Boalt 3L worth returning to school? (Employment Prospects)

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Rock-N-Roll
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Re: Boalt 3L worth returning to school? (Employment Prospects)

Postby Rock-N-Roll » Tue Jun 28, 2011 3:20 pm

Desert Fox wrote:I guess I need to retard proof my message for the boaltie 0Ls.

I was clearly referring to Kronks claim that the 30% figure must be wrong because he counts 45-50%. I replied that 30% was for a different year. If it would make you waterheads feel better, next time I will write it out as "The 30% claim was for 2009. That data is for 2010. That seems right."

That 165 25%ile really shows in some of these threads.

^That is Boalt antitrolling.


This post of yours is intelligent, elegant, and classy. Thank you Desert Fox! You are a scholar among scholars and a gentleman among gentlemen.

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Kronk
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Re: Boalt 3L worth returning to school? (Employment Prospects)

Postby Kronk » Tue Jun 28, 2011 3:22 pm

Rock-N-Roll wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:I guess I need to retard proof my message for the boaltie 0Ls.

I was clearly referring to Kronks claim that the 30% figure must be wrong because he counts 45-50%. I replied that 30% was for a different year. If it would make you waterheads feel better, next time I will write it out as "The 30% claim was for 2009. That data is for 2010. That seems right."

That 165 25%ile really shows in some of these threads.

^That is Boalt antitrolling.


This post of yours is intelligent, elegant, and classy. Thank you Desert Fox! You are a scholar among scholars and a gentleman among gentlemen.


Don't worry about him. His GPA was in our 0th percentile.

And yes, he could've been more upfront about it. But either way the stat is a bogus rumor that people shouldn't pay attention to, which is why I posted that stat from our OCI spreadsheet.

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Rock-N-Roll
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Re: Boalt 3L worth returning to school? (Employment Prospects)

Postby Rock-N-Roll » Tue Jun 28, 2011 3:26 pm

BTW big thanks for posting that data Kronk! It paints a much better picture for us incoming 1Ls.

09042014
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Re: Boalt 3L worth returning to school? (Employment Prospects)

Postby 09042014 » Tue Jun 28, 2011 3:28 pm

Kronk wrote:
Rock-N-Roll wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:I guess I need to retard proof my message for the boaltie 0Ls.

I was clearly referring to Kronks claim that the 30% figure must be wrong because he counts 45-50%. I replied that 30% was for a different year. If it would make you waterheads feel better, next time I will write it out as "The 30% claim was for 2009. That data is for 2010. That seems right."

That 165 25%ile really shows in some of these threads.

^That is Boalt antitrolling.


This post of yours is intelligent, elegant, and classy. Thank you Desert Fox! You are a scholar among scholars and a gentleman among gentlemen.


Don't worry about him. His GPA was in our 0th percentile.

And yes, he could've been more upfront about it. But either way the stat is a bogus rumor that people shouldn't pay attention to, which is why I posted that stat from our OCI spreadsheet.


My UGPA + 1.0 is still probably in your bottom 25%ile.

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Re: Boalt 3L worth returning to school? (Employment Prospects)

Postby robotclubmember » Tue Jun 28, 2011 5:22 pm

Rock-N-Roll wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:Shut the fuck up, you are out of your element.


This How 'bout less aggression and more data please? What is your source for 30% 2009 OCI? will not stand, man.


ftfy

boaltrising3l
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Re: Boalt 3L worth returning to school? (Employment Prospects)

Postby boaltrising3l » Tue Jun 28, 2011 7:05 pm

Not sure how spreading hard truths is trolling but let me address things said.

1. The 75% figure is completely untrue. Perhaps 10% at most of the class is willing to settle for low paying work. The CDO also personally advised many of my friends not to participate in OCI because "it would be a waste of their time", so many did not participate due to encouragement from CDO. So many do not participate through advisement of the school.

