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Anonymous User
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Pointless Thread.

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jan 25, 2012 7:26 pm

...
Last edited by Anonymous User on Wed Jan 25, 2012 10:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Helmholtz
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Re: 1L SA unpaid at v100?

Postby Helmholtz » Wed Jan 25, 2012 8:00 pm

I'm surprised that the firm is willing to do this. Legally, this could be a really sticky area for them.

If you don't have anything else, then I guess you've got to take it, though. Unfortunately, it doesn't pay and your school is never going to offer you any kind of stipend for working unpaid for a firm.

Anonymous User
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Re: 1L SA unpaid at v100?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jan 25, 2012 8:04 pm

Helmholtz wrote:I'm surprised that the firm is willing to do this. Legally, this could be a really sticky area for them.

If you don't have anything else, then I guess you've got to take it, though. Unfortunately, it doesn't pay and your school is never going to offer you any kind of stipend for working unpaid for a firm.


Thank you for the response. As of right now, nothing else, don't really expect anything else and biglaw after graduation is definitely my goal. Money isn't an issue, my only expense would be gas/food.

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sunynp
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Re: 1L SA unpaid at v100?

Postby sunynp » Wed Jan 25, 2012 8:17 pm

I wouldn't expect any substantive work - this set up sounds odd. It isn't legal for a for profit law firm to take volunteers. Is this some kind of internship? Will you be able to put their name on your resume for OCI? Will you be able to get references? What will they say?

LjakW
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Re: 1L SA unpaid at v100?

Postby LjakW » Wed Jan 25, 2012 8:21 pm

If money is not an issue and you can write Summer Associate on your resume, this is definitely a blessing. Close to bottom 1/3 at a low T14 has iffy odds of getting biglaw at 2L EIP. With this on your resume, odds are much better, in my opinion.

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Aberzombie1892
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Re: 1L SA unpaid at v100?

Postby Aberzombie1892 » Wed Jan 25, 2012 8:23 pm

I agree that this set up is fishy. In fact, it could downright be illegal.

Regardless, the biggest concern for you is to explain why you weren't invited back for 2L (assuming this is the case). I'm not sure what you would say.

Anonymous User
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Re: 1L SA unpaid at v100?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jan 25, 2012 8:26 pm

LjakW wrote:If money is not an issue and you can write Summer Associate on your resume, this is definitely a blessing. Close to bottom 1/3 at a low T14 has iffy odds of getting biglaw at 2L EIP. With this on your resume, odds are much better, in my opinion.


This is what I'm hoping. Clearly being above median after next semester is pretty necessary, but right now I feel this will be my best option for 1l summer.

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Re: 1L SA unpaid at v100?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jan 25, 2012 8:31 pm

Aberzombie1892 wrote:I agree that this set up is fishy. In fact, it could downright be illegal.

Regardless, the biggest concern for you is to explain why you weren't invited back for 2L (assuming this is the case). I'm not sure what you would say.


Yes, that is exactly my concern. I will say that I in no way shape or form tried my absolute hardest 1st semester, more of a complete underestimate of the work needed for top grades, and an underestimate of how bright everyone else is. But given that hardwork doesn't always correlate with good grades, very scared of a repeat semester.

But then again, if I'm bottom 1/3 after spring, is there really a difference of either explaining why I wasn't invited back or not. Either way I'll be in a shitty spot, probably with no interviews. I guess if I do better and have grades that snag me actual interviews, explaining it would suck, but right now I think its a chance I should take. No?

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Re: 1L SA unpaid at v100?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jan 25, 2012 8:34 pm

sunynp wrote:I wouldn't expect any substantive work - this set up sounds odd. It isn't legal for a for profit law firm to take volunteers. Is this some kind of internship? Will you be able to put their name on your resume for OCI? Will you be able to get references? What will they say?


Substantive work is what I'm worried about, although the way it was explained to me is that it will be an SA position. But why wouldn't I be able to put their name on my resume? How would anybody know I didn't get paid, aside from this thread which will be deleted shortly.

cantabaout
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Re: 1L SA unpaid at v100?

Postby cantabaout » Wed Jan 25, 2012 8:40 pm

this is strange too.
either they won't let you do substantive work,
or this will not continue for a long period

(I know a pal who interned for a firm for free for a short period, before it turned into a paid position... and my pal just happened to be there and wanted to start earlier)

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Pato_09
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Re: 1L SA unpaid at v100?

Postby Pato_09 » Wed Jan 25, 2012 8:42 pm

Take it. Most 1L summer positions are unpaid anyway. It would be good for OCI, since you will be able to talk about how you excelled in a big firm environment etc. etc.

09042014
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Re: 1L SA unpaid at v100?

Postby 09042014 » Wed Jan 25, 2012 8:45 pm

1) Most people work for free at law schools.

2) If you aren't getting paid you can probably get credit for an externship. My school certainly allows it.

3) It'll be good for your resume.

4) IF you do good work, there is an outside shot they take you long term. Bottom third isn't too bad for v100.

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$peppercorn
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Re: 1L SA unpaid at v100?

Postby $peppercorn » Wed Jan 25, 2012 8:46 pm

Our Career office was talking to us about this. Technically the firm can do it as long you do absolutely nothing to benefit the firm or their work. They said the only things that you are allowed to do are things that you could do in an education environment. I'm surprised that a firm would even go through the trouble.

cantabaout
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Re: 1L SA unpaid at v100?

