wealth from being an associate

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yesofcourse
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Re: wealth from being an associate

Postby yesofcourse » Wed Jun 30, 2010 4:49 pm

nealric wrote:
so then vote for Ron Paul to avoid slave labor; otherwise, as is the current case, you will be working for the gov't FOR FREE W/O PAY for an entire 3.5 of those 7 years.


Riiiiighhhhtt. Because Ron Paul is going to single-handedly make all taxes go away :roll:


Granted you could interpret my statement to be stronger than I actually intended it to be (e.g. I never said single-handedly or all taxes); but the relevant point is that Ron is the only person that I am aware of who has ran for the presidency in the recent past that wants to abolish the evil, enslaving federal income tax

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nealric
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Re: wealth from being an associate

Postby nealric » Wed Jun 30, 2010 4:53 pm

Granted you could interpret my statement to be stronger than I actually intended it to be (e.g. I never said single-handedly or all taxes); but the relevant point is that Ron is the only person that I am aware of who has ran for the presidency in the recent past that wants to abolish the evil, enslaving federal income tax


Sure, but you need to be realistic. Nobody who you could possibly vote for is going to radically change the tax system. There is an incredible amount of inertia in the tax code. You can complain about the income tax or deal with it- it's not going anywhere in our lifetimes. Think about this: what OECD country has no income tax?

I could go on, but this thread is not about tax policy.

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sanpiero
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Re: wealth from being an associate

Postby sanpiero » Wed Jun 30, 2010 4:57 pm

agentzer0 wrote:I did this math 2 days ago:

Assumptions:

biglaw lockstep salary for 8 years (included modest bonuses)
$200k of student loans, paid off over 5 years (included interest of course)
$1500/mo housing (perhaps low but I figured this as rent, if you're paying more but it's a mortgage you have to factor in equity)
$1500/mo living expenses (food, gas, fun, etc)
Taxes: State (used NY State), Federal, Social Security, Medicare
Auto Insurance: $1500/year
Medical Insurance: $2400/year
$60k car purchased upon graduation from LS, 4 year note
$120k car purchased at end of biglaw year 4/upon completion of payments for first car; this car also a 4-year note

End Result:

$500k in savings at end of year 8
Note that this is after having spent ~ $185k on cars (certainly an unnecessary expense to incur on this scale, perhaps altogether if living in city with good transit)
Note also that this is assuming renting housing, not buying, which would offset some of the housing cost

No I didn't account for inflation, assumed that biglaw salaries will rise in conjunction; this is not a strong assumption but shouldn't skew these results too much either way.


This is good, agent. Thank you. One comment: you should include the nyc income tax, if you want to be thorough. It's about 3-3.5%, depending on your salary. I'm sure it wouldn't reduce the $500k figure much, maybe by 10 or 15%.

yesofcourse
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Re: wealth from being an associate

Postby yesofcourse » Wed Jun 30, 2010 4:58 pm

nealric wrote:
Granted you could interpret my statement to be stronger than I actually intended it to be (e.g. I never said single-handedly or all taxes); but the relevant point is that Ron is the only person that I am aware of who has ran for the presidency in the recent past that wants to abolish the evil, enslaving federal income tax


Sure, but you need to be realistic. Nobody who you could possibly vote for is going to radically change the tax system. There is an incredible amount of inertia in the tax code. You can complain about the income tax or deal with it- it's not going anywhere in our lifetimes. Think about this: what OECD country has no income tax?

I could go on, but this thread is not about tax policy.


yes, there is the submissive spirit. Also, I'm going to assume that you didn't actually think I intended my initial statement to be a practical solution to OP's enslavement problem.

ravens9111
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Re: wealth from being an associate

Postby ravens9111 » Wed Jun 30, 2010 5:15 pm

yesofcourse wrote:
nealric wrote:
so then vote for Ron Paul to avoid slave labor; otherwise, as is the current case, you will be working for the gov't FOR FREE W/O PAY for an entire 3.5 of those 7 years.


