V15 Partner/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

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itbdvorm
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Re: V15 Senior Associate/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby itbdvorm » Mon Aug 13, 2012 2:56 pm

anon168 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:How much of your decision whether to call someone back is based on the quality of the interview as opposed to a pre-determination based on the students qualification (ie do you have a pretty good idea of who you will be calling back prior to the screener barring an extremely good/bad interview)?


Whenever I did OCI, the your grades got you the CB, the screen was just to make sure you could put two words together without swallowing your own tongue.


I know some firms are like this. Ours isn't.

itbdvorm
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Re: V15 Senior Associate/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby itbdvorm » Mon Aug 13, 2012 2:57 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I've heard that students generally have a 50% chance of getting an offer after going to a callback. Any thoughts on this? Can interviewees greatly improve their chances by scheduling their callbacks as early as possible? I'm in the lower t-14 with callbacks at v50 firms.


do your callbacks ASAP.

itbdvorm
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Re: V15 Senior Associate/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby itbdvorm » Mon Aug 13, 2012 2:57 pm

anon168 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:As someone who's been in the business for a while, is the whole "culture" thing overblown?

It seems to make sense on the surface, but doesn't it just come down to luck in terms of coming in with the right class of people/getting work from the right partners?


It's important. Trust me.


ditto. hugely.

Anonymous User
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Re: V15 Senior Associate/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Aug 13, 2012 3:02 pm

Bombed an interview with one partner...did your firm just go by majority vote or did partners vote count more or less than associates or legal recruiters?

itbdvorm
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Re: V15 Senior Associate/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby itbdvorm » Mon Aug 13, 2012 4:11 pm

roranoa wrote:
Plenty of work, but there are people who frankly aren't any good. "Stealth" vs. "that guy wasn't any good and we had to ease him out" may just depend on viewpoint


OP, you said this way back and I was wondering,
Your firm must be selecting people mostly (only?) from T14 schools with decent to good grades and respectable softs, but still find that your selection isn't perfect.

Why do you think that some people who did well in LS don't do well in Biglaw? I understand that LS doesn't really teach you how to do well in Biglaw but then what do you think makes the difference between people who get it and people who don't?

Plus, where do you even learn how to do well in Biglaw?


There are so many different factors in biglaw success. For example, two people with identical GPAs - one person spent every single waking moment in the library, the other barely studied and just got it. Maybe the first person will be the better hire, because she'll be willing to put in the work necessary. Or maybe the second one will be, because when both are forced to work equally hard she'll perform head and shoulders above.

itbdvorm
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Re: V15 Senior Associate/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby itbdvorm » Mon Aug 13, 2012 4:13 pm

fumagalli wrote:If you had a nephew/niece considering LS what kind of advice would you give him/her that would allow him/her to make the right choice?

How would someone judge by himself if he/she is cut out for Biglaw?


All depends on why he/she is going.

itbdvorm
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Re: V15 Senior Associate/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby itbdvorm » Mon Aug 13, 2012 4:14 pm

anon168 wrote:
roranoa wrote:
Plenty of work, but there are people who frankly aren't any good. "Stealth" vs. "that guy wasn't any good and we had to ease him out" may just depend on viewpoint


OP, you said this way back and I was wondering,
Your firm must be selecting people mostly (only?) from T14 schools with decent to good grades and respectable softs, but still find that your selection isn't perfect.

Why do you think that some people who did well in LS don't do well in Biglaw? I understand that LS doesn't really teach you how to do well in Biglaw but then what do you think makes the difference between people who get it and people who don't?

Plus, where do you even learn how to do well in Biglaw?


I'm not the OP, but from my experience a lot of times it has come down to "fit" -- which is code for you were not kissing the right ass, or if were kissing the right ass, you weren't kissing it often enough. My old firm (V5) left people go over others who had better performance reviews simply because they were not well liked, or were not protected by a powerful partner.


