Medicine vs. Law - prospects? Forum

[jdhopeful14]

OP, realize that med and law require very different personalities. If you don't have the personality for the profession, you will be miserable in it, and probably unsuccessful.

[2LLLL]

Your prospects for either profession aren't great:

Law -- reduced SA class sizes, clients not paying for junior associates, legal process outsourcing, Conception v. ATT decision

Medicine -- Obamacare, the death of private practices and rise of HMOs, interest accruing on your loans for the entire 1340953 years you're in med school


That being said, medicine has a lot more cachet and prestige than law...

[Noval]

Let's not jump into the classic conclusions and suggest OP to go to Med School right away, both have grim job prospects but at a different angle, it's just that most people here don't know shit about Medicine and have the common misconceptions that it's a free ride to wealth and happiness.

Let's begin with Law:
Pros: - Less school years.
- More opportunities for advancement, compared to Medicine where you get locked up in specific
salaries that rise by a very small amount each year(Even Private Practice isn't great anymore).
- Can move to other fields like Finance or Management Consulting if you know what the hell you are doing.
- No insurers trying to ram your ass every chance they get.
- If you screw up, you can lose your job, but often get a chance to get back up, in Medicine if you screw up, you
get sued, enter probation for a year or two and can lose your license for ever.
- Prestige, like in Medicine, is still present since most people view Law & Med as elitist fields.

Cons: - Shit job prospects unless you come from good schools, while in Med you still have the "100% employment
card" if you hop into Primary Care(Good placement, shit salary) in any Med School.
- Shit opportunities for advancement if you don't come from good schools.
- Working hours will kill you if you don't have the stamina.
- Tuition cost/COL can turn you into a debt machine, which makes the idea of going to Law School stupid
unless you get scholarships.

As you can see, Law is not for the faint of heart, you'll have to work hard to get into a good school and work harder to get
a good job, but in general, smart students who can make it to Top Med Schools can get good jobs out of Top Law Schools, it's a calculated risk.

Let's check Medicine:
Pros: - Slightly more respected than Law, especially if you talk about Specialists.
- Easier to find jobs(Only for Primary Care, ex: Family Med, EM, Pediatry).
- More stable salaries.

Cons: - Insurance reimbursement is becoming a huge problem, so don't think that the 165k/year median salary means
something.
- Medicine is slowly turning into the next Law, as new Med Schools are popping up out of no where, making
admission standards going down and the market even more satured(Especially for Specialists).
- While it's easier to get jobs in Medicine, it's easier to lose them as well, people will yell at you, diss you, and sue
you with no mercy if you're not giving your 110% 24/7.
- Med School is a fucking nightmare and a debt sink just like Law School, and Residency = Worse + Constant
public humiliation with even worse hours.
- Cannot move to Finance or any field other than Research/Teaching, because seriously, who the fuck would hire
an MD to do Banking/Business or Non-Scientifical Consulting ?
- Setting up Private Practice is becoming harder and even more costly, especially for Specialists.
- If you miss the R.O.A.D. Boat in Residency Matching you'll hate your life, unless you were dead set on a Specialty
and got the passion to do it.
- You will not pick up chicks in bars, they hear that every week end.


As you can see here, Med School is not a better option at all, it's changing to a point of no return and unless you can't see yourself doing something else in life, do not go to Med School, same for Law School.

I'll sum it up for the ADD kids here:

The best Lawyer will out earn the best Doctor.
The average Doctor makes more than the average Lawyer.
The average Lawyer is more happy than the average Doctor.
Both professions are changing to the worse and each of you guys will need
persistence and motivation to achieve your professionnal goals.

To OP, here you got the explanation, now you choose.

[cornellbeez]

Let's not jump into the classic conclusions and suggest OP to go to Med School right away, both have grim job prospects but at a different angle, it's just that most people here don't know shit about Medicine and have the common misconceptions that it's a free ride to wealth and happiness.

