V15 Partner/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

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itbdvorm
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Re: V15 Partner/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby itbdvorm » Wed Sep 21, 2016 11:06 am

Anonymous User wrote:I clerked for 2 years (fed dist ct and COA) and am headed to a major market to litigate. I eventually want to move back to the smaller market where I clerked. Is there a "sweet spot" for making this move? Is lateralling as a 6th or 7th year associate "too late" usually without some sort of career reset like government work?


I would start the process slowly - as a 3rd or 4th year maybe to move as a 5th or 6th year

"too late" is the wrong way to think about it assuming it's a reasonably large market - question will just be what realistic long-term plan will be for you at different stages

itbdvorm
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Re: V15 Partner/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby itbdvorm » Wed Sep 21, 2016 11:07 am

Anonymous User wrote:Thanks for doing this. Do you have any insights into the current demand for junior tax laterals at the usual NY corporate shops?


assume pretty good

Anonymous User
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Re: V15 Partner/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Sep 21, 2016 11:23 am

itbdvorm wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I clerked for 2 years (fed dist ct and COA) and am headed to a major market to litigate. I eventually want to move back to the smaller market where I clerked. Is there a "sweet spot" for making this move? Is lateralling as a 6th or 7th year associate "too late" usually without some sort of career reset like government work?


I would start the process slowly - as a 3rd or 4th year maybe to move as a 5th or 6th year

"too late" is the wrong way to think about it assuming it's a reasonably large market - question will just be what realistic long-term plan will be for you at different stages


Not a very big market. Mostly regional mid-law type places with a very limited biglaw presence. Don't know if this changes the calculus. Kind of what I am trying to figure out is if it would be more beneficial to be at that kind of firm earlier than 6th year.

itbdvorm
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Re: V15 Partner/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby itbdvorm » Wed Sep 21, 2016 11:26 am

Anonymous User wrote:
itbdvorm wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I clerked for 2 years (fed dist ct and COA) and am headed to a major market to litigate. I eventually want to move back to the smaller market where I clerked. Is there a "sweet spot" for making this move? Is lateralling as a 6th or 7th year associate "too late" usually without some sort of career reset like government work?


I would start the process slowly - as a 3rd or 4th year maybe to move as a 5th or 6th year

"too late" is the wrong way to think about it assuming it's a reasonably large market - question will just be what realistic long-term plan will be for you at different stages


Not a very big market. Mostly regional mid-law type places with a very limited biglaw presence. Don't know if this changes the calculus. Kind of what I am trying to figure out is if it would be more beneficial to be at that kind of firm earlier than 6th year.


Not necessarily. But you'll likely want to bolt by then

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Danger Zone
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Re: V15 Partner/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby Danger Zone » Wed Sep 21, 2016 11:28 am

Why haven't you bolted? Isn't being a partner more work than being an associate?

itbdvorm
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Re: V15 Partner/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby itbdvorm » Wed Sep 21, 2016 1:39 pm

Danger Zone wrote:Why haven't you bolted? Isn't being a partner more work than being an associate?


Well yeah. But I didn't, and don't, have an obvious other market to go to. If that was staring me in the face as a junior (and what I wanted to do eventually) I suspect I would have taken that opportunity during one of the inevitable rough stretches

Plus, while being a partner is more work, it's better across the board.

bigapplelittleworm
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Re: V15 Partner/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby bigapplelittleworm » Wed Sep 21, 2016 5:35 pm

In your opinion, what factors cemented your promotion to partnership? I'm at a BigLaw firm which like most of its peers has an uncertain timeline and trajectory for promotion from associate to counsel (or some variation of counsel)/partner. But each year, a handful of folks make the cut. It's no secret that hard work and diligence are no longer the silver bullet they once used to be. What in your experience gives the lucky few the edge they need?

itbdvorm
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Re: V15 Partner/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby itbdvorm » Wed Sep 21, 2016 5:39 pm

bigapplelittleworm wrote:In your opinion, what factors cemented your promotion to partnership? I'm at a BigLaw firm which like most of its peers has an uncertain timeline and trajectory for promotion from associate to counsel (or some variation of counsel)/partner. But each year, a handful of folks make the cut. It's no secret that hard work and diligence are no longer the silver bullet they once used to be. What in your experience gives the lucky few the edge they need?


There's going to be some degree of "talent" (I know, hard to believe) as well.

But a big piece is also understanding the business side of things - where / how it all fits together

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Re: V15 Partner/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Sep 25, 2016 10:28 pm

This might be a terribly naive question, but do you find some correlation in law school ranking/grades within law school with actual associate performance? or is it just kind of all over the place?

