Midwest T25s OCI discussion/results

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Re: Midwest T25s OCI discussion/results

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Aug 23, 2011 1:02 am

Reliably getting callbacks from UIUC this year means having top grades, a solid resume, good answers to substantive interview questions, AND really hitting it off with interviewers. People who lacked any one of the above during their OCI interviews aren't getting callbacks, or are limping away with 1-2. I expected top 5% at UIUC + LR to give me my pick of the Chicago firms. As it is, I feel lucky to have just enough callbacks to feel like I might have more than one option (more realistically: one option) for next summer.

Here's the cause as I see it: The firms with big classes (Kirkland, Sidley, etc) are too cool for the T25 schools these days. They can cherry pick a couple of us if they want (Kirkland had 3 UIUC summers last year, and didn't even come to OCI), and fill the bulk of their classes with T14 kids who are only slightly less desperate for jobs than we are. That leaves the majority of the firms at our OCI who have relatively tiny summer classes. E.g. Paul Hastings interviewed 20ish people for 7ish summer spots, most if not all of which will end up being filled by T10 students. They had no UIUC summers last year.

Buyer beware. Midwestern schools that are not Chicago, Michigan or maybe Northwestern offer pretty terrible chances at biglaw.

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Re: Midwest T25s OCI discussion/results

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Aug 23, 2011 1:09 am

Anonymous User wrote:Just for informational purposes, CB with Taft and I know that Bingham and Ice have started giving callbacks.



What school do you go to?

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Re: Midwest T25s OCI discussion/results

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Aug 23, 2011 9:22 am

Anonymous User wrote:Reliably getting callbacks from UIUC this year means having top grades, a solid resume, good answers to substantive interview questions, AND really hitting it off with interviewers. People who lacked any one of the above during their OCI interviews aren't getting callbacks, or are limping away with 1-2. I expected top 5% at UIUC + LR to give me my pick of the Chicago firms. As it is, I feel lucky to have just enough callbacks to feel like I might have more than one option (more realistically: one option) for next summer.

Here's the cause as I see it: The firms with big classes (Kirkland, Sidley, etc) are too cool for the T25 schools these days. They can cherry pick a couple of us if they want (Kirkland had 3 UIUC summers last year, and didn't even come to OCI), and fill the bulk of their classes with T14 kids who are only slightly less desperate for jobs than we are. That leaves the majority of the firms at our OCI who have relatively tiny summer classes. E.g. Paul Hastings interviewed 20ish people for 7ish summer spots, most if not all of which will end up being filled by T10 students. They had no UIUC summers last year.

Buyer beware. Midwestern schools that are not Chicago, Michigan or maybe Northwestern offer pretty terrible chances at biglaw.


I mostly agree with this and am also pretty frustrated with lack of CBs so far. But I haven't heard yet from most of the firms I interviewed with. I also have interviews lined up outside of OCI. I think its just a little too early to declare the sky is falling.

Also Paul Hastings didn't have any UIUC summers but I know of at least one person who got an offer from them but turned it down for another firm.

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Re: Midwest T25s OCI discussion/results

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Aug 23, 2011 9:38 am

not to be a dick...
but i'mma be a dick for a second. And this is not directed @ any one person. Just a general comment.

If you're disappointed with the number of callbacks that you have, isn't the mirror the only place where you can place that blame?

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Re: Midwest T25s OCI discussion/results

Postby blurbz » Tue Aug 23, 2011 9:45 am

Anonymous User wrote:not to be a dick...
but i'mma be a dick for a second. And this is not directed @ any one person. Just a general comment.

If you're disappointed with the number of callbacks that you have, isn't the mirror the only place where you can place that blame?


Why is that anonymous?


And you take a pretty damn simplistic view of things, don't you think? I'm doing pretty well so far, comparatively speaking, but I'm still disappointed I don't have more callbacks right now. While I have been dinged from firms where I knew the interview didn't go wonderfully, I've also been dinged from firms where I had great interviews. The candidate plays a large part, of course, but there are extrinsic factors, too, that you are clearly, and wrongly, ignoring.

