What are t-20-30 grads doing?

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Re: What are t-20-30 grads doing?

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Feb 19, 2011 5:28 pm

From my prospective it's a real crapshoot at my t20-30. There doesn't seem to be much outside of the public sector and BigLaw. Jobs are sparse but kids in the top 15% seem well off and the 30-50 percentiles are on an even playing field with spotty employment. How I (2L top 35-40 percentile) got a v100 SA is still a mystery.

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MrKappus
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Re: What are t-20-30 grads doing?

Postby MrKappus » Sat Feb 19, 2011 5:31 pm

Anonymous User wrote:How I (2L top 35-40 percentile) got a v100 SA is still a mystery.


You're top 60-65% and have a Vault SA? Somebody up there loves you.

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Re: What are t-20-30 grads doing?

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Feb 19, 2011 5:35 pm

DeeCee wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Back on topic...

Here's the thing. If you're going to a t20-30, you need 1 or 2 of the following:

(a) kick ass grades
(b) 50%+ tuition paid, by the school, a trust fund, a rich aunt, savings from a job
(c) resignation to shitlaw/PD + IBR slavery

(a) is probably preferable, because from a t20-30 if you kick ass you can still get a great job. But it's nearly impossible to predict. (b) is really the only one you can know in advance.

I go to a t20-30, came in with a 50% scholarship, and have kicked serious ass so far (top 5%). I always thought I would do well, but maybe I just got lucky? Who the hell really knows. Moral of the story: unless you have (b) or (c), counting on (a) is a serious gamble at a t20-30.


What about great in-state tuition that will not put you in 200k debt? This is why I am considering a T28, otherwise I'd probably resign myself to my T14 waiting lists.
Anon from above here. First, "T28" LOL

The level of debt you're comfortable with is a personal thing, really. Obviously in-state is a much different calculus than private. Point is, if you're taking on six figures of debt, you basically HAVE to have biglaw in order to service that debt, and from a t20-30, biglaw is a huge gamble. If you're taking on an amount of debt where you don't NEED biglaw to survive (i.e. $50k or so), it's a totally different animal, in my opinion.

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DeeCee
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Re: What are t-20-30 grads doing?

Postby DeeCee » Sat Feb 19, 2011 5:45 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
DeeCee wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Back on topic...

Here's the thing. If you're going to a t20-30, you need 1 or 2 of the following:

(a) kick ass grades
(b) 50%+ tuition paid, by the school, a trust fund, a rich aunt, savings from a job
(c) resignation to shitlaw/PD + IBR slavery

(a) is probably preferable, because from a t20-30 if you kick ass you can still get a great job. But it's nearly impossible to predict. (b) is really the only one you can know in advance.

I go to a t20-30, came in with a 50% scholarship, and have kicked serious ass so far (top 5%). I always thought I would do well, but maybe I just got lucky? Who the hell really knows. Moral of the story: unless you have (b) or (c), counting on (a) is a serious gamble at a t20-30.


What about great in-state tuition that will not put you in 200k debt? This is why I am considering a T28, otherwise I'd probably resign myself to my T14 waiting lists.
Anon from above here. First, "T28" LOL

The level of debt you're comfortable with is a personal thing, really. Obviously in-state is a much different calculus than private. Point is, if you're taking on six figures of debt, you basically HAVE to have biglaw in order to service that debt, and from a t20-30, biglaw is a huge gamble. If you're taking on an amount of debt where you don't NEED biglaw to survive (i.e. $50k or so), it's a totally different animal, in my opinion.


Yeah T28, guess I should have addressed it #28 but I think there's about 5 #28's and you get what I'm saying. The only reason I say this is because I'm looking at 17k tuition plus possible scholarship in a low COL area, versus 45k sticker and higher COL at numerous T14's (if I got off the WLs). And I never want to do biglaw, I want to do PI, so I feel like it's kind of a crapshoot for me either way. And I'm pretty uncomfortable with high debt, too.

Hopefully I didn't bring this too off-topic, but I'm just assessing my options by reading this thread.

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Re: What are t-20-30 grads doing?

Postby sullidop » Sat Feb 19, 2011 5:50 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
DeeCee wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Back on topic...

Here's the thing. If you're going to a t20-30, you need 1 or 2 of the following:

(a) kick ass grades
(b) 50%+ tuition paid, by the school, a trust fund, a rich aunt, savings from a job
(c) resignation to shitlaw/PD + IBR slavery

(a) is probably preferable, because from a t20-30 if you kick ass you can still get a great job. But it's nearly impossible to predict. (b) is really the only one you can know in advance.

