Traveling to a wedding during Summer SA

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Anonymous User
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Traveling to a wedding during Summer SA

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Dec 13, 2011 12:38 pm

Hi TLS,

A member of my immediate family just got engaged and plans to get married in the summertime. I want to go to the wedding- but it's going to be halfway around the world and take a long time to get to (China).
I have an SA at one of the kinder, gentler V10s in NYC.. How do you think a firm like this would respond to a request for a couple of days off for me to get to/ from the wedding? How do I broach the subject? Is taking off a day or two a big no-no? I would not be spending any time there except for the wedding, probably just going and then returning ASAP to miss as little as possible.

Did anyone take a couple of days off their SA? how was this viewed? TIA!

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Hamilton
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Re: Traveling to a wedding during Summer SA

Postby Hamilton » Tue Dec 13, 2011 12:41 pm

I was able to take a day off for a wedding, no problem, but without pay for that day. I'd just suggest bringing it up sooner rather than later.

imchuckbass58
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Re: Traveling to a wedding during Summer SA

Postby imchuckbass58 » Tue Dec 13, 2011 12:45 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Hi TLS,

A member of my immediate family just got engaged and plans to get married in the summertime. I want to go to the wedding- but it's going to be halfway around the world and take a long time to get to (China).
I have an SA at one of the kinder, gentler V10s in NYC.. How do you think a firm like this would respond to a request for a couple of days off for me to get to/ from the wedding? How do I broach the subject? Is taking off a day or two a big no-no? I would not be spending any time there except for the wedding, probably just going and then returning ASAP to miss as little as possible.

Did anyone take a couple of days off their SA? how was this viewed? TIA!


First of all, is the wedding towards the beginning or end of the summer? The best possible result is it's either in August or May, and you arrange your start/end dates such that you just go afterwards or before.

If that's not an option (i.e., it is in June or July), I think it is ok to ask, as long as you do so well in advance (i.e., now). Make sure you make clear this is an immediate family member (I am assuming it's your brother/sister, otherwise, don't bother), and that you are only looking for 2-3 days off. Frame it as a discussion, not as a demand, and say you're open to starting early/ending late to make up for it. Also, broach this with legal recruiting, not with a partner.

The truth of the matter is, there's no real reason they can't give you 2-3 days off given how most SA programs are run. But you want to broach this delicately since you haven't even started working and are already asking for things.

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thesealocust
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Re: Traveling to a wedding during Summer SA

Postby thesealocust » Tue Dec 13, 2011 1:00 pm

People definitely do this. It's not a big deal, just keep your requests reasonable and professional (i.e. don't ask for the entire week off, make sure you tell lawyers you're working with about your plans well in advance, and be prepared to bring the BB with you when you go).

c3pO4
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Re: Traveling to a wedding during Summer SA

Postby c3pO4 » Tue Dec 13, 2011 1:16 pm

i wouldn't take more than 1 day off.

Citizen Genet
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Re: Traveling to a wedding during Summer SA

Postby Citizen Genet » Tue Dec 13, 2011 1:21 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I have an SA at one of the kinder, gentler V10s in NYC.



Kinder gentler compared to what? Slaughterhouses? The Mafia? Otherwise, does not compute.

BeenDidThat
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Re: Traveling to a wedding during Summer SA

Postby BeenDidThat » Tue Dec 13, 2011 1:24 pm

Citizen Genet wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I have an SA at one of the kinder, gentler V10s in NYC.



Kinder gentler compared to what? Slaughterhouses? The Mafia? Otherwise, does not compute.


...the other V10s...

Citizen Genet
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Re: Traveling to a wedding during Summer SA

Postby Citizen Genet » Tue Dec 13, 2011 2:04 pm

BeenDidThat wrote:
Citizen Genet wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I have an SA at one of the kinder, gentler V10s in NYC.



Kinder gentler compared to what? Slaughterhouses? The Mafia? Otherwise, does not compute.


...the other V10s...