Let's begin with Law:
Pros: - Less school years.
- More opportunities for advancement, compared to Medicine where you get locked up in specific
salaries that rise by a very small amount each year(Even Private Practice isn't great anymore).
- Can move to other fields like Finance or Management Consulting if you know what the hell you are doing.
- No insurers trying to ram your ass every chance they get.
- If you screw up, you can lose your job, but often get a chance to get back up, in Medicine if you screw up, you
get sued, enter probation for a year or two and can lose your license for ever.
- Prestige, like in Medicine, is still present since most people view Law & Med as elitist fields.

Cons: - Shit job prospects unless you come from good schools, while in Med you still have the "100% employment
card" if you hop into Primary Care(Good placement, shit salary) in any Med School.
- Shit opportunities for advancement if you don't come from good schools.
- Working hours will kill you if you don't have the stamina.
- Tuition cost/COL can turn you into a debt machine, which makes the idea of going to Law School stupid
unless you get scholarships.

As you can see, Law is not for the faint of heart, you'll have to work hard to get into a good school and work harder to get
a good job, but in general, smart students who can make it to Top Med Schools can get good jobs out of Top Law Schools, it's a calculated risk.

Let's check Medicine:
Pros: - Slightly more respected than Law, especially if you talk about Specialists.
- Easier to find jobs(Only for Primary Care, ex: Family Med, EM, Pediatry).
- More stable salaries.

Cons: - Insurance reimbursement is becoming a huge problem, so don't think that the 165k/year median salary means
something.
- Medicine is slowly turning into the next Law, as new Med Schools are popping up out of no where, making
admission standards going down and the market even more satured(Especially for Specialists).
- While it's easier to get jobs in Medicine, it's easier to lose them as well, people will yell at you, diss you, and sue
you with no mercy if you're not giving your 110% 24/7.
- Med School is a fucking nightmare and a debt sink just like Law School, and Residency = Worse + Constant
public humiliation with even worse hours.
- Cannot move to Finance or any field other than Research/Teaching, because seriously, who the fuck would hire
an MD to do Banking/Business or Non-Scientifical Consulting ?
- Setting up Private Practice is becoming harder and even more costly, especially for Specialists.
- If you miss the R.O.A.D. Boat in Residency Matching you'll hate your life, unless you were dead set on a Specialty
and got the passion to do it.
- You will not pick up chicks in bars, they hear that every week end.


As you can see here, Med School is not a better option at all, it's changing to a point of no return and unless you can't see yourself doing something else in life, do not go to Med School, same for Law School.

I'll sum it up for the ADD kids here:

The best Lawyer will out earn the best Doctor.
The average Doctor makes more than the average Lawyer.
The average Lawyer is more happy than the average Doctor.
Both professions are changing to the worse and each of you guys will need
persistence and motivation to achieve your professionnal goals.

To OP, here you got the explanation, now you choose.

So depressing. So what professions in America are blossoming?

And what's up with the Obama care thing? Will it really obliterate doctors' salaries? I've also heard that because of Obama care, that other med professionals (non-MDs) will start taking greater roles in primary care and push the MDs out of the "easy" med jobs. Is this true?

And what do you mean by "shit" salaries in primary care?

[Renzo]

So depressing. So what professions in America are blossoming?

And what's up with the Obama care thing? Will it really obliterate doctors' salaries? I've also heard that because of Obama care, that other med professionals (non-MDs) will start taking greater roles in primary care and push the MDs out of the "easy" med jobs. Is this true?

Actuary, compensation consultant, dental hygenist, pharmacist.

As for Obamacare, it does basically nothing to make healthcare cost less, and among other things it doesn't do, it doesn't at all change the way doctors are paid.

[ResolutePear]

Let's not jump into the classic conclusions and suggest OP to go to Med School right away, both have grim job prospects but at a different angle, it's just that most people here don't know shit about Medicine and have the common misconceptions that it's a free ride to wealth and happiness.

