Market on the upswing? Forum
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Market on the upswing?
I know some poeple on here are pessimistic about the condition of the legal market, but it sounds like some people think summer hiring has returned to pre recession levels and the market has atleast troughed. This is obviously not true for all markets but I think certain regions like the conditions in the northeast are improving and will continue to improve as the recovery continues.
- Mce252
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Re: Market on the upswing?
The recession was a myth. Anyone who says they had a hard time getting a job - even out of TTTT schools - just isn't working hard enough.
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Re: Market on the upswing?
Whoops!Anonymous User wrote:The recession was a myth. Anyone who says they had a hard time getting a job - even out of TTTT schools - just isn't working hard enough.
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Re: Market on the upswing?
Im not sure if that is truly the case. (Almost) anyone who is competent enough to go to law school and graduate can find a job flipping burgers or another job where they are unemployed. Based on pure statistical data it is easy to say that the legal market was impacted greatly
edit: under employed
edit: under employed
- Mce252
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Re: Market on the upswing?
Anonymous User wrote:The recession was a myth. Anyone who says they had a hard time getting a job - even out of TTTT schools - just isn't working hard enough.
You're right. I've even met people that graduated from the University of Phoenix and had a job immediately at 60K to 80K. You'll be fine.
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- Stonewall
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Re: Market on the upswing?
"everything is better. everything will be ok. jobs are plentiful. i don't have to study."
repeat/follow this every morning to make a high class rank for me that much easier
repeat/follow this every morning to make a high class rank for me that much easier
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Re: Market on the upswing?
@Stonewall: That was not at all the intended purpose of this post.
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Re: Market on the upswing?
No. There's little upswing, and it's DEFINITELY not to "pre-recession levels."droges wrote:I know some poeple on here are pessimistic about the condition of the legal market, but it sounds like some people think summer hiring has returned to pre recession levels and the market has atleast troughed. This is obviously not true for all markets but I think certain regions like the conditions in the northeast are improving and will continue to improve as the recovery continues.
- Hannibal
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Re: Market on the upswing?
Actually a few firms did announce that they returned to pre-recession levels for this past OCI. The problem is that it isn't for every firm so the total effect is a small upswing.blsingindisguise wrote:No. There's little upswing, and it's DEFINITELY not to "pre-recession levels."droges wrote:I know some poeple on here are pessimistic about the condition of the legal market, but it sounds like some people think summer hiring has returned to pre recession levels and the market has atleast troughed. This is obviously not true for all markets but I think certain regions like the conditions in the northeast are improving and will continue to improve as the recovery continues.
- Cavalier
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Re: Market on the upswing?
Things do seem to be improving, but legal hiring is not (and may not ever be) at "pre recession levels."
- Big Shrimpin
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Re: Market on the upswing?
pls pls pls pls...dood wrote:NY to 190K
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Re: Market on the upswing?
For Tier 1 firms, the market is booming. For Tier 2 firms, the market is tougher because clients are demanding lower rates. For Tier 3 firms, the situation is even worse.
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- lisjjen
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Re: Market on the upswing?
And thus the bimodal income structure becomes further entrenched. Where is Karl Marx when you need him?Anonymous User wrote:For Tier 1 firms, the market is booming. For Tier 2 firms, the market is tougher because clients are demanding lower rates. For Tier 3 firms, the situation is even worse.
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Re: Market on the upswing?
If anything, that's not the case. The fact that clients in the Tier 2/Tier 3 range are more cost-sensitive implies the creation of another salary bump (say, $145k).And thus the bimodal income structure becomes further entrenched. Where is Karl Marx when you need him?
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Re: Market on the upswing?
Yes, new bleak economic reality = tons of $145K jobs for new grads, in the magical world where things happen because I want them to.Anonymous User wrote:If anything, that's not the case. The fact that clients in the Tier 2/Tier 3 range are more cost-sensitive implies the creation of another salary bump (say, $145k).And thus the bimodal income structure becomes further entrenched. Where is Karl Marx when you need him?
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Re: Market on the upswing?
There is an actual upswing in the recruiting world
Document review for all!
Document review for all!
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Re: Market on the upswing?
I never said this. The reality here is that firms that used to be able to pay at the top of the market no longer can. This factor is combined with the general reluctance of clients to pay for junior associates at tier 2/3 firms.Yes, new bleak economic reality = tons of $145K jobs for new grads, in the magical world where things happen because I want them to.
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Re: Market on the upswing?
But the creation of this new salary will undoubtedly come from existing $160k firms that cannot continue to pay their associates at the $160k rate. Yes, there may be less of a bimodal structure, but it will be at the expense of current $160k group.Anonymous User wrote:If anything, that's not the case. The fact that clients in the Tier 2/Tier 3 range are more cost-sensitive implies the creation of another salary bump (say, $145k).
- AreJay711
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Re: Market on the upswing?
I misread this but I'll post anyway. I agree that things may not ever return to pre-recession levels (because firms got burned a bit) but they will improve. The question is will it improve in time for most people on this board to have good prospects.Cavalier wrote:Things do seem to be improving, but legal hiring is not (and may not ever be) at "pre recession levels."
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Re: Market on the upswing?
This is not inconsistent with what I said above.Anonymous User wrote:But the creation of this new salary will undoubtedly come from existing $160k firms that cannot continue to pay their associates at the $160k rate. Yes, there may be less of a bimodal structure, but it will be at the expense of current $160k group.Anonymous User wrote:If anything, that's not the case. The fact that clients in the Tier 2/Tier 3 range are more cost-sensitive implies the creation of another salary bump (say, $145k).
It's not about the market improving. It's about what clients want. The demand for entry-level attorneys is permanently lowered.AreJay711 wrote:I misread this but I'll post anyway. I agree that things may not ever return to pre-recession levels (because firms got burned a bit) but they will improve. The question is will it improve in time for most people on this board to have good prospects.Cavalier wrote:Things do seem to be improving, but legal hiring is not (and may not ever be) at "pre recession levels."
- AreJay711
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Re: Market on the upswing?
Is it really? Why is that? I don't know why that would be the case but I'm no expert on the legal market.Anonymous User wrote:It's not about the market improving. It's about what clients want. The demand for entry-level attorneys is permanently lowered.AreJay711 wrote:I misread this but I'll post anyway. I agree that things may not ever return to pre-recession levels (because firms got burned a bit) but they will improve. The question is will it improve in time for most people on this board to have good prospects.Cavalier wrote:Things do seem to be improving, but legal hiring is not (and may not ever be) at "pre recession levels."
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Re: Market on the upswing?
Outsourcing, staff attorneys, and a general reluctance from clients to pay junior associate rates for middling work product.Is it really? Why is that? I don't know why that would be the case but I'm no expert on the legal market.
- romothesavior
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Re: Market on the upswing?
I don't disagree. But I also think it is a bit exaggerated. Permanently lowered? Probably. But things will still be a lot better than they are now at some point in the future. When firms hit a point where they need extra bodies or find that they have a gap in their hiring model, they'll hire more. I've already heard from a number of people in hiring that they expect to see increased hiring this fall, and we've heard reports from some of the megafirms that they plan to hire more as well. I don't expect this fall's OCI to be leaps and bounds better, but it is still better than nothing.Anonymous User wrote:Outsourcing, staff attorneys, and a general reluctance from clients to pay junior associate rates for middling work product.Is it really? Why is that? I don't know why that would be the case but I'm no expert on the legal market.
Will it ever be like it was 5 years ago? No. Are there still waaaay more jobs than there are grads? Absolutely yes. But I do think things will still be a bit better in the near future.
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