How do you stay motivated?

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Curious1
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Re: How do you stay motivated?

Postby Curious1 » Tue Oct 04, 2011 2:56 pm

minnbills wrote:
Curious1 wrote:
minnbills wrote:
Eco wrote:If you don't know already, Obama is signing into law the right of government debt collectors to call your cellphone with robo calls. Get ready for hell if you struck out on OCI.


You know, there are other things to do as a lawyer besides biglaw.


Name 4


What? Are you really taking issue with what I said?


No I'm just lightening the mood...damn it people here take things too seriously. But srsly. Name 4 :D

Anonymous User
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Re: How do you stay motivated?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Oct 04, 2011 3:01 pm

minnbills wrote:
Curious1 wrote:
minnbills wrote:
Eco wrote:If you don't know already, Obama is signing into law the right of government debt collectors to call your cellphone with robo calls. Get ready for hell if you struck out on OCI.


You know, there are other things to do as a lawyer besides biglaw.


Name 4


What? Are you really taking issue with what I said?


Stop posting. Really. You're a 0L who knows nothing of the job market yet you blindly assume that there are other positions waiting to be had.

Compliance, public interest work, in-house, Government, midlaw, small law, whatever. Good luck getting it. It's a different world, and those people you see working those jobs got them in a different time.

Why biglaw? Because it hires brand-new graduates. Why not gov't/private-company work? Because they hire very few new grads and most of those positions are very competitive.

Go through 1L, get yourself a 1L summer gig, go through the 2L job hunt, then come back and begin to speak as though you have any clue as to what it's like out there. In the meantime, don't try and talk about something you have no experience with.

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minnbills
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Re: How do you stay motivated?

Postby minnbills » Tue Oct 04, 2011 3:03 pm

.
Last edited by minnbills on Sat Nov 05, 2011 7:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

KamaalTheAbstract
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Re: How do you stay motivated?

Postby KamaalTheAbstract » Tue Oct 04, 2011 3:21 pm

minnbills wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Stop posting. Really. You're a 0L who knows nothing of the job market yet you blindly assume that there are other positions waiting to be had.



Hello strawman.

And nice abuse of the anon feature. What, don't want TLS to know you're a douchebag?


You do post in the employment forum entirely too much for someone that is a 0L. Most of the time its annoying.

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minnbills
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Re: How do you stay motivated?

Postby minnbills » Tue Oct 04, 2011 3:24 pm

,
Last edited by minnbills on Sat Nov 05, 2011 7:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

KamaalTheAbstract
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Re: How do you stay motivated?

Postby KamaalTheAbstract » Tue Oct 04, 2011 3:31 pm

By all means go ahead and do that. Its a big reason why the forum is here. Just think harder as to when your suggestions will be appreciated and when they will annoy people because they are struggling to get offers and a 0L is trying to tell them how to find employment.

Anonymous User
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Re: How do you stay motivated?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Oct 04, 2011 3:53 pm

I don't stay motivated. I do the bare minimum during the year, skip a lot of class, and then allocate 3-4 days per class to cram for finals. This keeps the grades at acceptable levels. The time that I DO spend studying, I spend trying to learn the law instead of trying to do well on the tests. Those are not always the same thing (although sometimes they overlap).

To be honest, I don't anticipate the employer that offered me to really care even if they knew I was slacking. Why would they care? They saw me work for over three months and know I can do the job. They are not invested in my grades at this point. They do probably want me to continue to learn, so I am putting a modicum of effort into that.

If you have an offer, congrats. We've earned it. Ever consider that you simply may deserve to put it on cruise control for a while?

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ExAnt3
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Re: How do you stay motivated?

Postby ExAnt3 » Tue Oct 04, 2011 5:36 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I don't stay motivated. I do the bare minimum during the year, skip a lot of class, and then allocate 3-4 days per class to cram for finals. This keeps the grades at acceptable levels. The time that I DO spend studying, I spend trying to learn the law instead of trying to do well on the tests. Those are not always the same thing (although sometimes they overlap).

To be honest, I don't anticipate the employer that offered me to really care even if they knew I was slacking. Why would they care? They saw me work for over three months and know I can do the job. They are not invested in my grades at this point. They do probably want me to continue to learn, so I am putting a modicum of effort into that.

If you have an offer, congrats. We've earned it. Ever consider that you simply may deserve to put it on cruise control for a while?


I'm a 2L with a v30 offer at CLS/NYU and already feel this way. So hard to keep motivated. I was hired for 2L SA with median grades, and with the better curve this year, I see diminishing marginal utility of studying like woah. Also, I like the Situation. Haters gon' hate.

tlstlstls73
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Re: How do you stay motivated?

Postby tlstlstls73 » Tue Oct 04, 2011 5:47 pm

ExAnt3 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I don't stay motivated. I do the bare minimum during the year, skip a lot of class, and then allocate 3-4 days per class to cram for finals. This keeps the grades at acceptable levels. The time that I DO spend studying, I spend trying to learn the law instead of trying to do well on the tests. Those are not always the same thing (although sometimes they overlap).

