Boies or W & C

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yellowjacket2012
Posts: 283
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Re: Boies or W & C

Postby yellowjacket2012 » Fri Sep 03, 2010 1:02 am

pfft.. yeah yeah.. I'll give you guys this.. you go to W&C and you'll probably have an easier "time" because its a "proxy" for whatever.

My point - guys - is that "proxies" end up being casper the friendly ghost in the long run - just like a Ponzi scheme - and all of it "tends" to the real world results you generate as a lawyer.. but maybe this is a dunski viewpoint in need of a reality check in itself.

Anonymous User
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Re: Boies or W & C

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Sep 03, 2010 1:12 am

Definitely W&C. BSF's DC office has a funny color scheme and is on the outskirts of town.

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BruceWayne
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Re: Boies or W & C

Postby BruceWayne » Fri Sep 03, 2010 11:40 am

dbt wrote:
yellowjacket2012 wrote:I don't get this point - at all.

Why would the name on your resume matter for exit options? Shouldn't your body of work, what companies you represented, whether you won a motion on summary judgment, what you did for your clients - shouldn't those REAL RESULTS matter?

I mean.. tell me what I'm missing here.. If I go to Google and scratch my ass for 3 years.. or if I go to Citrix and develop a great interface for go2mypc.com for use on mobile phones in my 3 years there - why in the WORLD would I be less marketable coming from Citrix?

I mean, if you scratch your ass at W&C for 3 years.. and do jack - what exactly did you do to increase your market value other than gain admission at W&C - much like gaining admission at Yale... I mean - what the hell?! Your body of work is your worth as a lawyer, not your "entries" into various "selective" offices.... look you're a Yale guy, I'm at lowly Boaltie, I would love for you to smack me down here - I am genuinely missing the point.


Lol I'm not going to smack you down - I went to NYU originally, and I'm also not a douchebag.

I do think you really misunderstand what junior associates do. At firms of this caliber, it's not going to differ much - in that you're not going to be doing much that's impressive. You may get lucky and be put on some publicized case, but probably not (and I'd guess the chances of being put on such a case and getting to show off what you can do - which again, isn't much at this point - is more likely at W&C just because they get so much high profile stuff). The fact of the matter is until you specialize (which for most isn't until at least 3-4 years in) you're just another associate. You should at least be an associate at the firm that will truly wow future employers. Boies will do that; W&C will do that more than, in my opinion, any other firm (for litigation).


Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't that the quintessential difference between Williams and Connolly and other top firms? From the Vault guides, general law student word of mouth, their website, low leverage ratio, and their reviews say W&C gives it associates hands on in the trenches substantive experience from day one. In fact, a large part of their selectivity isn't necessarily grades/school based (although a lot of it obviously is) it's having that litigation "it" factor. They don't like resumes that scream academia/nothing but a bookworm/socially awkward, and they don't like resumes that scream "looking for a transactional V10 type position" either. They like WE (particularly military), a focus on things like mock trial and moot court, journal work, and litigation focused coursework. They also aren't big on the up or out thing like a lot of the highly ranked NYC transactional firms, so since they will actually be working with their associates for more than 3 years they care about their hires personality etc.

Anonymous User
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Re: Boies or W & C

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Sep 03, 2010 12:27 pm

BruceWayne wrote:
dbt wrote:
yellowjacket2012 wrote:I don't get this point - at all.

Why would the name on your resume matter for exit options? Shouldn't your body of work, what companies you represented, whether you won a motion on summary judgment, what you did for your clients - shouldn't those REAL RESULTS matter?

I mean.. tell me what I'm missing here.. If I go to Google and scratch my ass for 3 years.. or if I go to Citrix and develop a great interface for go2mypc.com for use on mobile phones in my 3 years there - why in the WORLD would I be less marketable coming from Citrix?

I mean, if you scratch your ass at W&C for 3 years.. and do jack - what exactly did you do to increase your market value other than gain admission at W&C - much like gaining admission at Yale... I mean - what the hell?! Your body of work is your worth as a lawyer, not your "entries" into various "selective" offices.... look you're a Yale guy, I'm at lowly Boaltie, I would love for you to smack me down here - I am genuinely missing the point.


Lol I'm not going to smack you down - I went to NYU originally, and I'm also not a douchebag.

I do think you really misunderstand what junior associates do. At firms of this caliber, it's not going to differ much - in that you're not going to be doing much that's impressive. You may get lucky and be put on some publicized case, but probably not (and I'd guess the chances of being put on such a case and getting to show off what you can do - which again, isn't much at this point - is more likely at W&C just because they get so much high profile stuff). The fact of the matter is until you specialize (which for most isn't until at least 3-4 years in) you're just another associate. You should at least be an associate at the firm that will truly wow future employers. Boies will do that; W&C will do that more than, in my opinion, any other firm (for litigation).


Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't that the quintessential difference between Williams and Connolly and other top firms? From the Vault guides, general law student word of mouth, their website, low leverage ratio, and their reviews say W&C gives it associates hands on in the trenches substantive experience from day one. In fact, a large part of their selectivity isn't necessarily grades/school based (although a lot of it obviously is) it's having that litigation "it" factor. They don't like resumes that scream academia/nothing but a bookworm/socially awkward, and they don't like resumes that scream "looking for a transactional V10 type position" either. They like WE (particularly military), a focus on things like mock trial and moot court, journal work, and litigation focused coursework. They also aren't big on the up or out thing like a lot of the highly ranked NYC transactional firms, so since they will actually be working with their associates for more than 3 years they care about their hires personality etc.


