Postby Detrox » Wed Feb 22, 2012 2:28 am

Anecdotal NYU report:

Everyone I know who partcipated in EIW and did not limit themselves to a non-NYC market received an offer. Even the few who did limit themselves to other markets later managed to get offers although not necessarily in the target market.

Only people who I know who are still looking are those who chose not to partcipate in EIW and I do not know the real extent of their job hunting efforts at present.

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Re: How many 2Ls at a t10 are still jobless?

Postby Stanford4Me » Wed Feb 22, 2012 2:50 am

I can't think of any of my friends who are unemployed. I know one of my friends had trouble because his grades were shitty (like bottom quarter) not sure if he ever found anything. People may not have gotten their first choice, but they got something.

@NYU btw.

Edit: This is not to say we have 100% employment.

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Re: How many 2Ls at a t10 are still jobless?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Feb 22, 2012 3:15 am

abacus wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:At HLS, and I know nobody who did EIP and struck out. I do know a couple of people who didn't have an offer in hand before fall semester started, but those people have since found biglaw jobs or market-paying equivalents.


Did the people that struck out at EIP have any obvious weaknesses as candidates? (e.g.: no work experience, an LP)


The only person I know that struck out at EIP at HLS was both straight through and applying to tough secondary market (along with probably bot 25% grades? didn't know their grades exactly). That said they found a V50ish firm job shortly after EIP.

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Re: How many 2Ls at a t10 are still jobless?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Feb 22, 2012 9:46 am

Interesting, many 2Ls I talk to do not have anything lined up and are starting to panic. Granted, not top 20 school but still, pretty scary.

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Re: How many 2Ls at a t10 are still jobless?

Postby ahnhub » Wed Feb 22, 2012 10:04 am

Anonymous User wrote:Interesting, many 2Ls I talk to do not have anything lined up and are starting to panic. Granted, not top 20 school but still, pretty scary.


Starting to panic, huh? Because everyone who chose to attend a non Top-20 school in 2010 assumed they would swoop into OCI and get Biglaw?

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Re: How many 2Ls at a t10 are still jobless?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Feb 22, 2012 10:08 am

ahnhub wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Interesting, many 2Ls I talk to do not have anything lined up and are starting to panic. Granted, not top 20 school but still, pretty scary.


Starting to panic, huh? Because everyone who chose to attend a non Top-20 school in 2010 assumed they would swoop into OCI and get Biglaw?



No, swoop into private practice at least.

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Re: How many 2Ls at a t10 are still jobless?

Postby LawIdiot86 » Wed Feb 22, 2012 11:44 am

Anonymous User wrote:
ahnhub wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Interesting, many 2Ls I talk to do not have anything lined up and are starting to panic. Granted, not top 20 school but still, pretty scary.


Starting to panic, huh? Because everyone who chose to attend a non Top-20 school in 2010 assumed they would swoop into OCI and get Biglaw?



No, swoop into private practice at least.


When only 2/3 of graduates are getting jobs requiring JDs, let alone private practice, that is a risky assumption on which to base a life-altering choice.

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Re: How many 2Ls at a t10 are still jobless?

Postby Stanford4Me » Wed Feb 22, 2012 12:01 pm

LawIdiot86 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
ahnhub wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Interesting, many 2Ls I talk to do not have anything lined up and are starting to panic. Granted, not top 20 school but still, pretty scary.


Starting to panic, huh? Because everyone who chose to attend a non Top-20 school in 2010 assumed they would swoop into OCI and get Biglaw?



No, swoop into private practice at least.


When only 2/3 of graduates are getting jobs requiring JDs, let alone private practice, that is a risky assumption on which to base a life-altering choice.

Welcome to law school!

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Re: How many 2Ls at a t10 are still jobless?

Postby c3pO4 » Wed Feb 22, 2012 12:42 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
ahnhub wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Interesting, many 2Ls I talk to do not have anything lined up and are starting to panic. Granted, not top 20 school but still, pretty scary.


Starting to panic, huh? Because everyone who chose to attend a non Top-20 school in 2010 assumed they would swoop into OCI and get Biglaw?



No, swoop into private practice at least.


Yea, they were hopelessly misinformed or in denial. The fact that you find this "interesting" implies you are equally naive.

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Re: How many 2Ls at a t10 are still jobless?

Postby 2LsAPlenty » Wed Feb 22, 2012 12:52 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
ahnhub wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Interesting, many 2Ls I talk to do not have anything lined up and are starting to panic. Granted, not top 20 school but still, pretty scary.


Starting to panic, huh? Because everyone who chose to attend a non Top-20 school in 2010 assumed they would swoop into OCI and get Biglaw?



No, swoop into private practice at least.


Yea, they were hopelessly misinformed or in denial. The fact that you find this "interesting" implies you are equally naive.


Interesting meant from the perspective of being different from what is being said here. Does your style of posting translate into effective interview skills?

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Re: How many 2Ls at a t10 are still jobless?