I don't buy this one, at least not above the first/second year level

itbdvorm
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Re: V15 Senior Associate/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby itbdvorm » Mon Aug 13, 2012 4:51 pm

Also, in response to a PM'd question about relative firm safety from someone who seemed likely to make a very poor choice due to speculation:

While a number of firms out there publicly and openly engaged in headcount reduction during the great recession, don't think for even a moment that even more firms weren't out there finding any excuse to cut people. Literally the only firms out there where I don't have either a confirmed report or a very strong suspicion of cuts occurring are WLRK, MTO and Williams & Connolly. Things were scary a few years back and different firms used different methods to stay competitive. Try to make your choices based upon facts, not rumors/ATL/conjecture

Anonymous User
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Re: V15 Senior Associate/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Aug 13, 2012 5:57 pm

Recieved text message (with noise) during screener am I dead

itbdvorm
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Re: V15 Senior Associate/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby itbdvorm » Mon Aug 13, 2012 7:40 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Recieved text message (with noise) during screener am I dead


no

Anonymous User
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Re: V15 Senior Associate/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Aug 13, 2012 7:42 pm

Thank you emails -- yes, no, don't care?

Anonymous User
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Re: V15 Senior Associate/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Aug 13, 2012 9:21 pm

itbdvorm wrote:
anon168 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:As someone who's been in the business for a while, is the whole "culture" thing overblown?

It seems to make sense on the surface, but doesn't it just come down to luck in terms of coming in with the right class of people/getting work from the right partners?


It's important. Trust me.


ditto. hugely.



Original anon following up: how did you guys go about determining culture before picking your firms? I've been doing all the reading and talking to
alums but... They're still starting to run todether

roranoa
Posts: 588
Joined: Sat Aug 22, 2009 11:18 am

Re: V15 Senior Associate/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby roranoa » Mon Aug 13, 2012 9:23 pm

itbdvorm wrote:
anon168 wrote:
roranoa wrote:
Plenty of work, but there are people who frankly aren't any good. "Stealth" vs. "that guy wasn't any good and we had to ease him out" may just depend on viewpoint


OP, you said this way back and I was wondering,
Your firm must be selecting people mostly (only?) from T14 schools with decent to good grades and respectable softs, but still find that your selection isn't perfect.

Why do you think that some people who did well in LS don't do well in Biglaw? I understand that LS doesn't really teach you how to do well in Biglaw but then what do you think makes the difference between people who get it and people who don't?

Plus, where do you even learn how to do well in Biglaw?


I'm not the OP, but from my experience a lot of times it has come down to "fit" -- which is code for you were not kissing the right ass, or if were kissing the right ass, you weren't kissing it often enough. My old firm (V5) left people go over others who had better performance reviews simply because they were not well liked, or were not protected by a powerful partner.


I don't buy this one, at least not above the first/second year level


OP, are you saying that kissing ass is neccessary only for the first one or two years? What becomes more important later on? Can you elaborate?

itbdvorm
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Joined: Tue Aug 17, 2010 9:09 am

Re: V15 Senior Associate/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby itbdvorm » Mon Aug 13, 2012 9:50 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Thank you emails -- yes, no, don't care?


i don't care

itbdvorm
Posts: 1573
Joined: Tue Aug 17, 2010 9:09 am

Re: V15 Senior Associate/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby itbdvorm » Mon Aug 13, 2012 9:51 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
itbdvorm wrote:
anon168 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:As someone who's been in the business for a while, is the whole "culture" thing overblown?

It seems to make sense on the surface, but doesn't it just come down to luck in terms of coming in with the right class of people/getting work from the right partners?


It's important. Trust me.


ditto. hugely.



Original anon following up: how did you guys go about determining culture before picking your firms? I've been doing all the reading and talking to
alums but... They're still starting to run todether


Go on your callbacks. Then go on another set of callbacks. Start narrowing firms down. Then go on post-offer callbacks if need be.

itbdvorm
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Joined: Tue Aug 17, 2010 9:09 am

Re: V15 Senior Associate/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby itbdvorm » Mon Aug 13, 2012 9:52 pm

roranoa wrote:
OP, are you saying that kissing ass is neccessary only for the first one or two years? What becomes more important later on? Can you elaborate?


After a year or two, people's abilities really can be differentiated. Talent wins over ass-kissing in my experience.

