Do you believe in the second wave of callbacks?

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Second Wave?

Yes.
25
30%
No.
31
37%
I can't wait for this to be over.
28
33%
 
Total votes: 84

Anonymous User
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Re: Do you believe in the second wave of callbacks?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Sep 07, 2010 4:39 pm

dbt wrote:
rayiner wrote:
disco_barred wrote:
rayiner wrote:
Taking writing advice from Scalia are we?


My triple negatives flow like poetry. BACK OFF, MAN.


Is Scalia going to have to choke a bitch?


Is Scalia going to have to have another baby!?!?


All that Scalia wants is another baby.

GreenHeels
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Re: Do you believe in the second wave of callbacks?

Postby GreenHeels » Tue Sep 07, 2010 4:39 pm

spanktheduck wrote:There will most likely not be a second wave of cbs. There wasn't last year and there won't be one this year. I am sorry if you are waiting on a firm, but if others have heard back and you have not, you are likely dinged. There will be the random cb or late offer made, but these will be rare. Some smaller markets hire later and have a longer hiring period, but those are generally firms you will contact on your own. Firms that come to OCI will not be doing a second wave of callbacks. Offers are more likely, but even there, it won't be substantial.


If this is true, and I am not saying it isn't, why the epic delay in telling the losers they've lost?

Loser here is not in any sense perjorative, it is just the title accorded the person who doesn't win a competition.

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Kohinoor
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Re: Do you believe in the second wave of callbacks?

Postby Kohinoor » Tue Sep 07, 2010 4:44 pm

GreenHeels wrote:
spanktheduck wrote:There will most likely not be a second wave of cbs. There wasn't last year and there won't be one this year. I am sorry if you are waiting on a firm, but if others have heard back and you have not, you are likely dinged. There will be the random cb or late offer made, but these will be rare. Some smaller markets hire later and have a longer hiring period, but those are generally firms you will contact on your own. Firms that come to OCI will not be doing a second wave of callbacks. Offers are more likely, but even there, it won't be substantial.


If this is true, and I am not saying it isn't, why the epic delay in telling the losers they've lost?

Loser here is not in any sense perjorative, it is just the title accorded the person who doesn't win a competition.

Because they don't care. If you're rejected, they don't have much motivation to let you know in a timely manner because you're no longer their 'client'. I was getting rejections from 1L OCI in the middle of the summer.

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rayiner
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Re: Do you believe in the second wave of callbacks?

Postby rayiner » Tue Sep 07, 2010 4:49 pm

spanktheduck wrote:There will most likely not be a second wave of cbs. There wasn't last year and there won't be one this year. I am sorry if you are waiting on a firm, but if others have heard back and you have not, you are likely dinged. There will be the random cb or late offer made, but these will be rare. Some smaller markets hire later and have a longer hiring period, but those are generally firms you will contact on your own. Firms that come to OCI will not be doing a second wave of callbacks. Offers are more likely, but even there, it won't be substantial.


I won't argue that there will or will not be a second wave of callbacks, but using last year as evidence is not necessarily useful.

I know for a fact at least one major firm (that hires 50+ SAs) is doing a tiered system for offers because they got burned last year giving out too many offers early. Skadden had to go and call up people they had rejected because they undershot their summer class. Firms are still acclimating to the "new normal" and I think for some that acclimation will involve a tiered offer system, and maybe a tiered callback system.

KamaalTheAbstract
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Re: Do you believe in the second wave of callbacks?

Postby KamaalTheAbstract » Tue Sep 07, 2010 4:55 pm

Kohinoor wrote:
GreenHeels wrote:
spanktheduck wrote:There will most likely not be a second wave of cbs. There wasn't last year and there won't be one this year. I am sorry if you are waiting on a firm, but if others have heard back and you have not, you are likely dinged. There will be the random cb or late offer made, but these will be rare. Some smaller markets hire later and have a longer hiring period, but those are generally firms you will contact on your own. Firms that come to OCI will not be doing a second wave of callbacks. Offers are more likely, but even there, it won't be substantial.


If this is true, and I am not saying it isn't, why the epic delay in telling the losers they've lost?

Loser here is not in any sense perjorative, it is just the title accorded the person who doesn't win a competition.

Because they don't care. If you're rejected, they don't have much motivation to let you know in a timely manner because you're no longer their 'client'. I was getting rejections from 1L OCI in the middle of the summer.


