Offer accepted, the TTT gamble pays off

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Jessep
Posts: 94
Joined: Thu Aug 12, 2010 12:07 am

Re: Offer accepted, the TTT gamble pays off

Postby Jessep » Thu Aug 19, 2010 3:21 pm

Pip wrote:
mistergoft wrote:
Pip wrote:You won the lottery. Goto a low ranking school and you will likely find 80-90% of the graduates are making less than $50,000/year.

The real question that I would have for you is whether you will win the next lottery (partner or asked to leave)... that is where you may find that getting your degree without debt is working against you. Unless you perform way beyond the level of your rivals you could fall victim of the snob effect that often comes into play. Partners aren't given to the associates that perform best, their are also things considered such as the network of future clients you bring. If I have two equal associates, one from a lower level school and one from a top school who do I think will be more likely to bring in clients? I would have to go with the one from a top school because he would be more likely to have the country club connections that will generate clients and revenue.

I'm not saying it is fair, but that is the reality of firms and how they operate. I've also seen associates that were better at their job than another associate passed over because they weren't from the right background... so make the best of where you are but don't be surprised if your decision still comes back to smack you on the head 7 years down the road.

Are you an attorney or even someone who works at a large firm? I am not saying that your vantage is necessarily wrong, but "where you went to school" is a quality that is neither necessary nor sufficient in becoming a rainmaker. Also remember that a lot of third to fifth year associates at big firms have comfortable exit options that don't force them to shove their credentials down potential clients throats. fwiw.


I was an attorney until I realized it was more enjoyable working in a company... but I still stay in contact with law school classmates so know not only from first hand experience but from the experience of classmates how the partnership track works across a wide swath of firms... And for the record I never said being from a particular school was a requirement for being a rainmaker, I simply said that many of the partners in law firms that are going to pick the associates to be partners will care... that THEY will believe there is some added pull from a lawyer from an A level school versus a C or D level school.... and I'm not sure how you define a comfortable exist strategy... but when an associate has toiled long hours for 5 years to become a partner where they will work less and make more there really isn't any exist strategy that can make up for that.

I have to question your knowledge a little bit, because of this. It is simply not true. Partners often work more hours than they did as associates.

Going to a better school will mean that your classmates/connections will more likely lead more successful careers, which should leave you with a stronger network. However, I've heard time and time again that once you graduate, very few places care where you went to school. You either have a sales mentality or you do not. Being around successful people at a country club or at a class reunion will not make up for an inability to sell.

Anonymous User
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Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Offer accepted, the TTT gamble pays off

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Aug 22, 2010 2:37 pm

Anonymous User wrote:But I also wanted to share the story for those folks who are considering the same route, so they know it does happen from time to time. I know other students at my school, 3Ls, who pulled it off last year. My strongest advice if you're considering it is to realize that you're (obviously) going to have to be near the top of your class, top 15 percent or higher, and be really aggressive with selling yourself outside of the traditional OCI format. "Really aggressive" means more than 100 mailings, a lot of networking through friends and social networking and linkedin, and starting your summer job push in mid-July, not August.


Would you mind being more specific about this? What exactly did you do? Send unsolicited resumes to top firms? Targeted local firms? Stalk the hiring partners on Facebook? I'd love some more detail.

Anonymous User
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Re: Offer accepted, the TTT gamble pays off

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Aug 25, 2010 7:16 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:But I also wanted to share the story for those folks who are considering the same route, so they know it does happen from time to time. I know other students at my school, 3Ls, who pulled it off last year. My strongest advice if you're considering it is to realize that you're (obviously) going to have to be near the top of your class, top 15 percent or higher, and be really aggressive with selling yourself outside of the traditional OCI format. "Really aggressive" means more than 100 mailings, a lot of networking through friends and social networking and linkedin, and starting your summer job push in mid-July, not August.


Would you mind being more specific about this? What exactly did you do? Send unsolicited resumes to top firms? Targeted local firms? Stalk the hiring partners on Facebook? I'd love some more detail.


OP here. Some things I thought were key (beyond the usual good grades, law review, etc.):

-- Spent my summer interning in federal district court and got a good writing sample out of it. Firms appeared to place a higher value on this than I expected. If you're using a writing sample from legal writing or another class, and you're from a TTT, you're not helping yourself.

-- Booked legal research. Again, firms placed a higher value on this than I expected.

-- Aggressively targeted firms in my desired areas that weren't coming to OCI and that weren't going to OCI at any law schools. There are more firms like this than you realize and the only way you find them is by getting a list of the top 50 law firms in your state and then individually checking out each website to see if they have a summer program. I received at least 3 callbacks with firms that weren't going to campus anywhere (ended up at a bigger firm that did do OCI, although not at my school).

-- Checked each firm's website for partners from my school, sent them a copy of my application, and then contacted them via e-mail and asked them to put in a word with the hiring partner if they liked what they saw.

-- Sent my HARD COPIES of my writing sample, cover letter, resume and transcript, then followed up with e-mail. Multiple hiring partners told me they much preferred hard copies to e-mail. I think you get a much better look at all your stuff when you send hard copies.

-- Sent my stuff in mid-July. I think this was crucial because it got me on certain firms radar before they went to OCI and got busy with other candidates.

-- What didn't work? The farther I got from my TTT, the harder it was to get people to take a look. Firms I applied to which were more than a day's drive universally rejected me, even when I had lived in their state or had alumni at the firm that I contacted.

Hope that helps.

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goosey
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Joined: Tue Aug 19, 2008 11:48 pm

Re: Offer accepted, the TTT gamble pays off

Postby goosey » Wed Aug 25, 2010 7:45 am

Congratulations!!

Thanks for the post, I took the same route myself (TT though, not TTT--but I suppose that makes .05% of a difference) in my first wk of 1L and god do I hope I can bump this post in 2 yrs and say "me too!!"

More important than how your classmates are doing job-wise is how did you get where your are rt now? What were your study habits? How did you conduct your job search--I know you mentioned mailings and networking, but at what point did you start all this?

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20160810
Posts: 19648
Joined: Fri May 02, 2008 1:18 pm

Re: Offer accepted, the TTT gamble pays off

Postby 20160810 » Wed Aug 25, 2010 5:34 pm

Dude 3 CBs from direct mailings from a guy at a TTT is awesome. People at low-ranked schools should read this thread VERY carefully (not saying that people should go to those schools in the first place, that's another debate for another time, but OP is an excellent example of how to hustle and make the best of your situation).

midwestls
Posts: 79
Joined: Sun Jul 05, 2009 9:46 am

Re: Offer accepted, the TTT gamble pays off

Postby midwestls » Thu Aug 26, 2010 5:28 pm

I know three students at my school (third tier) who are having good luck with mailings this recruiting period. All have callbacks with good firms. Not Big Law, not Amlaw 100 or 200, but firms that are very respected in our area and regularly attract grads from the nearest t14.




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