How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

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djaja
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby djaja » Wed Apr 02, 2014 9:39 pm

FlanAl wrote:But the emotional toll is crushing. If you have any empathy at all, being a PD sucks. Its nearly impossible. Its not about dedication, or "serving the indigent", or how hard you are willing to work. Everyone who lasts more than a couple months at a PD's office is dedicated and a hard worker. Its just about endurance and compartmentalization.


I don't buy this shit. If you think the emotional toll of being a PD is crushing, try washing dishes or graveyard shift security or construction or flipping burgers at Whattaburger or wiping someone's ass as a home health aide. You know, the jobs your clients work. If you can't handle being a PD, you probably couldn't have handled prosecution or biglaw or any other legal job either.

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spleenworship
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby spleenworship » Wed Apr 02, 2014 9:47 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
FlanAl wrote:But the emotional toll is crushing. If you have any empathy at all, being a PD sucks. Its nearly impossible. Its not about dedication, or "serving the indigent", or how hard you are willing to work. Everyone who lasts more than a couple months at a PD's office is dedicated and a hard worker. Its just about endurance and compartmentalization.


I don't buy this shit. If you think the emotional toll of being a PD is crushing, try washing dishes or graveyard shift security or construction or flipping burgers at Whattaburger or wiping someone's ass as a home health aide. You know, the jobs your clients work. If you can't handle being a PD, you probably couldn't have handled prosecution or biglaw or any other legal job either.


And I'm pretty sure you're an idiot. The joy of all of those except ass wiping is that you have very little responsibility and you don't have to worry about fucking up someone's life.

DayTripper1967
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby DayTripper1967 » Wed Apr 02, 2014 10:45 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Wow, I've heard anecdotes of people who start PD and go DA but I've never met one. What went wrong?


At my law school, we have clinics for both DA and PD. They consist of a trial ad class and either a prosecution/defense class (depending on what you're in) in the spring, a summer internship at an office, and then a fall reflective class. I've just been having a really bad experience in my PD clinic and i can't be wait to be done with the professor who teaches it. I feel like I've really screwed up by choosing the wrong side. :(

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Tanicius
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Tanicius » Wed Apr 02, 2014 10:57 pm

DayTripper1967 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Wow, I've heard anecdotes of people who start PD and go DA but I've never met one. What went wrong?


At my law school, we have clinics for both DA and PD. They consist of a trial ad class and either a prosecution/defense class (depending on what you're in) in the spring, a summer internship at an office, and then a fall reflective class. I've just been having a really bad experience in my PD clinic and i can't be wait to be done with the professor who teaches it. I feel like I've really screwed up by choosing the wrong side. :(


It's typically much easier to switch into DA work than it is to switch into public defense. Your instinct is correct about that, but it does depend on the office.

What was it about your PD work that made you think you've chosen the wrong side? It's understandable to not like the work because you've had a miserable experience due to a supervisor, but be careful not to impute the supervisor's bad attitude to the meaningfulness of your work. It's a matter of not wanting to work around assholes, then you're SOL trying to switch to DA work, cause it's probably the most political government legal work you can get. By that I don't mean your supervisor will have strong political ideologies. What I mean is, the office itself is super political, and you're going to be taking orders from an asshole eventually and having to do something you morally disagree with because your boss tells you to do it.

secondshot
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby secondshot » Wed Apr 02, 2014 11:07 pm

Hey guys, I'm curious about the Los Angeles PD (or even DA) job market. Is it as congested as I've heard or are there ample opportunities to get in? I will be at UCLA Law, or that's my goal anyway. What are my odds coming out of UCLA? I will of course do everything possible to increase my odds while in LS, thanks for all the tips in this thread. Thanks guys. :)

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A. Nony Mouse
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Wed Apr 02, 2014 11:22 pm

secondshot wrote:Hey guys, I'm curious about the Los Angeles PD (or even DA) job market. Is it as congested as I've heard or are there ample opportunities to get in? I will be at UCLA Law, or that's my goal anyway. What are my odds coming out of UCLA? I will of course do everything possible to increase my odds while in LS, thanks for all the tips in this thread. Thanks guys. :)

Hi - please look at the rules at the top of each forum. 0Ls (not yet in law school) are not allowed to post in this forum. It's a great place to read, but if you have questions please post in the Ask a Law Student/Graduate forum.