This is true. I had an issue arise that prompted me to send a few firms emails informing them. All of the firms were places I interviewed with but haven't heard from in a couple of weeks. Shortly after the emails, the letters came. They aren't really worried about rejected candidates. The send the letters when they feel like it.

GreenHeels
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Re: Do you believe in the second wave of callbacks?

Postby GreenHeels » Tue Sep 07, 2010 5:04 pm

Interesting. I would have thought that many of them continually get emails, letters, and phone calls from those out there who are clinging to the last bit of hope. If it was me, I would want to stop getting that crap as soon as possible by shooting those hopes down.

rynabrius
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Re: Do you believe in the second wave of callbacks?

Postby rynabrius » Tue Sep 07, 2010 5:28 pm

Pandora's box contained many wretched things, but it also contained hope. And hope was the most wretched of them all.

Anonymous User
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Re: Do you believe in the second wave of callbacks?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Sep 07, 2010 5:35 pm

Know of a few top firms that had, essentially, callback "waitlists" last year. Don't know about this year.

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spanktheduck
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Re: Do you believe in the second wave of callbacks?

Postby spanktheduck » Tue Sep 07, 2010 5:45 pm

My post was meant to get across this. Second way cbs/offers will be unlikely. If you do not get one initially do not expect one to come later. It might, but it probably won't. Sure Skadden might be holding back, but most firms won't be. You will do best to count it as a ding and move on to find other employment.

Renzo
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Re: Do you believe in the second wave of callbacks?

Postby Renzo » Wed Sep 08, 2010 8:20 pm

spanktheduck wrote:There will most likely not be a second wave of cbs. There wasn't last year and there won't be one this year. I am sorry if you are waiting on a firm, but if others have heard back and you have not, you are likely dinged. There will be the random cb or late offer made, but these will be rare. Some smaller markets hire later and have a longer hiring period, but those are generally firms you will contact on your own. Firms that come to OCI will not be doing a second wave of callbacks. Offers are more likely, but even there, it won't be substantial.

I agree with the conclusion, but question the methods.

Making comparisons to past practices is basically useless--too much has changed. The economy isn't what it was in 2007, but it's also not what it was last year. Plus, the NALP rules have changed so it's entirely possible that a smaller (for biglaw) firm could make a bunch of offers, wait to see if they are accepted, then invite more callbacks in the same timeframe that it would take the firms with the biggest classes to finish callbacks.

All that being said, I don't think it's happening. Firms don't want to pick the dregs left by other firms.

spondee
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Re: Do you believe in the second wave of callbacks?

Postby spondee » Wed Sep 08, 2010 8:34 pm

A second 'wave' of callbacks doesn't make sense. OCI occurs and candidates are split into 3 groups: reject, hold, CB. Then the CBs occur and candidates are further split into 3 groups: reject, hold, offer. After some offers go out, they'll begin to add offers from the CB-hold group until they hit their intended class size. All remaining holds are then rejected.

For a second 'wave' of callbacks to occur would mean the firm exhausts both their CB-offer group and their CB-hold group without meeting their targets, but because firms have some experience with yield, this isn't likely to occur at very many firms. A few more CBs will occur, but nothing that constitutes a wave.

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spanktheduck
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Re: Do you believe in the second wave of callbacks?

Postby spanktheduck » Wed Sep 08, 2010 9:05 pm

Renzo wrote:
spanktheduck wrote:There will most likely not be a second wave of cbs. There wasn't last year and there won't be one this year. I am sorry if you are waiting on a firm, but if others have heard back and you have not, you are likely dinged. There will be the random cb or late offer made, but these will be rare. Some smaller markets hire later and have a longer hiring period, but those are generally firms you will contact on your own. Firms that come to OCI will not be doing a second wave of callbacks. Offers are more likely, but even there, it won't be substantial.

I agree with the conclusion, but question the methods.

Making comparisons to past practices is basically useless--too much has changed. The economy isn't what it was in 2007, but it's also not what it was last year. Plus, the NALP rules have changed so it's entirely possible that a smaller (for biglaw) firm could make a bunch of offers, wait to see if they are accepted, then invite more callbacks in the same timeframe that it would take the firms with the biggest classes to finish callbacks.

All that being said, I don't think it's happening. Firms don't want to pick the dregs left by other firms.



