What's the truth here?

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Black-Blue
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Re: What's the truth here?

Postby Black-Blue » Wed Oct 20, 2010 11:18 am

OP:

No, you will not be working at McDonalds, because you'd be overqualified at them. They'll think you're a flight risk, because you'll just be leaving the job once you find another job. They'll also think that you'll have trouble fitting in with their employees due to education difference.

Don't think that you can depend on McDonalds.

stinger35
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Re: What's the truth here?

Postby stinger35 » Wed Oct 20, 2010 11:22 am

Black-Blue wrote:OP:

No, you will not be working at McDonalds, because you'd be overqualified at them. They'll think you're a flight risk, because you'll just be leaving the job once you find another job. They'll also think that you'll have trouble fitting in with their employees due to education difference.

Don't think that you can depend on McDonalds.


Sadly, this is true in regards to jobs not requiring JD's. Although there is obvious sarcasm in regards to McDonald's, many jobs actually will think this way.

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JazzOne
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Re: What's the truth here?

Postby JazzOne » Wed Oct 20, 2010 11:37 am

stinger35 wrote:
Black-Blue wrote:OP:

No, you will not be working at McDonalds, because you'd be overqualified at them. They'll think you're a flight risk, because you'll just be leaving the job once you find another job. They'll also think that you'll have trouble fitting in with their employees due to education difference.

Don't think that you can depend on McDonalds.


Sadly, this is true in regards to jobs not requiring JD's. Although there is obvious sarcasm in regards to McDonald's, many jobs actually will think this way.

No, McDonald's will think this way too. Why the hell would they hire someone with a JD? He'd be a royal pain in the ass.

turbotong
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Re: What's the truth here?

Postby turbotong » Thu Nov 04, 2010 12:37 am

Does anyone have any idea how the job market looks for patent attorneys, say 3 years from now?

I just graduated with a BS.EE and a 3.92 school GPA->4.0 LSAC GPA. I'm thinking about becoming a patent lawyer. I landed an engineering job paying 70k a year, and I am saving up most of the money right now. I should have about 30k saved by fall next year. I dont like much current job that much, it just pays well. I have a shot at Berkeley, decent chance at UT Austin, and probably guaranteed at Illinois with a large scholarship.
I heard that patent attorneys have a much better outlook than the rest of the JD grads. First, you have to have a "real" science/engineering degree. English majors, political majors, social studies majors, art majors, business majors are all immediately taken out of the equation. Most of the scientists/engineers get decent paying 50k-70k jobs out of school and don't apply to law. Second, you have to pass the USPTO's patent bar exam, which narrows the number even more.

Aqualibrium
Posts: 2011
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Re: What's the truth here?

Postby Aqualibrium » Thu Nov 04, 2010 12:41 am

turbotong wrote:Does anyone have any idea how the job market looks for patent attorneys, say 3 years from now?



What kind of ridiculous question is this?

Also, keep your job for awhile. Law school isn't going anywhere, and employers will value your work experience.

Anonymous User
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Re: What's the truth here?

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Nov 04, 2010 12:46 am

From the low T2 i transferred out of I've heard of 3 debevoise and cleary offers, plus a couple other V100 offers. Probably about 7 big law summer offers, which would translate to under the top 5% banking a decent job. Most schools outside the top 14 are going to give you similar odds. If you hit top 5% you've definitely have a good chance, but the odds of hitting those grades 1L aren't good, as the difference between an A and B+ on one exam could likely knock you outside of this top echelon.
Last edited by Anonymous User on Thu Nov 04, 2010 12:49 am, edited 2 times in total.

Aqualibrium
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Re: What's the truth here?

Postby Aqualibrium » Thu Nov 04, 2010 12:47 am

Anonymous User wrote:From the low T2 i transferred out of I've heard of 3 debevoise and cleary offers, plus a couple other V100 offers. Probably about 7 big law summer offers, which would translate to under the top 5% banking a decent job. Most schools outside the top 14% are going to give you similar odds. It's a big gamble.



Only v100 firms offer decent jobs?

Anonymous User
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Re: What's the truth here?

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Nov 04, 2010 12:53 am

Aqualibrium wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:From the low T2 i transferred out of I've heard of 3 debevoise and cleary offers, plus a couple other V100 offers. Probably about 7 big law summer offers, which would translate to under the top 5% banking a decent job. Most schools outside the top 14% are going to give you similar odds. It's a big gamble.