Riiiiighhhhtt. Because Ron Paul is going to single-handedly make all taxes go away :roll:


Granted you could interpret my statement to be stronger than I actually intended it to be (e.g. I never said single-handedly or all taxes); but the relevant point is that Ron is the only person that I am aware of who has ran for the presidency in the recent past that wants to abolish the evil, enslaving federal income tax


Peter Schiff is the other guy. They both also want to abolish the Federal Reserve.

Anonymous User
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Re: wealth from being an associate

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 30, 2010 5:40 pm

ravens9111 wrote:
yesofcourse wrote:
nealric wrote:
so then vote for Ron Paul to avoid slave labor; otherwise, as is the current case, you will be working for the gov't FOR FREE W/O PAY for an entire 3.5 of those 7 years.


Riiiiighhhhtt. Because Ron Paul is going to single-handedly make all taxes go away :roll:


Granted you could interpret my statement to be stronger than I actually intended it to be (e.g. I never said single-handedly or all taxes); but the relevant point is that Ron is the only person that I am aware of who has ran for the presidency in the recent past that wants to abolish the evil, enslaving federal income tax


Peter Schiff is the other guy. They both also want to abolish the Federal Reserve.



I HATE TAXES.... INCOME DISTRIBUTION IS A HOAX.

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Matthies
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Re: wealth from being an associate

Postby Matthies » Wed Jun 30, 2010 6:08 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
I HATE TAXES.... INCOME DISTRIBUTION IS A HOAX.


Only the little people pay taxes

leron
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Re: wealth from being an associate

Postby leron » Wed Jun 30, 2010 6:11 pm

if we don't pay taxes then the federal government will simply pay for things by printing more money. then we will simply be paying "taxes" via inflation. same result.

acrossthelake
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Re: wealth from being an associate

Postby acrossthelake » Wed Jun 30, 2010 6:13 pm

So from I can see from this thread...lawyer=upper middle class lifestyle. That's my goal. I don't see the problem?

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romothesavior
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Re: wealth from being an associate

Postby romothesavior » Wed Jun 30, 2010 6:15 pm

acrossthelake wrote:So from I can see from this thread...lawyer=upper middle class lifestyle. That's my goal. I don't see the problem?


Some lawyers. Very important to keep in mind. The rest of you are screwed. (But not me, I'm T20 safe.)

acrossthelake
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Re: wealth from being an associate

Postby acrossthelake » Wed Jun 30, 2010 6:18 pm

romothesavior wrote:
acrossthelake wrote:So from I can see from this thread...lawyer=upper middle class lifestyle. That's my goal. I don't see the problem?


Some lawyers. Very important to keep in mind.


Ah, yes, I realize that. The OP's math is strange--taxes in the tax bracket he's talking about don't work the way he's talking about, I think, and he assumes when talking about spouses that spouses=negative money rather than splitting the cost of mortgage/propertytax/utilities/bills/etc. I figure my income + future spouse's income=comfortable.

Nobody in my family ever made more than $100K/yr, and I enjoyed a rather comfortable lifestyle. His savings rate is def. off. I know many ppl who do way better than that.

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let/them/eat/cake
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Re: wealth from being an associate

Postby let/them/eat/cake » Wed Jun 30, 2010 8:01 pm

theghostofDrewTate wrote:
Eric475 wrote:How do you feel about what Mathies said, about "firm culture". Though you said you live cheaply, do you find that there are certain expenses that are more or less "necessary", such as expensive suits and such, to "fit in" with the firm culture?

