mock trial vs. moot court

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Re: mock trial vs. moot court

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Sep 04, 2010 11:51 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
hi_im_josh wrote:It's like being on a journal--it hurts you if you aren't on it. Employers will see it as a gap on the resume and may ask you why you aren't on moot court. I'd work hard to get on so you won't have the gap on the resume, but after that point I wouldn't kill myself putting a lot of effort into it.



What? I haven't had one interviewer ask me about not being on moot court or mock trial, and I have three offers. It is a decent talking point, but so are other things on your resume. It's not anything 'lacking' if you don't do it, dude.


Same. Biglaw doesn't care about moot court/mock trial unless you don't have any journal at all. (And I mean in the context of using it as an excuse for not being on a journal.)

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Re: mock trial vs. moot court

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Sep 04, 2010 11:54 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
hi_im_josh wrote:It's like being on a journal--it hurts you if you aren't on it. Employers will see it as a gap on the resume and may ask you why you aren't on moot court. I'd work hard to get on so you won't have the gap on the resume, but after that point I wouldn't kill myself putting a lot of effort into it.



What? I haven't had one interviewer ask me about not being on moot court or mock trial, and I have three offers. It is a decent talking point, but so are other things on your resume. It's not anything 'lacking' if you don't do it, dude.


Same. Biglaw doesn't care about moot court/mock trial unless you don't have any journal at all. (And I mean in the context of using it as an excuse for not being on a journal.)



Plus, only a few asked me about my secondary journal--it's not like we have actually started doing stuff yet.

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Re: mock trial vs. moot court

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Sep 04, 2010 11:58 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
hi_im_josh wrote:It's like being on a journal--it hurts you if you aren't on it. Employers will see it as a gap on the resume and may ask you why you aren't on moot court. I'd work hard to get on so you won't have the gap on the resume, but after that point I wouldn't kill myself putting a lot of effort into it.



What? I haven't had one interviewer ask me about not being on moot court or mock trial, and I have three offers. It is a decent talking point, but so are other things on your resume. It's not anything 'lacking' if you don't do it, dude.


Same. Biglaw doesn't care about moot court/mock trial unless you don't have any journal at all. (And I mean in the context of using it as an excuse for not being on a journal.)



Plus, only a few asked me about my secondary journal--it's not like we have actually started doing stuff yet.


True, only 1/5 of my interviewers asked about journals. However, I think they are more likely to ask about journals if you aren't on one, aka "why aren't you on a journal? what do you plan on doing instead?"

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Re: mock trial vs. moot court

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:04 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
hi_im_josh wrote:It's like being on a journal--it hurts you if you aren't on it. Employers will see it as a gap on the resume and may ask you why you aren't on moot court. I'd work hard to get on so you won't have the gap on the resume, but after that point I wouldn't kill myself putting a lot of effort into it.



What? I haven't had one interviewer ask me about not being on moot court or mock trial, and I have three offers. It is a decent talking point, but so are other things on your resume. It's not anything 'lacking' if you don't do it, dude.


Same. Biglaw doesn't care about moot court/mock trial unless you don't have any journal at all. (And I mean in the context of using it as an excuse for not being on a journal.)



Plus, only a few asked me about my secondary journal--it's not like we have actually started doing stuff yet.


True, only 1/5 of my interviewers asked about journals. However, I think they are more likely to ask about journals if you aren't on one, aka "why aren't you on a journal? what do you plan on doing instead?"[/quote]

Maybe. IDK, I can't say, as I am on one.

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Re: mock trial vs. moot court

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:05 am

Anonymous User wrote:Maybe. IDK, I can't say, as I am on one.


Ditto, but my friend isn't and got asked that question in every single interview.

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Re: mock trial vs. moot court

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:07 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Maybe. IDK, I can't say, as I am on one.


Ditto, but my friend isn't and got asked that question in every single interview.



Really? Approx rank and school?

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Re: mock trial vs. moot court

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:08 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
hi_im_josh wrote:It's like being on a journal--it hurts you if you aren't on it. Employers will see it as a gap on the resume and may ask you why you aren't on moot court. I'd work hard to get on so you won't have the gap on the resume, but after that point I wouldn't kill myself putting a lot of effort into it.



What? I haven't had one interviewer ask me about not being on moot court or mock trial, and I have three offers. It is a decent talking point, but so are other things on your resume. It's not anything 'lacking' if you don't do it, dude.