Anonymous User
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Re: V15 Senior Associate/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Aug 13, 2012 10:03 pm

Do you have any clue how your firm chooses who to interview from mass mailing?

Is it only for the super gpa superstars?

roranoa
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Re: V15 Senior Associate/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby roranoa » Mon Aug 13, 2012 10:29 pm

itbdvorm wrote:
roranoa wrote:
OP, are you saying that kissing ass is neccessary only for the first one or two years? What becomes more important later on? Can you elaborate?


After a year or two, people's abilities really can be differentiated. Talent wins over ass-kissing in my experience.


Thanks for the reply.

Then going back to my original question, how does one become "good" or "talented" in Biglaw?
Do you think one can prepare and train oneself for it?

itbdvorm
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Joined: Tue Aug 17, 2010 9:09 am

Re: V15 Senior Associate/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby itbdvorm » Mon Aug 13, 2012 10:52 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Do you have any clue how your firm chooses who to interview from mass mailing?

Is it only for the super gpa superstars?


Probably - do you mean non-OCI schools? Really gotta be in top 1-10 (not percent) of your class

itbdvorm
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Re: V15 Senior Associate/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby itbdvorm » Mon Aug 13, 2012 10:53 pm

roranoa wrote:
itbdvorm wrote:
roranoa wrote:
OP, are you saying that kissing ass is neccessary only for the first one or two years? What becomes more important later on? Can you elaborate?


After a year or two, people's abilities really can be differentiated. Talent wins over ass-kissing in my experience.


Thanks for the reply.

Then going back to my original question, how does one become "good" or "talented" in Biglaw?
Do you think one can prepare and train oneself for it?


Some yes, some no. Attention to detail. Logic. Basic human interactions. Writing ability.

Anonymous User
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Re: V15 Senior Associate/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Aug 13, 2012 11:08 pm

Is a 3.1 from MVP dead in the water?

anon168
Posts: 920
Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2012 10:36 pm

Re: V15 Senior Associate/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby anon168 » Mon Aug 13, 2012 11:41 pm

itbdvorm wrote:
roranoa wrote:
OP, are you saying that kissing ass is neccessary only for the first one or two years? What becomes more important later on? Can you elaborate?


After a year or two, people's abilities really can be differentiated. Talent wins over ass-kissing in my experience.


I disagree. In fact, I think it's just the opposite.

In life, as you get further along, it's less about what you know and more and more about who you know.
Last edited by anon168 on Mon Aug 13, 2012 11:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.

anon168
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Re: V15 Senior Associate/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby anon168 » Mon Aug 13, 2012 11:43 pm

itbdvorm wrote:Original anon following up: how did you guys go about determining culture before picking your firms? I've been doing all the reading and talking to
alums but... They're still starting to run todether

Go on your callbacks. Then go on another set of callbacks. Start narrowing firms down. Then go on post-offer callbacks if need be.


I agree.

I would also add that once you have an offer from a firm, pick up the phone or e-mail the folks you interviewed with and pick their brains a bit more. The conversations at that stage (i.e. once you have an offer) is on a much different level than when you are interviewing.

itbdvorm
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Re: V15 Senior Associate/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby itbdvorm » Tue Aug 14, 2012 7:59 am

Anonymous User wrote:Is a 3.1 from MVP dead in the water?


For us? Probably, yeah (sorry). In general? Nah. But hustle.

itbdvorm
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Re: V15 Senior Associate/OCI Interviewer Answering Questions...

Postby itbdvorm » Tue Aug 14, 2012 8:02 am

anon168 wrote:
itbdvorm wrote:
roranoa wrote:
OP, are you saying that kissing ass is neccessary only for the first one or two years? What becomes more important later on? Can you elaborate?


After a year or two, people's abilities really can be differentiated. Talent wins over ass-kissing in my experience.


I disagree. In fact, I think it's just the opposite.

In life, as you get further along, it's less about what you know and more and more about who you know.


I'm not disagreeing with that sentiment. I just think "further along" means partner (or I guess nearly-partner). The less talented guy with amazing client relationships is likely in a better position than the more talented guy who nobody likes. But neither will get there unless they have fundamental skills.




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