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Re: Midwest T25s OCI discussion/results

Postby Kilpatrick » Tue Aug 23, 2011 9:46 am

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Last edited by Kilpatrick on Tue Nov 08, 2011 11:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Midwest T25s OCI discussion/results

Postby fl0w » Tue Aug 23, 2011 10:01 am

blurbz wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:not to be a dick...
but i'mma be a dick for a second. And this is not directed @ any one person. Just a general comment.

If you're disappointed with the number of callbacks that you have, isn't the mirror the only place where you can place that blame?


Why is that anonymous?


And you take a pretty damn simplistic view of things, don't you think? I'm doing pretty well so far, comparatively speaking, but I'm still disappointed I don't have more callbacks right now. While I have been dinged from firms where I knew the interview didn't go wonderfully, I've also been dinged from firms where I had great interviews. The candidate plays a large part, of course, but there are extrinsic factors, too, that you are clearly, and wrongly, ignoring.


anon was accidental because the button is to the far right.
I realize I was being a dick, I admitted that in the post. And yes, the view is simplistic but honestly I think that people over-complicate things. It comes down to each one of us, as individuals, doing everything we can to put ourselves in the best position.

I don't feel like I can rightly blame a screener for not giving me a callback. I don't feel like I can rightly blame career services for not creating an environment where callbacks fall from the heavens. When it comes down to it those are things that I cannot control.

When it comes to getting a job I find it better to not focus on those unnamed extrinsic factors which I cannot control.

It was just a general comment at the frustration of there not being more callbacks. I don't really know what response you could give to someone other than kill more of your interviews. But, in my opinion, if you can get 1-2 callbacks from any given job event that's a success. People look at the ratios in a way that makes them feel defeated (probably a characteristic law students in general). You can say, hey 15 interviews and only 1 CB. That sucks. Or you can say, hey 1 job fair and 1-2 callbacks. Fairly successful and there are 1-2 firms that are ready to take me seriously. In the callback stage your success rate to procuring an offer should be pretty high. Firms don't waste their time with these.

Just don't forget that you only need 1 offer.

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Re: Midwest T25s OCI discussion/results

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Aug 23, 2011 10:05 am

are you guys only targeting the big markets or what? i've gotten 2 callbacks already from kc/stl and i'm just average with a good personality.

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Re: Midwest T25s OCI discussion/results

Postby blurbz » Tue Aug 23, 2011 10:08 am

Your explanation of your original comment makes more sense than your original comment. Now you're talking about things that are outside of our control so, unless that mirror falls on my interviewers head during the screener, I don't know that I can blame it!

I understand (and agree!) that people shouldn't be taking the "world is ending, the sky is falling" approach to OCI when they're getting a couple of callbacks. That being said, I think a lot of people thought the economy is better than it is (I know I had at least hoped as much!) and equated that with a high probability of more callbacks. The extrinsic factors are not limited to interviewer or career services, they are much more broad and yes, as you said, they are outside of our control. I suspect we'll all still continue to bitch about them, though.....it's kind of what we do.

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Re: Midwest T25s OCI discussion/results

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Aug 23, 2011 10:10 am

Anonymous User wrote:are you guys only targeting the big markets or what? i've gotten 2 callbacks already from kc/stl and i'm just average with a good personality.



School/Stats? I'm targeting both a large market and a secondary market. I've heard NOTHING from my secondary market but I'm assuming (HOPING) that it's because they just move so damn slow there.

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Re: Midwest T25s OCI discussion/results

Postby fl0w » Tue Aug 23, 2011 10:19 am

blurbz wrote:Your explanation of your original comment makes more sense than your original comment. Now you're talking about things that are outside of our control so, unless that mirror falls on my interviewers head during the screener, I don't know that I can blame it!

I understand (and agree!) that people shouldn't be taking the "world is ending, the sky is falling" approach to OCI when they're getting a couple of callbacks. That being said, I think a lot of people thought the economy is better than it is (I know I had at least hoped as much!) and equated that with a high probability of more callbacks. The extrinsic factors are not limited to interviewer or career services, they are much more broad and yes, as you said, they are outside of our control. I suspect we'll all still continue to bitch about them, though.....it's kind of what we do.


Yeah, it's the disease that infects everyone as soon as they become a law student.

I'm not sure what everyone's background is, but I worked for 5yrs before school and was employed when the market tanked. I watched how bad it was at my firm and at my client firms. People shat themselves as they got laid off for no reason other than the fact that the bottom line needed salvaged. You'd see good performers get let go just because the company couldn't afford them. Firms that were right-sized before the downturn are hiring more right now and firms that were forced to right-size are going to be slow to catch up until attrition forces them to hire again.

