Unpaid Biglaw Internship Abroad

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Anonymous User
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Unpaid Biglaw Internship Abroad

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Jan 08, 2011 7:52 am

I have a family friend who's a senior-level associate at a V20 firm in Asia. We don't have a relationship where I could ask him this sort of question, so my question to you guys is: is it worth it? I'm a HYS 1L - I have three 2 USAO offers open until the end of the month (in top-level branches) as well as an SEC gig on the East Coast that I'm probably going to turn down soon. My ultimate goal is to do biglaw (and I dont really care about the whole concern about doing a 1L firm gig and then having more limited options down the line), so if this would help, I'll take it. What do you guys think? Thanks.

Sup Kid
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Re: Unpaid Biglaw Internship Abroad

Postby Sup Kid » Sat Jan 08, 2011 2:13 pm

A V20 firm is paying nothing?? Not even your plane ticket? I can't see how that's worth it -- sure, a Biglaw item on your resume looks good during OCI, but so does the USAO (esp if you are in a big office like NY, DC, or LA), and I don't think having one over the other will change anything. Remember, it's ALL ABOUT THE GRADES

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vamedic03
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Re: Unpaid Biglaw Internship Abroad

Postby vamedic03 » Sat Jan 08, 2011 3:14 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I have a family friend who's a senior-level associate at a V20 firm in Asia. We don't have a relationship where I could ask him this sort of question, so my question to you guys is: is it worth it? I'm a HYS 1L - I have three 2 USAO offers open until the end of the month (in top-level branches) as well as an SEC gig on the East Coast that I'm probably going to turn down soon. My ultimate goal is to do biglaw (and I dont really care about the whole concern about doing a 1L firm gig and then having more limited options down the line), so if this would help, I'll take it. What do you guys think? Thanks.


SEC, USAO, etc. are just as good if not better than an UNPAID V20 internship as a 1L. Honestly, as the above poster said, it's all about grades. Most of the people I know who are going to V10 and V20 firms next summer worked as an RA their 1L summer or did a gov't or judicial internship.

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Re: Unpaid Biglaw Internship Abroad

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Jan 08, 2011 5:20 pm

vamedic03 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I have a family friend who's a senior-level associate at a V20 firm in Asia. We don't have a relationship where I could ask him this sort of question, so my question to you guys is: is it worth it? I'm a HYS 1L - I have three 2 USAO offers open until the end of the month (in top-level branches) as well as an SEC gig on the East Coast that I'm probably going to turn down soon. My ultimate goal is to do biglaw (and I dont really care about the whole concern about doing a 1L firm gig and then having more limited options down the line), so if this would help, I'll take it. What do you guys think? Thanks.


SEC, USAO, etc. are just as good if not better than an UNPAID V20 internship as a 1L. Honestly, as the above poster said, it's all about grades. Most of the people I know who are going to V10 and V20 firms next summer worked as an RA their 1L summer or did a gov't or judicial internship.


Thanks for the replies. But how would employers know that it was unpaid? I actually specifically asked about how I would list it on my resume and he said to do it exactly as if it were an SA and that virtually no interviewer would ask you whether you were paid or not. Does that change things?

In terms of whether they will cover the cost of airfare/accommodations, although we haven't formally worked anything out yet, it seems like they would open to something like that (esp. airfare).

Sup Kid
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Re: Unpaid Biglaw Internship Abroad

Postby Sup Kid » Sat Jan 08, 2011 5:45 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Thanks for the replies. But how would employers know that it was unpaid? I actually specifically asked about how I would list it on my resume and he said to do it exactly as if it were an SA and that virtually no interviewer would ask you whether you were paid or not. Does that change things?

In terms of whether they will cover the cost of airfare/accommodations, although we haven't formally worked anything out yet, it seems like they would open to something like that (esp. airfare).


Sure, you can list it on your resume the same way, but the point is your 1L summer really doesn't help that much during OCI (so long as you are doing something legal-related). That's why it's not worth spending thousands and thousands of dollars to travel and live overseas during your 1L summer. If the firm is paying for travel and accommodations, then it's not "unpaid" (since that's going to cost the firm a significant amount). If they're willing to cover expenses, sure, take the job, but otherwise go to the USAO.