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rpupkin
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Re: V15 Partner/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby rpupkin » Sun Sep 25, 2016 10:37 pm

Anonymous User wrote:This might be a terribly naive question, but do you find some correlation in law school ranking/grades within law school with actual associate performance? or is it just kind of all over the place?

Itbdvorm should answer, but I'll give you the perspective of someone who works in lit: once the hiring process is over, I basically forget what a particular candidate's grades are. As soon as the associate starts work, they're evaluated based solely on performance. I suppose you could go back and do a study that correlates law school GPA with associate performance, but I would be surprised if there was a significant correlation.

You need strong grades from a good school to get hired at my firm. Do folks who were, say, top 5% at HLS do better than folks who were top 10% at Berkeley? Maybe, but I really doubt it.

itbdvorm
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Re: V15 Partner/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby itbdvorm » Sun Sep 25, 2016 11:09 pm

rpupkin wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:This might be a terribly naive question, but do you find some correlation in law school ranking/grades within law school with actual associate performance? or is it just kind of all over the place?

Itbdvorm should answer, but I'll give you the perspective of someone who works in lit: once the hiring process is over, I basically forget what a particular candidate's grades are. As soon as the associate starts work, they're evaluated based solely on performance. I suppose you could go back and do a study that correlates law school GPA with associate performance, but I would be surprised if there was a significant correlation.

You need strong grades from a good school to get hired at my firm. Do folks who were, say, top 5% at HLS do better than folks who were top 10% at Berkeley? Maybe, but I really doubt it.


I think that's probably right, with exceptions for the truly special.

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Re: V15 Partner/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Sep 26, 2016 12:48 am

rpupkin wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:This might be a terribly naive question, but do you find some correlation in law school ranking/grades within law school with actual associate performance? or is it just kind of all over the place?

Itbdvorm should answer, but I'll give you the perspective of someone who works in lit: once the hiring process is over, I basically forget what a particular candidate's grades are. As soon as the associate starts work, they're evaluated based solely on performance. I suppose you could go back and do a study that correlates law school GPA with associate performance, but I would be surprised if there was a significant correlation.

You need strong grades from a good school to get hired at my firm. Do folks who were, say, top 5% at HLS do better than folks who were top 10% at Berkeley? Maybe, but I really doubt it.


Wait, so all the partners see new associates' transcripts?

Hopefullitassociate
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Re: V15 Partner/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby Hopefullitassociate » Mon Sep 26, 2016 1:05 am

Just started as a new associate, placed in a practice group (corporate) that I don't want to be in (I want lit). I'm looking to leave within a year or so. I don't want to make it look bad (I'm going to of course do my best with each work assignment), but I don't want to get stuck on this corporate track so that I cannot get out of and get locked out of litigation forever. In terms of reaching out to new firms, when do you think would be the ideal time, both in terms of the time of the year, and how far into my time at my current firm? Thank you.

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Eldon Tyrell
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Re: V15 Partner/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby Eldon Tyrell » Mon Sep 26, 2016 7:53 am

itbdvorm wrote:
Danger Zone wrote:Why haven't you bolted? Isn't being a partner more work than being an associate?


Well yeah. But I didn't, and don't, have an obvious other market to go to. If that was staring me in the face as a junior (and what I wanted to do eventually) I suspect I would have taken that opportunity during one of the inevitable rough stretches

Plus, while being a partner is more work, it's better across the board.


Is this because client calls and development and higher level negotiations aren't as menial or mentally exhausting as the lower level work? It always seems to me like partners still work a lot but their work is infinitely more interesting, at least relatively.

Anonymous User
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Re: V15 Partner/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Sep 26, 2016 5:02 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
rpupkin wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:This might be a terribly naive question, but do you find some correlation in law school ranking/grades within law school with actual associate performance? or is it just kind of all over the place?

Itbdvorm should answer, but I'll give you the perspective of someone who works in lit: once the hiring process is over, I basically forget what a particular candidate's grades are. As soon as the associate starts work, they're evaluated based solely on performance. I suppose you could go back and do a study that correlates law school GPA with associate performance, but I would be surprised if there was a significant correlation.

You need strong grades from a good school to get hired at my firm. Do folks who were, say, top 5% at HLS do better than folks who were top 10% at Berkeley? Maybe, but I really doubt it.


Wait, so all the partners see new associates' transcripts?


at least at my firm, they could if they wanted to, but probably not everyone looks that closely.

dwyf
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Re: V15 Partner/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby dwyf » Mon Sep 26, 2016 7:43 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
rpupkin wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:This might be a terribly naive question, but do you find some correlation in law school ranking/grades within law school with actual associate performance? or is it just kind of all over the place?

Itbdvorm should answer, but I'll give you the perspective of someone who works in lit: once the hiring process is over, I basically forget what a particular candidate's grades are. As soon as the associate starts work, they're evaluated based solely on performance. I suppose you could go back and do a study that correlates law school GPA with associate performance, but I would be surprised if there was a significant correlation.

