In desperate need of clerkship advice

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sharklasers
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Re: In desperate need of clerkship advice

Postby sharklasers » Sun Jul 17, 2011 8:16 pm

XxSpyKEx wrote:Not if the he/she is not on any journal (similar to the OP). Without journal, the likelihood of getting a district court judge isn't particularly great.


Credited. I forgot about that.

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Re: In desperate need of clerkship advice

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jul 18, 2011 12:35 am

XxSpyKEx wrote:
sharklasers wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:My school allows as many as possible but demands you only use paper for judges not online. I'd Also really appreciate advice especially from the GTL master.

As top 15% at Top 10, which is slightly better position: I plan:

SSC Judges (have around 42 of these)

District Judges and Mag judges in Cali (paper) (LA where I'm from) 40.

As many random judges online as possible in one off markets (read Newark, Hartford, Baltimore, Philly).

My career office insists its very likely I can get Dist (50/50 in major markets and pretty much certain for a mag position or a position in a one off market). Does this sound reasonable as a search strategy?


You're setting your sights too low and doing overkill. Ramp back, cut SSC (which is pretty shit anyhow), limit your district apps to all the places you could stand living w/o cutting your own throat (i.e., not the South), and go for COA widely.


Not if the he/she is not on any journal (similar to the OP). Without journal, the likelihood of getting a district court judge isn't particularly great. CoA is very unlikely. I've been though the clerkship application cycle, and article III clerkships are extremely competitive. I think it's a mistake to assume you can just sweep one up with top 15% at a t10 without any journal or moot court. Another poster on here, ToTransferorNot, mentioned that there are people last year who were on the editorial board of law review at his school (UChi) who applied broadly but still completely struck out (i.e. they didn't even manage to pick up a district court clerkship in a non-major market). The clerkship hiring process is very crazy and can be somewhat random/unpredictable with respect to on-plan hiring. I mean there are literally 2 days of interviewing across the nation where something like 80-90% of all on-plan clerkship hiring (judges that don't hire incoming 3Ls early) is completed. It's not uncommon for district court judges in major markets to get 1,500-2,500 applications, and for judges even in the crappiest of locations (e.g. Montana) to get 350-400 applications.

Anonymous User wrote:A follow up question: should I primarily target magistrate judges or are they just as difficult to land as district court clerkships?


Not as difficult, but still competitive.

Anonymous User wrote:Are these positions still "prestigious?"


Nope.


I dont know this is all crazy to me especially as a non-SA 2L and now I'm being told even dist court is out, appreciate the advice though. It's crazy to me how as a 3l top 15% at t10 School I'm not in contention for pretty much any job. Been told too low for fed gov as well. I find it crazy that I have a good chance I could be waiting tables after graduating. So nuts from what i thought i was getting myself into.

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A'nold
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Re: In desperate need of clerkship advice

Postby A'nold » Mon Jul 18, 2011 1:10 am

Anonymous User wrote:
XxSpyKEx wrote:
sharklasers wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:My school allows as many as possible but demands you only use paper for judges not online. I'd Also really appreciate advice especially from the GTL master.

As top 15% at Top 10, which is slightly better position: I plan:

SSC Judges (have around 42 of these)

District Judges and Mag judges in Cali (paper) (LA where I'm from) 40.

As many random judges online as possible in one off markets (read Newark, Hartford, Baltimore, Philly).

My career office insists its very likely I can get Dist (50/50 in major markets and pretty much certain for a mag position or a position in a one off market). Does this sound reasonable as a search strategy?


You're setting your sights too low and doing overkill. Ramp back, cut SSC (which is pretty shit anyhow), limit your district apps to all the places you could stand living w/o cutting your own throat (i.e., not the South), and go for COA widely.


