Top 5%, LR at T25 - no offers

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Anonymous User
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Re: Top 5%, LR at T25 - no offers

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Sep 09, 2011 8:49 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I'm not the OP, but I have the same stats and also no offers. For me, it hasn't been a question of social skills. Through unique family circumstances I don't have ties to anywhere and that has really hurt me in the Midwest and secondary markets.


The importance of this is understated on these boards. If you're not at a T14+Fordham, NYC biglaw generally gives you the finger no matter what your rank is. This means you're stuck duking it out in dilapidated legal markets like Atlanta and Chicago where it's like Thunderdome trying to convert a callback into an offer. Many of the firms in secondary markets with small summer classes appear to be calling back 10x as many students as they have spots to fill.

Not having ties to these markets turns the odds from tough to Hail Mary status. I'm in a similar boat to the above posters and have been taking callbacks wherever I can get them (completed 9 so far in 5 different markets), still no offers but am hopeful. Many of these have been in southern markets which move at a snail's pace.

tl;dr- Having 6+ CBs in NYC is nothing, and I mean nothing, like having 6+ CBs in smaller markets in terms of conversion rates. People can shove it with the "aspie" namecalling- myself and other socially capable people are having a hell of a hard time right now and we're not mouthbreathers by any stretch.


Don't you sort of automatically have ties to wherever you attended undergrad and law school?

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JusticeHarlan
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Re: Top 5%, LR at T25 - no offers

Postby JusticeHarlan » Fri Sep 09, 2011 9:55 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I just had a cb at a firm that brought in twenty candidates in for six positions. That'll still be a 30% conversion rate at that firm.
Your math assumes a 100% yield on their offers, though. I'm sure it's less than that, so more offers and a higher offer rate on CBs.

Not that things aren't rough and some firms/markets are going to be lower probabilities on callbacks than others, of course.

Edit: epic grammar fail
Last edited by JusticeHarlan on Sat Sep 10, 2011 7:02 am, edited 1 time in total.

Anonymous User
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Re: Top 5%, LR at T25 - no offers

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Sep 10, 2011 12:48 am

Anonymous User wrote:OP here. Almost all of my interviews at OCI were in one market, a market that I have no ties to. I didn't have a good answer to the "Why this city?" question at all, probably because I have never been to the city in question. More than anything, I think this has hurt me the most. Career Services explicitly told me that was the major problem. I only had one interview that went very poorly; apart from that, my interviews were OK to great. Admittedly, I'm not the most sociable person, but I'm not socially retarded, either. I'm not arrogant by any means; if anything, I lack confidence.

I've had a few callbacks that I thought went well, but I ended up getting dinged. Career Services has basically told me to network my ass off, though part of the problem is that they don't have many alumni in the two areas in which I have ties.

I really want to work in biglaw, but time is ticking, and I feel somewhat hopeless that I'm going to be able to find something.


Try alumni of your UG. You need to really really really really hustle right now. Not being mean but just an anecdote -- I have a friend who was top 2% @ T30, missed OCI, and spent an entire year working for free before he found a midlaw job in a different state. You need to not freak out, but realize how precarious your situation is.

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Re: Top 5%, LR at T25 - no offers

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Sep 10, 2011 11:36 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I'm not the OP, but I have the same stats and also no offers. For me, it hasn't been a question of social skills. Through unique family circumstances I don't have ties to anywhere and that has really hurt me in the Midwest and secondary markets.


The importance of this is understated on these boards. If you're not at a T14+Fordham, NYC biglaw generally gives you the finger no matter what your rank is. This means you're stuck duking it out in dilapidated legal markets like Atlanta and Chicago where it's like Thunderdome trying to convert a callback into an offer. Many of the firms in secondary markets with small summer classes appear to be calling back 10x as many students as they have spots to fill.

