What is the significance of Vault rankings?

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goseminoles
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What is the significance of Vault rankings?

Postby goseminoles » Sun Jul 04, 2010 9:10 pm

Sorry to sound ignorant, I am about to bid for OCI and need some advice. Exactly what is the distinction between different firms (ie V5, V10 etc)? Is this just a prestige ranking? How should you consider it when bidding on firms? Any other tips on bidding strategy at a T10 OCI would be greatly appreciated.

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rayiner
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Re: What is the significance of Vault rankings?

Postby rayiner » Sun Jul 04, 2010 9:15 pm

goseminoles wrote:Sorry to sound ignorant, I am about to bid for OCI and need some advice. Exactly what is the distinction between different firms (ie V5, V10 etc)? Is this just a prestige ranking? How should you consider it when bidding on firms? Any other tips on bidding strategy at a T10 OCI would be greatly appreciated.


It's a prestige ranking, on a logarithmic scale. So Vault #10 is 10x more prestigious than Vault #20, etc.

The prestige scores are from a survey of lawyers in NYC, so it's pretty accurate.

To give you advice about bidding, we need to know your grades.

NYAssociate
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Re: What is the significance of Vault rankings?

Postby NYAssociate » Mon Jul 05, 2010 7:49 am

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Last edited by NYAssociate on Tue Oct 05, 2010 5:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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NewHere
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Re: What is the significance of Vault rankings?

Postby NewHere » Mon Jul 05, 2010 12:43 pm

It is also important to read not only the ranking but also the descriptions of the firms. Your law school probably gives you access to Vault's descriptions. They will help you get an idea of each firm's main practice areas, and their reputations in each, but also an idea of the culture of the firm, in particular the office you are looking at. It's not the same as actually visiting a firm, but if these things are important to you it may help to know if a firm's office is said to be boozy, fratty, nerdy, formal, old-fashioned, etc. Of course these things are all stereotypes, but nevertheless it may help you get an idea of what it would be like to work for a firm.

Chambers is good if you have a rough idea of the kind of work you want to do. Generally speaking, the #1 ranked Vault firm will be better regarded than the #50 firm, but it may be that #50 has the best insurance-law practice in the country, while #1 does nothing but M&A. Chambers is good to find out about reputations of firms' individual practice areas.

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Bosque
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Re: What is the significance of Vault rankings?

Postby Bosque » Tue Jul 06, 2010 12:00 pm

rayiner wrote:
goseminoles wrote:Sorry to sound ignorant, I am about to bid for OCI and need some advice. Exactly what is the distinction between different firms (ie V5, V10 etc)? Is this just a prestige ranking? How should you consider it when bidding on firms? Any other tips on bidding strategy at a T10 OCI would be greatly appreciated.


It's a prestige ranking, on a logarithmic scale. So Vault #10 is 10x more prestigious than Vault #20, etc.

The prestige scores are from a survey of lawyers in NYC, so it's pretty accurate.

To give you advice about bidding, we need to know your grades.


Lulz.

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nealric
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Re: What is the significance of Vault rankings?

Postby nealric » Tue Jul 06, 2010 1:00 pm

The only real way to find your way around law firms is to talk to a lot of people. Keep in mind that while firm X might be "prestigious", it might not be so for a new associate, and/or might be a terrible place to develop as an associate. The Vault rankings tend to be based more on the deals or cases the partners are working on, rather than selectivity or associate experience.

For example, a firm like Skadden may be a V5, but Munger (currently at 40), is considered a more prestigious firm to get an offer from as a junior associate. Skadden is considered a sweatshop with very high leverage and next to no chance of partnership for new hires, while Munger has low leverage and an unusually short partnership track.

The vault rankings also don't track selectivity very well either. For example, Patterson Belknap (currently at 98) is exceedingly selective (has always required top 10% grades at my school), while Jones Day (currently at 19) is comparatively not very selective at all (was hiring sub-median during the boom).

One rule of thumb is that firms with high PPP (profits per partner), but low leverage (partner/associate ratios) are usually more prestigious and selective (i.e. Wachtell). Firms with lower PPP and higher leverage (i.e. DLA Piper) tend to be less prestigious and less selective.

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rayiner
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Re: What is the significance of Vault rankings?

Postby rayiner » Tue Jul 06, 2010 2:36 pm

Bosque wrote:
rayiner wrote:
goseminoles wrote:Sorry to sound ignorant, I am about to bid for OCI and need some advice. Exactly what is the distinction between different firms (ie V5, V10 etc)? Is this just a prestige ranking? How should you consider it when bidding on firms? Any other tips on bidding strategy at a T10 OCI would be greatly appreciated.


It's a prestige ranking, on a logarithmic scale. So Vault #10 is 10x more prestigious than Vault #20, etc.

The prestige scores are from a survey of lawyers in NYC, so it's pretty accurate.

To give you advice about bidding, we need to know your grades.


Lulz.


I think I would've gotten more lulz if people ITT knew what "logrithmic" meant.

NYAssociate
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Re: What is the significance of Vault rankings?

Postby NYAssociate » Tue Jul 06, 2010 3:28 pm

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Last edited by NYAssociate on Tue Oct 05, 2010 5:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Renzo
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Re: What is the significance of Vault rankings?

Postby Renzo » Tue Jul 06, 2010 7:47 pm

rayiner wrote:
Bosque wrote:
rayiner wrote:
goseminoles wrote:Sorry to sound ignorant, I am about to bid for OCI and need some advice. Exactly what is the distinction between different firms (ie V5, V10 etc)? Is this just a prestige ranking? How should you consider it when bidding on firms? Any other tips on bidding strategy at a T10 OCI would be greatly appreciated.


It's a prestige ranking, on a logarithmic scale. So Vault #10 is 10x more prestigious than Vault #20, etc.

The prestige scores are from a survey of lawyers in NYC, so it's pretty accurate.

To give you advice about bidding, we need to know your grades.


Lulz.


I think I would've gotten more lulz if people ITT knew what "logrithmic" meant.

I knew what it meant, and knew you were kidding, but I think it's the correct answer,




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