Let's begin with Law:
Pros: - Less school years.
- More opportunities for advancement, compared to Medicine where you get locked up in specific
salaries that rise by a very small amount each year(Even Private Practice isn't great anymore).
- Can move to other fields like Finance or Management Consulting if you know what the hell you are doing.
- No insurers trying to ram your ass every chance they get.
- If you screw up, you can lose your job, but often get a chance to get back up, in Medicine if you screw up, you
get sued, enter probation for a year or two and can lose your license for ever.
- Prestige, like in Medicine, is still present since most people view Law & Med as elitist fields.

Cons: - Shit job prospects unless you come from good schools, while in Med you still have the "100% employment
card" if you hop into Primary Care(Good placement, shit salary) in any Med School.
- Shit opportunities for advancement if you don't come from good schools.
- Working hours will kill you if you don't have the stamina.
- Tuition cost/COL can turn you into a debt machine, which makes the idea of going to Law School stupid
unless you get scholarships.

As you can see, Law is not for the faint of heart, you'll have to work hard to get into a good school and work harder to get
a good job, but in general, smart students who can make it to Top Med Schools can get good jobs out of Top Law Schools, it's a calculated risk.

Let's check Medicine:
Pros: - Slightly more respected than Law, especially if you talk about Specialists.
- Easier to find jobs(Only for Primary Care, ex: Family Med, EM, Pediatry).
- More stable salaries.

Cons: - Insurance reimbursement is becoming a huge problem, so don't think that the 165k/year median salary means
something.
- Medicine is slowly turning into the next Law, as new Med Schools are popping up out of no where, making
admission standards going down and the market even more satured(Especially for Specialists).
- While it's easier to get jobs in Medicine, it's easier to lose them as well, people will yell at you, diss you, and sue
you with no mercy if you're not giving your 110% 24/7.
- Med School is a fucking nightmare and a debt sink just like Law School, and Residency = Worse + Constant
public humiliation with even worse hours.
- Cannot move to Finance or any field other than Research/Teaching, because seriously, who the fuck would hire
an MD to do Banking/Business or Non-Scientifical Consulting ?
- Setting up Private Practice is becoming harder and even more costly, especially for Specialists.
- If you miss the R.O.A.D. Boat in Residency Matching you'll hate your life, unless you were dead set on a Specialty
and got the passion to do it.
- You will not pick up chicks in bars, they hear that every week end.


As you can see here, Med School is not a better option at all, it's changing to a point of no return and unless you can't see yourself doing something else in life, do not go to Med School, same for Law School.

I'll sum it up for the ADD kids here:

The best Lawyer will out earn the best Doctor.
The average Doctor makes more than the average Lawyer.
The average Lawyer is more happy than the average Doctor.
Both professions are changing to the worse and each of you guys will need
persistence and motivation to achieve your professionnal goals.

To OP, here you got the explanation, now you choose.

So depressing. So what professions in America are blossoming?

And what's up with the Obama care thing? Will it really obliterate doctors' salaries? I've also heard that because of Obama care, that other med professionals (non-MDs) will start taking greater roles in primary care and push the MDs out of the "easy" med jobs. Is this true?

America is stagnant in terms of professions imo.

National security is the hot item now, imo. Education might be, depending on changes to school policy.

[ResolutePear]

So depressing. So what professions in America are blossoming?

And what's up with the Obama care thing? Will it really obliterate doctors' salaries? I've also heard that because of Obama care, that other med professionals (non-MDs) will start taking greater roles in primary care and push the MDs out of the "easy" med jobs. Is this true?

Actuary, compensation consultant, dental hygenist, pharmacist.

As for Obamacare, it does basically nothing to make healthcare cost less, and among other things it doesn't do, it doesn't at all change the way doctors are paid.

Actuarial science is such a bitch though.

[Renzo]

So depressing. So what professions in America are blossoming?

And what's up with the Obama care thing? Will it really obliterate doctors' salaries? I've also heard that because of Obama care, that other med professionals (non-MDs) will start taking greater roles in primary care and push the MDs out of the "easy" med jobs. Is this true?