Only v100 firms offer decent jobs?


Well, no, but it's a matter of how many jobs are available at certain salary levels. You've got a decent amount of biglaw jobs at 145-160k, a decent amount of small firm/public interest jobs at 35-60k, but really not much in between.

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Drummingreg
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Re: What's the truth here?

Postby Drummingreg » Thu Nov 04, 2010 1:17 am

Black-Blue wrote:OP:

No, you will not be working at McDonalds, because you'd be overqualified at them. They'll think you're a flight risk, because you'll just be leaving the job once you find another job. They'll also think that you'll have trouble fitting in with their employees due to education difference.

Don't think that you can depend on McDonalds.

OP, do you have ties to the McDonalds area? Family, SO, etc... As long as you totally convince them that you want to work at McDonalds and won't leave for the first Chipotle job that comes up then you're golden.

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PDaddy
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Re: What's the truth here?

Postby PDaddy » Thu Nov 04, 2010 1:32 am

ZachOda wrote:Okay, so I am just about to send out applications soon, and I want an idea of what I'm necessarily getting myself into from people who are going through the process now. Is the legal market that bad? No, I will not be going to a T14, I can't afford it with my loans from UG.
Thanks guys


If cost is the primary concern, you can't afford NOT to go to a T14, assuming you can gain admission. People on TLS don't pick non-T14's because they "can't afford it", they pick non-T14's because they either couldn't get admitted or some school on the cusp (read: UCLA, Vandy, USC, TX, WUSTL, GWU, ND, Emory, GWU, UIUC, MN) offered them a sweetheart of a deal while they got little/no $ from a T14 or found themselves summer WL'd and did not want to wait.

The economy is pretty bad. If money is a concern, you had better be getting a full ride and then some...turning away a T14. And the school had better be a real darkhorse.

Anonymous User
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Re: What's the truth here?

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Nov 04, 2010 2:35 am

PDaddy wrote:
ZachOda wrote:Okay, so I am just about to send out applications soon, and I want an idea of what I'm necessarily getting myself into from people who are going through the process now. Is the legal market that bad? No, I will not be going to a T14, I can't afford it with my loans from UG.
Thanks guys


If cost is the primary concern, you can't afford NOT to go to a T14, assuming you can gain admission. People on TLS don't pick non-T14's because they "can't afford it", they pick non-T14's because they either couldn't get admitted or some school on the cusp (read: UCLA, Vandy, USC, TX, WUSTL, GWU, ND, Emory, GWU, UIUC, MN) offered them a sweetheart of a deal while they got little/no $ from a T14 or found themselves summer WL'd and did not want to wait.

The economy is pretty bad. If money is a concern, you had better be getting a full ride and then some...turning away a T14. And the school had better be a real darkhorse.


ITE, if you can get a boatload of money from a school like GWU (which gives roughly 50 scholarships of $120k-$150k), take it over a T14 (excluding HYS). You're gonna have to work your ass off at either school to get Biglaw, so you might as well take the cash and study hard -- top 20% at GWU will get you the same market-paying job that GULC/CCN will get you, and you'll have a hell of a lot less loans to pay back afterwards

upgrade
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Re: What's the truth here?

Postby upgrade » Thu Nov 04, 2010 10:11 am

ZachOda wrote:And no, I don't mind working for a mid-sized firm.


Just in case you are under the mistaken assumption that people are only having a rough time making it into large firms and that mid-sized firm jobs are plentiful, that is not the case. Most mid-sized firms (that don't participate in OCI) will only hire people with a few years of legal experience.

Anonymous User
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Re: What's the truth here?

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Nov 04, 2010 10:35 am

Anonymous User wrote:
PDaddy wrote:
ZachOda wrote:Okay, so I am just about to send out applications soon, and I want an idea of what I'm necessarily getting myself into from people who are going through the process now. Is the legal market that bad? No, I will not be going to a T14, I can't afford it with my loans from UG.
Thanks guys


If cost is the primary concern, you can't afford NOT to go to a T14, assuming you can gain admission. People on TLS don't pick non-T14's because they "can't afford it", they pick non-T14's because they either couldn't get admitted or some school on the cusp (read: UCLA, Vandy, USC, TX, WUSTL, GWU, ND, Emory, GWU, UIUC, MN) offered them a sweetheart of a deal while they got little/no $ from a T14 or found themselves summer WL'd and did not want to wait.