Postby dailygrind » Wed Feb 22, 2012 12:57 pm

How about we all try to be civil to each other when using the anonymous feature?

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Re: How many 2Ls at a t10 are still jobless?

Postby Guchster » Wed Feb 22, 2012 1:23 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Guchster wrote:Things seems back to pre-disaster times at CLS.

From earlier CLS posts, getting jobs before the recession was like “shooting fish in a barrel.” Are you saying things are heading in that direction or are presently at that level? CLS is a few notches up from my school ranking―hoping for a trickledown effect!


I'd say this is same at CLS:


Detrox wrote:Anecdotal NYU report:

Everyone I know who partcipated in EIW and did not limit themselves to a non-NYC market received an offer. Even the few who did limit themselves to other markets later managed to get offers although not necessarily in the target market.

Only people who I know who are still looking are those who chose not to partcipate in EIW and I do not know the real extent of their job hunting efforts at present.


Wouldn't say this is quite shooting fish in a barrel yet, but it's headed in that trajectory.

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Re: How many 2Ls at a t10 are still jobless?

Postby LawIdiot86 » Wed Feb 22, 2012 2:34 pm

Guchster wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Guchster wrote:Things seems back to pre-disaster times at CLS.

From earlier CLS posts, getting jobs before the recession was like “shooting fish in a barrel.” Are you saying things are heading in that direction or are presently at that level? CLS is a few notches up from my school ranking―hoping for a trickledown effect!


I'd say this is same at CLS:


Detrox wrote:Anecdotal NYU report:

Everyone I know who partcipated in EIW and did not limit themselves to a non-NYC market received an offer. Even the few who did limit themselves to other markets later managed to get offers although not necessarily in the target market.

Only people who I know who are still looking are those who chose not to partcipate in EIW and I do not know the real extent of their job hunting efforts at present.


Wouldn't say this is quite shooting fish in a barrel yet, but it's headed in that trajectory.


I think ITE there is a much greater stratification of schools than there was in the past as employers flee to indicia of quality. My T14 is nowhere near its prior numbers and even people I know at T30s are struggling unless they have lots of latin/dean's list stuff on their resume. It looks like you either have to go to a school with instant name recognition (T6) or have killed it with latin at a good school.

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Re: How many 2Ls at a t10 are still jobless?

Postby ahnhub » Wed Feb 22, 2012 6:36 pm

LawIdiot86 wrote: I think ITE there is a much greater stratification of schools than there was in the past as employers flee to indicia of quality. My T14 is nowhere near its prior numbers and even people I know at T30s are struggling unless they have lots of latin/dean's list stuff on their resume. It looks like you either have to go to a school with instant name recognition (T6) or have killed it with latin at a good school.


I don't understand what the bolded means (mostly because you use the word "even"). Why do you think T6 schools have instant name recognition while, say, Berkeley or Duke don't?

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Re: How many 2Ls at a t10 are still jobless?

Postby LawIdiot86 » Wed Feb 22, 2012 6:44 pm

ahnhub wrote:
LawIdiot86 wrote: I think ITE there is a much greater stratification of schools than there was in the past as employers flee to indicia of quality. My T14 is nowhere near its prior numbers and even people I know at T30s are struggling unless they have lots of latin/dean's list stuff on their resume. It looks like you either have to go to a school with instant name recognition (T6) or have killed it with latin at a good school.


I don't understand what the bolded means (mostly because you use the word "even"). Why do you think T6 schools have instant name recognition while, say, Berkeley or Duke don't?


I'm saying that people I know at good law schools, T14s and T30s, are still struggling and those schools haven't bounced back to the degree that the T6 have. And T6 schools seem to have a greater indicia of quality and name recognition as excellent law schools compared to the rest of the T14. The same way a friend of mine regrets going to Swarthmore over UPenn because people have heard of Swarthmore, but don't have the instantaneous association of extreme excellence they do from UPenn's membership in the ivy league. Everyone's heard of Duke and Berkeley, but imo, they don't place it in them in the same league as the T6 (note, I go to a T14 and have a job, so I'm not trying to inflate my school or excuse a personal failure).

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Re: How many 2Ls at a t10 are still jobless?

Postby booboo » Wed Feb 22, 2012 6:46 pm

ahnhub wrote:
LawIdiot86 wrote: I think ITE there is a much greater stratification of schools than there was in the past as employers flee to indicia of quality. My T14 is nowhere near its prior numbers and even people I know at T30s are struggling unless they have lots of latin/dean's list stuff on their resume. It looks like you either have to go to a school with instant name recognition (T6) or have killed it with latin at a good school.


I don't understand what the bolded means (mostly because you use the word "even"). Why do you think T6 schools have instant name recognition while, say, Berkeley or Duke don't?


I don't think this is too difficult. HYS are relatively (we can talk about H another day) insulated from the current legal climate. Chicago is small and has an extreme dispersion of its grads (Chicago, NY, and California), which make students more desirable for employers. NYU and CLS just lucked out in being NYC schools with great reputations (within NY) and CSO's pestering law firms to treat them with a 'holier than thou' perspective while students recognize the legal climate and focus on getting hired over location.