Same. Biglaw doesn't care about moot court/mock trial unless you don't have any journal at all. (And I mean in the context of using it as an excuse for not being on a journal.)



True, only 1/5 of my interviewers asked about journals. However, I think they are more likely to ask about journals if you aren't on one, aka "why aren't you on a journal? what do you plan on doing instead?"


The problem, though, is that most of the people on journals are also on moot court. If you just do a journal and have to compete against another student that is doing a journal and moot court, you will be at a disadvantage.

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Re: mock trial vs. moot court

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:09 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
hi_im_josh wrote:It's like being on a journal--it hurts you if you aren't on it. Employers will see it as a gap on the resume and may ask you why you aren't on moot court. I'd work hard to get on so you won't have the gap on the resume, but after that point I wouldn't kill myself putting a lot of effort into it.



What? I haven't had one interviewer ask me about not being on moot court or mock trial, and I have three offers. It is a decent talking point, but so are other things on your resume. It's not anything 'lacking' if you don't do it, dude.


Same. Biglaw doesn't care about moot court/mock trial unless you don't have any journal at all. (And I mean in the context of using it as an excuse for not being on a journal.)



True, only 1/5 of my interviewers asked about journals. However, I think they are more likely to ask about journals if you aren't on one, aka "why aren't you on a journal? what do you plan on doing instead?"


The problem, though, is that most of the people on journals are also on moot court. If you just do a journal and have to compete against another student that is doing a journal and moot court, you will be at a disadvantage.[/quote]

Wrong. Most of the people here, at my school (Columbia), are on a journal (probably 2/3). Most are not on any sort of moot court, even fewer after 1L year.

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Re: mock trial vs. moot court

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:10 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
hi_im_josh wrote:It's like being on a journal--it hurts you if you aren't on it. Employers will see it as a gap on the resume and may ask you why you aren't on moot court. I'd work hard to get on so you won't have the gap on the resume, but after that point I wouldn't kill myself putting a lot of effort into it.



What? I haven't had one interviewer ask me about not being on moot court or mock trial, and I have three offers. It is a decent talking point, but so are other things on your resume. It's not anything 'lacking' if you don't do it, dude.


Same. Biglaw doesn't care about moot court/mock trial unless you don't have any journal at all. (And I mean in the context of using it as an excuse for not being on a journal.)



True, only 1/5 of my interviewers asked about journals. However, I think they are more likely to ask about journals if you aren't on one, aka "why aren't you on a journal? what do you plan on doing instead?"


The problem, though, is that most of the people on journals are also on moot court. If you just do a journal and have to compete against another student that is doing a journal and moot court, you will be at a disadvantage.[/quote]

Plus, how the heck is bluebooking even going to help you in moot court? Those briefs aren't based on your citation correctness.

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Re: mock trial vs. moot court

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:16 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Maybe. IDK, I can't say, as I am on one.


Ditto, but my friend isn't and got asked that question in every single interview.



Really? Approx rank and school?


MVPB, rank median? (not exactly sure what his rank is)

It's not really that weird. Most people are on a journal. A secondary journal is seen more as a bare minimum rather than a plus. Of course if you have a high GPA, biglaw doesn't give a shit if you have a journal or not.

If I could start law school over, I'd just gun for a super high GPA and not participate in a single extracurricular. Having gone through OCI, I now fully believe that grades are, by far, the biggest factor in determining how many callbacks/offers you get.
Last edited by Anonymous User on Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:21 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: mock trial vs. moot court

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:21 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Maybe. IDK, I can't say, as I am on one.


Ditto, but my friend isn't and got asked that question in every single interview.



Really? Approx rank and school?


MVPB, rank median? (not exactly sure what his rank is)

It's not really that weird. Most people are on a journal. A secondary journal is seen more as a bare minimum rather than a plus. Of course if you have a high GPA, biglaw doesn't give a shit if you have a journal or not.

If I could start law school over, I'd just gun for a super high GPA and not participate in a single extracurricular. Having gone through OCI, I now fully believe that grades are the biggest factor in determining how many callbacks/offers you get.


Interesting, cause I have below median grades, and I credit all my offers to my personality and how I interview.

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Re: mock trial vs. moot court

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:24 am

Anonymous User wrote:Interesting, cause I have below median grades, and I credit all my offers to my personality and how I interview.


School? IP? Are all your offers out of OCI?

All I know is top 10% at my school is swimming in callbacks/offers while everyone else, it seems, has a few here and there. Top 10% along with IP, are the only people I personally know with double digit callbacks.
Last edited by Anonymous User on Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:25 am, edited 1 time in total.