You need strong grades from a good school to get hired at my firm. Do folks who were, say, top 5% at HLS do better than folks who were top 10% at Berkeley? Maybe, but I really doubt it.


Wait, so all the partners see new associates' transcripts?


at least at my firm, they could if they wanted to, but probably not everyone looks that closely.


I'm horrified by the fact that somewhere in my firm's HR system are the notes that people wrote about their interviews with me. I wonder if once I inevitably make partner I'll be able to log in and find that shit.

Separately - as an associate at my firm, I do not see grades for incoming candidates. I only see a resume very briefly before going to lunch with someone, and it is handed to me as someone comes in to interview. How does that work elsewhere?

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Re: V15 Partner/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Sep 26, 2016 9:47 pm

With a mind toward maybe exiting toward a client, do you think the pharmaceutical industry's a good set of companies to work for? As a junior associate currently in a public M&A practice, it seems exciting with strong, consistent deal flow. The people within it are large public companies used to dealing with lawyers on a steady stream of mergers and acquisitions. Should I try to be getting more of these deals?

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Re: V15 Partner/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Sep 28, 2016 7:49 pm

3L here. I recently accepted a position at a V20 firm I didn't summer with. A few weeks later I got invited to interview with the USDOJ honors program (criminal trial division). Am I crazy to pass up the DOJ honors program? I'll graduate with very little law school debt, so money isn't really an issue.

Anonymous User
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Re: V15 Partner/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Sep 28, 2016 8:20 pm

Anonymous User wrote:3L here. I recently accepted a position at a V20 firm I didn't summer with. A few weeks later I got invited to interview with the USDOJ honors program (criminal trial division). Am I crazy to pass up the DOJ honors program? I'll graduate with very little law school debt, so money isn't really an issue.


Recall that you'd be passing up only a chance at DOJ honors.

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Re: V15 Partner/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Sep 28, 2016 8:35 pm

I am sure this has already been answered, but at what point in your career did you know that you were tapped to be a partner? I guess the question is along the lines of, for those associates who spend 7-9 years at a firm how do you know that you are on the road to being a partner?

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Re: V15 Partner/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Sep 28, 2016 10:41 pm

I know there is some stuff on TLS about this, but if I'm interested in doing M+A and PE work after law school and am doing that this summer, am I crazy to still want to do a clerkship? I know some firms have gotten rid of the clerkship bonus for people going into corporate (how could I figure out if the firm I'm at is one of them?) but this is something I shouldn't be talking about with people in the group, right?

lawlorbust
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Re: V15 Partner/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby lawlorbust » Thu Sep 29, 2016 12:48 am

Anonymous User wrote:I know there is some stuff on TLS about this, but if I'm interested in doing M+A and PE work after law school and am doing that this summer, am I crazy to still want to do a clerkship? I know some firms have gotten rid of the clerkship bonus for people going into corporate (how could I figure out if the firm I'm at is one of them?) but this is something I shouldn't be talking about with people in the group, right?


Seriously. Talk to HR.

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Re: V15 Partner/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Sep 29, 2016 5:33 am

As an interviewer, what info do you have on candidates that have already interviewed with the firm before but was rejected or declined an offer? Do you have access to previous interviewers' notes, whether they were recommended a callback/offer, etc.?

itbdvorm
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Re: V15 Partner/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby itbdvorm » Thu Sep 29, 2016 2:35 pm

Hopefullitassociate wrote:Just started as a new associate, placed in a practice group (corporate) that I don't want to be in (I want lit). I'm looking to leave within a year or so. I don't want to make it look bad (I'm going to of course do my best with each work assignment), but I don't want to get stuck on this corporate track so that I cannot get out of and get locked out of litigation forever. In terms of reaching out to new firms, when do you think would be the ideal time, both in terms of the time of the year, and how far into my time at my current firm? Thank you.


ASAP

itbdvorm
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Re: V15 Partner/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby itbdvorm » Thu Sep 29, 2016 2:36 pm

Eldon Tyrell wrote:
itbdvorm wrote:
Danger Zone wrote:Why haven't you bolted? Isn't being a partner more work than being an associate?


Well yeah. But I didn't, and don't, have an obvious other market to go to. If that was staring me in the face as a junior (and what I wanted to do eventually) I suspect I would have taken that opportunity during one of the inevitable rough stretches

Plus, while being a partner is more work, it's better across the board.


Is this because client calls and development and higher level negotiations aren't as menial or mentally exhausting as the lower level work? It always seems to me like partners still work a lot but their work is infinitely more interesting, at least relatively.


that's part of it. different pressures, different politics, different work. but all better.




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