Postby cantabaout » Wed Jan 25, 2012 8:47 pm

maybe OP'sbackground is otherwise impressive (despite his 1L grades) and the firm saw potential in him and considered take him/her as a permanent hire?

09042014
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Re: 1L SA unpaid at v100?

Postby 09042014 » Wed Jan 25, 2012 8:48 pm

$peppercorn wrote:Our Career office was talking to us about this. Technically the firm can do it as long you do absolutely nothing to benefit the firm or their work. They said the only things that you are allowed to do are things that you could do in an education environment. I'm surprised that a firm would even go through the trouble.


This shit isn't enforced. Companies do unpaid internships commonly ITE.

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Re: 1L SA unpaid at v100?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jan 25, 2012 8:51 pm

Desert Fox wrote:
$peppercorn wrote:Our Career office was talking to us about this. Technically the firm can do it as long you do absolutely nothing to benefit the firm or their work. They said the only things that you are allowed to do are things that you could do in an education environment. I'm surprised that a firm would even go through the trouble.


This shit isn't enforced. Companies do unpaid internships commonly ITE.


This is what I'm hoping. According to OCS a writing sample is something that I need from my 1L summer and if no substantive work I don't see how this is possible. ?

FWIW most associates from this office are T1 grads from the local market. I grew up in the market and attended undergrad there. I'm guessing the t14 on the top of my transcript is helping a little, although I know this is really a favor.

Anonymous User
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Re: 1L SA unpaid at v100?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jan 25, 2012 8:53 pm

cantabaout wrote:maybe OP'sbackground is otherwise impressive (despite his 1L grades) and the firm saw potential in him and considered take him/her as a permanent hire?


Negative. :oops:. The only thing somewhat impressive is the LS on top of my transcript and my very strong ties to the region.

Anonymous User
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Re: 1L SA unpaid at v100?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jan 25, 2012 8:54 pm

Aberzombie1892 wrote:I agree that this set up is fishy. In fact, it could downright be illegal.

Regardless, the biggest concern for you is to explain why you weren't invited back for 2L (assuming this is the case). I'm not sure what you would say.



I had a 1L SA. When I went through 2L OCI not a single firm asked me if I had received a full-time offer or if I was invited back. I did, however, have great fodder for interviews- discussing everything I did or saw all summer.

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Helmholtz
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Re: 1L SA unpaid at v100?

Postby Helmholtz » Wed Jan 25, 2012 8:56 pm

Anonymous User wrote:This is what I'm hoping. According to OCS a writing sample is something that I need from my 1L summer and if no substantive work I don't see how this is possible. ?


As far as I know, maybe one or two firms out of our entire OCI asked for a writing sample. Not one NYC/Chicago biglaw firm asked for one. Maybe things are different for secondary markets.

However, you will be asked in virtually every single interview what you did over the summer. This occupied probably 30 to 40 percent of my conversation during OCI.

09042014
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Re: 1L SA unpaid at v100?

Postby 09042014 » Wed Jan 25, 2012 8:59 pm

Helmholtz wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:This is what I'm hoping. According to OCS a writing sample is something that I need from my 1L summer and if no substantive work I don't see how this is possible. ?


As far as I know, maybe one or two firms out of our entire OCI asked for a writing sample. Not one NYC/Chicago biglaw firm asked for one. Maybe things are different for secondary markets.

However, you will be asked in virtually every single interview what you did over the summer. This occupied probably 30 to 40 percent of my conversation during OCI.


Several asked me, but I had one from a LWR brief.

cantabaout
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Re: 1L SA unpaid at v100?

Postby cantabaout » Wed Jan 25, 2012 9:03 pm

yeah - on the bright side
if they do not like you, they would not even bother letting you work there for free - reasonable_man said summer positions, paid or unpaid, take up resources. you make mistakes and the associates would need to check for errors in your work etc.

maybe they like your resume. however, by the time they saw your resume all their 2L spots have been taken up. Because they were not planning to hire 1Ls or there were no more spots for the summer, they could not create a vacancy just for you.

MrAnon
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Re: 1L SA unpaid at v100?

Postby MrAnon » Wed Jan 25, 2012 9:11 pm

Do it. Its lame but apparently your friend is influential. You won't know until get there if they plan to use you as an actual SA or paralegal. You'll see when you arrive I guess. Your friend may be influential enough to get you a 2L SA there as well.

cantabaout
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Re: 1L SA unpaid at v100?

Postby cantabaout » Wed Jan 25, 2012 9:22 pm

come to think of it if a firm takes someone outside its formal/usual hiring schedule then it's unlikely to be paid work -
i thought it would be easier for a big firm to pay its interns, though.

unpaid internship helps you get in the door - as long as it's a legitimate firm, not one of those sleazy employers on craigslist.

phonepro
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Re: 1L SA unpaid at v100?

Postby phonepro » Wed Jan 25, 2012 9:27 pm

seems super shady.. and its illegal for profit firms to take volunteers.. although it happens alot.. i never heard of a V100 firm doing so, its usually crappy firms.

cantabaout
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Re: 1L SA unpaid at v100?

Postby cantabaout » Wed Jan 25, 2012 9:29 pm

but bingham xxxx in boston took 1L 'interns' last year.

the intern was a fairly bright one too, top 15% grades at a T25




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