How much discrimination should I show?

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Anonymous User
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How much discrimination should I show?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jul 26, 2011 11:52 am

I'm a 0L and I've been trying to network this summer to increase my chances of getting a paying summer position at a firm after 1L. My questions is: how much discrimination should I show? Should I take anything paying that's law related my 1L summer?

I was told by a lawyer-friend last night: "You have a summer job if your grades are good." The firm is comprised of 5 attorneys who all went to nearby, mediocre law schools and they do med/mal work. They are not ambulance chasers or sleaze-balls, in fact they are very nice people who are proud of what they do. Even so, it's not big law or mid law. I would not be happy in that job.

If my goal is big law, does something like this on your resume help or hurt, or is any legal experience good experience? Am I being an ungrateful asshole? How should I consider opportunities like this one?

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BackToTheOldHouse
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Re: How much discrimination should I show?

Postby BackToTheOldHouse » Tue Jul 26, 2011 11:55 am

At first I thought this question was stupid (I don't like the way you put it--"How much discrimination should I show?"), but now that I'm past your phrasing I think it's a good question and I look forward to thoughtful responses.

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bjsesq
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Re: How much discrimination should I show?

Postby bjsesq » Tue Jul 26, 2011 12:00 pm

Be sneaky about your discrimination.

Aston2412
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Re: How much discrimination should I show?

Postby Aston2412 » Tue Jul 26, 2011 12:01 pm

It depends on your circumstances. The rote response is to do anything legal.

That said, unless getting paid is a requirement for you, I think PI or interning for a judge would look better than a five person firm. You'll probably get more hands-on legal experience by working for a five person firm but it won't have the "prestige" that other opportunities for 1L summer have.

If you have to get paid and are set on a firm, you should hold out for MidLaw (if you can find it) at least.

seatown12
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Re: How much discrimination should I show?

Postby seatown12 » Tue Jul 26, 2011 12:11 pm

Will they pay you? Either take the highest paying job you can get, or the most interesting position. If they won't pay, or won't pay much, and you aren't interested in the work, don't do it. Biglaw 1L jobs are hard to get but 1L jobs/internships in general aren't. You should be able to find something you are actually excited about.

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Veyron
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Re: How much discrimination should I show?

Postby Veyron » Tue Jul 26, 2011 12:12 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I'm a 0L and I've been trying to network this summer to increase my chances of getting a paying summer position at a firm after 1L. My questions is: how much discrimination should I show? Should I take anything paying that's law related my 1L summer?

I was told by a lawyer-friend last night: "You have a summer job if your grades are good." The firm is comprised of 5 attorneys who all went to nearby, mediocre law schools and they do med/mal work. They are not ambulance chasers or sleaze-balls, in fact they are very nice people who are proud of what they do. Even so, it's not big law or mid law. I would not be happy in that job.

If my goal is big law, does something like this on your resume help or hurt, or is any legal experience good experience? Am I being an ungrateful asshole? How should I consider opportunities like this one?


Turning down paying work 1L summer is stupid.

goodolgil
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Re: How much discrimination should I show?

Postby goodolgil » Tue Jul 26, 2011 12:28 pm

Immediate response to topic was: "legal conclusions are insufficient."

zachanson
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Re: How much discrimination should I show?

Postby zachanson » Tue Jul 26, 2011 2:11 pm

BackToTheOldHouse wrote:At first I thought this question was stupid (I don't like the way you put it--"How much discrimination should I show?"), but now that I'm past your phrasing I think it's a good question and I look forward to thoughtful responses.


i still think it is a stupid question, very.

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bceagles182
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Re: How much discrimination should I show?

Postby bceagles182 » Tue Jul 26, 2011 2:13 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
BackToTheOldHouse wrote:At first I thought this question was stupid (I don't like the way you put it--"How much discrimination should I show?"), but now that I'm past your phrasing I think it's a good question and I look forward to thoughtful responses.


i still think it is a stupid question, very.



Another abuse of anonymous posting

Anonymous User
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Re: How much discrimination should I show?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jul 26, 2011 3:11 pm

OP here.

Aston2412 wrote:...unless getting paid is a requirement for you, I think PI or interning for a judge would look better than a five person firm...If you have to get paid and are set on a firm, you should hold out for MidLaw (if you can find it) at least.