There is no kinder, gentler V10. Even on a relative scale.

shmoo597
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Re: Traveling to a wedding during Summer SA

Postby shmoo597 » Tue Dec 13, 2011 3:38 pm

DO. NOT. GO. It will result in a no-offer. This is not some random firm, its a pressure cooking NYC v10 sweatshop that only cares about having you available to be a slave 24/7. This shows you are not committed. And given the worsening economy, esp re corporate work, they'll be looking for excuses to no-offer people or cold offer them to keep their offer rates high. You're a fool not cut out for biglaw if you think you can get away with this.

Citizen Genet
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Re: Traveling to a wedding during Summer SA

Postby Citizen Genet » Tue Dec 13, 2011 4:49 pm

G. T. L. Rev. wrote:
BeenDidThat wrote:
Citizen Genet wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I have an SA at one of the kinder, gentler V10s in NYC.




...the other V10s...


There is no kinder, gentler V10. Even on a relative scale.

False. Non-NYC firms demand fewer associate hours, relatively speaking (at least outside of NYC).


You're right. I meant in the context of NYC, like the original quote said. I should have been specific; I was going for humorous execution over specificity.

Anonymous User
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Re: Traveling to a wedding during Summer SA

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Dec 13, 2011 10:38 pm

G. T. L. Rev. wrote:False. Non-NYC firms demand fewer associate hours, relatively speaking (at least outside of NYC).


This is false at Kirkland & Ellis.

Anonymous User
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Re: Traveling to a wedding during Summer SA

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Dec 13, 2011 10:56 pm

G. T. L. Rev. wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
G. T. L. Rev. wrote:False. Non-NYC firms demand fewer associate hours, relatively speaking (at least outside of NYC).


This is false at Kirkland & Ellis.

I am ready to admit that. But is it really the case that the average associate @ K&E Chicago (or DC, or LA) works as many hours as the average associate in the NYC office of a NYC headquartered V10? I guess I would not be surprised if the answer was "yes," but I also would not be surprised if it was "no," with a small margin (perhaps 50 hours/year) separating the two.


Yes, if not more.

Anonymous User
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Re: Traveling to a wedding during Summer SA

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Dec 13, 2011 10:57 pm

My V10 last summer gave everyone one personal day they could use over the summer. I don't know of anyone that requested another one, but I do know of a couple of people that managed long haul vacation weddings with just that one day, but I do know of a couple of people the firm flew to destination weddings when they were unexpectedly made to travel for work either side of a weeekend and thus their previously purchased tickets became useless. Also someone that was exempted from an otherwise required weekend business trip for a siblings wedding. I think if it is a brother/sister it is fine.

ETA both of those cases involved best man/maid of honors. So if you could be in the wedding that might help heh

Anonymous User
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Re: Traveling to a wedding during Summer SA

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Dec 13, 2011 11:21 pm

Anonymous User wrote:My V10 last summer gave everyone one personal day they could use over the summer. I don't know of anyone that requested another one, but I do know of a couple of people that managed long haul vacation weddings with just that one day, but I do know of a couple of people the firm flew to destination weddings when they were unexpectedly made to travel for work either side of a weeekend and thus their previously purchased tickets became useless. Also someone that was exempted from an otherwise required weekend business trip for a siblings wedding. I think if it is a brother/sister it is fine.

ETA both of those cases involved best man/maid of honors. So if you could be in the wedding that might help heh


thanks for this. it is my sibling in-law. my spouse is in the wedding... sibling was in our wedding, too. IMO it's pretty important that I be there.

I think I actually located a couple of overnight flights online that would get me there and back for the ceremony... probably no time to even sleep in the hotel! It's going to be a brutal weekend, but if necessary I will either ask for one personal day early on or take my allotted personal day for these purposes. Thanks to everyone who responded! (except you fear-mongerors out there, ha. )

Anonymous User
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Re: Traveling to a wedding during Summer SA

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Dec 14, 2011 2:33 pm

Don't go for the in-laws. Not worth it. Save it for one of your best friends or one of your own siblings.

c3pO4
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Re: Traveling to a wedding during Summer SA

Postby c3pO4 » Wed Dec 14, 2011 2:40 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Don't go for the in-laws. Not worth it. Save it for one of your best friends or one of your own siblings.


yea... this seems like something that wouldn't be fun anyway. there will come a day where you'll have to skip a far more important occasion than an inlaw's wedding for a project at the firm. better to stay and make them think you're willing to make those kind of sacrifices. this is actually an opportunity to score points at the firm, if you play it right.