But these are the parameters that define the universe of our job search. The days of unicorns and rainbows really are behind us forever. Play the hand you're dealt, but remember that this game is now for the hustlers so pack as many aces up your sleeve as possible. hustle. hard.

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Re: Midwest T25s OCI discussion/results

Postby blurbz » Tue Aug 23, 2011 10:22 am

fl0w wrote:Play the hand you're dealt, but remember that this game is now for the hustlers so pack as many aces up your sleeve as possible. hustle. hard.



Amen.

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Re: Midwest T25s OCI discussion/results

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Aug 23, 2011 10:26 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:are you guys only targeting the big markets or what? i've gotten 2 callbacks already from kc/stl and i'm just average with a good personality.



School/Stats? I'm targeting both a large market and a secondary market. I've heard NOTHING from my secondary market but I'm assuming (HOPING) that it's because they just move so damn slow there.


average, wustl, good internships, mixed, from missouri, hot jk (very friendly)

i've been rejected by one missouri firm that for some reason i had an off-interview with...

I should add I've been treating my "secondary market" as my primary...not apps to Chi. I think I've successfully communicated that to interviewers. I don't know how smaller markets would feel if it was obvious that they weren't your first choice.

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Re: Midwest T25s OCI discussion/results

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Aug 23, 2011 10:30 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:are you guys only targeting the big markets or what? i've gotten 2 callbacks already from kc/stl and i'm just average with a good personality.



School/Stats? I'm targeting both a large market and a secondary market. I've heard NOTHING from my secondary market but I'm assuming (HOPING) that it's because they just move so damn slow there.


average, wustl, good internships, mixed, from missouri, hot jk (very friendly)

i've been rejected by one missouri firm that for some reason i had an off-interview with...

I should add I've been treating my "secondary market" as my primary...not apps to Chi. I think I've successfully communicated that to interviewers. I don't know how smaller markets would feel if it was obvious that they weren't your first choice.



Makes sense!

Hopefully what I'm doing and what I'm communicating to firms are two very different things...

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Re: Midwest T25s OCI discussion/results

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Aug 23, 2011 2:58 pm

updates today?

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Re: Midwest T25s OCI discussion/results

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Aug 23, 2011 3:05 pm

Nothing. Better than my 5 dings yesterday, though.

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Re: Midwest T25s OCI discussion/results

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Aug 23, 2011 3:42 pm

Anyone heard anything from Jenner, Winston, Sidley, Chapman, Vedder, or Jones Day (non-Chicago)?

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Re: Midwest T25s OCI discussion/results

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Aug 23, 2011 3:46 pm

Chapman call back went out last week. Someone from IUB got it

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Re: Midwest T25s OCI discussion/results

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Aug 23, 2011 4:06 pm

t30 transfer to t14 checking back in, dinged from katten, dykema, drinker, and schiff today. that pretty much obliterates my chances at chicago biglaw (probably biglaw in general).

now what... ?

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Re: Midwest T25s OCI discussion/results

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Aug 23, 2011 4:28 pm

At least one Chapman CB went out yesterday

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Re: Midwest T25s OCI discussion/results

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Aug 23, 2011 4:40 pm

Anonymous User wrote:At least one Chapman CB went out yesterday


To someone at what school? Stats?


Please folks, remember we're dealing with multiple schools here.

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Re: Midwest T25s OCI discussion/results

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Aug 23, 2011 4:45 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:At least one Chapman CB went out yesterday


To someone at what school? Stats?


Please folks, remember we're dealing with multiple schools here.


IUB - top 10%

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Re: Midwest T25s OCI discussion/results

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Aug 23, 2011 5:14 pm

Ding from Taft. 10%/LR ND

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Re: Midwest T25s OCI discussion/results

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Aug 23, 2011 5:15 pm

Anonymous User wrote:At least one Chapman CB went out yesterday


When did the person who got a CB interview with them?

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Re: Midwest T25s OCI discussion/results

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Aug 23, 2011 5:22 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Ding from Taft. 10%/LR ND


Indy only? I'm sort of shocked Taft can be so selective.




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