Not if the he/she is not on any journal (similar to the OP). Without journal, the likelihood of getting a district court judge isn't particularly great. CoA is very unlikely. I've been though the clerkship application cycle, and article III clerkships are extremely competitive. I think it's a mistake to assume you can just sweep one up with top 15% at a t10 without any journal or moot court. Another poster on here, ToTransferorNot, mentioned that there are people last year who were on the editorial board of law review at his school (UChi) who applied broadly but still completely struck out (i.e. they didn't even manage to pick up a district court clerkship in a non-major market). The clerkship hiring process is very crazy and can be somewhat random/unpredictable with respect to on-plan hiring. I mean there are literally 2 days of interviewing across the nation where something like 80-90% of all on-plan clerkship hiring (judges that don't hire incoming 3Ls early) is completed. It's not uncommon for district court judges in major markets to get 1,500-2,500 applications, and for judges even in the crappiest of locations (e.g. Montana) to get 350-400 applications.

Anonymous User wrote:A follow up question: should I primarily target magistrate judges or are they just as difficult to land as district court clerkships?


Not as difficult, but still competitive.

Anonymous User wrote:Are these positions still "prestigious?"


Nope.


I dont know this is all crazy to me especially as a non-SA 2L and now I'm being told even dist court is out, appreciate the advice though. It's crazy to me how as a 3l top 15% at t10 School I'm not in contention for pretty much any job. Been told too low for fed gov as well. I find it crazy that I have a good chance I could be waiting tables after graduating. So nuts from what i thought i was getting myself into.

Things can often get blown up to unrealistic proportions on this site IMO. While top 15% at a t10 with no journal might be 50/50 or whatever for a district court clerkship, there is no way if you are competent and not completely socially awkward that you will be waiting tables with those stats.

I guess it might be all doom and gloom for you if you were biglaw or bust and are just using this clerkship thing as a second bite at the biglaw apple. However, if you are talking about being a lawyer in some firm somewhere, I doubt you will have a problem. The numbers support what I just said. While I'm sure there are anecdotes about the top 15%, t10 graduate that washes dishes at Denny's, that is not the case for the vast majority of t10 graduates, even ITE. If you think about it, that would basically mean (in general) that there are less attorney jobs out there than can handle all the t10, top 15% graduates out there (very small amount). Obviously I see how those with connections and any crap grades or schools get some of those jobs and how the tippy top of almost all schools' grads get some of those jobs, but c'mon, let's not get crazy.

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XxSpyKEx
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Re: In desperate need of clerkship advice

Postby XxSpyKEx » Mon Jul 18, 2011 1:30 am

Anonymous User wrote:
XxSpyKEx wrote:
sharklasers wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:My school allows as many as possible but demands you only use paper for judges not online. I'd Also really appreciate advice especially from the GTL master.

As top 15% at Top 10, which is slightly better position: I plan:

SSC Judges (have around 42 of these)

District Judges and Mag judges in Cali (paper) (LA where I'm from) 40.

As many random judges online as possible in one off markets (read Newark, Hartford, Baltimore, Philly).

My career office insists its very likely I can get Dist (50/50 in major markets and pretty much certain for a mag position or a position in a one off market). Does this sound reasonable as a search strategy?


You're setting your sights too low and doing overkill. Ramp back, cut SSC (which is pretty shit anyhow), limit your district apps to all the places you could stand living w/o cutting your own throat (i.e., not the South), and go for COA widely.


Not if the he/she is not on any journal (similar to the OP). Without journal, the likelihood of getting a district court judge isn't particularly great. CoA is very unlikely. I've been though the clerkship application cycle, and article III clerkships are extremely competitive. I think it's a mistake to assume you can just sweep one up with top 15% at a t10 without any journal or moot court. Another poster on here, ToTransferorNot, mentioned that there are people last year who were on the editorial board of law review at his school (UChi) who applied broadly but still completely struck out (i.e. they didn't even manage to pick up a district court clerkship in a non-major market). The clerkship hiring process is very crazy and can be somewhat random/unpredictable with respect to on-plan hiring. I mean there are literally 2 days of interviewing across the nation where something like 80-90% of all on-plan clerkship hiring (judges that don't hire incoming 3Ls early) is completed. It's not uncommon for district court judges in major markets to get 1,500-2,500 applications, and for judges even in the crappiest of locations (e.g. Montana) to get 350-400 applications.