Has anyone actually received an offer from these illustrious firms?

Anonymous User
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Re: Boies or W & C

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Sep 04, 2010 12:00 am

Yes, offers received. It's an interesting dilemma

NYAssociate
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Joined: Wed Jun 09, 2010 8:15 pm

Re: Boies or W & C

Postby NYAssociate » Sat Sep 04, 2010 8:51 am

.
Last edited by NYAssociate on Tue Oct 05, 2010 7:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Anonymous User
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Re: Boies or W & C

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Sep 05, 2010 5:59 pm

oP here. I think I'm going with bsf bc of ny connections. Anyone think it's crazy or huge mistake?

Pablo Ramirez
Posts: 161
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Re: Boies or W & C

Postby Pablo Ramirez » Sun Sep 05, 2010 6:19 pm

Anonymous User wrote:oP here. I think I'm going with bsf bc of ny connections. Anyone think it's crazy or huge mistake?


Not crazy. Not a huge mistake. Good luck!

Anonymous User
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Re: Boies or W & C

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Sep 06, 2010 5:49 pm

You just made the biggest mistake of your life

Anonymous User
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Re: Boies or W & C

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Sep 07, 2010 9:54 am

Don't worry about it OP - Boies is hands down best lit. in NY

Anonymous User
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Re: Boies or W & C

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Sep 07, 2010 9:57 am

Anonymous User wrote:oP here. I think I'm going with bsf bc of ny connections. Anyone think it's crazy or huge mistake?


Crazy.

Anonymous User
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Re: Boies or W & C

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Sep 07, 2010 10:43 am

So, this thread seems to confirm that there are actual W&C offers out there. Does it seem to be just a few people so far, or can anyone else weigh in? I'm almost 2 weeks past my callback, have gotten offers from everywhere else I'm interested in, and am just waiting on W&C to get back to me before making a final decision... so the wait is killing me!

Also, how long was the turnaround between cb and offer for anyone out there who has gotten an offer?

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SleekFire
Posts: 120
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2008 10:13 pm

Re: Boies or W & C

Postby SleekFire » Fri Aug 26, 2011 1:10 am

OP, if you are still around I would love to chat. :-)

PM me?

Anonymous User
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Re: Boies or W & C

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Aug 26, 2011 10:54 am

SleekFire wrote:OP, if you are still around I would love to chat. :-)

PM me?


do you have on offer from W&C?

johndhi
Posts: 358
Joined: Sun Sep 27, 2009 11:25 am

Re: Boies or W & C

Postby johndhi » Fri Aug 26, 2011 11:24 am

BruceWayne wrote:Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't that the quintessential difference between Williams and Connolly and other top firms? From the Vault guides, general law student word of mouth, their website, low leverage ratio, and their reviews say W&C gives it associates hands on in the trenches substantive experience from day one. In fact, a large part of their selectivity isn't necessarily grades/school based (although a lot of it obviously is) it's having that litigation "it" factor. They don't like resumes that scream academia/nothing but a bookworm/socially awkward, and they don't like resumes that scream "looking for a transactional V10 type position" either. They like WE (particularly military), a focus on things like mock trial and moot court, journal work, and litigation focused coursework. They also aren't big on the up or out thing like a lot of the highly ranked NYC transactional firms, so since they will actually be working with their associates for more than 3 years they care about their hires personality etc.



Dude, you sound like a marketing coordinator for Williams and Connolly. Give me a fucking break about this "it" factor - W&C is a law firm; they file things like motions to dismiss, oppositions to motions for summary judgment and fee motions. They engage in discovery disputes. The water that flows through their faucets will not cure diseases. I agree their system is different from NYC biglaw, but so is the system of any smaller or one-office firm. Great firm, good in certain areas of work, legendary in DC. Let's stop it there.

Anonymous User
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Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Boies or W & C

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Aug 28, 2011 10:43 pm

johndhi wrote:
BruceWayne wrote:Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't that the quintessential difference between Williams and Connolly and other top firms? From the Vault guides, general law student word of mouth, their website, low leverage ratio, and their reviews say W&C gives it associates hands on in the trenches substantive experience from day one. In fact, a large part of their selectivity isn't necessarily grades/school based (although a lot of it obviously is) it's having that litigation "it" factor. They don't like resumes that scream academia/nothing but a bookworm/socially awkward, and they don't like resumes that scream "looking for a transactional V10 type position" either. They like WE (particularly military), a focus on things like mock trial and moot court, journal work, and litigation focused coursework. They also aren't big on the up or out thing like a lot of the highly ranked NYC transactional firms, so since they will actually be working with their associates for more than 3 years they care about their hires personality etc.



Dude, you sound like a marketing coordinator for Williams and Connolly. Give me a fucking break about this "it" factor - W&C is a law firm; they file things like motions to dismiss, oppositions to motions for summary judgment and fee motions. They engage in discovery disputes. The water that flows through their faucets will not cure diseases. I agree their system is different from NYC biglaw, but so is the system of any smaller or one-office firm. Great firm, good in certain areas of work, legendary in DC. Let's stop it there.


You're talking to someone who posted in September of 2010!




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