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Tanicius
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Tanicius » Wed Apr 02, 2014 11:38 pm

A. Nony Mouse wrote:
secondshot wrote:Hey guys, I'm curious about the Los Angeles PD (or even DA) job market. Is it as congested as I've heard or are there ample opportunities to get in? I will be at UCLA Law, or that's my goal anyway. What are my odds coming out of UCLA? I will of course do everything possible to increase my odds while in LS, thanks for all the tips in this thread. Thanks guys. :)

Hi - please look at the rules at the top of each forum. 0Ls (not yet in law school) are not allowed to post in this forum. It's a great place to read, but if you have questions please post in the Ask a Law Student/Graduate forum.


My bad. I told him to come here because he already made a post elsewhere about these questions.

secondshot
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby secondshot » Thu Apr 03, 2014 12:20 am

Sorry guys, I was referred to this thread to discuss my PD endeavors. Won't happen again. :)

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FlanAl
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby FlanAl » Thu Apr 03, 2014 9:10 am

spleenworship wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
FlanAl wrote:But the emotional toll is crushing. If you have any empathy at all, being a PD sucks. Its nearly impossible. Its not about dedication, or "serving the indigent", or how hard you are willing to work. Everyone who lasts more than a couple months at a PD's office is dedicated and a hard worker. Its just about endurance and compartmentalization.


I don't buy this shit. If you think the emotional toll of being a PD is crushing, try washing dishes or graveyard shift security or construction or flipping burgers at Whattaburger or wiping someone's ass as a home health aide. You know, the jobs your clients work. If you can't handle being a PD, you probably couldn't have handled prosecution or biglaw or any other legal job either.


And I'm pretty sure you're an idiot. The joy of all of those except ass wiping is that you have very little responsibility and you don't have to worry about fucking up someone's life.


How'd I get quoted as saying the above? It was the actual PD's response to my thing about the big law thread. I don't want to go down in internet history quoted for this, I'm a true believer! :D

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transferror
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby transferror » Thu Apr 03, 2014 9:17 am

FlanAl wrote:
spleenworship wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
FlanAl wrote:But the emotional toll is crushing. If you have any empathy at all, being a PD sucks. Its nearly impossible. Its not about dedication, or "serving the indigent", or how hard you are willing to work. Everyone who lasts more than a couple months at a PD's office is dedicated and a hard worker. Its just about endurance and compartmentalization.


I don't buy this shit. If you think the emotional toll of being a PD is crushing, try washing dishes or graveyard shift security or construction or flipping burgers at Whattaburger or wiping someone's ass as a home health aide. You know, the jobs your clients work. If you can't handle being a PD, you probably couldn't have handled prosecution or biglaw or any other legal job either.


And I'm pretty sure you're an idiot. The joy of all of those except ass wiping is that you have very little responsibility and you don't have to worry about fucking up someone's life.


How'd I get quoted as saying the above? It was the actual PD's response to my thing about the big law thread. I don't want to go down in internet history quoted for this, I'm a true believer! :D


Is that you, Travis?

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FlanAl
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby FlanAl » Thu Apr 03, 2014 9:36 am

Displeased wrote:But the emotional toll is crushing. If you have any empathy at all, being a PD sucks. Its nearly impossible. Its not about dedication, or "serving the indigent", or how hard you are willing to work. Everyone who lasts more than a couple months at a PD's office is dedicated and a hard worker. Its just about endurance and compartmentalization.


Who's travis? haha and this was by displeased, who I hope continues to post here because its great to have an actual PD on the thread.

djaja
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby djaja » Thu Apr 03, 2014 10:05 am

spleenworship wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
FlanAl wrote:But the emotional toll is crushing. If you have any empathy at all, being a PD sucks. Its nearly impossible. Its not about dedication, or "serving the indigent", or how hard you are willing to work. Everyone who lasts more than a couple months at a PD's office is dedicated and a hard worker. Its just about endurance and compartmentalization.


