How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

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Ded Precedent
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Ded Precedent » Fri May 02, 2014 1:15 am

spleenworship wrote:
Ded Precedent wrote:Has anyone gone to the EJW conference/career fair? I know it's not until October but is it worth it to consider going? Did you get serious interviews or just BS table talks? Any insight would be awesome.


I got a serious Miami interview from a table talk.

Maybe sometime, if you're not busy you could break down how these things work (sorry I'm totally oblivious). Do you just kind of wander from table to table and talk to people and then try to set up interviews or is it like you get a set number of employers to meet with and you actually get a time set aside for like a 1 on 1 pre-interview.

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BlueLotus
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby BlueLotus » Fri May 02, 2014 1:17 am

Ded Precedent wrote:Has anyone gone to the EJW conference/career fair? I know it's not until October but is it worth it to consider going? Did you get serious interviews or just BS table talks? Any insight would be awesome.


I got my 2L summer jerb thru EJW (got one interview and was offered the position right then and there!).

Also, worth it for the table talks, even if you don't get an official interview. There is an anon poster from like page 90-something ITT who got a position at LAS this way--the table talk was basically treated as a screener. Let me see if I can pull up that post, it was helpful.

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BlueLotus
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby BlueLotus » Fri May 02, 2014 1:20 am

Anonymous User wrote:Hey all:

I'm a recent tier 1 graduate who accepted a PD position at Legal Aid with zero help from my school's career center.

Re: EJW - absolutely go. I only got interviews with New Hampshire and Palm Beach, but the "table talk" portion is 100% what got me in the door at LAS. Also made great connections with Bronx, Harlem, Maryland, Miami, etc. My advice is to apply to as many interviews as you can before the deadline (make a spreadsheet), but also keep a list of all the others you're interested in talking to at the fair/applying cold afterwards. It also helps if you've submitted apps to these places before the fair, but also fine if you refer to EJW in your cover letter post-fair.

The listings will keep getting posted up until the deadline (I remember one job got posted like a day before the deadline). Apply to as many as your can, but don't be discouraged if you don't get an interview. Treat EJW as super important - get your stuff on resume paper, wear a good suit, suck up your pride and network like a champ. They give you a big list of all the employers and a map of the room - plot out your strategy and wait your turn to have a few minutes face-to-face with the employers. Tell em your deal, make sure they get your resume, and follow up with a thank you email. Remember most PDs have separate applications, and not getting a 1st round through the formal EJW system means little. I spent maybe 3 minutes talking with someone at LAS, followed up, and then got a 2nd round interview in NY (they treated table talk as my first round).

Good luck to you all! But highly highly recommend EJW/cold applications.


^Yeah, this was the post I was referring to.

Treat the table talks like regular interviews. Bring extra copies of your resume, have a 2-3 minute spiel, and be prepared with thoughtful questions.

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Ded Precedent
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Ded Precedent » Fri May 02, 2014 1:22 am

Thanks so much guys. I'm sure I'll have more questions. I have pre-law PD experience and then I spent (am spending) both of my summers at a PD office so I was planning on going to the EJW conference as a back up in case I don't get hired through my office.

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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby DayTripper1967 » Tue May 06, 2014 11:51 pm

Is Colorado PD still hiring a lot of new grads? I've heard that they are the most receptive towards out of state grads. I'm a 2L at Wisconsin, my grades are shit, but I have a lot of PD experience (interned at PD office 1L summer, and will be doing another internship at PD office this summer with my own case load), I have done a criminal appeals clinic, I will be interning with a Federal Defenders office in the fall, and I've done some other various PI stuff.

Was just wondering what I can realistically expect if I go to EJW and interview with them.

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spleenworship
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby spleenworship » Wed May 07, 2014 12:53 am

DayTripper1967 wrote:Is Colorado PD still hiring a lot of new grads? I've heard that they are the most receptive towards out of state grads. I'm a 2L at Wisconsin, my grades are shit, but I have a lot of PD experience (interned at PD office 1L summer, and will be doing another internship at PD office this summer with my own case load), I have done a criminal appeals clinic, I will be interning with a Federal Defenders office in the fall, and I've done some other various PI stuff.