The economy is pretty bad. If money is a concern, you had better be getting a full ride and then some...turning away a T14. And the school had better be a real darkhorse.


ITE, if you can get a boatload of money from a school like GWU (which gives roughly 50 scholarships of $120k-$150k), take it over a T14 (excluding HYS). You're gonna have to work your ass off at either school to get Biglaw, so you might as well take the cash and study hard -- top 20% at GWU will get you the same market-paying job that GULC/CCN will get you, and you'll have a hell of a lot less loans to pay back afterwards


Given my current shitty status and initially not wanting to go to NY, I wish I had taken GWU with the full ride over Harvard.

Anonymous User
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Re: What's the truth here?

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Nov 04, 2010 11:05 am

I have been fucked by OCI despite being well above median (not quite tippy-top 10% or 20%) at a T14. (Not a "bottom" T14, either, although I question the meaning of MVPB vs. NCDG or whatever.) I have a strong resume and although I sometimes blow interviews, I've usually been described as fun to talk to. (Probably average-ish interviewing, with more variation up or down than the typical person.) The time window is merciless, and a few planning errors can totally screw you.

OP: I would actually suggest, if it's possible, that you consider a T14. If you play it right, you are probably at least more likely than not to get a swinging BigLaw gig. Elsewhere, you're talking about like a 10% or 20% chance. You really do not know where you'll place. "A giant robot will step on your house, BUT! you can roll this die, and if you get a 6 or a 7, it won't!" That's not a bet most people would actually make, staring at their painted wooden abode and a piston-driven metal foot hovering in midair above it.

If you want to do PI/government, T14 might work even if you bank on just doing LRAP. It's not a great life, but it's not bad. I'm not sure how UG loans play into it, though.

For now: apply fucking everywhere. If your LSAT is too low for T14, retake the LSAT and apply everywhere. Consider waiting a year to pump up your resume, make some money, and take a break from academics. Get all the options you can, and then make your choice.

Two things the veracity of which I have immense confidence in:

1) Given the amount of money at stake, application fees should be gladly thrown into the wind. Hunt down waivers if you can/have to.
2) Given the amount of money at stake, LSAT prep courses are, as they say, the credited response unless you're already testing in the 170s. (If you have the time for it, try self-studying first, and see where it gets you. If it doesn't take you all the way, do a course.) I have a relatively low GPA but am at a good school because of my bubble-filling ability. (Given that GPA is itself a fucking ridiculous, non-standardized metric, I don't feel particularly guilty about this.)

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wiseowl
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Re: What's the truth here?

Postby wiseowl » Thu Nov 04, 2010 6:17 pm

I think it's amusing that any posts that, even in jest, emphasize how poor the hiring market is and how much of a gamble lower-ranked schools are are automatically "straw men".

Make sure to wash your hands after you pull your fingers out of your ears.

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Doritos
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Re: What's the truth here?

Postby Doritos » Sat Nov 06, 2010 1:01 am

Drummingreg wrote:
Black-Blue wrote:OP:

No, you will not be working at McDonalds, because you'd be overqualified at them. They'll think you're a flight risk, because you'll just be leaving the job once you find another job. They'll also think that you'll have trouble fitting in with their employees due to education difference.

Don't think that you can depend on McDonalds.

OP, do you have ties to the McDonalds area? Family, SO, etc... As long as you totally convince them that you want to work at McDonalds and won't leave for the first Chipotle job that comes up then you're golden.


lol

Anonymous User
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Re: What's the truth here?

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Nov 06, 2010 11:10 pm

Doritos wrote:
Drummingreg wrote:
Black-Blue wrote:OP:

No, you will not be working at McDonalds, because you'd be overqualified at them. They'll think you're a flight risk, because you'll just be leaving the job once you find another job. They'll also think that you'll have trouble fitting in with their employees due to education difference.

Don't think that you can depend on McDonalds.

OP, do you have ties to the McDonalds area? Family, SO, etc... As long as you totally convince them that you want to work at McDonalds and won't leave for the first Chipotle job that comes up then you're golden.


lol


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