Actuary, compensation consultant, dental hygenist, pharmacist.

As for Obamacare, it does basically nothing to make healthcare cost less, and among other things it doesn't do, it doesn't at all change the way doctors are paid.

Actuarial science is such a bitch though.

Fuck yeah it is. That's why it's a good job.

[ResolutePear]

So depressing. So what professions in America are blossoming?

And what's up with the Obama care thing? Will it really obliterate doctors' salaries? I've also heard that because of Obama care, that other med professionals (non-MDs) will start taking greater roles in primary care and push the MDs out of the "easy" med jobs. Is this true?

Actuary, compensation consultant, dental hygenist, pharmacist.

As for Obamacare, it does basically nothing to make healthcare cost less, and among other things it doesn't do, it doesn't at all change the way doctors are paid.

Actuarial science is such a bitch though.

Fuck yeah it is. That's why it's a good job.

If I were to take the route, it'd be for the ability to get into a top-5 MFE program. Either way, competition is fierce.

[TUP]

- If you miss the R.O.A.D. Boat in Residency Matching you'll hate your life, unless you were dead set on a Specialty

+1 to your entire post, but this is what would scare the hell out of me most as a med student.

[eth3n]

!

[Noval]

- If you miss the R.O.A.D. Boat in Residency Matching you'll hate your life, unless you were dead set on a Specialty

+1 to your entire post, but this is what would scare the hell out of me most as a med student.

That would scare the shit out of me as well, but hey, there's no such thing as "Job security" anymore.

The only Healthcare jobs i would take are either Pharmacy or Clinical Psychology(Only if coming from a funded program with secured top choice internship).

To the dude asking about salaries, Primary Care salaries are shit because insurers do everything to eat your paycheck, add the horrible salary yearly progression, the debt and the hours worked and you'll find yourself even more exploited than a BigLaw attorney doing research in a dungeon 80 hours a week.

[DoubleChecks]

No one who can actually get into medical school would go to law school.

lies, i would probably still choose law school over medical school lol -- it is a profession that is arguably more stressful with a much more hellish grad school period

[DoubleChecks]

- If you miss the R.O.A.D. Boat in Residency Matching you'll hate your life, unless you were dead set on a Specialty

+1 to your entire post, but this is what would scare the hell out of me most as a med student.

That would scare the shit out of me as well, but hey, there's no such thing as "Job security" anymore.

The only Healthcare jobs i would take are either Pharmacy or Clinical Psychology(Only if coming from a funded program with secured top choice internship).

To the dude asking about salaries, Primary Care salaries are shit because insurers do everything to eat your paycheck, add the horrible salary yearly progression, the debt and the hours worked and you'll find yourself even more exploited than a BigLaw attorney doing research in a dungeon 80 hours a week.

interesting you say that -- my pharm friends are telling me that pharm isnt the place to be anymore due to markets getting oversaturated as new pharm schools keep popping up like law schools did

[Renzo]

interesting you say that -- my pharm friends are telling me that pharm isnt the place to be anymore due to markets getting oversaturated as new pharm schools keep popping up like law schools did

Those clowns are always bitching about something. Next they'll tell you how hard it is to work a retail pharmacy for six figures--never mind that they are doing the same job as the cashier in the photo lab, but for 100x more pay.

[Noval]

- If you miss the R.O.A.D. Boat in Residency Matching you'll hate your life, unless you were dead set on a Specialty

+1 to your entire post, but this is what would scare the hell out of me most as a med student.

That would scare the shit out of me as well, but hey, there's no such thing as "Job security" anymore.

The only Healthcare jobs i would take are either Pharmacy or Clinical Psychology(Only if coming from a funded program with secured top choice internship).