Pay is a requirement. I have a family to support.

seatown12 wrote:Will they pay you?

Yes, it is a paying position.

goodolgil wrote:Immediate response to topic was: "legal conclusions are insufficient."

I'm sorry. I don't understand what you mean.

zachanson wrote:i still think it is a stupid question, very.

Would you please explain why.

Veyron wrote:Turning down paying work 1L summer is stupid.

For me, pay must trump legal work. My question is this: If it comes down to a choice between being paid to work at the aforementioned firm or being paid to do something non-law-related, which position would be the easiest to explain to a big-law recruiter—if I'm ever so lucky?

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Veyron
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Re: How much discrimination should I show?

Postby Veyron » Tue Jul 26, 2011 3:17 pm

Anonymous User wrote:OP here.

Aston2412 wrote:...unless getting paid is a requirement for you, I think PI or interning for a judge would look better than a five person firm...If you have to get paid and are set on a firm, you should hold out for MidLaw (if you can find it) at least.

Pay is a requirement. I have a family to support.

seatown12 wrote:Will they pay you?

Yes, it is a paying position.

goodolgil wrote:Immediate response to topic was: "legal conclusions are insufficient."

I'm sorry. I don't understand what you mean.

zachanson wrote:i still think it is a stupid question, very.

Would you please explain why.

Veyron wrote:Turning down paying work 1L summer is stupid.

For me, pay must trump legal work. My question is this: If it comes down to a choice between being paid to work at the aforementioned firm or being paid to do something non-law-related, which position would be the easiest to explain to a big-law recruiter—if I'm ever so lucky?


If pay trumps legal work so that you don't do legal work your 1L summer you won't get biglaw. However, being paid to do legal work for a small firm is VERY easy to explain to a biglaw recruiter - as long as you do something legal your first summer, it doesn't matter if you're working for Smallaw LLP or the COA.

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tww909
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Re: How much discrimination should I show?

Postby tww909 » Tue Jul 26, 2011 3:19 pm

goodolgil wrote:Immediate response to topic was: "legal conclusions are insufficient."


mine was "enough to demonstrate causation and damages"

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Re: How much discrimination should I show?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jul 26, 2011 3:20 pm

Veyron wrote:If pay trumps legal work so that you don't do legal work your 1L summer you won't get biglaw. However, being paid to do legal work for a small firm is VERY easy to explain to a biglaw recruiter - as long as you do something legal your first summer, it doesn't matter if you're working for Smallaw LLP or the COA.

Thanks.

Anonymous User
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Re: How much discrimination should I show?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jul 26, 2011 3:22 pm

Paying work 1l summer is overrated unless its a BigLaw SA. I'm getting paid for the summer at a small firm and making shit. I wish I would've just taken out summer loans like most of my friends.

And don't ever let pay trump legal work. Getting a substantive legal job your 1l summer is too important. Just suck it up and take out loans if you have to.

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Rock-N-Roll
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Re: How much discrimination should I show?

Postby Rock-N-Roll » Tue Jul 26, 2011 3:33 pm

The word discrimination can be used in other ways besides having the meaning of being prejudicial. i.e. Discrimination between right and wrong is important. It just sounds awkward in the middle of a sentence though. I guess it's kind of like the word niggardly, which although has a benign meaning, is hardly ever actually used for obvious reasons.

Anonymous User
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Re: How much discrimination should I show?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jul 26, 2011 3:40 pm

Rock-N-Roll wrote:The word discrimination can be used in other ways besides having the meaning of being prejudicial. i.e. Discrimination between right and wrong is important. It just sounds awkward in the middle of a sentence though. I guess it's kind of like the word niggardly, which although has a benign meaning, is hardly ever actually used for obvious reasons.

Then I guess I should have gone with my initial phrasing: "Would I be acting a mongoloid if..."

I kid; I kid.

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Rock-N-Roll
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Re: How much discrimination should I show?

Postby Rock-N-Roll » Tue Jul 26, 2011 3:41 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Rock-N-Roll wrote:The word discrimination can be used in other ways besides having the meaning of being prejudicial. i.e. Discrimination between right and wrong is important. It just sounds awkward in the middle of a sentence though. I guess it's kind of like the word niggardly, which although has a benign meaning, is hardly ever actually used for obvious reasons.