Was just wondering what I can realistically expect if I go to EJW and interview with them.



I got an interview but no further. The person I know who got a job with them worked for them his 2L summer. I'd recommend that, personally.

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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed May 07, 2014 9:36 am

DayTripper1967 wrote:Is Colorado PD still hiring a lot of new grads? I've heard that they are the most receptive towards out of state grads. I'm a 2L at Wisconsin, my grades are shit, but I have a lot of PD experience (interned at PD office 1L summer, and will be doing another internship at PD office this summer with my own case load), I have done a criminal appeals clinic, I will be interning with a Federal Defenders office in the fall, and I've done some other various PI stuff.

Was just wondering what I can realistically expect if I go to EJW and interview with them.


If you don't work there 2L summer, you need some ties to CO (IMO). I got an interview with them at EJW, but the interviewer basically spent the whole 30 minutes asking me if I would really move to a small town in the middle of nowhere CO. Since I got rejected, I guess my answer wasn't plausible. To be fair to them, I have never even been to the state. So if you really want to work there, have an airtight answer for why you want to be in small-town CO.

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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby samcro_op » Wed May 07, 2014 1:02 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
DayTripper1967 wrote:Is Colorado PD still hiring a lot of new grads? I've heard that they are the most receptive towards out of state grads. I'm a 2L at Wisconsin, my grades are shit, but I have a lot of PD experience (interned at PD office 1L summer, and will be doing another internship at PD office this summer with my own case load), I have done a criminal appeals clinic, I will be interning with a Federal Defenders office in the fall, and I've done some other various PI stuff.

Was just wondering what I can realistically expect if I go to EJW and interview with them.


If you don't work there 2L summer, you need some ties to CO (IMO). I got an interview with them at EJW, but the interviewer basically spent the whole 30 minutes asking me if I would really move to a small town in the middle of nowhere CO. Since I got rejected, I guess my answer wasn't plausible. To be fair to them, I have never even been to the state. So if you really want to work there, have an airtight answer for why you want to be in small-town CO.


How many of the hires go to bigger cities? I am interested in CO but don't think I would be happy in small town CO.

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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed May 07, 2014 5:19 pm

samcro_op wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
DayTripper1967 wrote:Is Colorado PD still hiring a lot of new grads? I've heard that they are the most receptive towards out of state grads. I'm a 2L at Wisconsin, my grades are shit, but I have a lot of PD experience (interned at PD office 1L summer, and will be doing another internship at PD office this summer with my own case load), I have done a criminal appeals clinic, I will be interning with a Federal Defenders office in the fall, and I've done some other various PI stuff.

Was just wondering what I can realistically expect if I go to EJW and interview with them.


If you don't work there 2L summer, you need some ties to CO (IMO). I got an interview with them at EJW, but the interviewer basically spent the whole 30 minutes asking me if I would really move to a small town in the middle of nowhere CO. Since I got rejected, I guess my answer wasn't plausible. To be fair to them, I have never even been to the state. So if you really want to work there, have an airtight answer for why you want to be in small-town CO.


How many of the hires go to bigger cities? I am interested in CO but don't think I would be happy in small town CO.


The way it was presented to me was that you can tell them your preferences but they make the ultimate decision and you must stay in the original office for two years before asking to be transferred. I imagine some people get to start off at the bigger cities, but they definitely made it seem to me that most likely you would end up in a small town. Again, I got rejected after EJW, so someone who worked there would definitely know more.

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Borhas
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Borhas » Wed May 07, 2014 9:34 pm

I doubt *most* people end up in small towns simply because the urban offices are much bigger and have relatively high turnover.

And working in a rural office isn't that bad. You'll have a much more manageable caseload at least.

