How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

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Anonymous User
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Sep 10, 2014 12:45 am

I've recently had first rounds with some DA's offices here in NYC. Contrary to what I was expecting, they were pretty relaxed and chill (one of them I had interned for during law school). It was mostly resume review and "what do you think about X" kind of questions. I was somewhat thrown off because both of my internship interviews (one for local DA, one for the feds) were hypos and intense. There was a semi-hypo that came out of a discussion of a case I'd worked on while interning, but that was pretty much it. Overall my feeling is the two interviews went well, but I was thrown off by how, I guess, "easy" they were. Thoughts?

rpcb
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby rpcb » Wed Sep 10, 2014 2:29 am

Anonymous User wrote:
rpcb wrote:Does anybody have any experience interning or working at the Defender Association of Philadelphia? I haven't head too much about it but what I have heard has been largely positive.


Not sure if you are asking for internship or job reasons, but you must must must have a great answer for why you are okay with horizontal representation.

Its a fun city and a very big office. They don't have too much attrition which is a good sign.


I'm applying for an internship. Thanks for the heads up that they do horizontal representation

xChiTowNx
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby xChiTowNx » Wed Sep 10, 2014 11:10 am

The Dark Shepard wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
rpcb wrote:Does anybody know anything about Hennepin County Public Defenders' Office? Its the one PD office I haven't really found out anything about. Anybody know if they got a good reputation for training new attorneys and interns?


PM'ed. The short answer is the training so far has been incredible.


could you PM me as well? Office I'd be most interested in working at, and I'd like to know what I should do throughout my 3 years to ensure my best opportunity at it.


If you could also PM me info about Hennepin as its one of the few midwest offices. thanks!

gr8scOtt!
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby gr8scOtt! » Thu Sep 11, 2014 1:10 pm

How should I indicate on my cover letter that I'm pretty much willing to move anywhere for a PD job? Or should I save that for the actual interview, assuming I get one?

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Displeased
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Displeased » Thu Sep 11, 2014 7:40 pm

gr8scOtt! wrote:How should I indicate on my cover letter that I'm pretty much willing to move anywhere for a PD job? Or should I save that for the actual interview, assuming I get one?


Do you mean anywhere as in "anywhere in the continental U.S?" or anywhere as in "I'll work in the most impoverished, rural, backwater county in my state?". Because if its the former, and you are tossing out applications to states that are thousands of miles away from your school, you'll need to offer some explanation in the cover letter. If I was sitting in Virginia and got an application from a 3L in Texas, I'd really want to see a justification. If its the latter, I'd just save that explanation for the interview.

"I'm just desperate for a job and will move anywhere" may be your motivating factor, but if you do get hired, you are going to actually have to live within 30 miles or so of the office, and you'll be committed for at least a year or so. If you can't think of one reasonable articulable reason to live there, maybe you should rethink the application.

On a side note, I want to point out that a LOT of PD's offices don't do OCI, don't advertise internships, and definitely don't go to Equal Justice Works. If you get bogged down in applying to just nationally famous PD's offices (like PDS, Bronx, California, Colorado, etc), you'll miss a lot of more attainable opportunities at other offices. Virginia has 30 something PD offices, and very few of them do any kind of formal OCI. Tiny Rhode Island has a half-dozen PD's offices. Even the godforsaken hellscape of Wisconsin has 30+ offices. Just saying, if you're just looking for PD experience and don't need the prestige of PDS, just shoot an email out to a local PD office. You might be surprised how easily you can pick up an internship.

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BlueLotus
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby BlueLotus » Mon Sep 15, 2014 10:05 pm

Do Bronx Defenders, BDS, and Legal Aid Society eventually ask for transcripts?

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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Sep 16, 2014 6:14 pm

To those who have interviewed with PDS (2Ls specifically) how long did it take for you to hear back?

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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Sep 16, 2014 6:21 pm

Anonymous User wrote:To those who have interviewed with PDS (2Ls specifically) how long did it take for you to hear back?


I don't remember exactly, I think I heard in late September or early October... but I think I blocked out that whole time because of the nervousness and anxiety associated with it. It was relatively fast turnaround.

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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Sep 16, 2014 6:24 pm

Anonymous User wrote:To those who have interviewed with PDS (2Ls specifically) how long did it take for you to hear back?

Just under a month (this year)

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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Sep 16, 2014 6:26 pm

Thanks! It hasn't been too long for me but I am also just really anxious about it. My interview was mostly conversational so I hope that was a good thing!