I don't buy this shit. If you think the emotional toll of being a PD is crushing, try washing dishes or graveyard shift security or construction or flipping burgers at Whattaburger or wiping someone's ass as a home health aide. You know, the jobs your clients work. If you can't handle being a PD, you probably couldn't have handled prosecution or biglaw or any other legal job either.


And I'm pretty sure you're an idiot. The joy of all of those except ass wiping is that you have very little responsibility and you don't have to worry about fucking up someone's life.


[/privilege]

Anonymous User
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Apr 03, 2014 10:15 am

DayTripper1967 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Wow, I've heard anecdotes of people who start PD and go DA but I've never met one. What went wrong?


At my law school, we have clinics for both DA and PD. They consist of a trial ad class and either a prosecution/defense class (depending on what you're in) in the spring, a summer internship at an office, and then a fall reflective class. I've just been having a really bad experience in my PD clinic and i can't be wait to be done with the professor who teaches it. I feel like I've really screwed up by choosing the wrong side. :(


Don't let one bad prof dissuade you. My school has multiple current and former PDs as profs and they are, without exception, fantastic and amiable folks.

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transferror
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby transferror » Thu Apr 03, 2014 10:22 am

FlanAl wrote:
Displeased wrote:But the emotional toll is crushing. If you have any empathy at all, being a PD sucks. Its nearly impossible. Its not about dedication, or "serving the indigent", or how hard you are willing to work. Everyone who lasts more than a couple months at a PD's office is dedicated and a hard worker. Its just about endurance and compartmentalization.


Who's travis? haha and this was by displeased, who I hope continues to post here because its great to have an actual PD on the thread.


Travis is the male PD followed in Gideon's Army who is a "true believer." I've never heard the term used much outside of that film and thought that's what you were referencing.

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FlanAl
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby FlanAl » Thu Apr 03, 2014 11:00 am

haha I liked that movie but I feel like that guy is going to end up with a lot of tattoos through no fault of his own.

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Displeased
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Displeased » Thu Apr 03, 2014 11:39 pm

FlanAl wrote:
spleenworship wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
FlanAl wrote:But the emotional toll is crushing. If you have any empathy at all, being a PD sucks. Its nearly impossible. Its not about dedication, or "serving the indigent", or how hard you are willing to work. Everyone who lasts more than a couple months at a PD's office is dedicated and a hard worker. Its just about endurance and compartmentalization.


I don't buy this shit. If you think the emotional toll of being a PD is crushing, try washing dishes or graveyard shift security or construction or flipping burgers at Whattaburger or wiping someone's ass as a home health aide. You know, the jobs your clients work. If you can't handle being a PD, you probably couldn't have handled prosecution or biglaw or any other legal job either.


And I'm pretty sure you're an idiot. The joy of all of those except ass wiping is that you have very little responsibility and you don't have to worry about fucking up someone's life.




Yea, I've worked in fast food restaurants, grocery stores, etc. Those jobs have their own challenges (the poverty, the crushing boredom). Just pointing out to all the prospective PDs that it is an extraordinarily stressful job, even by attorney standards.

And I'm still a PD, and I fully intend to be a PD for the foreseeable future.

I may have been self-indulgent and overstated my case in the original post, but I stand by my point. Empathy is a killer in a PD's office. I've seen a lot of dedicated, caring people with the perfect public defender resume burn out within just a few months of being on the job.

But I'll try to be more helpful to the people in this thread, I'll answer questions if anybody asks. I've been a full-time PD for roughly two years, with internships in PD's offices and in other, non-trial attorney offices. Never worked as a prosecutor or interned in a prosecutors office.

Anonymous User
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Apr 04, 2014 12:02 am

djaja wrote:
spleenworship wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
FlanAl wrote:But the emotional toll is crushing. If you have any empathy at all, being a PD sucks. Its nearly impossible. Its not about dedication, or "serving the indigent", or how hard you are willing to work. Everyone who lasts more than a couple months at a PD's office is dedicated and a hard worker. Its just about endurance and compartmentalization.


I don't buy this shit. If you think the emotional toll of being a PD is crushing, try washing dishes or graveyard shift security or construction or flipping burgers at Whattaburger or wiping someone's ass as a home health aide. You know, the jobs your clients work. If you can't handle being a PD, you probably couldn't have handled prosecution or biglaw or any other legal job either.