2. The OCI figures people point to from the career office deceptively include those who got government jobs, not that there is anything wrong, but I don't think a summer at the federal public defender is what people think about of for OCI jobs.

3. The 30% figure is from my own personal conversations with career office personel about landing biglaw.

4. Even if the biglaw numbers are great 0Ls should look at the downside. Those who don't get a job at OCI fall into a few categories:

a. unemployed
b. underemployed (working at doc review making around 10-15 dollars an hour)
c. doing government clerkship work (Working for free for a pd/ prosecutor or working for 15 an hour plus no health insurance coverage).

Once again, yeah Biglaw pays well, but outside biglaw people with a JD from Boalt make 15- 20 an hour tops. This information is not from me, its from a conversation with the career office about what a student can realistically expect to earn in the private sector.

So yeah there's good upside, but if you don't get Biglaw you wont be making more money than a barrista or car valet, which is why I plan to start mass mailing real soon. 0Ls deserve realistic expectations of the value of a Boalt JD.

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Kronk
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Re: Boalt 3L worth returning to school? (Employment Prospects)

Postby Kronk » Tue Jun 28, 2011 7:13 pm

boaltrising3l wrote:Not sure how spreading hard truths is trolling but let me address things said.

2. The OCI figures people point to from the career office deceptively include those who got government jobs, not that there is anything wrong, but I don't think a summer at the federal public defender is what people think about of for OCI jobs.


1. No they don't. As I said in my post, a few of the jobs were government. I just looked back. Seven of the jobs were not firms. The rest all were. So 126 / (270 - whoever doesn't do OCI because of choice). Still around 45%+.

2. You are most likely a troll.

3. There are jobs besides BigLaw and temp doc review. There are government jobs besides PD and prosecutor jobs. There are PI jobs covered by PSLF that many people would be happy to have. There are midlaw regional firms that pay $100k and upwards.

4. That is all.

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Re: Boalt 3L worth returning to school? (Employment Prospects)

Postby BackToTheOldHouse » Tue Jun 28, 2011 7:19 pm

Kronk wrote:
boaltrising3l wrote:Not sure how spreading hard truths is trolling but let me address things said.

2. The OCI figures people point to from the career office deceptively include those who got government jobs, not that there is anything wrong, but I don't think a summer at the federal public defender is what people think about of for OCI jobs.


1. No they don't. As I said in my post, a few of the jobs were government. I just looked back. Seven of the jobs were not firms. The rest all were. So 126 / (270 - whoever doesn't do OCI because of choice). Still around 45%+.

2. You are most likely a troll.

3. There are jobs besides BigLaw and temp doc review. There are government jobs besides PD and prosecutor jobs. There are PI jobs covered by PSLF that many people would be happy to have. There are midlaw regional firms that pay $100k and upwards.

4. That is all.

I think I want the last sentence of number #3.

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Kronk
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Re: Boalt 3L worth returning to school? (Employment Prospects)

Postby Kronk » Tue Jun 28, 2011 7:26 pm

BackToTheOldHouse wrote:
Kronk wrote:
boaltrising3l wrote:Not sure how spreading hard truths is trolling but let me address things said.

2. The OCI figures people point to from the career office deceptively include those who got government jobs, not that there is anything wrong, but I don't think a summer at the federal public defender is what people think about of for OCI jobs.


1. No they don't. As I said in my post, a few of the jobs were government. I just looked back. Seven of the jobs were not firms. The rest all were. So 126 / (270 - whoever doesn't do OCI because of choice). Still around 45%+.

2. You are most likely a troll.

3. There are jobs besides BigLaw and temp doc review. There are government jobs besides PD and prosecutor jobs. There are PI jobs covered by PSLF that many people would be happy to have. There are midlaw regional firms that pay $100k and upwards.

4. That is all.

I think I want the last sentence of number #3.