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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Sep 16, 2014 6:27 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Thanks! It hasn't been too long for me but I am also just really anxious about it. My interview was mostly conversational so I hope that was a good thing!

Strongly recommend sending an email to Jen Thomas re-iterating your interest if it's been a while. I did that and received an offer 2 days later.

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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Sep 16, 2014 6:33 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Thanks! It hasn't been too long for me but I am also just really anxious about it. My interview was mostly conversational so I hope that was a good thing!

Strongly recommend sending an email to Jen Thomas re-iterating your interest if it's been a while. I did that and received an offer 2 days later.


It's only been about a week so I didn't know if that was too soon. I asked my CSO but they haven't responded.

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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Sep 16, 2014 6:39 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Thanks! It hasn't been too long for me but I am also just really anxious about it. My interview was mostly conversational so I hope that was a good thing!

Strongly recommend sending an email to Jen Thomas re-iterating your interest if it's been a while. I did that and received an offer 2 days later.


It's only been about a week so I didn't know if that was too soon. I asked my CSO but they haven't responded.

Yea, I was 2 days shy of 4 weeks, I know you're anxious, but I'd wait

Good luck!

forty-two
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby forty-two » Tue Sep 16, 2014 7:26 pm

Displeased wrote:On a side note, I want to point out that a LOT of PD's offices don't do OCI, don't advertise internships, and definitely don't go to Equal Justice Works. If you get bogged down in applying to just nationally famous PD's offices (like PDS, Bronx, California, Colorado, etc), you'll miss a lot of more attainable opportunities at other offices. Virginia has 30 something PD offices, and very few of them do any kind of formal OCI. Tiny Rhode Island has a half-dozen PD's offices. Even the godforsaken hellscape of Wisconsin has 30+ offices. Just saying, if you're just looking for PD experience and don't need the prestige of PDS, just shoot an email out to a local PD office. You might be surprised how easily you can pick up an internship.


I want to second this. There are 43 circuit PD offices in Georgia, and many of those circuits cover multiple counties. I don't think any of them do EJW or have defined hiring classes, but there are a lot of new hires every year. Most would also love to have interns, even the ones that don't advertise or have a formal recruiting process. I don't think my office got any applications for internships this past summer, and the office I interned at while waiting for bar results only rarely got applications (and they're both great offices). So I definitely think it's worth reaching out to local offices.

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FlanAl
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby FlanAl » Tue Sep 16, 2014 7:40 pm

Displeased wrote:
gr8scOtt! wrote:On a side note, I want to point out that a LOT of PD's offices don't do OCI, don't advertise internships, and definitely don't go to Equal Justice Works. If you get bogged down in applying to just nationally famous PD's offices (like PDS, Bronx, California, Colorado, etc), you'll miss a lot of more attainable opportunities at other offices. Virginia has 30 something PD offices, and very few of them do any kind of formal OCI. Tiny Rhode Island has a half-dozen PD's offices. Even the godforsaken hellscape of Wisconsin has 30+ offices. Just saying, if you're just looking for PD experience and don't need the prestige of PDS, just shoot an email out to a local PD office. You might be surprised how easily you can pick up an internship.


I think that this is good advice but just wanted to throw it out there that its really tough to get a response from the smaller offices. I sent emails to Rhode Island and a number of other offices like this and received no response, even after following up. I would focus on the national offices first and then shift to the other offices. I would also really hustle to try and get some connection to these offices, maybe even drop off a resume in person if you have the chance.

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BlueLotus
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby BlueLotus » Tue Sep 16, 2014 8:02 pm

is it impossible to get a PD jerb with all civil indigent Legal Aid stuff on your resume? In know a woman who works at the Middlesex DA who had no crim experience on her resume, but i think that she is an outlier.

ash0117
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby ash0117 » Tue Sep 16, 2014 9:14 pm

BlueLotus wrote:is it impossible to get a PD jerb with all civil indigent Legal Aid stuff on your resume? In know a woman who works at the Middlesex DA who had no crim experience on her resume, but i think that she is an outlier.


No, I don't think it's impossible. Some offices don't like hiring people with victim services stuff, but I don't think the woman you know is that much as an outlier. I know at least 10 PDs in several different offices that were once Legal Aid attorneys. I think it's very possible to get a PD job, especially if you didn't do victim services/ domestic violence stuff (but I think even that experience can be spun).

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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Sep 16, 2014 9:43 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Thanks! It hasn't been too long for me but I am also just really anxious about it. My interview was mostly conversational so I hope that was a good thing!