To the dude asking about salaries, Primary Care salaries are shit because insurers do everything to eat your paycheck, add the horrible salary yearly progression, the debt and the hours worked and you'll find yourself even more exploited than a BigLaw attorney doing research in a dungeon 80 hours a week.

interesting you say that -- my pharm friends are telling me that pharm isnt the place to be anymore due to markets getting oversaturated as new pharm schools keep popping up like law schools did

Pharm jobs grow at a faster rate since retails are everywhere.

[ResolutePear]

+1 to your entire post, but this is what would scare the hell out of me most as a med student.

That would scare the shit out of me as well, but hey, there's no such thing as "Job security" anymore.

The only Healthcare jobs i would take are either Pharmacy or Clinical Psychology(Only if coming from a funded program with secured top choice internship).

To the dude asking about salaries, Primary Care salaries are shit because insurers do everything to eat your paycheck, add the horrible salary yearly progression, the debt and the hours worked and you'll find yourself even more exploited than a BigLaw attorney doing research in a dungeon 80 hours a week.

interesting you say that -- my pharm friends are telling me that pharm isnt the place to be anymore due to markets getting oversaturated as new pharm schools keep popping up like law schools did

Pharm jobs grow at a faster rate since retails are everywhere.

Salary will end up getting slammed by it, though.

[Verity]

JD/MD?


Look, do what you find more interesting. Neither one is harder than the other to study, but lawyers generally have a much more stable schedule, even if this stability is offset by poorer job security. Medical school, by the way, isn't necessarily harder to get into than law school (you can go to med school in the Caribbean for half the price, it's easier to get in, and you can practice in the U.S. no problem). But you can go to basically any med school and still be a doctor; this isn't quite true for lawyers if you went to a TTT and can't find a job.

[cornellbeez]

JD/MD?


Look, do what you find more interesting. Neither one is harder than the other to study, but lawyers generally have a much more stable schedule, even if this stability is offset by poorer job security. Medical school, by the way, isn't necessarily harder to get into than law school (you can go to med school in the Caribbean for half the price, it's easier to get in, and you can practice in the U.S. no problem). But you can go to basically any med school and still be a doctor; this isn't quite true for lawyers if you went to a TTT and can't find a job.

Yeah, you can get into lower tiered med schools with a 26-28 MCAT (I know people who have done this) and a 3.5 GPA because med schools actually care about ECs. But Caribbean med schools don't offer the best residency placements. I think your boards matter the most though, for placement.

I'd say it's harder getting into a good law school than low-tiered med school if you are a bad test taker. (It's really not that hard getting a good GPA in the few pre-med reqs from a not-so-competitive school, and you can ramp up your resume with ECs.)

But you are more or less ensured a job, even if it is somewhat shitty and low paying, out of med school. And med schools don't fail anyone - you can retake classes, although that wouldn't look good for residency placement.

[Anonymous User]

- If you miss the R.O.A.D. Boat in Residency Matching you'll hate your life, unless you were dead set on a Specialty

+1 to your entire post, but this is what would scare the hell out of me most as a med student.

That would scare the shit out of me as well, but hey, there's no such thing as "Job security" anymore.

The only Healthcare jobs i would take are either Pharmacy or Clinical Psychology(Only if coming from a funded program with secured top choice internship).

To the dude asking about salaries, Primary Care salaries are shit because insurers do everything to eat your paycheck, add the horrible salary yearly progression, the debt and the hours worked and you'll find yourself even more exploited than a BigLaw attorney doing research in a dungeon 80 hours a week.

How do you get a fully funded pharm program? The only people I know doing pharm are paying sticker. And that's the first time I've heard about clinical psychology being in great demand, hmm.

[The Insider]

My biggest concern is the kind of work you do..so for example, I hear horror stories and Partners debilitating you in BigLaw, which is what is keeping me from consider law school to its fullest. I'm not saying medical practice is any easier as residency is torture too; but wouldn't one argue that as a physician/specialist you can find more meaning in your work in helping others versus BigLaw? I'm just trying to objectively assess here, that is all.

And +1 in asking a fully funded program to any med program, anyone know anything about this?