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vamedic03
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Re: Unpaid Biglaw Internship Abroad

Postby vamedic03 » Sat Jan 08, 2011 5:56 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
vamedic03 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I have a family friend who's a senior-level associate at a V20 firm in Asia. We don't have a relationship where I could ask him this sort of question, so my question to you guys is: is it worth it? I'm a HYS 1L - I have three 2 USAO offers open until the end of the month (in top-level branches) as well as an SEC gig on the East Coast that I'm probably going to turn down soon. My ultimate goal is to do biglaw (and I dont really care about the whole concern about doing a 1L firm gig and then having more limited options down the line), so if this would help, I'll take it. What do you guys think? Thanks.


SEC, USAO, etc. are just as good if not better than an UNPAID V20 internship as a 1L. Honestly, as the above poster said, it's all about grades. Most of the people I know who are going to V10 and V20 firms next summer worked as an RA their 1L summer or did a gov't or judicial internship.


Thanks for the replies. But how would employers know that it was unpaid? I actually specifically asked about how I would list it on my resume and he said to do it exactly as if it were an SA and that virtually no interviewer would ask you whether you were paid or not. Does that change things?

In terms of whether they will cover the cost of airfare/accommodations, although we haven't formally worked anything out yet, it seems like they would open to something like that (esp. airfare).


There's no real advantage to working in a lawfirm 1L summer aside from money. Of everyone I know going to a V10 firm next summer, only 1 or 2 worked in a firm 1L summer and neither of those were V100 firms.

UCLAtransfer
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Re: Unpaid Biglaw Internship Abroad

Postby UCLAtransfer » Sat Jan 08, 2011 6:08 pm

I'm gonna buck the trend here and say you should really consider it, especially if you can work something out where they will at least pay for airfare.

I agree that once you are choosing between USAO, SEC, externships w/federal judges, etc. for your 1L summer, you will likely be in fine shape for OCI. (Especially coming from HYS.)

But another big part of screening interviews during OCI is standing out and having something interesting to discuss during the interview. Here, we are talking about spending a summer abroad at a very prestigious firm where they will most likely be working on pretty interesting transactional-type stuff. I don't think you can get a summer experience much more interesting than that. The interviewers will be talking to dozens of people who did one of a handful of things- this V20 abroad will stand out in that regard.

Another thing to consider is whether you are leaning towards litigation or transactional. Since it is an international office of a US firm they will undoubtedly working almost exclusively on transactional matters, whereas USAO and most other options will be litigation-focused. If you have a particular interest in transactional work the V20 gig would be a rare opportunity for a 1L to get a real look at what it is like.

At the end of the day I don't think you can make a wrong decision here!

Edit: felonious typos.

A&O
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Re: Unpaid Biglaw Internship Abroad

Postby A&O » Sat Jan 08, 2011 6:14 pm

Absolutely no reason to go further in debt for a 1L summer job.

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Unitas
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Re: Unpaid Biglaw Internship Abroad

Postby Unitas » Sat Jan 08, 2011 6:21 pm

A&O wrote:Absolutely no reason to go further in debt for a 1L summer job.


TCR, plus you likely won't be able to get any kind of stipend to cover 1L summer whereas you may get one doing a PI type job.

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DoubleChecks
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Re: Unpaid Biglaw Internship Abroad

Postby DoubleChecks » Sat Jan 08, 2011 6:29 pm

UCLAtransfer wrote:But another big part of screening interviews during OCI is standing out and having something interesting to discuss during the interview. Here, we are talking about spending a summer abroad at a very prestigious firm where they will most likely be working on pretty interesting transactional-type stuff. I don't think you can get a summer experience much more interesting than that. The interviewers will be talking to dozens of people who did one of a handful of things- this V20 abroad will stand out in that regard.

Another thing to consider is whether you are leaning towards litigation or transactional. Since it is an international office of a US firm they will undoubtedly working almost exclusively on transactional matters, whereas USAO and most other options will be litigation-focused. If you have a particular interest in transactional work the V20 gig would be a rare opportunity for a 1L to get a real look at what it is like.

At the end of the day I don't think you can make a wrong decision here!

Edit: felonious typos.


i really liked this post, and i think it brings up something to consider if you really want to do transactional work post-law school. of course, OP should also first go find out if they'll cover expenses. answering these questions could really change the landscape of your decision, though so far everything everyone's said in this thread has been pretty spot on.




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