+1. And it's worth mentioning that the people who do get those kinds of jobs (or get jobs with firms that don't come to OCI) don't appear on that list of 133 / 270 or whatever. I know at least a couple rising 3Ls that have jobs they got by mass mailing or targeting secondary market midlaw and biglaw firms. So the percentage of people with firm jobs they want is probably more like 50% straight.

boaltrising3l
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Re: Boalt 3L worth returning to school? (Employment Prospects)

Postby boaltrising3l » Tue Jun 28, 2011 7:36 pm

There are around 320 people in the 2L class not 270, we had 60 transfers.
Also let me prove I'm not a troll: the first listing on B-line right now is for a Seattle Midlaw firm (diversity fellowship). Go check for yourself.

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Rock-N-Roll
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Re: Boalt 3L worth returning to school? (Employment Prospects)

Postby Rock-N-Roll » Tue Jun 28, 2011 7:45 pm

At this point, 9 pages into this thread, whether or not the OP truly is a Boalt 3L, it is clear that he or she is not fond of the school.

The only thing that the OP has ever stated which needed addressing was his or her claim of 30% at this years OCI. The REAL OCI data was posted earlier today, proving that OP either lied regarding this important data or was badly mislead.

Given this, the racist remarks he or she made earlier regarding the Boalt grading system, and some of the general meandering nature of his or her posts, I think we all have the right and would be in fact well served to disregard what he or she has to say from this point forward.

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Re: Boalt 3L worth returning to school? (Employment Prospects)

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 28, 2011 7:48 pm

The remarks are not racist, they merely explain why Boalt grade reform was rejected.

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Rock-N-Roll
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Re: Boalt 3L worth returning to school? (Employment Prospects)

Postby Rock-N-Roll » Tue Jun 28, 2011 7:54 pm

boaltrising3l wrote:BUT, Any reform to this system in the past has been vehemently opposed by minority groups, I'm not even going to attempt to tread further in these waters. Just know that the basic principle behind our grading system is that its an affirmative action project. I'm sure you can do the math in your heads.


Well, anonymous user, this is the quote from OP which I referenced earlier. Since, whoever you are, you are posting anonymously, please explain how I should understand this quote.

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bilbobaggins
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Re: Boalt 3L worth returning to school? (Employment Prospects)

Postby bilbobaggins » Tue Jun 28, 2011 7:55 pm

boaltrising3l wrote:Not sure how spreading hard truths is trolling but let me address things said.

1. The 75% figure is completely untrue. Perhaps 10% at most of the class is willing to settle for low paying work. The CDO also personally advised many of my friends not to participate in OCI because "it would be a waste of their time", so many did not participate due to encouragement from CDO. So many do not participate through advisement of the school.

2. The OCI figures people point to from the career office deceptively include those who got government jobs, not that there is anything wrong, but I don't think a summer at the federal public defender is what people think about of for OCI jobs.

3. The 30% figure is from my own personal conversations with career office personel about landing biglaw.

4. Even if the biglaw numbers are great 0Ls should look at the downside. Those who don't get a job at OCI fall into a few categories:

a. unemployed
b. underemployed (working at doc review making around 10-15 dollars an hour)
c. doing government clerkship work (Working for free for a pd/ prosecutor or working for 15 an hour plus no health insurance coverage).

Once again, yeah Biglaw pays well, but outside biglaw people with a JD from Boalt make 15- 20 an hour tops. This information is not from me, its from a conversation with the career office about what a student can realistically expect to earn in the private sector.

So yeah there's good upside, but if you don't get Biglaw you wont be making more money than a barrista or car valet, which is why I plan to start mass mailing real soon. 0Ls deserve realistic expectations of the value of a Boalt JD.


We get it, dude. You're bitter and you likely can't interview well. Your dreams of an easy paycheck have been dashed. However, this doesn't mean it's cool to just spout off random BS to make yourself feel better.

1. Can't imagine you have "many" friends and while I know "many" people may have been advised not to do OCI, "many" who were told this still got offers.