I guess it also depends on what you mean by rural/small town. My guess is at least half of new hires have been split up between Colorado Springs, Denver, Fort Collins, and the counties surrounding Denver

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Borhas
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Borhas » Wed May 07, 2014 9:42 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
DayTripper1967 wrote:Is Colorado PD still hiring a lot of new grads? I've heard that they are the most receptive towards out of state grads. I'm a 2L at Wisconsin, my grades are shit, but I have a lot of PD experience (interned at PD office 1L summer, and will be doing another internship at PD office this summer with my own case load), I have done a criminal appeals clinic, I will be interning with a Federal Defenders office in the fall, and I've done some other various PI stuff.

Was just wondering what I can realistically expect if I go to EJW and interview with them.


If you don't work there 2L summer, you need some ties to CO (IMO). I got an interview with them at EJW, but the interviewer basically spent the whole 30 minutes asking me if I would really move to a small town in the middle of nowhere CO. Since I got rejected, I guess my answer wasn't plausible. To be fair to them, I have never even been to the state. So if you really want to work there, have an airtight answer for why you want to be in small-town CO.


Ties to CO aren't necessary but they definitely help. I never lived in or visited CO before and I got hired.

I'd say about half of the new PDs in my office never interned in CO.

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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed May 07, 2014 11:46 pm

For Colorado: If you're aiming for a Western Slope office, what are the chances you'd actually get it? Do those chances improve if you work a summer in a Western Slope office?

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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Anonymous User » Fri May 23, 2014 7:35 pm

Just wanted to chime in and thank everyone on this thread for all of the advice throughout, especially Borhas. I've been following this thread since the beginning and have gotten a lot out of it. I was recently offered by a PD office here in CA after volunteering for the last 8 months or so!

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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Anonymous User » Sat May 24, 2014 12:09 am

so im a rising 2L working at a public defender's office, and today was the end of my 2nd week there.

should i be worried that pretty much all i've done so far is copying transcripts and organizing files? or is that standard? when should i expect to do more substantive work?

I'm trying to balance my desire to get as much experience as possible with being a good employee and being professional and all that. so far I've done what I'm told, I've asked if theres anything else i can do, and have tried to be opportunistic.

i guess if someone could explain the timeline of what they did their 1L summer (if at a public defender's office) and when they started doing real work, i would appreciate that so i could get a feel of what to expect. thanks

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jdx2014
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby jdx2014 » Sat May 24, 2014 12:13 am

easy.....don't.

there, you are welcome

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spleenworship
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby spleenworship » Sat May 24, 2014 2:39 pm

Anonymous User wrote:so im a rising 2L working at a public defender's office, and today was the end of my 2nd week there.

should i be worried that pretty much all i've done so far is copying transcripts and organizing files? or is that standard? when should i expect to do more substantive work?

I'm trying to balance my desire to get as much experience as possible with being a good employee and being professional and all that. so far I've done what I'm told, I've asked if theres anything else i can do, and have tried to be opportunistic.

i guess if someone could explain the timeline of what they did their 1L summer (if at a public defender's office) and when they started doing real work, i would appreciate that so i could get a feel of what to expect. thanks


I didn't start doing research until week three, memos until week 4, motions until week 6.

Every office is very different though. Generally, unless you've taken crim pro, however, you aren't a whole ton of use to them.

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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Anonymous User » Sat May 24, 2014 2:48 pm

Anonymous User wrote:so im a rising 2L working at a public defender's office, and today was the end of my 2nd week there.

should i be worried that pretty much all i've done so far is copying transcripts and organizing files? or is that standard? when should i expect to do more substantive work?

I'm trying to balance my desire to get as much experience as possible with being a good employee and being professional and all that. so far I've done what I'm told, I've asked if theres anything else i can do, and have tried to be opportunistic.

i guess if someone could explain the timeline of what they did their 1L summer (if at a public defender's office) and when they started doing real work, i would appreciate that so i could get a feel of what to expect. thanks


Only DA experience here but fwiw:

My first summer at a DAs office, i literally did nothing besides write memos on random areas of law or do busy work like you are doing now and observe court. I got maybe 3 assignments all summer that were worth anything (and they really werent) and used those as my three bullet points on the resume.

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anjmissy
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby anjmissy » Sat May 24, 2014 5:37 pm

Anonymous User wrote:so im a rising 2L working at a public defender's office, and today was the end of my 2nd week there.

should i be worried that pretty much all i've done so far is copying transcripts and organizing files? or is that standard? when should i expect to do more substantive work?

