Bottom 1/3 at T6

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Anonymous User
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Bottom 1/3 at T6

Postby Anonymous User » Mon May 23, 2011 2:36 am

Hey everyone,

Seeing how there's a "Median at CLS" thread here, I'd like to start one for those who look like they might be at the bottom end of the curve after 2nd semester. I'm at a T6 in NY, haven't gotten all my grades yet but things aren't looking so great.

Specifically, I'm wondering what I can do now through August to maximize my chances of getting biglaw/NJL250, or if my best option at this point would be to drop out. Not IP, but I have an otherwise great resume and did not expect my grades to turn out this way. I know mass mailing and networking are things I should definitely be doing, but I'm not sure how to approach that or what firm ranges to target given these kind of grades.

No interest in doing PI, as the reason I came to law school was to work for a firm. Also planning on bidding solely NYC if I end up not dropping out.

Thanks guys

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IzziesGal
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Re: Bottom 1/3 at T6

Postby IzziesGal » Mon May 23, 2011 8:11 am

Don't drop out. You are at a T6. Take this holiday weekend and start mass emailing firms - send a small blurb in the email itself and attach your resume and cover letter. No transcripts. Let them like you and ask you for them later. I'm very open about not being a rockstar transcript wise....and this worked for me. I used to be at a T6 (screw you, USNWR!). I started emailing firms last year around memorial day weekend. Go through the entire vault list in reverse. Start with 100 and work your way back because you have a shot at the lower ranked firms coming from a school like yours. Aim to send out about 10 or 15 a day and don't let rejection discourage you. I sent out about 200 apps to get 9 interviews. Just keep plugging along.

Also, take some time to make your resume PERFECT. I mean, PERFECT. Since your grades aren't stellar, capitalize on whatever experience you have. Update those blurbs under each place of employment to make yourself really stand out.

Good luck and PM me if you need more info.

timbs4339
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Re: Bottom 1/3 at T6

Postby timbs4339 » Mon May 23, 2011 9:06 am

Anonymous User wrote:Hey everyone,

Seeing how there's a "Median at CLS" thread here, I'd like to start one for those who look like they might be at the bottom end of the curve after 2nd semester. I'm at a T6 in NY, haven't gotten all my grades yet but things aren't looking so great.

Specifically, I'm wondering what I can do now through August to maximize my chances of getting biglaw/NJL250, or if my best option at this point would be to drop out. Not IP, but I have an otherwise great resume and did not expect my grades to turn out this way. I know mass mailing and networking are things I should definitely be doing, but I'm not sure how to approach that or what firm ranges to target given these kind of grades.

No interest in doing PI, as the reason I came to law school was to work for a firm. Also planning on bidding solely NYC if I end up not dropping out.

Thanks guys


First, don't get down just because of grades. Hiring is not linear throughout the class. Firms will often hire bottom 1/3 students with work experience over median students with no work experience. They're just looking for something that sets you apart from the pack and WE does this better than 3.3 GPA over 3.1. A BIGLAW job is by no means guaranteed, but I would have rather been in your situation than mine (median at T6, no WE, struck out).

There are a few things you should do to maximize your chances at OCI and give you a necessary confidence boost going into your interviews.

1) Do the mass mail thing. Get every list you can find, NLJ 250, Vault, NALP, USNews. Email every firm in your law school's market and every market you have some geographic tie to. This includes midlaw, boutiques, plaintiff's side mass lit, etc. Read up on how to do a mass mail.

2) In your bidding, bid on the firms with large summer classes. If you are at a NYC T6, they will be easier to find locally. If you are at UChi, you may want to talk to people to see if they recommend bidding on Chicago over NYC. I could see how this has both advantages and disadvantages. Stay away from the V10, but otherwise don't arbitrarily restrict yourself to "V50 on down" or "V75 on down." It might give you a false sense of security because this process reminds you of the law school admissions process which is very numbers driven and centered around one ranking (USNWR vs Vault), This is not a good strategy because the lower ranked Vault firms will often have smaller summer classes, which means fewer callbacks and they can pick from the top 4 or 5 grade people they see at OCI. Also, you have firms such as Irell and Munger which are ranked in the V40 (and were ranked 40 and 50 last year) but you would be laughed out of their interview with your grades even with IP background. There are other firms like that too, so do your research and run your bidlist by people, either online or IRL.