Anonymous User wrote:A follow up question: should I primarily target magistrate judges or are they just as difficult to land as district court clerkships?


Not as difficult, but still competitive.

Anonymous User wrote:Are these positions still "prestigious?"


Nope.


I dont know this is all crazy to me especially as a non-SA 2L and now I'm being told even dist court is out, appreciate the advice though. It's crazy to me how as a 3l top 15% at t10 School I'm not in contention for pretty much any job. Been told too low for fed gov as well. I find it crazy that I have a good chance I could be waiting tables after graduating. So nuts from what i thought i was getting myself into.


You make it sounds like a federal district court judge is some bottom of the barrel shit legal job, and that if you can't get a federal district court clerkship, then you "pretty much" can't get "any job." You have to realize prestigious fed government (e.g. US DoJ, etc) and article III clerkships are substantially more prestigious and competitive than a SA at some large law firm, and a shitload more prestigious than working at some small firm, local government (e.g. local PD's office), etc. Widen your net. It's not either you go clerk at for a federal judge, work at some v100, fed government OR you wait tables after graduation. There are other legal jobs out there (e.g. smaller law firms, local government, etc). You might need to get hands dirty a bit and do some networking, like just about every TTT grad ITE, but you can find a paying legal job being top 15% at a t10. It may not be the level of prestige and money you had hoped for when you started law school, but it's still a hell of a lot better than waiting tables.

A'nold wrote:While top 15% at a t10 with no journal might be 50/50 ... for a district court clerkship


Definitely not 50/50 for a fed district court clerkship. There's a chance, but it's a smaller one.

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Re: In desperate need of clerkship advice

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jul 19, 2011 2:37 pm

OP-

So, I am applying to around 20 state supreme court justices in my state and in neighboring states and a few state appellate clerkships in my state.

One of my recommenders (the most important one) set a limit of around 25 LOR's.

Question: OSCAR basically counts as one LOR, correct? Once the LOR is on file with OSCAR, doesn't that professor just have to go online and click something saying he/she agrees to release that letter to a judge each time I apply to a new judge? Also, if that is so, should I set up all of the applications before having the professor go onto OSCAR so he/she can give permission for all of them at once?

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Re: In desperate need of clerkship advice

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jul 19, 2011 2:47 pm

How do 1Ls typically fair in comparison to 2Ls for summer judicial positions? I am a 0L who is mapping out m target list of places to apply--I know SA positions are insanely hard to get as a 1L, but am also interested in clerking. I am a 0L entering MVP and won't have any grades when applying.

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A'nold
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Re: In desperate need of clerkship advice

Postby A'nold » Tue Jul 19, 2011 6:20 pm

Anonymous User wrote:How do 1Ls typically fair in comparison to 2Ls for summer judicial positions? I am a 0L who is mapping out m target list of places to apply--I know SA positions are insanely hard to get as a 1L, but am also interested in clerking. I am a 0L entering MVP and won't have any grades when applying.

This thread is about clerking (post graduation paid position with a judge) and not interning for free during summers (which is what you are asking about).

There are tons of threads about summer internships with judges (at least I assume there are). Good luck!

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XxSpyKEx
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Re: In desperate need of clerkship advice

Postby XxSpyKEx » Tue Jul 19, 2011 10:55 pm

Anonymous User wrote:OP-

So, I am applying to around 20 state supreme court justices in my state and in neighboring states and a few state appellate clerkships in my state.

One of my recommenders (the most important one) set a limit of around 25 LOR's.


Ouch. Try to get another recommender, so you can get some more applications out. 25 apps is extremely low.