Then I guess I should have gone with my initial phrasing: "Would I be acting a mongoloid if..."

I kid; I kid.


:)

zachanson
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Re: How much discrimination should I show?

Postby zachanson » Tue Jul 26, 2011 3:42 pm

Veyron wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:OP here.

Aston2412 wrote:...unless getting paid is a requirement for you, I think PI or interning for a judge would look better than a five person firm...If you have to get paid and are set on a firm, you should hold out for MidLaw (if you can find it) at least.

Pay is a requirement. I have a family to support.

seatown12 wrote:Will they pay you?

Yes, it is a paying position.

goodolgil wrote:Immediate response to topic was: "legal conclusions are insufficient."

I'm sorry. I don't understand what you mean.

zachanson wrote:i still think it is a stupid question, very.

Would you please explain why.

Veyron wrote:Turning down paying work 1L summer is stupid.

For me, pay must trump legal work. My question is this: If it comes down to a choice between being paid to work at the aforementioned firm or being paid to do something non-law-related, which position would be the easiest to explain to a big-law recruiter—if I'm ever so lucky?


If pay trumps legal work so that you don't do legal work your 1L summer you won't get biglaw. However, being paid to do legal work for a small firm is VERY easy to explain to a biglaw recruiter - as long as you do something legal your first summer, it doesn't matter if you're working for Smallaw LLP or the COA.



this.

apology for saying "its a stupid question." now if the reason that you need 1L summer $ is for supporting family, that makes sense.

i struggle to think of useful advice because it's highly YMMV.
meaningful 1L legal experience, meaningful 1L summer pay -- anyone would be very lucky to get one of the two.
your choice highly depends on your situation and priorities. say if you already figured out your area of practice, it would be great to get a firm job in that area. paid or not, as long as you get SUBSTANTIVE assignments and experience. i'm sure that would make you feel much more comfortable coming into OCIs after the 1L summer.

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Stanford4Me
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Re: How much discrimination should I show?

Postby Stanford4Me » Tue Jul 26, 2011 3:45 pm

tww909 wrote:
goodolgil wrote:Immediate response to topic was: "legal conclusions are insufficient."


mine was "enough to demonstrate causation and damages"

Stop being legal nerds and GTFO.

OP, the advice that is touted most is "DO SOMETHING LEGAL!1!1!!" Going by that logic (which I ascribe to), it's better to do something for Small Firm, LLP while getting paid than it is to do something for Non-Legal, Inc. while getting paid. The "skills" you develop from a legal clerkship are valued by BigLaw firms.

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Glock
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Re: How much discrimination should I show?

Postby Glock » Tue Jul 26, 2011 4:14 pm

I keep my discrimination to trolling URM on TLS.

Anonymous User
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Re: How much discrimination should I show?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jul 27, 2011 10:08 am

Glock wrote:I keep my discrimination to trolling URM on TLS.


stop being a niggard

merc280
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Re: How much discrimination should I show?

Postby merc280 » Wed Jul 27, 2011 10:12 am

Is it better to be an RA for a professor during the summer of 1L or is that kind of looked at as a last resort for people who didn't get firm or gov jobs?

gulcregret
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Re: How much discrimination should I show?

Postby gulcregret » Wed Jul 27, 2011 10:27 am

merc280 wrote:Is it better to be an RA for a professor during the summer of 1L or is that kind of looked at as a last resort for people who didn't get firm or gov jobs?


I don't know the general answer to this question but here are four anecdotes from my peers at GULC:

1) RA with corporate, well regarded Prof = SA at V5 (top 10 on secondary journal with Ivy undergrad).

2) RA with Prof who no one knows outside of GULC = SA at magic circle firm in London (top 1/3 on secondary journal with Ivy undergrad).

3) RA with baller conlaw Prof who is very well connected = unpaid judicial clerk on a federal appellate court (no idea what grades, on secondary journal and t25 undergrad).

4) RA with decent Prof who runs a clinic = legal aid non-profit (top 10-15 on secondary journal, not sure about undergrad).




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