2. It's been covered. There are barely any govt OCI jobs in there. It should also be pointed out that a good number of Boalt students get prestigious Federal and State government jobs every year. These are not always people with top 25% grades and they are often people who don't participate in a big firm 2L summer.

3. Since we have two sources of information (your supposed conversation and the OCI records that have been provided) we can evaluate the trustworthiness of the sources and decide which figure is more likely.

4. This is just inaccurate. There's a plethora of employment options for those who don't get OCI offers (including Biglaw- a few people every year will get SA positions despite striking out at OCI and without having family connections). Many individuals go into smaller firms, other government work, paying criminal work, etc. You could make an argument about the risks of going to law school, but when you're hyperbolic about it then you lose all credibility (along with the whole, weird AA grade argument, which you never substantiated when asked).

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Re: Boalt 3L worth returning to school? (Employment Prospects)

Postby bilbobaggins » Tue Jun 28, 2011 7:56 pm

Anonymous User wrote:The remarks are not racist, they merely explain why Boalt grade reform was rejected.


No, they don't. They simply say, "The grading is an AA project." This, aside from the fact it doesn't make any sense, is also not a real explanation.

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wiseowl
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Re: Boalt 3L worth returning to school? (Employment Prospects)

Postby wiseowl » Tue Jun 28, 2011 9:27 pm

sweet Lord this thread is an abortion.

I hate Boalt objectively just because of it.

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bilbobaggins
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Re: Boalt 3L worth returning to school? (Employment Prospects)

Postby bilbobaggins » Tue Jun 28, 2011 9:48 pm

wiseowl wrote:sweet Lord this thread is an abortion.

I hate Boalt objectively just because of it.


So, you have something against the right to choose? What's your problem?

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wiseowl
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Re: Boalt 3L worth returning to school? (Employment Prospects)

Postby wiseowl » Tue Jun 28, 2011 9:55 pm

bilbobaggins wrote:
wiseowl wrote:sweet Lord this thread is an abortion.

I hate Boalt objectively just because of it.


So, you have something against the right to choose? What's your problem?


Well played.

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Re: Boalt 3L worth returning to school? (Employment Prospects)

Postby nleefer » Tue Jun 28, 2011 10:09 pm

boaltrising3l wrote:There are around 320 people in the 2L class not 270, we had 60 transfers.
Also let me prove I'm not a troll: the first listing on B-line right now is for a Seattle Midlaw firm (diversity fellowship). Go check for yourself.


There were actually more like 45 transfer students this past year. But hey, you were only off by about 33%.

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bilbobaggins
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Re: Boalt 3L worth returning to school? (Employment Prospects)

Postby bilbobaggins » Tue Jun 28, 2011 10:59 pm

wiseowl wrote:
bilbobaggins wrote:
wiseowl wrote:sweet Lord this thread is an abortion.

I hate Boalt objectively just because of it.


So, you have something against the right to choose? What's your problem?


Well played.


:wink:

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Stringer Bell
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Re: Boalt 3L worth returning to school? (Employment Prospects)

Postby Stringer Bell » Tue Jun 28, 2011 11:01 pm

boaltrising3l wrote:1. The 75% figure is completely untrue. Perhaps 10% at most of the class is willing to settle for low paying work. The CDO also personally advised many of my friends not to participate in OCI because "it would be a waste of their time", so many did not participate due to encouragement from CDO. So many do not participate through advisement of the school.



If people didn't participate in OCI on the recommendation of career services that sounds fucking moronic to me. Even if the process would be a Hail Mary, I can't fathom why you wouldn't at least go for it. At the very least it gives the opportunity to gain some experience interviewing.

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Re: Boalt 3L worth returning to school? (Employment Prospects)

Postby 20121109 » Tue Jun 28, 2011 11:04 pm

wiseowl wrote:sweet Lord this thread is an abortion.


This.

Why was this thread resurrected?

Locked.




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