Anonymous User wrote:Question: OSCAR basically counts as one LOR, correct?


Nope. Every judge or listed position you apply to on OSCAR counts as one LOR. Realistically, it will be your prof's faculty assistant uploading the letters. I had one prof that limited my applications, and the faculty assistant considered every listed position I applied as 1 LOR (there are a number of judges that will list more than one position open - e.g. even if the judge has 3 clerkships all starting and ending on the same date, he might list those as separate openings on OSCAR, and this faculty assistant counted every single one of those as a LOR. In other words, if you apply to 5 judges with 5 positions listed on OSCAR, and the faculty assistant counts each one of those as 1 LOR, then you might only be able to apply to those 5 judges before you exhaust your 25 LOR limit).

EDIT- sorry, this is a bit confusing to explain without typing a lot. Let me know if that doesn't make sense, and I'll elaborate more.

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Re: In desperate need of clerkship advice

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jul 20, 2011 12:38 am

XxSpyKEx wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:OP-

So, I am applying to around 20 state supreme court justices in my state and in neighboring states and a few state appellate clerkships in my state.

One of my recommenders (the most important one) set a limit of around 25 LOR's.


Ouch. Try to get another recommender, so you can get some more applications out. 25 apps is extremely low.

Anonymous User wrote:Question: OSCAR basically counts as one LOR, correct?


Nope. Every judge or listed position you apply to on OSCAR counts as one LOR. Realistically, it will be your prof's faculty assistant uploading the letters. I had one prof that limited my applications, and the faculty assistant considered every listed position I applied as 1 LOR (there are a number of judges that will list more than one position open - e.g. even if the judge has 3 clerkships all starting and ending on the same date, he might list those as separate openings on OSCAR, and this faculty assistant counted every single one of those as a LOR. In other words, if you apply to 5 judges with 5 positions listed on OSCAR, and the faculty assistant counts each one of those as 1 LOR, then you might only be able to apply to those 5 judges before you exhaust your 25 LOR limit).

EDIT- sorry, this is a bit confusing to explain without typing a lot. Let me know if that doesn't make sense, and I'll elaborate more.

Thanks.

So, the professor has to upload a letter each time I apply to the judge? That sucks.......what if I just target the judges I listed above instead of any federal "reaches?" Shouldn't my numbers at least make the state appellate clerkships semi safeties? I realize my real targets are state supreme court justices, and that's fine. Actually, I wouldn't really want to move to any other states than the ones I applied to. What if I spend the time I would have taken to apply to tons more judges and really tailor my cover letters? I realize that some judges/clerks just throw apps away that they do not like based on the numbers, but targeting non-federal clerkships and really tailoring.....do I really need to send out more?

It just sucks b/c this is basically my "big" LOR. Without it my application packet sort of falls apart. :| I know I did not plan enough for this (it is a recent thing for me) but it is what it is, unfortunately.

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Re: In desperate need of clerkship advice

Postby XxSpyKEx » Wed Jul 20, 2011 1:07 am

Anonymous User wrote:Thanks.


No prob.

So, the professor has to upload a letter each time I apply to the judge?


Yup. It'll probably be his faculty assistant that does it though. Law profs really don't do much work.

what if I just target the judges I listed above instead of any federal "reaches?"


Might make sense if you are absolutely limited to 25 applications. IMHO, I think you should try and get another LOR, so you can apply to more judges. At least, that's what I would do in your situation (your applications on OSCAR won't get released to judges until September anyways).

Shouldn't my numbers at least make the state appellate clerkships semi safeties?


Maybe.. It all depends. There's a lot of factors. For example, State court judges tend to really like people with strong ties to the specific state, intent to practice in the state after the clerkship, and having gone to the good local school there. For example, a lot of the Nebraska Supreme Court judges mostly went to schools in Nebraska, and will prefer to hire students that went to the local school there than some person who went to some t14 and has no ties to Nebraska. There are, of course, exceptions. But in your situation it makes the most sense to focus on the state courts in the state your school is in (assuming this wasn't already your plan). Moreover, there is a pretty big difference between applying to state appellate courts in Utah versus NY (NY, obviously, being a lot more competitive).