3) At OCI bring enough resumes to not only give one to every interviewer, but to give one to every hospitality suite as well. There were about 8-12 hospitality suites per day of OCI at my school. Do not be dissuaded because a firm is too highly Vault ranked, even a Vault 10, chat with the HR rep and give them a resume anyway. Worst case scenario they throw it away afterwards and you get useful swag.

4) If your school has an add/drop period, be online at that time and add as many interviews as possible, making sure to avoid IP firms. Make a block schedule of all your interviews before this to make rapid fire clicking easier.

5) Send your school's CSO your grades. Ask them to construct a bidlist that will maximize your chances of getting a job. Do not give them any information like "I want to work in X market," which allows them to give you an answer they think you might want to hear. See what they come up with and then come post it here or ask rising 3Ls. They may have an idea of which firms do not have grade cutoffs at your school that they just don't publish. Or their list may be shit. But at least you've tried to work with them.

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TaipeiMort
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Re: Bottom 1/3 at T6

Postby TaipeiMort » Mon May 23, 2011 9:35 am

Well, I'm assuming you aren't going to Chicago, because grades aren't even close to out, and more than 50% ofyour grades are coming out this quarter. You could be in the top 30% for all you know.

That being said, career services has said that people at the bottom of the class get many offers, and those at the top get few. Many firms are more interested in fit than Chicago's crazy grading system/ grades in general. I would say to just prepare for interviews like a champ, network with alum at firms before applying, on July 15th, mass mail every single mid and big firm that wont be coming to OCI. Also, depending on where you work over the summer, see if you can interview the last week of summer with firms that you are really interested in before OCI.

If you are at Chicago also, I would think about targeting two markets really hard in OCI, one of them being New York. Ancdotally, this is by far the easiest market to get into because there are the most jobs relative to overall want by students. The other market might be one which you have ties to. Also, maximize your chances by attending as many additional screening interviews as possible.

I would bet you if you made applying to firms and interview prep your job, ITRE (in this rebounding economy), you would get many, many offers.

paulinaporizkova
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Re: Bottom 1/3 at T6

Postby paulinaporizkova » Mon May 23, 2011 9:38 am

Anonymous User wrote: I'm at a T6 in NY


TaipeiMort wrote:Well, I'm assuming you aren't going to Chicago

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KMaine
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Re: Bottom 1/3 at T6

Postby KMaine » Mon May 23, 2011 10:02 am

TaipeiMort wrote:I would bet you if you made applying to firms and interview prep your job, ITRE (in this rebounding economy), you would get many, many offers.


Though I think OP stands a good chance of getting a job, this may be a little optimistic.

hurldes
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Re: Bottom 1/3 at T6

Postby hurldes » Mon May 23, 2011 10:24 am

but you would be laughed out of their interview with your grades even with IP background.


Just a quick question... I don't want to hijack this thread. But is there something special about having an IP background so that your grades don't have to be as high? thanks.

bdubs
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Re: Bottom 1/3 at T6

Postby bdubs » Mon May 23, 2011 10:30 am

hurldes wrote:
but you would be laughed out of their interview with your grades even with IP background.


Just a quick question... I don't want to hijack this thread. But is there something special about having an IP background so that your grades don't have to be as high? thanks.


I think they are more in demand because there are fewer people that are eligible for the patent bar in law school, so grades matter less.
Last edited by bdubs on Mon May 23, 2011 10:35 am, edited 1 time in total.

timbs4339
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Re: Bottom 1/3 at T6

Postby timbs4339 » Mon May 23, 2011 10:34 am

hurldes wrote:
but you would be laughed out of their interview with your grades even with IP background.


Just a quick question... I don't want to hijack this thread. But is there something special about having an IP background so that your grades don't have to be as high? thanks.


What the above poster said, and there are some firms that hire only people with a technical or engineering degree, and pay market.




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