Anonymous User
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Re: mock trial vs. moot court

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:24 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Interesting, cause I have below median grades, and I credit all my offers to my personality and how I interview.


School? IP? Are all your offers out of OCI?

All I know is top 10% at my school is swimming in callbacks/offers while everyone else has a few here and there. Top 10% along with IP, are the only people with double digit callbacks.



CLS. Not IP, no. Yes, my offers are from the CBs I received at EIP (EIP=OCI at CLS).

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Re: mock trial vs. moot court

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:25 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Interesting, cause I have below median grades, and I credit all my offers to my personality and how I interview.


School? IP? Are all your offers out of OCI?

All I know is top 10% at my school is swimming in callbacks/offers while everyone else has a few here and there. Top 10% along with IP, are the only people with double digit callbacks.



CLS. Not IP, no. Yes, my offers are from the CBs I received at EIP (EIP=OCI at CLS).


How many callbacks did you get?

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Re: mock trial vs. moot court

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:26 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Interesting, cause I have below median grades, and I credit all my offers to my personality and how I interview.


School? IP? Are all your offers out of OCI?

All I know is top 10% at my school is swimming in callbacks/offers while everyone else has a few here and there. Top 10% along with IP, are the only people with double digit callbacks.



CLS. Not IP, no. Yes, my offers are from the CBs I received at EIP (EIP=OCI at CLS).


How many callbacks did you get?



7

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Re: mock trial vs. moot court

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:28 am

You're probably the very rare exception. (Check out NYU's callback sheet for sub median folks.)

Once you hit a certain GPA range, callbacks double.

Speaking of your offers though, any tips on how to own callbacks?

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Re: mock trial vs. moot court

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:30 am

Anonymous User wrote:You're probably the very rare exception. (Check out NYU's callback sheet for sub median folks.)

Once you hit a certain GPA range, callbacks double.

Speaking of your offers though, any tips on how to own callbacks?



I just make sure to be extremely friendly and know everything about the firm. I also make sure to know about the interviewer.

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Re: mock trial vs. moot court

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:31 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:You're probably the very rare exception. (Check out NYU's callback sheet for sub median folks.)

Once you hit a certain GPA range, callbacks double.

Speaking of your offers though, any tips on how to own callbacks?



I just make sure to be extremely friendly and know everything about the firm. I also make sure to know about the interviewer.


my callback firms won't send me a list of interviewers until the night before...how much research should I do? (just read the bio page on the firm site or what?)

also, what in particular should i know about the firm besides practice areas? new deals? offices?

sorry to hijack

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Re: mock trial vs. moot court

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:38 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:You're probably the very rare exception. (Check out NYU's callback sheet for sub median folks.)

Once you hit a certain GPA range, callbacks double.

Speaking of your offers though, any tips on how to own callbacks?



I just make sure to be extremely friendly and know everything about the firm. I also make sure to know about the interviewer.


my callback firms won't send me a list of interviewers until the night before...how much research should I do? (just read the bio page on the firm site or what?)

also, what in particular should i know about the firm besides practice areas? new deals? offices?



I read the bios, yes, and picked up on a few interesting things each interviewer had done: some case, something they may have written, some past experience in a certain area. It varied on the person. Sometimes, there won't be enough information on the bio, esp with a first year associate, so I looked at recent developments in the field and asked how it is affecting their work: for example, with financial services, the Frank-Dodd Act.

In terms of research, I knew about what recent cases had happened at the firm in each interviewer's particular practice group. I also had down the firm's summer program and any aspects of the firm culture the website emphasized (sociability, early responsibility, etc....varied by the firm). I tended NOT to ask generic questions about the summer program or something I could research online. I wanted to show more interest than that. Anyway, I hope that helps.

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Re: mock trial vs. moot court

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:44 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:You're probably the very rare exception. (Check out NYU's callback sheet for sub median folks.)

Once you hit a certain GPA range, callbacks double.

Speaking of your offers though, any tips on how to own callbacks?



I just make sure to be extremely friendly and know everything about the firm. I also make sure to know about the interviewer.


my callback firms won't send me a list of interviewers until the night before...how much research should I do? (just read the bio page on the firm site or what?)

also, what in particular should i know about the firm besides practice areas? new deals? offices?



I read the bios, yes, and picked up on a few interesting things each interviewer had done: some case, something they may have written, some past experience in a certain area. It varied on the person. Sometimes, there won't be enough information on the bio, esp with a first year associate, so I looked at recent developments in the field and asked how it is affecting their work: for example, with financial services, the Frank-Dodd Act.

