Legal Internships at Big 4?

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goosey
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Legal Internships at Big 4?

Postby goosey » Fri Oct 21, 2011 9:35 pm

i tried finding info on this online but havent come across anything. has anyone heard of summer positions in tax law at any of the big 4 accounting firms?

maf70
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Re: Legal Internships at Big 4?

Postby maf70 » Fri Oct 21, 2011 9:47 pm

also interested in this.

Anonymous User
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Re: Legal Internships at Big 4?

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Oct 21, 2011 10:37 pm

Ernst and Young had a posting at my T10, the deadline was August 31st

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Re: Legal Internships at Big 4?

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Oct 22, 2011 12:05 am

PWC does. they did some oci-like recruiting

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Re: Legal Internships at Big 4?

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Oct 22, 2011 1:07 am

Are these internships actually legal internships? Can someone post a link or the name of one of these internships? I have been looking for a Big 4 legal internship but the only internships I could find were the same ones that juniors in college apply for.

TheFriendlyBarber
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Re: Legal Internships at Big 4?

Postby TheFriendlyBarber » Sat Oct 22, 2011 1:15 am

Anyone hear from Arthur Andersen????
Last edited by TheFriendlyBarber on Sat Oct 22, 2011 1:15 am, edited 1 time in total.

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crazycanuck
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Re: Legal Internships at Big 4?

Postby crazycanuck » Sat Oct 22, 2011 1:15 am

I know the tax law office that is part of/associated with (I'm not really sure what they are, their offices are on the tax floor) of my firm takes someone every now and then.

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Re: Legal Internships at Big 4?

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Oct 22, 2011 10:20 am

Anonymous User wrote:Are these internships actually legal internships? Can someone post a link or the name of one of these internships? I have been looking for a Big 4 legal internship but the only internships I could find were the same ones that juniors in college apply for.

I worked at a Big 4 as an accountant. No, they are not actually legal internships. They are tax internships. The type of tax work done at a Big 4 v. Biglaw is very very different. Big 4 are usually concerned with compliance (filing out the return) and Biglaw is more about the concepts (what's being taxed). This varies from specialty to specialty and you will be reading a lot of law if you are in Big 4 tax, it will just be from a very very different perspective. Pay is also about half of Biglaw.

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Re: Legal Internships at Big 4?

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Oct 23, 2011 2:28 pm

Anonymous User wrote: I worked at a Big 4 as an accountant. No, they are not actually legal internships. They are tax internships. The type of tax work done at a Big 4 v. Biglaw is very very different. Big 4 are usually concerned with compliance (filing out the return) and Biglaw is more about the concepts (what's being taxed). This varies from specialty to specialty and you will be reading a lot of law if you are in Big 4 tax, it will just be from a very very different perspective. Pay is also about half of Biglaw.


So did you apply for the same internships that juniors in college apply for? Also, did you have any prior accounting experience?

Lastly, do you know what salary level you would start at? I have my CPA and almost two years of accounting experience at smaller CPA firm. It would really tough to start as anything less than senior.

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Re: Legal Internships at Big 4?

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Oct 23, 2011 2:38 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote: I worked at a Big 4 as an accountant. No, they are not actually legal internships. They are tax internships. The type of tax work done at a Big 4 v. Biglaw is very very different. Big 4 are usually concerned with compliance (filing out the return) and Biglaw is more about the concepts (what's being taxed). This varies from specialty to specialty and you will be reading a lot of law if you are in Big 4 tax, it will just be from a very very different perspective. Pay is also about half of Biglaw.


So did you apply for the same internships that juniors in college apply for? Also, did you have any prior accounting experience?

Lastly, do you know what salary level you would start at? I have my CPA and almost two years of accounting experience at smaller CPA firm. It would really tough to start as anything less than senior.


Yes, same internships as juniors in college. I went in right from my MBA program, then left after a year to go to law school, so I had a BBA and MBA in accounting. A lawyer with 4 years experience who went and took accounting classes at night started at 115 as a junior associate with an eye towards a quick promotion to senior. With the JD and two years at a small firm, they might give you two years reciprocity.

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Re: Legal Internships at Big 4?

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Oct 23, 2011 3:01 pm

Anonymous User wrote:A lawyer with 4 years experience who went and took accounting classes at night started at 115 as a junior associate with an eye towards a quick promotion to senior. With the JD and two years at a small firm, they might give you two years reciprocity.


I assume that's not 115K per year as a junior?

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Re: Legal Internships at Big 4?

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Oct 23, 2011 3:08 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:A lawyer with 4 years experience who went and took accounting classes at night started at 115 as a junior associate with an eye towards a quick promotion to senior. With the JD and two years at a small firm, they might give you two years reciprocity.


I assume that's not 115K per year as a junior?

Right, I think hers was a unique circumstance in that she was a junior because our particular group wanted lawyers to have a CPA before they could be seniors. But it would be fair to say a 4th year person with an advanced graduate degree probably would get 115.

de5igual
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Re: Legal Internships at Big 4?

Postby de5igual » Sun Oct 23, 2011 3:16 pm

Not sure if it's the same in all markets, but when I was working at a Big4, the tax attorneys would start off at a Senior I level (with a bit more pay than their tax accounting counterparts: think 75K vs 60K). As far as internships, though, I'm not sure if they have it for the attorneys.

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Re: Legal Internships at Big 4?