I go to a t20-30, came in with a 50% scholarship, and have kicked serious ass so far (top 5%). I always thought I would do well, but maybe I just got lucky? Who the hell really knows. Moral of the story: unless you have (b) or (c), counting on (a) is a serious gamble at a t20-30.


What about great in-state tuition that will not put you in 200k debt? This is why I am considering a T28, otherwise I'd probably resign myself to my T14 waiting lists.
Anon from above here. First, "T28" LOL

The level of debt you're comfortable with is a personal thing, really. Obviously in-state is a much different calculus than private. Point is, if you're taking on six figures of debt, you basically HAVE to have biglaw in order to service that debt, and from a t20-30, biglaw is a huge gamble. If you're taking on an amount of debt where you don't NEED biglaw to survive (i.e. $50k or so), it's a totally different animal, in my opinion.


I'm divided on this issue. With the income-based repayment option, debt is no longer the issue that it once was (esp if you're going into the public sector and can have all federal debt waived after 10 years of service...I actually know kids doing this and, as a result, are taking out the maximum loan possible).
The question then becomes how long you're willing to drag it around with you. Personally, I want mine to be gone in 5 years. But that's just my debt-hating self.
However, if you're cool with spending 15% of your discretionary income on loans each month for the next 25 years, then it doesn't matter how much you take out.

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Re: What are t-20-30 grads doing?

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Feb 19, 2011 5:50 pm

DeeCee wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
DeeCee wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Back on topic...

Here's the thing. If you're going to a t20-30, you need 1 or 2 of the following:

(a) kick ass grades
(b) 50%+ tuition paid, by the school, a trust fund, a rich aunt, savings from a job
(c) resignation to shitlaw/PD + IBR slavery

(a) is probably preferable, because from a t20-30 if you kick ass you can still get a great job. But it's nearly impossible to predict. (b) is really the only one you can know in advance.

I go to a t20-30, came in with a 50% scholarship, and have kicked serious ass so far (top 5%). I always thought I would do well, but maybe I just got lucky? Who the hell really knows. Moral of the story: unless you have (b) or (c), counting on (a) is a serious gamble at a t20-30.


What about great in-state tuition that will not put you in 200k debt? This is why I am considering a T28, otherwise I'd probably resign myself to my T14 waiting lists.
Anon from above here. First, "T28" LOL

The level of debt you're comfortable with is a personal thing, really. Obviously in-state is a much different calculus than private. Point is, if you're taking on six figures of debt, you basically HAVE to have biglaw in order to service that debt, and from a t20-30, biglaw is a huge gamble. If you're taking on an amount of debt where you don't NEED biglaw to survive (i.e. $50k or so), it's a totally different animal, in my opinion.


Yeah T28, guess I should have addressed it #28 but I think there's about 5 #28's and you get what I'm saying. The only reason I say this is because I'm looking at 17k tuition plus possible scholarship in a low COL area, versus 45k sticker and higher COL at numerous T14's (if I got off the WLs). And I never want to do biglaw, I want to do PI, so I feel like it's kind of a crapshoot for me either way. And I'm pretty uncomfortable with high debt, too.

Hopefully I didn't bring this too off-topic, but I'm just assessing my options by reading this thread.

If the #28 is in the geographic area you want to work, I'd probably go for that one. But I'm debt averse. And if you're looking for prestigious PI (ACLU, DOJ, etc) you may be better off eating sticker at a T14 (but not a lower one) and suffering through IBR for 10 years

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DeeCee
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Re: What are t-20-30 grads doing?

Postby DeeCee » Sat Feb 19, 2011 5:54 pm

Anonymous User wrote:If the #28 is in the geographic area you want to work, I'd probably go for that one. But I'm debt averse. And if you're looking for prestigious PI (ACLU, DOJ, etc) you may be better off eating sticker at a T14 (but not a lower one) and suffering through IBR for 10 years


Yeah, I'm looking at a UNC acceptance (which is a preferred geographical area for me, I want to work from NC northward) versus UVA or Penn WL. I'm also withdrawing off of some other T14 WLs because I'm not that interested in those schools.

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HarlandBassett
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Re: What are t-20-30 grads doing?