In terms of research, I knew about what recent cases had happened at the firm in each interviewer's particular practice group. I also had down the firm's summer program and any aspects of the firm culture the website emphasized (sociability, early responsibility, etc....varied by the firm). I tended NOT to ask generic questions about the summer program or something I could research online. I wanted to show more interest than that. Anyway, I hope that helps.


Yeah, it does, thanks a lot.

Also, quick question - did you express interest in a certain practice area or just say you were undecided?

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Re: mock trial vs. moot court

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:47 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:You're probably the very rare exception. (Check out NYU's callback sheet for sub median folks.)

Once you hit a certain GPA range, callbacks double.

Speaking of your offers though, any tips on how to own callbacks?



I just make sure to be extremely friendly and know everything about the firm. I also make sure to know about the interviewer.


my callback firms won't send me a list of interviewers until the night before...how much research should I do? (just read the bio page on the firm site or what?)

also, what in particular should i know about the firm besides practice areas? new deals? offices?



I read the bios, yes, and picked up on a few interesting things each interviewer had done: some case, something they may have written, some past experience in a certain area. It varied on the person. Sometimes, there won't be enough information on the bio, esp with a first year associate, so I looked at recent developments in the field and asked how it is affecting their work: for example, with financial services, the Frank-Dodd Act.

In terms of research, I knew about what recent cases had happened at the firm in each interviewer's particular practice group. I also had down the firm's summer program and any aspects of the firm culture the website emphasized (sociability, early responsibility, etc....varied by the firm). I tended NOT to ask generic questions about the summer program or something I could research online. I wanted to show more interest than that. Anyway, I hope that helps.


Yeah, it does, thanks a lot.

Also, quick question - did you express interest in a certain practice area or just say you were undecided?[/quote]


I did some lit work this summer for a gov agency, and, while I expressed I was interested in lit and enjoyed it, I also said that I wanted to try out corp stuff (which is true) this summer because I felt that you don't get enough exposure to it while in law school (which I also have found to be true). Law school trains litigators, and most attorneys agreed with me on that.

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Re: mock trial vs. moot court

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:49 am

Anonymous User wrote:I did some lit work this summer for a gov agency, and, while I expressed I was interested in lit and enjoyed it, I also said that I wanted to try out corp stuff (which is true) this summer because I felt that you don't get enough exposure to it while in law school (which I also have found to be true). Law school trains litigators, and most attorneys agreed with me on that.


ok, that's a quality response. thanks.

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Re: mock trial vs. moot court

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:54 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I did some lit work this summer for a gov agency, and, while I expressed I was interested in lit and enjoyed it, I also said that I wanted to try out corp stuff (which is true) this summer because I felt that you don't get enough exposure to it while in law school (which I also have found to be true). Law school trains litigators, and most attorneys agreed with me on that.


ok, that's a quality response. thanks.



Haha, the spiel isn't copyrighted, so have fun using.

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941law
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Re: mock trial vs. moot court

Postby 941law » Tue May 15, 2012 5:39 pm

do you try-out for these or just moot?

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Re: mock trial vs. moot court

Postby smokyroom26 » Tue May 15, 2012 7:55 pm

Tryouts depend on the school, I think. At my school, the coaches of the particular teams go hunting for people. We have a 1L moot court competition, and the people who finish at or near the top are actively recruited. Most of the moot court coaches at my school are also writing profs, so many recruit from their brief-writing/oral argument classes. However, when a student expresses interest in moot court, s/he is generally able to find a spot on a team.

Here are some things to think about:

1) Moot court is a lot of work.
2) Moot court is a lot of fun, if you like competing.
3) If you are good at it, interviewers will want to talk about it, and it gives you a boost in the clerkship application process.
4) Moot court = scholarship opportunities.

Also, someone above said bluebooking is irrelevant to moot court success, and that isn't quite right. Bluebooking is generally a not-insignificant portion of your brief score, which is carried through with you into the pre-break oral argument rounds (all the competitions I have participated in have several "seed" rounds where your points and win/loss tally determine whether you break into the bracketed rounds, and what seed you are assigned going into them).

I like moot court because even though it is a lot of work, it's great to spend that portion of my time thinking about something other than classes and journal work. It is, in a way, a mental break that I really enjoy.

FWIW, I am on moot court, law review, and a secondary journal. The work gets done.




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