I realize my real targets are state supreme court justices, and that's fine. Actually, I wouldn't really want to move to any other states than the ones I applied to. What if I spend the time I would have taken to apply to tons more judges and really tailor my cover letters? I realize that some judges/clerks just throw apps away that they do not like based on the numbers, but targeting non-federal clerkships and really tailoring.....do I really need to send out more?


Honestly, if you are absolutely going to limit yourself to 25 applications, call alumni, call chambers, and talk to your career services office.

For one, make absolutely sure that each of the judges you apply to are for sure hiring term clerks for the term you want. A LOT of state court judges will either have solely career clerks, or term clerks, but not have an opening for the term you want. There's a lot of waste there since, unlike the federal system, there is a lot of just guessing and throwing an application out there. In my situation, the prof that limited my LORs limited me to 100 state courts applications and 200 federal court applications. With that volume of state courts LORs, I really didn't care that much about waste. I was largely only interested in one state's supreme court, so waste was a non-issue. In your situation, it makes sense to do the extra work and make sure the judges you are applying to are actually hiring.

Furthermore, actually research these judges and make sure that you're actually going to want to work for these judges, it'll likely be a fit, and you'll have a realistic shot (e.g. if X judge only has had t6 grads as law clerks for the past 5 years, it's probably reasonable to guess you don't have a shot). Also, with respect to the having a realistic shot point, I recall getting a some rejection letters because the judges were looking for something specific that I didn't have. For example, some were looking for a couple years of post-grad work experience, and absolutely would not hire someone who did not have that. Others were looking for someone who will have completed an appellate level clerkship prior to commencing a clerkship with them. Different judges want different things. It's in your best interest to figure out exactly what each one you apply to wants (because you don't have enough LORs to just spam a bunch of judges and let them sort it out).

It just sucks b/c this is basically my "big" LOR. Without it my application packet sort of falls apart. :| I know I did not plan enough for this (it is a recent thing for me) but it is what it is, unfortunately.


It's not too late to get another LOR. Just make sure it's a prof you actually had some relationship with and you got a good grade in his/her class. You have nearly 2 months before OSCAR will release your apps anyways. And you already missed the boat for off-plan hiring.
Last edited by XxSpyKEx on Wed Jul 20, 2011 1:17 am, edited 1 time in total.

JusticeJackson
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Re: In desperate need of clerkship advice

Postby JusticeJackson » Wed Jul 20, 2011 1:17 am

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Last edited by JusticeJackson on Thu Jul 21, 2011 3:47 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: In desperate need of clerkship advice

Postby XxSpyKEx » Wed Jul 20, 2011 1:19 am

JusticeJackson wrote:
It just sucks b/c this is basically my "big" LOR. Without it my application packet sort of falls apart. :| I know I did not plan enough for this (it is a recent thing for me) but it is what it is, unfortunately.


Profs will go out of their way to write good things about you. They want you to get a clerkship. If you got an A in someone's class, they'll probably write a favorable letter. If they don't know you, it will be based heavily on your resume and the content of the exam you wrote for them, but it will nonetheless be good. That is my experience at least.


+1. All the profs I had write letters about me managed to write hell of a lot better of stuff about me than I, myself, would have been able to write. In my experience, if a prof is willing to write you a LOR, he is going to write you a really good one.

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Re: In desperate need of clerkship advice

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jul 20, 2011 1:29 am

OP-

Wow, thanks guys, that was extremely helpful. I really appreciate you taking the time to help me out.

