Tanicius wrote: lmr wrote: kapital98 wrote:
adonai wrote:I always found it interesting that some PD offices allow certified law students argue in court...I'd imagine there would be a crap load of IAC claims later down the line, frivolous or not.
I'm surprised people want to intern more than 1-2 semesters at a PD's office. By that time you should have networked pretty well. You won't have much to gain by continuing to work there.
Regarding the IAC claims, yes but that's pretty much the default argument for every criminal appeal. I externed for an appellate justice and most criminal appeals were either centered on IAC or added it in at the end. By the end of the externship I wanted to do an eye roll every time I saw this argued.
Won't gain much? So doing nearly 50 preliminary hearings and arguing a bunch of motions, interviewing a variety of clients and getting a chance at doing real life trials all before you actually even take the bar isn't gaining much?! Internships aren't just about networking but actually acquiring real life experience. As for IAC claims most of the valid ones stem from private attorney conduct, not public.
It would surprise me quite a bit if there were more IAC claims against private attorneys than public defenders. Not because public defenders are worse -- far towards the opposite, really -- but because most cases are handled by public defenders, and because IAC claims are, as others have already said, pretty much automatic for any criminal appeal.
Proportions of successful
IAC claims are another matter.
yes, as I stated above, valid
IAC claims. PDs have more training, experience and exposure than most private attorneys-they get their clients better deals in less time bc of their familiarity w the court and DAs. lots of these private attorneys are winging it and have no clue what the hell they are doing-they operate as a solo or in a small firm doing shit law level work and most don't answer.
As for IAC claims against interns-that's unlikely. they are under the supervision of an attorney, client signs sheet agreeing. interns aren't doing murders, rapes, child molest cases; we mostly do grand theft, drugs, and crap like that (most of what actually comes through the courts). It's incredibly difficult for a pd to fk up a prelim, as clients get bound over 99% of the time. Arraignments are also impossible to fk up as are change of pleas. Motion arguing depends-most of the time the attorney tells the intern what motion to write and argue so IAC claim is inapplicable. With trials, interns are allowed to do some misdos completely (public drunkness) or in part (dui) and if they get to do a felony trial, they'll be allowed to do an opening statement and cross examine a minor witness, again very difficult to fk up esp under the supervision of an attorney.
I had an interviewer as me if I had done a trial yet, despite all the other crap I had on my resume-I had to go on the offensive and tell her all the stuff I had done and planned to do... i was thinking your office doesn't even let post-bars do trials, why are you grilling me on lack of trial?