Also, did you do extraordinarily well at your law school to get your biglaw job? what level of school was it? I'm very curious. I also have grown up in a family that is not exactly poor but certainly not too well-off, and feel I could live frugally without much trouble. The trouble is getting the biglaw firm job in the first place


Nobody makes partner at my firm, so saying clothes matter for making partner is irrelevant. I only shop at Brooks Brothers and only when crap is on sale. Sometimes I go to the outlet. I drop maybe around a grand a year on clothes and shoes. I bought some decent suits when I started, but it's not like I'm going out and buying a new pair of Ferragamo kicks every week or something to impress the people I work with. If I fuck up the indemnification section in an agreement, it's not like they'll say "Hey, you fucked up this indemnification section, but your shoes are so nice I'm going to give you a pass." I've gone to plenty of negotiations where I've been WAY overdressed. The clients don't give a crap, as long as I hammer away with them and turn the documents properly, they are happy. At 3 in the morning, they're usually happy someone else is there. Plus, if we go out, I expense that shit back to the firm, so the clients get a good trip out and I don't come out of pocket.

And GCs who steer the quantity of business I would need to make partner wouldn't talk biz with me (right now anyway) regardless of whether I attended the same country club. You make connections from working with people and those people going in house or from having friends from back in the day going in house. I wouldn't steer biz to some clown who came up to me at the CC with a pitch while I was maxing and relaxing unless he was a specialist in some niche and that niche was an area I just had a problem in.

I do M&A and securities work. Fact is, the dudes I work with don't look at other dudes' watches, shoes and suits. That's petty ass 7th grade girl bullshit. They look at the fucking documents we're working on and are a helluva lot more worried about the content of that than whether or not the guy working on it is wearing Tag or some shit. Plus, the clients are pissed as hell about the billing rates, there's really no point in attempting to flash money around.


ROFL. u tell 'em man.

theghostofDrewTate
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Re: wealth from being an associate

Postby theghostofDrewTate » Wed Jun 30, 2010 8:25 pm

let/them/eat/cake wrote:
theghostofDrewTate wrote:
Eric475 wrote:How do you feel about what Mathies said, about "firm culture". Though you said you live cheaply, do you find that there are certain expenses that are more or less "necessary", such as expensive suits and such, to "fit in" with the firm culture?

Also, did you do extraordinarily well at your law school to get your biglaw job? what level of school was it? I'm very curious. I also have grown up in a family that is not exactly poor but certainly not too well-off, and feel I could live frugally without much trouble. The trouble is getting the biglaw firm job in the first place


Nobody makes partner at my firm, so saying clothes matter for making partner is irrelevant. I only shop at Brooks Brothers and only when crap is on sale. Sometimes I go to the outlet. I drop maybe around a grand a year on clothes and shoes. I bought some decent suits when I started, but it's not like I'm going out and buying a new pair of Ferragamo kicks every week or something to impress the people I work with. If I fuck up the indemnification section in an agreement, it's not like they'll say "Hey, you fucked up this indemnification section, but your shoes are so nice I'm going to give you a pass." I've gone to plenty of negotiations where I've been WAY overdressed. The clients don't give a crap, as long as I hammer away with them and turn the documents properly, they are happy. At 3 in the morning, they're usually happy someone else is there. Plus, if we go out, I expense that shit back to the firm, so the clients get a good trip out and I don't come out of pocket.

And GCs who steer the quantity of business I would need to make partner wouldn't talk biz with me (right now anyway) regardless of whether I attended the same country club. You make connections from working with people and those people going in house or from having friends from back in the day going in house. I wouldn't steer biz to some clown who came up to me at the CC with a pitch while I was maxing and relaxing unless he was a specialist in some niche and that niche was an area I just had a problem in.

I do M&A and securities work. Fact is, the dudes I work with don't look at other dudes' watches, shoes and suits. That's petty ass 7th grade girl bullshit. They look at the fucking documents we're working on and are a helluva lot more worried about the content of that than whether or not the guy working on it is wearing Tag or some shit. Plus, the clients are pissed as hell about the billing rates, there's really no point in attempting to flash money around.


ROFL. u tell 'em man.


Tell who what?

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BunkMoreland
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Re: wealth from being an associate

Postby BunkMoreland » Wed Jun 30, 2010 8:42 pm

Is there a list of firms out there who are still biz formal? I like wearing suits and don't want to look like a douche wearing one whenever everyone else is wearing biz casual.