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Re: How many 2Ls at a t10 are still jobless?

Postby johansantana21 » Wed Feb 22, 2012 7:02 pm

LawIdiot86 wrote:
ahnhub wrote:
LawIdiot86 wrote: I think ITE there is a much greater stratification of schools than there was in the past as employers flee to indicia of quality. My T14 is nowhere near its prior numbers and even people I know at T30s are struggling unless they have lots of latin/dean's list stuff on their resume. It looks like you either have to go to a school with instant name recognition (T6) or have killed it with latin at a good school.


I don't understand what the bolded means (mostly because you use the word "even"). Why do you think T6 schools have instant name recognition while, say, Berkeley or Duke don't?


I'm saying that people I know at good law schools, T14s and T30s, are still struggling and those schools haven't bounced back to the degree that the T6 have. And T6 schools seem to have a greater indicia of quality and name recognition as excellent law schools compared to the rest of the T14. The same way a friend of mine regrets going to Swarthmore over UPenn because people have heard of Swarthmore, but don't have the instantaneous association of extreme excellence they do from UPenn's membership in the ivy league. Everyone's heard of Duke and Berkeley, but imo, they don't place it in them in the same league as the T6 (note, I go to a T14 and have a job, so I'm not trying to inflate my school or excuse a personal failure).


I'm sorry you go to Gtown.

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Re: How many 2Ls at a t10 are still jobless?

Postby ahnhub » Wed Feb 22, 2012 7:04 pm

booboo wrote: I don't think this is too difficult. HYS are relatively (we can talk about H another day) insulated from the current legal climate. Chicago is small and has an extreme dispersion of its grads (Chicago, NY, and California), which make students more desirable for employers. NYU and CLS just lucked out in being NYC schools with great reputations (within NY) and CSO's pestering law firms to treat them with a 'holier than thou' perspective while students recognize the legal climate and focus on getting hired over location.


Huh, well you would know better than me. But Desert Fox posted that he counted up everyone in one 2L section who had an SA lined up at NU, and 83% of those who wanted one had one. My impression was that 2011 OCI went much better everywhere, throughout the T-14.

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Re: How many 2Ls at a t10 are still jobless?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Feb 22, 2012 8:28 pm

just out of curiosity, when we talk about SA, is it just V100 or NLJ250 or even broader, i.e., roughly market-paying gig at a large firm?

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Re: How many 2Ls at a t10 are still jobless?

Postby 09042014 » Wed Feb 22, 2012 8:31 pm

Guchster wrote:Things seems back to pre-disaster times at CLS.

People that wanted big law that didn't get it seem to be bottom of the barrel, or made serious mistakes in bidding.


That isn't pre-disaster time placement. People on TLS in 2008 weren't bullshitting when they said t14 = biglaw.

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Re: How many 2Ls at a t10 are still jobless?

Postby LawIdiot86 » Wed Feb 22, 2012 8:38 pm

Desert Fox wrote:
Guchster wrote:Things seems back to pre-disaster times at CLS.

People that wanted big law that didn't get it seem to be bottom of the barrel, or made serious mistakes in bidding.


That isn't pre-disaster time placement. People on TLS in 2008 weren't bullshitting when they said t14 = biglaw.


This is something I wonder about. Looking at Chambers, many firms have slashed their classed 50-75%. Admitting it was really fucking hard to find a job and lots of my friends still can't find work, exactly who was getting jobs in 2008? Even 100% of the T14s would fill all the historical summer slots that no longer exist.

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Re: How many 2Ls at a t10 are still jobless?

Postby beachbum » Wed Feb 22, 2012 8:40 pm

I admittedly have a pretty limited base to work with, but of the 2Ls and 3Ls I've spoken with/heard about, only two don't have something lined up. (And one of those was almost definitely due to the burgers). Below median kids have biglaw lined up; I'm not sure if this is the rule or the exception, but it's definitely encouraging.

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Re: How many 2Ls at a t10 are still jobless?

Postby IAFG » Wed Feb 22, 2012 8:47 pm

LawIdiot86 wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:
Guchster wrote:Things seems back to pre-disaster times at CLS.

People that wanted big law that didn't get it seem to be bottom of the barrel, or made serious mistakes in bidding.


That isn't pre-disaster time placement. People on TLS in 2008 weren't bullshitting when they said t14 = biglaw.


This is something I wonder about. Looking at Chambers, many firms have slashed their classed 50-75%. Admitting it was really fucking hard to find a job and lots of my friends still can't find work, exactly who was getting jobs in 2008? Even 100% of the T14s would fill all the historical summer slots that no longer exist.

Are you asking who outside the T14? Top 10% at most schools had a good shot.

I think we're at pre-boom levels. But I also worry that some firms (Cleary, DPW) have been binging themselves again.




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