And I'm pretty sure you're an idiot. The joy of all of those except ass wiping is that you have very little responsibility and you don't have to worry about fucking up someone's life.


[/privilege]


Lol'd

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samcro_op
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby samcro_op » Mon Apr 07, 2014 1:09 pm

If anyone is considering Iowa (One of the placements is in Des Moines).
This would be for current 2Ls
https://spd.iowa.gov/Gideonfellows

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BlueLotus
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby BlueLotus » Wed Apr 09, 2014 8:26 pm

I have a coffee date with a PD I was paired with for a bar ass'n mentorship program this Friday. What are some good ideas of questions to ask?

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gdane
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby gdane » Thu Apr 10, 2014 11:20 am

BlueLotus wrote:I have a coffee date with a PD I was paired with for a bar ass'n mentorship program this Friday. What are some good ideas of questions to ask?

What are things that you want to know? Do you want to know how much he/she works? What the worst things about the job are? How to deal with bad clients?

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BlueLotus
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby BlueLotus » Thu Apr 10, 2014 12:19 pm

gdane wrote:
BlueLotus wrote:I have a coffee date with a PD I was paired with for a bar ass'n mentorship program this Friday. What are some good ideas of questions to ask?

What are things that you want to know? Do you want to know how much he/she works? What the worst things about the job are? How to deal with bad clients?


Yeah pretty much. I also wanna ask about the hiring practices of her office, without seeming crass or like I'm begging for a jerb. I just tend to seem so awkward when it comes to "networking"! She works in the civil division of a PD's office.

Also, when would be a good time to start applying for fall internships? May/June?

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anjmissy
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby anjmissy » Fri Apr 11, 2014 9:23 am

Rising 3L here, could anyone comment on the job fairs they attended that had PDs there and were looking to hire, meaning real interviews, no table talks.

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Lawst
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Lawst » Fri Apr 11, 2014 10:57 am

BlueLotus wrote:
gdane wrote:
BlueLotus wrote:I have a coffee date with a PD I was paired with for a bar ass'n mentorship program this Friday. What are some good ideas of questions to ask?

What are things that you want to know? Do you want to know how much he/she works? What the worst things about the job are? How to deal with bad clients?


Yeah pretty much. I also wanna ask about the hiring practices of her office, without seeming crass or like I'm begging for a jerb. I just tend to seem so awkward when it comes to "networking"! She works in the civil division of a PD's office.

Also, when would be a good time to start applying for fall internships? May/June?


Ask about how she got into PD work - people love to talk about themselves and it will give you some insight on what you might want to do and how her office works. Also, you're not sure if you want to do DA or PD, right? (I might be confusing you with someone else.). If so, it's a good way for her to tell you why she chose the side she did, and let you know her office's views on student with DA experience. Some don't care, and some won't take on people who have DA experience.

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BlueLotus
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby BlueLotus » Sun Apr 13, 2014 1:26 am

Lawst wrote:
BlueLotus wrote:
gdane wrote:
BlueLotus wrote:I have a coffee date with a PD I was paired with for a bar ass'n mentorship program this Friday. What are some good ideas of questions to ask?

What are things that you want to know? Do you want to know how much he/she works? What the worst things about the job are? How to deal with bad clients?


Yeah pretty much. I also wanna ask about the hiring practices of her office, without seeming crass or like I'm begging for a jerb. I just tend to seem so awkward when it comes to "networking"! She works in the civil division of a PD's office.

Also, when would be a good time to start applying for fall internships? May/June?


Ask about how she got into PD work - people love to talk about themselves and it will give you some insight on what you might want to do and how her office works. Also, you're not sure if you want to do DA or PD, right? (I might be confusing you with someone else.). If so, it's a good way for her to tell you why she chose the side she did, and let you know her office's views on student with DA experience. Some don't care, and some won't take on people who have DA experience.


Thanks! The meeting went well.

Anyone here apply for Bronx Defender's Family Defense Unit?

Anonymous User
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Re: How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Apr 16, 2014 12:44 pm

is anyone here doing an internship at the cook county pd office in Chicago this summer? do you have your start date yet?




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