What has really changed? The economy isn't really that much better and it is quickly appearing to be getting worse. Regarding the rule changes, are you referring to the 28 days? They was in place last year.

Renzo
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Re: Do you believe in the second wave of callbacks?

Postby Renzo » Thu Sep 09, 2010 1:02 pm

spanktheduck wrote:
Renzo wrote:
spanktheduck wrote:There will most likely not be a second wave of cbs. There wasn't last year and there won't be one this year. I am sorry if you are waiting on a firm, but if others have heard back and you have not, you are likely dinged. There will be the random cb or late offer made, but these will be rare. Some smaller markets hire later and have a longer hiring period, but those are generally firms you will contact on your own. Firms that come to OCI will not be doing a second wave of callbacks. Offers are more likely, but even there, it won't be substantial.

I agree with the conclusion, but question the methods.

Making comparisons to past practices is basically useless--too much has changed. The economy isn't what it was in 2007, but it's also not what it was last year. Plus, the NALP rules have changed so it's entirely possible that a smaller (for biglaw) firm could make a bunch of offers, wait to see if they are accepted, then invite more callbacks in the same timeframe that it would take the firms with the biggest classes to finish callbacks.

All that being said, I don't think it's happening. Firms don't want to pick the dregs left by other firms.



What has really changed? The economy isn't really that much better and it is quickly appearing to be getting worse. Regarding the rule changes, are you referring to the 28 days? They was in place last year.

I thought the 28 day rule was new this year, so I stand corrected on that point, and maybe last year is a better comparison than I thought. The economy in whole is not better than last year, but the legal job market appears to have reached a new (lower) equilibrium, whereas last year it was still pretty unsettled.

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Unemployed
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Re: Do you believe in the second wave of callbacks?

Postby Unemployed » Thu Sep 09, 2010 1:13 pm

Renzo wrote:
spanktheduck wrote:
Renzo wrote:
spanktheduck wrote:There will most likely not be a second wave of cbs. There wasn't last year and there won't be one this year. I am sorry if you are waiting on a firm, but if others have heard back and you have not, you are likely dinged. There will be the random cb or late offer made, but these will be rare. Some smaller markets hire later and have a longer hiring period, but those are generally firms you will contact on your own. Firms that come to OCI will not be doing a second wave of callbacks. Offers are more likely, but even there, it won't be substantial.

I agree with the conclusion, but question the methods.

Making comparisons to past practices is basically useless--too much has changed. The economy isn't what it was in 2007, but it's also not what it was last year. Plus, the NALP rules have changed so it's entirely possible that a smaller (for biglaw) firm could make a bunch of offers, wait to see if they are accepted, then invite more callbacks in the same timeframe that it would take the firms with the biggest classes to finish callbacks.

All that being said, I don't think it's happening. Firms don't want to pick the dregs left by other firms.



What has really changed? The economy isn't really that much better and it is quickly appearing to be getting worse. Regarding the rule changes, are you referring to the 28 days? They was in place last year.

I thought the 28 day rule was new this year, so I stand corrected on that point, and maybe last year is a better comparison than I thought. The economy in whole is not better than last year, but the legal job market appears to have reached a new (lower) equilibrium, whereas last year it was still pretty unsettled.


You don't stand corrected. The 28 days rule came into effect in Feb 2010.

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bwv812
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Re: Do you believe in the second wave of callbacks?

Postby bwv812 » Thu Sep 09, 2010 2:27 pm

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Last edited by bwv812 on Fri Nov 26, 2010 5:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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dresden doll
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Re: Do you believe in the second wave of callbacks?

Postby dresden doll » Thu Sep 09, 2010 2:30 pm

Supposedly, Chi firms are doing hiring in waves. Whether that entails several CB waves is a separate issue.

Renzo
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Re: Do you believe in the second wave of callbacks?

Postby Renzo » Thu Sep 09, 2010 3:50 pm

Unemployed wrote:
You don't stand corrected. The 28 days rule came into effect in Feb 2010.

Well, then I retract my withdrawal, Al Gore style.

rynabrius
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Re: Do you believe in the second wave of callbacks?

Postby rynabrius » Thu Sep 09, 2010 3:51 pm

Maybe, just maybe, if we question the second wave of callbacks, it will cease to exist. We all have to believe in fairies for Tinkerbell to live on, and if we don't believe elephants can fly, Dumbo will fall from the sky.




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