Anonymous User
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Re: Traveling to a wedding during Summer SA

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Dec 14, 2011 3:58 pm

c3pO4 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Don't go for the in-laws. Not worth it. Save it for one of your best friends or one of your own siblings.


yea... this seems like something that wouldn't be fun anyway. there will come a day where you'll have to skip a far more important occasion than an inlaw's wedding for a project at the firm. better to stay and make them think you're willing to make those kind of sacrifices. this is actually an opportunity to score points at the firm, if you play it right.


It seems like you're suggesting that OP tell the firm about a family wedding coming up and then tell the firm that they're so dedicated to this firm they have yet to even work at that they're going to skip it. If that's what you're suggesting, it would come off as super weird. Maybe I misread though.

I brought up a similar situation with my summer V20 and was told it wouldn't be a problem. It's not like they're assigning SAs death penalty cases, and the fact is most work can be done remotely now. When I interviewed, one of my interviewers was telling me about a vacation he had planned coming up. People don't sit in the office 24/7.

There's the caveat that maybe OP will need to cancel the trip if something comes up, but with the amount of time they have SAs spending at bs attorney lunches and bonding activities, there's no reason a wedding would doom his/her chances at this firm. Especially at a top firm that probably wants to keep that sterling 100% offer rate intact.

My advice would be to get in touch with some of last year's SAs at OP's school, sound them out, and then call recruiting based on what they have to say.

c3pO4
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Re: Traveling to a wedding during Summer SA

Postby c3pO4 » Wed Dec 14, 2011 4:04 pm

Anonymous User wrote:It seems like you're suggesting that OP tell the firm about a family wedding coming up and then tell the firm that they're so dedicated to this firm they have yet to even work at that they're going to skip it. If that's what you're suggesting, it would come off as super weird. Maybe I misread though.
.


I'm saying have your wife come to the firm's office, get in a public argument where you loudly proclaim that no wedding is more important than your work on that memo. and have her storm out. then stay at the office all weekend. profit.

Anonymous User
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Re: Traveling to a wedding during Summer SA

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Dec 16, 2011 1:48 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Don't go for the in-laws. Not worth it. Save it for one of your best friends or one of your own siblings.



would not be going for the in-laws. would be going for spouse. that's how these things work.

Anonymous User wrote:I'm saying have your wife come to the firm's office, get in a public argument where you loudly proclaim that no wedding is more important than your work on that memo. and have her storm out. then stay at the office all weekend. profit.


excellent. I think I will.

Anonymous User
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Re: Traveling to a wedding during Summer SA

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Dec 16, 2011 3:10 pm

c3pO4 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Don't go for the in-laws. Not worth it. Save it for one of your best friends or one of your own siblings.


yea... this seems like something that wouldn't be fun anyway. there will come a day where you'll have to skip a far more important occasion than an inlaw's wedding for a project at the firm. better to stay and make them think you're willing to make those kind of sacrifices. this is actually an opportunity to score points at the firm, if you play it right.


Um this is just stupid. There is no way someone will get no offered for asking for time to go to a family wedding. The worst that will happen is that the firm will say no(which they won't, you're a summer and basically useless). Firms value their offer rates, its not worth it for them to sacrifice their 100% offer rate for something like this. Hell, I know of firms that gave offers to people who acted in ways that I am surprised did not get them immediately FIRED.

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AreJay711
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Re: Traveling to a wedding during Summer SA

Postby AreJay711 » Fri Dec 16, 2011 3:13 pm

I'm hoping that one of the people getting married was born in China and has substantial family still there. Otherwise, you should boycott that shit out of principle.

Renzo
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Re: Traveling to a wedding during Summer SA

Postby Renzo » Fri Dec 16, 2011 5:07 pm

thesealocust wrote:People definitely do this. It's not a big deal, just keep your requests reasonable and professional (i.e. don't ask for the entire week off, make sure you tell lawyers you're working with about your plans well in advance, and be prepared to bring the BB with you when you go).

This

AreJay711 wrote:I'm hoping that one of the people getting married was born in China and has substantial family still there. Otherwise, you should boycott that shit out of principle.


And this.




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