To be honest, I don't anticipate the employer that offered me to really care even if they knew I was slacking. Why would they care? They saw me work for over three months and know I can do the job. They are not invested in my grades at this point. They do probably want me to continue to learn, so I am putting a modicum of effort into that.

If you have an offer, congrats. We've earned it. Ever consider that you simply may deserve to put it on cruise control for a while?


I'm a 2L with a v30 offer at CLS/NYU and already feel this way. So hard to keep motivated. I was hired for 2L SA with median grades, and with the better curve this year, I see diminishing marginal utility of studying like woah. Also, I like the Situation. Haters gon' hate.


Right here with you. The motivation problem is the worst for people hired at median. 2L = higher curve so it would really take some remarkable effort to get below a 3.0. Feel like I'm back in college. Think this semester will be the big test. If it ends without utter failure, then the final 3 will be guiltless.

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Lieut Kaffee
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Re: How do you stay motivated?

Postby Lieut Kaffee » Tue Oct 04, 2011 6:22 pm

Eco wrote:A few arguments:

Big law etc... only applies to either a) those in t-10 or b) those lower ranked schools with high gpas.

In a class of (sample size here) 100 students, 30 of them will be top 30%. 70 of them will not. And those 70 will be shut out of OCI for the most part.

I feel like dropping journal in this manner would have implications beyond your peers maybe holding it against you in five years. Some kind of black mark on your transcript or some kind of honor code proceeding. I could be wrong though.


Why is that a big deal though?

If your transcript has already shut you out of OCI (giving the example of someone shut out of OCI), then what would a "no credit" mark on your transcript possibly do? IMO if your GPA isn't high enough to get screener interviews at OCI, then you might as well not give a shit what's on the transcript because you're not getting a job on the basis of your grades anyways.

And it's easily explanable. "I got sick." "Mom had cancer so I couldn't do everything." Whatever. Better than working for 2 years on a journal doing editing and cite checking, writing a 30+ page note that'll most likely not get published, etc... That time can be used making some money that right now every student needs.

If you don't know already, Obama is signing into law the right of government debt collectors to call your cellphone with robo calls. Get ready for hell if you struck out on OCI.


Wait, what? I'm going to make the [rather charitable] assumption that you were being serious in responding to these points.

First, comparing sub-par grades to whatever hypothetical sanction might attach for quitting a journal. No, they are not comparable, and no, their job-getting-preventing power does not overlap entirely. For someone who is late in the game and desperate for jobs, maybe it's not so clear what bad grades "show" to an employer. Inconsistent effort? Lack of aptitude? The school is competitive and someone has to "lose"? Regardless, if I'm certain employers, I think I can find a spot for low-grade applicants with otherwise-attractive applications.

Getting a no-credit on your transcript for quitting journal (or some kind of honor code citation) is unambiguous. At best, it shows you are a lazy quitter. At worst, it shows a pretty alarming lack of integrity and commitment. Your solution seems to be to lie. The mom with cancer thing oughta do the trick! Whenever you find yourself in the unenviable dilemma of choosing between having to fulfill a commitment you made to your peers or "making some money that right now every student needs," you should absolutely tell whatever lies you can come up with in order to weasel your way to option 2.

Cheers.

Oban
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Re: How do you stay motivated?

Postby Oban » Tue Oct 04, 2011 7:47 pm

Most people I know, those with and without jobs, just on longer seem to give a fuck. We skip class, show up late when we go to class, we are totally slacking on our notes and peruse the free food at events the subject of which eludes us.

If there wasn't the impending doom of graduating jobless 2L/3L would be cake.

mrloblaw
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Re: How do you stay motivated?

Postby mrloblaw » Tue Oct 04, 2011 8:21 pm

Oban wrote:Most people I know, those with and without jobs, just on longer seem to give a fuck. We skip class, show up late when we go to class, we are totally slacking on our notes and peruse the free food at events the subject of which eludes us.

If there wasn't the impending doom of graduating jobless 2L/3L would be cake.


It's pretty easy to keep myself paranoid that I'm going to be no-offered and stuck on the 3L job market; I'm working twice as hard as I was 1L.

Pessimism is a gift; use it wisely.

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Lieut Kaffee
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Re: How do you stay motivated?

Postby Lieut Kaffee » Tue Oct 04, 2011 8:32 pm

This might sound simplistic and pointless, but I think one valid approach may be setting goals for yourself. I find myself choosing between some different goals and deciding which ones are important to me. Choosing intelligently where to slack has made it pretty easy for me to dedicate a reasonable amount of time to not being a total slacker in other areas. For example:

In Evidence, I have decided to never read and only to attend periodically. I'll cram for the final using some combination of supplements and outlines and hope for the best.

In Crim Pro--a notoriously gunner-filled class where I actually find the prof and subject matter interesting--I have decided that (a) I have a moderate intellectual interest in the material and (b) it would bring me satisfaction to get a good grade on such a tough curve. I read for and attend this class regularly.

Journal note: I'll give it the old college try, but I've decided publication is not a serious goal of mine.

Final GPA goals: I've set some.