Postby HarlandBassett » Sun Feb 20, 2011 3:22 am

MrAnon wrote:Nobody in the bottom half of your class will find a 50K job coming out. Funny how students seem to dream salaries like 35k and 40k into 55K jobs. If you wanted a 55K job next year then you should have started as a paralegal 3 years ago instead of going to law school.

i know a 24y.o mechanic who makes 78k in NYC (i just did his tax return.)

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Re: What are t-20-30 grads doing?

Postby fatduck » Sun Feb 20, 2011 3:23 am

HarlandBassett wrote:
MrAnon wrote:Nobody in the bottom half of your class will find a 50K job coming out. Funny how students seem to dream salaries like 35k and 40k into 55K jobs. If you wanted a 55K job next year then you should have started as a paralegal 3 years ago instead of going to law school.

i know a 24y.o mechanic who makes 78k in NYC (i just did his tax return.)


he probably went to HYS though

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A'nold
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Re: What are t-20-30 grads doing?

Postby A'nold » Sun Feb 20, 2011 3:34 am

fatduck wrote:
HarlandBassett wrote:
MrAnon wrote:Nobody in the bottom half of your class will find a 50K job coming out. Funny how students seem to dream salaries like 35k and 40k into 55K jobs. If you wanted a 55K job next year then you should have started as a paralegal 3 years ago instead of going to law school.

i know a 24y.o mechanic who makes 78k in NYC (i just did his tax return.)


he probably went to HYS though

Mechanic is the "Y" of the HYS (H-Vac tech) and (Sewage pumper) JDU trifecta.

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HarlandBassett
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Re: What are t-20-30 grads doing?

Postby HarlandBassett » Sun Feb 20, 2011 5:48 am

fatduck wrote:
HarlandBassett wrote:
MrAnon wrote:Nobody in the bottom half of your class will find a 50K job coming out. Funny how students seem to dream salaries like 35k and 40k into 55K jobs. If you wanted a 55K job next year then you should have started as a paralegal 3 years ago instead of going to law school.

i know a 24y.o mechanic who makes 78k in NYC (i just did his tax return.)


he probably went to HYS though

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Re: What are t-20-30 grads doing?

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Feb 21, 2011 12:40 am

well this is depressing, I hope to be 1 in my class. But if I were to be median, maybe I would buck up, assure myself that I can get myself into the top third by 3L. But man, if I was worse than median, I would probably flee to amsterdam for the summer and reevaluate everything. Maybe I'd stay, or comeback start looking for nurses, because I figure an ambulance chaser has a good head start if your girl is handing out business cards. Or lift weights, reacquaint myself with romantic literature, look into childcare and find myself a doctor to settle down with. Or an heiress. That would be better. And I hear a lot of the time, a law student fares better with women before he graduates. I suck at cleaning, though.

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Re: What are t-20-30 grads doing?

Postby fatduck » Mon Feb 21, 2011 12:42 am

Anonymous User wrote:well this is depressing, I hope to be 1 in my class. But if I were to be median, maybe I would buck up, assure myself that I can get myself into the top third by 3L. But man, if I was worse than median, I would probably flee to amsterdam for the summer and reevaluate everything. Maybe I'd stay, or comeback start looking for nurses, because I figure an ambulance chaser has a good head start if your girl is handing out business cards. Or lift weights, reacquaint myself with romantic literature, look into childcare and find myself a doctor to settle down with. Or an heiress. That would be better. And I hear a lot of the time, a law student fares better with women before he graduates. I suck at cleaning, though.


you should try harder with your next post. you are not trying hard enough.

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Re: What are t-20-30 grads doing?

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Feb 21, 2011 12:47 am

sir, yes, sir!

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Re: What are t-20-30 grads doing?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Apr 13, 2011 11:13 pm

SBL wrote:Bro, you keep asking, and people keep telling you: There is NO. WAY. that you will be making $55,000 coming out of the bottom-25% unless you find a job that is in another industry. Seriously.


This is a ridiculous opinion. I could rattle of so many ways to get a $55k legal job being in bottom 25% of your class at a T-30 that it'd make your head spin. Of course, a lot of that depends on your experiences in law school and your ability to interview and network.

I would agree that it will be DIFFICULT, but certainly not impossible. I know people who finished bottom half at TTT's and got $70k per year jobs. They generally had good summer experience and interview skills. A lot of firms that are not biglaw don't care much about GPA's compared to whether they like you or not.




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