I'm trying to balance my desire to get as much experience as possible with being a good employee and being professional and all that. so far I've done what I'm told, I've asked if theres anything else i can do, and have tried to be opportunistic.

i guess if someone could explain the timeline of what they did their 1L summer (if at a public defender's office) and when they started doing real work, i would appreciate that so i could get a feel of what to expect. thanks


I did pd work 1L summer as well and im doing it again this summer, I would suggest trying to get as much client interaction as possible..I dont think it would be rude to suggest that you assist with jail visits or help out with intake interviews. That work is truly important..Last summer I was doing your work for two weeks until I mentioned to my supervising attorney that I would like to do intake interviews and she was surprised, saying that usually interns don't want to do that. So be upfront..You definitely don't want to go a whole summer without getting that type of experience. It'll be pretty difficult to sit for a job interview trying to express your motivation for pd work when you havent had direct client interaction.

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Tanicius
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Tanicius » Sat May 24, 2014 6:24 pm

Motion practice is the most important thing you should be doing. Ask to write motions to dismiss based on insufficient evidence. It's basically the criminal law version of a motion for summary judgement. You require zero criminal procedure class experience to do that kind of assignment, and is heavy in both research and facts. By far the most impressive thing you can do as a non-certified rising 2L.

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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Anonymous User » Sun May 25, 2014 1:31 am

worth it: part time RA during 1l summer at PD office? well connected prof

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sd5289
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby sd5289 » Sun May 25, 2014 9:52 am

^ Definitely (so long as it doesn't interfere with whatever work you're doing full time). I've been an RA for one prof since January, and am continuing part time during the summer before he finishes his project and I move on to the next prof who's asked me to be his RA for an upcoming project. It's some extra $$, good research experience, and looks good on your resume.

ETA: and I agree with Tanicius above. I did a ton of motion practice my 1L summer, and it not only gave me a lot of references in that office for when I apply, it produced tons of writing samples (one of which helped me secure my 2L summer job by September of my 2L year).

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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Anonymous User » Sat May 31, 2014 5:21 pm

Anonymous User wrote:For Colorado: If you're aiming for a Western Slope office, what are the chances you'd actually get it? Do those chances improve if you work a summer in a Western Slope office?


The chances are usually wherever their hiring needs are when they hire or place you - usually your placement info is after you pass the bar.

However, if you are looking to summer with them, I think wanting to get placed in a Western Slope office for the summer gives you a bump if you want to go to such an office. And if you want to get hired in that office, it is another bump - just be ready in case you don't get the specific Western Slope office you prefer.

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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby mmm127 » Wed Jun 11, 2014 5:28 pm

anyone have any experience as a DA/SA for a VOP hearing? I am currently a 1L summer intern for a local SA office and keep having mini panic attacks about it. I haven't taken Evidence/Crim Pro yet-- and although there will be a state's attorney supervising me, I don't want to look like too much of a fool. No trial ad experience either.

dreakol
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby dreakol » Wed Jun 11, 2014 6:00 pm

mmm127 wrote:anyone have any experience as a DA/SA for a VOP hearing? I am currently a 1L summer intern for a local SA office and keep having mini panic attacks about it. I haven't taken Evidence/Crim Pro yet-- and although there will be a state's attorney supervising me, I don't want to look like too much of a fool. No trial ad experience either.


how are you able to do hearings as a 1L?

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Tanicius
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Tanicius » Wed Jun 11, 2014 6:02 pm

dreakol wrote:
mmm127 wrote:anyone have any experience as a DA/SA for a VOP hearing? I am currently a 1L summer intern for a local SA office and keep having mini panic attacks about it. I haven't taken Evidence/Crim Pro yet-- and although there will be a state's attorney supervising me, I don't want to look like too much of a fool. No trial ad experience either.


how are you able to do hearings as a 1L?


Some states allow you to become certified as a 1L, period. Other states allow you to become certified if you're just signed up for a fall semester class in evidence/crimpro.




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