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yinz
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Re: wealth from being an associate

Postby yinz » Wed Jun 30, 2010 8:43 pm

BunkMoreland wrote:Is there a list of firms out there who are still biz formal? I like wearing suits and don't want to look like a douche wearing one whenever everyone else is wearing biz casual.


I prefer BizMarkie.

yesofcourse
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Re: wealth from being an associate

Postby yesofcourse » Wed Jun 30, 2010 8:52 pm

leron wrote:if we don't pay taxes then the federal government will simply pay for things by printing more money. then we will simply be paying "taxes" via inflation. same result.


true but obviously the idea would be to murder the plantation owning fed. reserve in the process

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Matthies
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Re: wealth from being an associate

Postby Matthies » Wed Jun 30, 2010 8:57 pm

BunkMoreland wrote:Is there a list of firms out there who are still biz formal? I like wearing suits and don't want to look like a douche wearing one whenever everyone else is wearing biz casual.


Worry about getting a job first, then worry about what you can wear to that job. Targeting particular firms ITE is so 2007, targeting specific firms because they wear suits more often then other firms, is well, FUCKING INSANE. Trust me you got lots of other stuff to stress out about before this even becomes an issue :D

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romothesavior
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Re: wealth from being an associate

Postby romothesavior » Wed Jun 30, 2010 9:01 pm

Matthies, I'll be targeting firms with the hottest secretaries and paralegals.

Insane, or TCR?

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Matthies
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Re: wealth from being an associate

Postby Matthies » Wed Jun 30, 2010 9:11 pm

romothesavior wrote:Matthies, I'll be targeting firms with the hottest secretaries and paralegals.

Insane, or TCR?


Insane.

ITE you should target frims with older lonely male openly gay partners first, closeted partners that are married second. The first will openly push for your partnership, the second won't vote against it when you e-mail him the pics you took with the hidden camera while you spanked him and he wore a diaper. After your partner you can have all the hot paralegals and secretaries you want, and as a bonus, they will think its "safe:" to be with you cause your 'gay.' Then they get the added thrill of converting you, which make you even hotter property. Seriously, this is how you get ahead (literally and figuratively) in biglaw, while all your peers are slaving away doing work only to get up and out by 7, you will be on partner track and driving a company 7 series. The only difference is while you and the guy down the hall are both getting shafted, your shafting will lead to partnership, while he'll get a pen with the Frims name on it and an Applebee's gift certficate on his way out.

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romothesavior
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Re: wealth from being an associate

Postby romothesavior » Wed Jun 30, 2010 9:13 pm

Matthies wrote:
romothesavior wrote:Matthies, I'll be targeting firms with the hottest secretaries and paralegals.

Insane, or TCR?


Insane.

ITE you should target frims with older lonely male openly gay partners first, closeted partners that are married second. The first will openly push for your partnership, the second won't vote against it when you e-mail him the pics you took with the hidden camera while you spanked him and he wore a diaper. After your partner you can have all the hot paralegals and secretaries you want, and as a bonus, they will think its "safe:" to be with you cause your 'gay.' Then they get the added thrill of converting you, which make you even hotter property. Seriously, this is how you get ahead (literally and figuratively) in biglaw, while all your peers are slaving away doing work only to get up and out by 7, you will be on partner track and driving a company 7 series. The only difference is while you and the guy down the hall are both getting shafted, your shafting will lead to partnership, while he'll get a pen with the Frims name on it and an Applebee's gift certficate on his way out.


So this is what you mean by "networking" eh? Is this before or after the chapter on attending Inns of Court and CLEs?

Also, Applebee's gift certificate or partnership? That's a toss up.

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Matthies
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Re: wealth from being an associate

Postby Matthies » Wed Jun 30, 2010 9:18 pm

romothesavior wrote:
Matthies wrote:
romothesavior wrote:Matthies, I'll be targeting firms with the hottest secretaries and paralegals.

Insane, or TCR?


Insane.