Strongly recommend sending an email to Jen Thomas re-iterating your interest if it's been a while. I did that and received an offer 2 days later.



I might be doing that as well. I applied awhile ago and have only got an automated response saying they received my application. Complete silence since then which is really disappointing

aladdinismyprince
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby aladdinismyprince » Tue Sep 16, 2014 9:51 pm

Posting for a friend who is interested in the dark side:

Does anyone have any information on the Brooklyn DA? What are their interviews like? Do they ask ethics hypos?

The Dark Shepard
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby The Dark Shepard » Tue Sep 16, 2014 11:35 pm

ash0117 wrote:
BlueLotus wrote:is it impossible to get a PD jerb with all civil indigent Legal Aid stuff on your resume? In know a woman who works at the Middlesex DA who had no crim experience on her resume, but i think that she is an outlier.


No, I don't think it's impossible. Some offices don't like hiring people with victim services stuff, but I don't think the woman you know is that much as an outlier. I know at least 10 PDs in several different offices that were once Legal Aid attorneys. I think it's very possible to get a PD job, especially if you didn't do victim services/ domestic violence stuff (but I think even that experience can be spun).


That's really fucking stupid

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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Tue Sep 16, 2014 11:38 pm

The Dark Shepard wrote:
ash0117 wrote:
BlueLotus wrote:is it impossible to get a PD jerb with all civil indigent Legal Aid stuff on your resume? In know a woman who works at the Middlesex DA who had no crim experience on her resume, but i think that she is an outlier.


No, I don't think it's impossible. Some offices don't like hiring people with victim services stuff, but I don't think the woman you know is that much as an outlier. I know at least 10 PDs in several different offices that were once Legal Aid attorneys. I think it's very possible to get a PD job, especially if you didn't do victim services/ domestic violence stuff (but I think even that experience can be spun).


That's really fucking stupid

I don't know, if you've spent a bunch of time working on behalf of victims, I can see why an office would wonder if you'd be able to defend (say) DV defendants. I'm not saying people couldn't, I'm just saying I can see it raising a concern.

rpcb
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby rpcb » Tue Sep 16, 2014 11:50 pm

A. Nony Mouse wrote:
The Dark Shepard wrote:
ash0117 wrote:
BlueLotus wrote:is it impossible to get a PD jerb with all civil indigent Legal Aid stuff on your resume? In know a woman who works at the Middlesex DA who had no crim experience on her resume, but i think that she is an outlier.


No, I don't think it's impossible. Some offices don't like hiring people with victim services stuff, but I don't think the woman you know is that much as an outlier. I know at least 10 PDs in several different offices that were once Legal Aid attorneys. I think it's very possible to get a PD job, especially if you didn't do victim services/ domestic violence stuff (but I think even that experience can be spun).


That's really fucking stupid

I don't know, if you've spent a bunch of time working on behalf of victims, I can see why an office would wonder if you'd be able to defend (say) DV defendants. I'm not saying people couldn't, I'm just saying I can see it raising a concern.


I agree. I dont think it is stupid at all. You will have to defend people accused of some pretty nasty crimes; rape, battery, etc... If you have experience working with the victims I can see why PD offices would be concerned about whether or not you can defend the accused.

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BlueLotus
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby BlueLotus » Wed Sep 17, 2014 4:44 am

I agree. I dont think it is stupid at all. You will have to defend people accused of some pretty nasty crimes; rape, battery, etc... If you have experience working with the victims I can see why PD offices would be concerned about whether or not you can defend the accused.[/quote]

i think it is very short-sighted. a lot of criminal defendants are victims of trauma, and learning to work with them is a valuable experience to have as a PD.

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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Sep 17, 2014 7:10 am

BlueLotus wrote:I agree. I dont think it is stupid at all. You will have to defend people accused of some pretty nasty crimes; rape, battery, etc... If you have experience working with the victims I can see why PD offices would be concerned about whether or not you can defend the accused.


i think it is very short-sighted. a lot of criminal defendants are victims of trauma, and learning to work with them is a valuable experience to have as a PD.[/quote]

I was actually thinking about this yesterday when my training group went on a tour of the state prison. Considering the living conditions there and in jail, where a number of your defendants will be living, I think that having experience with victim work could really help with forming a meaningful relationship with the client.

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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Sep 17, 2014 1:32 pm

If you want to demonstrate your understanding of prison-related trauma, work with the fucking prisoners.




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