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Oct 23, 2011 3:21 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:A lawyer with 4 years experience who went and took accounting classes at night started at 115 as a junior associate with an eye towards a quick promotion to senior. With the JD and two years at a small firm, they might give you two years reciprocity.


I assume that's not 115K per year as a junior?

Right, I think hers was a unique circumstance in that she was a junior because our particular group wanted lawyers to have a CPA before they could be seniors. But it would be fair to say a 4th year person with an advanced graduate degree probably would get 115.



Thanks!

Do you, or anyone else, have any idea how the big 4 look at quality of law school? Would going to T6 school help in the recruiting process, and would being around median be seen as a bad/good thing? I am guessing no one here really has an answer to this, but figure I'd ask since I am starting to get desperate :cry:

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Re: Legal Internships at Big 4?

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Oct 23, 2011 3:37 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:A lawyer with 4 years experience who went and took accounting classes at night started at 115 as a junior associate with an eye towards a quick promotion to senior. With the JD and two years at a small firm, they might give you two years reciprocity.


I assume that's not 115K per year as a junior?

Right, I think hers was a unique circumstance in that she was a junior because our particular group wanted lawyers to have a CPA before they could be seniors. But it would be fair to say a 4th year person with an advanced graduate degree probably would get 115.



Thanks!

Do you, or anyone else, have any idea how the big 4 look at quality of law school? Would going to T6 school help in the recruiting process, and would being around median be seen as a bad/good thing? I am guessing no one here really has an answer to this, but figure I'd ask since I am starting to get desperate :cry:


I was at a national practice in NYC of a Big 4 and the lawyer they hired went to a mid TTT or TTTT. Another lawyer I knew from the org went to a low TT in NYC and another went to a low TTTT. They care about passion for tax over school name. School name pretty much doesn't matter and while I'm sure rank helps, the classes on your transcript probably mean more.

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goosey
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Re: Legal Internships at Big 4?

Postby goosey » Mon Oct 24, 2011 12:50 pm

i am seriously looking into this for the summer. its paid, you get tax experience, and there is a job where you are more qualified than the ppl competing with you (bachelors degrees vs JD)--starting to look more and more attractive

Eve0000
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Re: Legal Internships at Big 4?

Postby Eve0000 » Mon Oct 24, 2011 1:08 pm

I currently work for one of the Big 4 after doing a summer internship here while in undergrad and have friends at the rest of the Big 4 firms. Big 4 do not have separate legal internships but they do take a lot of law school students and in the last year, more and more lawyers have been getting hired as opposed to those who only received a bachelors or a masters. The internships are structured like the summer associate programs in Big Law but the work is different. Law students at Big 4 deal with a different aspect of accounting than those with bachelors or masters, in terms of conducting research and drafting memos, as opposed to preparing tax returns. The starting salary for those just out of law school is around 80k at the Big 4. Those with JDs are definitely more respected in the Big 4 though and it's easier to get promoted faster if you put in the effort. With that said, after about 3-4 years, you should be making around 100k - 115k.

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deebs
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Re: Legal Internships at Big 4?

Postby deebs » Mon Oct 24, 2011 2:18 pm

I've been considering this myself. Great thread, thanks for the info.

Carnival1860
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Re: Legal Internships at Big 4?

Postby Carnival1860 » Mon Oct 24, 2011 9:41 pm

Dont you need an accounting BA to do this?

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Re: Legal Internships at Big 4?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Oct 25, 2011 10:19 am

Carnival1860 wrote:Dont you need an accounting BA to do this?


At my t20 OCI, one big 4 firm came to campus and required an undergrad accounting degree. Ive networked with other JDs in tax and they all told me that having an accounting degree helps A LOT. They also told me that if you don't have an accounting degree then prob a LLM would do.

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Re: Legal Internships at Big 4?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Nov 22, 2011 3:23 pm

Is there any way to actually find these internships? I've found them for Deloitte, but nothing for the other 3

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Re: Legal Internships at Big 4?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Nov 22, 2011 5:40 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Is there any way to actually find these internships? I've found them for Deloitte, but nothing for the other 3


Can you share where you found this?

A friend at E&Y told me they do it through campus recruitment in the fall and I can send my resume to her next fall so the timing is right.

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Re: Legal Internships at Big 4?

Postby ruski » Tue Nov 22, 2011 9:26 pm

just curious, but what do partners make at the big4? im curious how it compares to law firm partners.

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Re: Legal Internships at Big 4?

Postby thegrayman » Wed Nov 23, 2011 1:17 pm

ruski wrote:just curious, but what do partners make at the big4? im curious how it compares to law firm partners.


they buy-in first year at ~350K, meaning they have to buy their pship units, so 1st year as partner is a wash (pship gives them loan which they pay back over time, so not really a wash I guess but that is how it is explained)

every year performance reviews determine how many more units they can purchase

average partner comp varies by office/practice group, big4 consulting partners/principles rake it in (low amount of partners/principles, high profit practice area)

senior partners are over $1M but that is definitely not the norm, those are the guys who have been partner 10+ years

also, you can get kicked out of the pship, when times get tough you see partners get demoted to directors (non-equity partners essentially)

partners talk about their income not being guaranteed being a downside, but it seems like when the economy tanks they just lay off as many people as are needed in order to take in the same paycheck they did last year :lol:

that was what I gathered during my Big4 tenure

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Re: Legal Internships at Big 4?

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Oct 12, 2013 4:41 pm

While i am not sure on the legal internships, with an LLM in tax and JD. Most BIG 4 only start at around 70K




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