ITE you should target frims with older lonely male openly gay partners first, closeted partners that are married second. The first will openly push for your partnership, the second won't vote against it when you e-mail him the pics you took with the hidden camera while you spanked him and he wore a diaper. After your partner you can have all the hot paralegals and secretaries you want, and as a bonus, they will think its "safe:" to be with you cause your 'gay.' Then they get the added thrill of converting you, which make you even hotter property. Seriously, this is how you get ahead (literally and figuratively) in biglaw, while all your peers are slaving away doing work only to get up and out by 7, you will be on partner track and driving a company 7 series. The only difference is while you and the guy down the hall are both getting shafted, your shafting will lead to partnership, while he'll get a pen with the Frims name on it and an Applebee's gift certficate on his way out.


So this is what you mean by "networking" eh? Is this before or after the chapter on attending Inns of Court and CLEs?

Also, Applebee's gift certificate or partnership? That's a toss up.



If you know how to do the oral sex trick with a glass of warm water, then ice water, then some self heating lube, you don't need networking, you don't even need to pass the freaking bar.

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stratocophic
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Re: wealth from being an associate

Postby stratocophic » Wed Jun 30, 2010 9:33 pm

Matthies wrote:
romothesavior wrote:
Matthies wrote:
romothesavior wrote:Matthies, I'll be targeting firms with the hottest secretaries and paralegals.

Insane, or TCR?


Insane.

ITE you should target frims with older lonely male openly gay partners first, closeted partners that are married second. The first will openly push for your partnership, the second won't vote against it when you e-mail him the pics you took with the hidden camera while you spanked him and he wore a diaper. After your partner you can have all the hot paralegals and secretaries you want, and as a bonus, they will think its "safe:" to be with you cause your 'gay.' Then they get the added thrill of converting you, which make you even hotter property. Seriously, this is how you get ahead (literally and figuratively) in biglaw, while all your peers are slaving away doing work only to get up and out by 7, you will be on partner track and driving a company 7 series. The only difference is while you and the guy down the hall are both getting shafted, your shafting will lead to partnership, while he'll get a pen with the Frims name on it and an Applebee's gift certficate on his way out.


So this is what you mean by "networking" eh? Is this before or after the chapter on attending Inns of Court and CLEs?

Also, Applebee's gift certificate or partnership? That's a toss up.



If you know how to do the oral sex trick with a glass of warm water, then ice water, then some self heating lube, you don't need networking, you don't even need to pass the freaking bar.
:shock: :lol: I like it when Matthies shares the real secrets to getting Biglaw

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TheTopBloke
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Re: wealth from being an associate

Postby TheTopBloke » Wed Jun 30, 2010 9:35 pm

I thought it was all about a series of blowjobs.

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stratocophic
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Re: wealth from being an associate

Postby stratocophic » Wed Jun 30, 2010 9:37 pm

TheTopBloke wrote:I thought it was all about a series of blowjobs.
To-may-to, to-mah-to. Matthies says it's about quality, you say it's about quantity. V20 will probably require a combination of the two ITE, though.

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BunkMoreland
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Re: wealth from being an associate

Postby BunkMoreland » Wed Jun 30, 2010 9:41 pm

Matthies wrote:
BunkMoreland wrote:Is there a list of firms out there who are still biz formal? I like wearing suits and don't want to look like a douche wearing one whenever everyone else is wearing biz casual.


Worry about getting a job first, then worry about what you can wear to that job. Targeting particular firms ITE is so 2007, targeting specific firms because they wear suits more often then other firms, is well, FUCKING INSANE. Trust me you got lots of other stuff to stress out about before this even becomes an issue :D



^_^ of course man. Just a nerdy hobby of mine.


As for me, having been risen by two parents who are DESTITUTE and so in debt that they will work til the day they die due to their poor financial habits and piss-poor jobs/job security, any net worth from $70k-$500k by age 32 for me would be just about, well, insanely amazing. I just spent some time on WSJ, reading "average american" comments who are on unemployment, who don't even have a fucking dime to their name because of Republicans cutting off their unemployment benefits. So, I'll take my chances on biglaw.




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