The "getting another LOR" thing sounds good in theory, however, I cannot tell you how much trouble I had getting these letters (especially the "good" one). I rarely go to office hours and am a commuter student. I have no professor relationships (well, maybe a TINY one that wrote one of the other LOR's). My adviser told me to have at least one LOR that speaks to my writing ability. That is the 25 limit LOR. :|

Other than that one professor, I have no professors that can say anything more than that I excelled in their classes grade-wise. I guess I can still "spam" with the less personal letters, but my spam ones will be my reach ones which seems especially crappy.

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Re: In desperate need of clerkship advice

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jul 20, 2011 1:30 am

XxSpyKEx wrote:
JusticeJackson wrote:
It just sucks b/c this is basically my "big" LOR. Without it my application packet sort of falls apart. :| I know I did not plan enough for this (it is a recent thing for me) but it is what it is, unfortunately.


Profs will go out of their way to write good things about you. They want you to get a clerkship. If you got an A in someone's class, they'll probably write a favorable letter. If they don't know you, it will be based heavily on your resume and the content of the exam you wrote for them, but it will nonetheless be good. That is my experience at least.


+1. All the profs I had write letters about me managed to write hell of a lot better of stuff about me than I, myself, would have been able to write. In my experience, if a prof is willing to write you a LOR, he is going to write you a really good one.


I've already seen one and it blew me away. I was flattered, to say the least.

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Re: In desperate need of clerkship advice

Postby JusticeJackson » Wed Jul 20, 2011 2:28 am

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Last edited by JusticeJackson on Thu Jul 21, 2011 3:48 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: In desperate need of clerkship advice

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jul 20, 2011 2:50 am

JusticeJackson wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:OP-

Wow, thanks guys, that was extremely helpful. I really appreciate you taking the time to help me out.

The "getting another LOR" thing sounds good in theory, however, I cannot tell you how much trouble I had getting these letters (especially the "good" one). I rarely go to office hours and am a commuter student. I have no professor relationships (well, maybe a TINY one that wrote one of the other LOR's). My adviser told me to have at least one LOR that speaks to my writing ability. That is the 25 limit LOR. :|

Other than that one professor, I have no professors that can say anything more than that I excelled in their classes grade-wise. I guess I can still "spam" with the less personal letters, but my spam ones will be my reach ones which seems especially crappy.


I don't want to beat a dead horse here, but I was in the same scenario, and professors that I never spoke to once wrote great things about how well written my exam was and how great a student I am. The exams were 3 hour scrambles to get all my notes into the answer, and weren't in the least bit well written. So don't beat yourself up. If you got more than 1 A from a professor, call that guy next. If not, call the professor you have the best grade(s) with. 25 letters is BS.

Alright, this makes me feel better. The letter I read talked about how great of a writer I am and how the exam was basically the most well-written exam he's seen by a long shot (or something along those lines). I will use the 25 limit professor's LOR's for the state court clerkships and then get another one to replace that one for the federal app reaches. Then I will apply to the hundreds (or however many my school allows) that might get me some kind of lucky bite.

Does this sound like a better plan? Thanks again guys. :)

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Re: In desperate need of clerkship advice

Postby XxSpyKEx » Wed Jul 20, 2011 5:21 am

Anonymous User wrote:
JusticeJackson wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:OP-

Wow, thanks guys, that was extremely helpful. I really appreciate you taking the time to help me out.

The "getting another LOR" thing sounds good in theory, however, I cannot tell you how much trouble I had getting these letters (especially the "good" one). I rarely go to office hours and am a commuter student. I have no professor relationships (well, maybe a TINY one that wrote one of the other LOR's). My adviser told me to have at least one LOR that speaks to my writing ability. That is the 25 limit LOR. :|

Other than that one professor, I have no professors that can say anything more than that I excelled in their classes grade-wise. I guess I can still "spam" with the less personal letters, but my spam ones will be my reach ones which seems especially crappy.


I don't want to beat a dead horse here, but I was in the same scenario, and professors that I never spoke to once wrote great things about how well written my exam was and how great a student I am. The exams were 3 hour scrambles to get all my notes into the answer, and weren't in the least bit well written. So don't beat yourself up. If you got more than 1 A from a professor, call that guy next. If not, call the professor you have the best grade(s) with. 25 letters is BS.