[Anonymous User]

My biggest concern is the kind of work you do..so for example, I hear horror stories and Partners debilitating you in BigLaw, which is what is keeping me from consider law school to its fullest. I'm not saying medical practice is any easier as residency is torture too; but wouldn't one argue that as a physician/specialist you can find more meaning in your work in helping others versus BigLaw? I'm just trying to objectively assess here, that is all.

And +1 in asking a fully funded program to any med program, anyone know anything about this?

I don't think I'd find meaning in my work because I'm helping people, to be honest, but I probably would find some med work more interesting than pushing papers all day because there are different scenarios to deal with in med whereas in biglaw you are often doing the same thing over and over again. It's up to your personality type. I think for certain med specialties (surgery, anesthesiology), I don't think I'd be able to handle the stress of having someone potentially die on me/being faced with malpractice lawsuits on a daily basis. I think that type of stress would be even greater than the stress associated with working in biglaw. But something like primary care seems less stressful, and it seems like a lot of primary care physicians don't really know what's going on anyway (just based off my own docs) and have to do research with each patient. However, I guess, according to the other poster, the hours and pay are bad and I think primary docs are the ones getting screwed over in the med profession in the near future. Some other specializations (dermatology) that I would find interesting are EXTREMELY competitive to get.

Outside of biglaw, there is interesting legal work, depending on your interests. However, getting that type of work often requires paying your dues first at a large firm, and then lateraling to a smaller firm/gov/in-house.

[vamedic03]

My biggest concern is the kind of work you do..so for example, I hear horror stories and Partners debilitating you in BigLaw, which is what is keeping me from consider law school to its fullest. I'm not saying medical practice is any easier as residency is torture too; but wouldn't one argue that as a physician/specialist you can find more meaning in your work in helping others versus BigLaw? I'm just trying to objectively assess here, that is all.

And +1 in asking a fully funded program to any med program, anyone know anything about this?

(1) Having witnesses many horrendous attending/resident relationships, I can't imagine that many partners could be much worse.

(2) I'm not sure that most physicians find some sort of transcendental meaning in their work. For anyone in medicine, most of the work is routine and it's about volume - either patients (if primary care) or procedures.

(3) Having known many healthcare professionals and knowing a fair number of attorneys, the only general group I know that has a higher level of satisfaction/meaning is prosecutors/public defenders.

[JamMasterJ]

No one who can actually get into medical school would go to law school.

One of the biggest myths in the world is that it is incredibly hard to get into med school and that everyone who gets in is crazy smart. In reality, the thing with science is that to get good grades you have to put in a relatively large amount of time compared to other majors. Many college students are not willing to this so what you end up with is a lot of lazy 2.8-3.0 students applying to med schools because they are "pre-med". Fact of the matter is that cell bio, genetics, organic chem and the like dont really require some amazing intellectual capacity as much as they do just brute time/work. A 3.5+, research position with a prof, and decent MCAT score and you have a decent enough chance of getting into med school (top med schools are a whole diff ball game of course, those guys are incredible).

Source: was on the pre-med(non-science major) path before scoring 175+ on the LSAT.

There is NOTHING in the 1L curriculum that even moderately approaches the complexity of even General Chemistry. Let alone the conceptual difficulty of the later pre med classes like Cell biology, Organic Chemistry, or Physics. The reason law school is "hard" isn't because of the material. It's because of the forced curve. In fact, I think that one of the reasons law schools instituted the idea of a forced curve (if you noticed no other discipline does it) is partially due to that fact. Torts is down right simplistic. If law schools cut out the forced curve people's GPAs would skyrocket. They don't even have forced curves in many of these premed classes, and yet people still routinely get crap grades in them. Science teachers often "curve up" so that entire classes don't fail.

I had a 2.7 gpa during a semester as a Bio major because of gen chem and zoology. In two years as a poly sci major, my gpa was like a 3.8.

[JamMasterJ]

go to medical school for the love of god

Paulina, I have thought your 'tar was awesome for like a week, and this post makes it even more hilarious