Finally, and more generally, I've found motivation in the enterprise of racking up a shit load of credits so my 3L can be epic in its easiness. I took 7 credits over the summer and I'm taking 16 right now (14 is the pace). I also plan to take an intersession course and 14-16 next semester. My 3L (if we think senioritis is bad now, I can only imagine how bad it will be after a 10-week taste of big law) could literally be filled with a year-long clinic, a spring break 5-credit vacation, and one seminar paper for the whole year.

Anonymous User
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Re: How do you stay motivated?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Oct 04, 2011 8:36 pm

I feel you. I can't focus in class; can't read; and have been missing classes. I just can't do it! I had a 1LSA and got a permanent offer from that firm and am working at a V-10 that gives offers to 100% almost every year (was 99% in 09).

I know I am incredibly lucky. I am also totally happy. I would really prefer to be working NOW. I can't so I just want to veg/workout/play video games for the next two years! But, they keep making me go to these stupid classes. WTF?

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Lieut Kaffee
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Re: How do you stay motivated?

Postby Lieut Kaffee » Tue Oct 04, 2011 8:38 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I feel you. I can't focus in class; can't read; and have been missing classes. I just can't do it! I had a 1LSA and got a permanent offer from that firm and am working at a V-10 that gives offers to 100% almost every year (was 99% in 09).

I know I am incredibly lucky. I am also totally happy. I would really prefer to be working NOW. I can't so I just want to veg/workout/play video games for the next two years! But, they keep making me go to these stupid classes. WTF?

On the other hand, this isn't necessarily a bad thing. Just enjoy the social aspects of law school, and if both you and your firm are okay with the prospect of you doing two years at a B average, then you literally have nothing to lose. Plus, even if you veg all semester and put a moderate bit of studying in at the end, I suspect that average might be closer to B+/A- anyway.

Anonymous User
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Re: How do you stay motivated?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Oct 04, 2011 8:50 pm

The fear of no-offer does not motivate me at all. If we are no-offered no amount of good grades will matter. Also as the one who was hired at median, if I'm no offered my 1L grades preclude me from any other job anyway, so back to square 1 --- play XBOX!

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BunkMoreland
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Re: How do you stay motivated?

Postby BunkMoreland » Tue Oct 04, 2011 8:54 pm

3L is even worse, fellas. Enjoy it.

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Lieut Kaffee
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Re: How do you stay motivated?

Postby Lieut Kaffee » Tue Oct 04, 2011 8:55 pm

Anonymous User wrote:The fear of no-offer does not motivate me at all. If we are no-offered no amount of good grades will matter.

I don't really see how that could be true. 3L hiring is certainly not something people should count on as a viable backup plan, but it's not the null set either. I had one firm tell me they were purposely decreasing the size of their 2L class to allow for a small amount of 3L hiring.

In other words, the fear that you might be in the 5% that gets no-offered, combined with the knowledge that a very select few 3Ls are hired by big law, should be a decent motivator to keep your grades up, I would think.

Anonymous User
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Re: How do you stay motivated?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Oct 04, 2011 8:58 pm

Lieut Kaffee wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:The fear of no-offer does not motivate me at all. If we are no-offered no amount of good grades will matter.

I don't really see how that could be true. 3L hiring is certainly not something people should count on as a viable backup plan, but it's not the null set either. I had one firm tell me they were purposely decreasing the size of their 2L class to allow for a small amount of 3L hiring.

In other words, the fear that you might be in the 5% that gets no-offered, combined with the knowledge that a very select few 3Ls are hired by big law, should be a decent motivator to keep your grades up, I would think.


Up is the key word. My grades already suck (median). No amount of getting them up will make me competitive for 3L OCI should I get no offered as a 2L. Thus, this is not a motivating factor.

Anonymous User
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Re: How do you stay motivated?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Oct 04, 2011 11:55 pm

the other thing is, after 1L, you get a much better sense of how to do decent in classes without trying so damn hard. I don't feel like I need to put in as much effort to get the same result. Since my classmates are (largely) slacking off too, I think we can all feel great about being median this semester after some post-thanksgiving cramming. I like it, too. I can focus on catching up on reading fiction, new television shows, actually going out to dinner with my boyfriend. law school post-offer is amazing.

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Lieut Kaffee
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Re: How do you stay motivated?

Postby Lieut Kaffee » Wed Oct 05, 2011 1:00 am

A lot of dubious anon posting ITT.

Oban
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Re: How do you stay motivated?

Postby Oban » Wed Oct 05, 2011 9:27 pm

ITT a gunner tries to justify his gunning

Anonymous User
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Re: How do you stay motivated?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Oct 05, 2011 10:35 pm

hah, staying motivated is definitely a problem. Got everything I could get out of law school grades, d.ct. clerkship next year, COA the year after, #1 choice firm after that.

I'm ineligible for honors because I transferred. I got nothing to work for except subject matter interest.

Anonymous User
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Re: How do you stay motivated?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Oct 05, 2011 11:28 pm

I am paranoid that the firm I'm with will no-offer me. It was my number 1 pick, but they don't have a 100% offer rate. Very scared and busting my ass off this year. Plus, I plan on getting married in the summer. New wife + no-offer does not equal fun honeymoon!




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