Not having ties to these markets turns the odds from tough to Hail Mary status. I'm in a similar boat to the above posters and have been taking callbacks wherever I can get them (completed 9 so far in 5 different markets), still no offers but am hopeful. Many of these have been in southern markets which move at a snail's pace.

tl;dr- Having 6+ CBs in NYC is nothing, and I mean nothing, like having 6+ CBs in smaller markets in terms of conversion rates. People can shove it with the "aspie" namecalling- myself and other socially capable people are having a hell of a hard time right now and we're not mouthbreathers by any stretch.


Don't you sort of automatically have ties to wherever you attended undergrad and law school?


Undergrad, yes. LS no. TLS gets many things wrong about the job search, and this is one of them. If you're from South Carolina and you go to UMinn because they're giving you 75% scholarship, Minn firms will be VERY suspicious of you without other ties. This goes for the Midwest, New England, and California. The only markets without this are New York and DC, and even there I received "Why New York?"

C/O 2015, make sure you have SOME tie to the area your school is in unless it's a T10 or something.

Anonymous User
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Re: Top 5%, LR at T25 - no offers

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Sep 10, 2011 11:40 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Don't you sort of automatically have ties to wherever you attended undergrad and law school?

Undergrad, yes. LS no. TLS gets many things wrong about the job search, and this is one of them. If you're from South Carolina and you go to UMinn because they're giving you 75% scholarship, Minn firms will be VERY suspicious of you without other ties. This goes for the Midwest, New England, and California. The only markets without this are New York and DC, and even there I received "Why New York?"

C/O 2015, make sure you have SOME tie to the area your school is in unless it's a T10 or something.



My 2 cents: You have ties to where your family is from and where you grew up. Maybe where you went to UG (maaaybe). If you aren't applying to one of those two markets, you better be applying to NYC/DC. Otherwise, you will be viewed skeptically. Based on this, I only applied to my home market. Even then I got a TON of questions about why I went to LS on the east coast -- even after living 20 years in the Bay. Got lucky and took an offer in SV and couldn't be happier to go home.

Anonymous User
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Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Top 5%, LR at T25 - no offers

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Sep 10, 2011 11:44 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Don't you sort of automatically have ties to wherever you attended undergrad and law school?

Undergrad, yes. LS no. TLS gets many things wrong about the job search, and this is one of them. If you're from South Carolina and you go to UMinn because they're giving you 75% scholarship, Minn firms will be VERY suspicious of you without other ties. This goes for the Midwest, New England, and California. The only markets without this are New York and DC, and even there I received "Why New York?"

C/O 2015, make sure you have SOME tie to the area your school is in unless it's a T10 or something.



My 2 cents: You have ties to where your family is from and where you grew up. Maybe where you went to UG (maaaybe). If you aren't applying to one of those two markets, you better be applying to NYC/DC. Otherwise, you will be viewed skeptically. Based on this, I only applied to my home market. Even then I got a TON of questions about why I went to LS on the east coast -- even after living 20 years in the Bay. Got lucky and took an offer in SV and couldn't be happier to go home.


Eh, I know people from my T6 who are getting offers from firms in California and Texas (and London) who have never even set foot in the state/country.

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Kilpatrick
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Re: Top 5%, LR at T25 - no offers

Postby Kilpatrick » Sat Sep 10, 2011 11:45 am

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Last edited by Kilpatrick on Tue Nov 08, 2011 11:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Anonymous User
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Re: Top 5%, LR at T25 - no offers

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Sep 10, 2011 12:18 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
My 2 cents: You have ties to where your family is from and where you grew up. Maybe where you went to UG (maaaybe). If you aren't applying to one of those two markets, you better be applying to NYC/DC. Otherwise, you will be viewed skeptically. Based on this, I only applied to my home market. Even then I got a TON of questions about why I went to LS on the east coast -- even after living 20 years in the Bay. Got lucky and took an offer in SV and couldn't be happier to go home.


Eh, I know people from my T6 who are getting offers from firms in California and Texas (and London) who have never even set foot in the state/country.


Key word here is T6. I'm comin' from a T50. I think you are correct that for the truly elite schools, it might matter less.




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