Alright, this makes me feel better. The letter I read talked about how great of a writer I am and how the exam was basically the most well-written exam he's seen by a long shot (or something along those lines). I will use the 25 limit professor's LOR's for the state court clerkships and then get another one to replace that one for the federal app reaches. Then I will apply to the hundreds (or however many my school allows) that might get me some kind of lucky bite.

Does this sound like a better plan? Thanks again guys. :)


Yup.

Also, what actually helps the prof a lot in writing a more well rounded letter is if you write some type of a narrative about yourself and give that to him (in addition to just your resume and transcript). At the school I went to, the CSO actually told us to include a narrative, and the profs just expected one. I don't really remember what went into the narrative exactly (there were certain things out CSO told us to include), but I remember writing about things like work experiences prior to starting law school, whether you were the first person in your family to go to college/grad school, family generally, some type of adversity issue you overcame, etc, etc. I recall writing a ton for the prof who wrote the most well rounded letter about me. The LORs are also a way to get additional info in about yourself that you can't get onto your resume (and that on-plan judges won't ever get around to reading on a cover letter since almost all of them don't read cover letters - it's weird because they'll read your LORs from your profs, but not your cover letter).

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Re: In desperate need of clerkship advice

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jul 20, 2011 2:17 pm

XxSpyKEx wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
JusticeJackson wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:OP-

Wow, thanks guys, that was extremely helpful. I really appreciate you taking the time to help me out.

The "getting another LOR" thing sounds good in theory, however, I cannot tell you how much trouble I had getting these letters (especially the "good" one). I rarely go to office hours and am a commuter student. I have no professor relationships (well, maybe a TINY one that wrote one of the other LOR's). My adviser told me to have at least one LOR that speaks to my writing ability. That is the 25 limit LOR. :|

Other than that one professor, I have no professors that can say anything more than that I excelled in their classes grade-wise. I guess I can still "spam" with the less personal letters, but my spam ones will be my reach ones which seems especially crappy.


I don't want to beat a dead horse here, but I was in the same scenario, and professors that I never spoke to once wrote great things about how well written my exam was and how great a student I am. The exams were 3 hour scrambles to get all my notes into the answer, and weren't in the least bit well written. So don't beat yourself up. If you got more than 1 A from a professor, call that guy next. If not, call the professor you have the best grade(s) with. 25 letters is BS.

Alright, this makes me feel better. The letter I read talked about how great of a writer I am and how the exam was basically the most well-written exam he's seen by a long shot (or something along those lines). I will use the 25 limit professor's LOR's for the state court clerkships and then get another one to replace that one for the federal app reaches. Then I will apply to the hundreds (or however many my school allows) that might get me some kind of lucky bite.

Does this sound like a better plan? Thanks again guys. :)


Yup.

Also, what actually helps the prof a lot in writing a more well rounded letter is if you write some type of a narrative about yourself and give that to him (in addition to just your resume and transcript). At the school I went to, the CSO actually told us to include a narrative, and the profs just expected one. I don't really remember what went into the narrative exactly (there were certain things out CSO told us to include), but I remember writing about things like work experiences prior to starting law school, whether you were the first person in your family to go to college/grad school, family generally, some type of adversity issue you overcame, etc, etc. I recall writing a ton for the prof who wrote the most well rounded letter about me. The LORs are also a way to get additional info in about yourself that you can't get onto your resume (and that on-plan judges won't ever get around to reading on a cover letter since almost all of them don't read cover letters - it's weird because they'll read your LORs from your profs, but not your cover letter).

Sounds like a plan. XxSpyKEx you are the best. :)

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XxSpyKEx
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Re: In desperate need of clerkship advice

Postby XxSpyKEx » Wed Jul 20, 2011 5:04 pm

Good luck man




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