Black URM, 1L, NYC, T14, BigLaw- looking for advice

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Black URM, 1L, NYC, T14, BigLaw- looking for advice

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jun 28, 2010 4:56 pm

Hello everyone. I will be starting law school at NYU/Columbia (don't want to specify which one) in September. I want to go into BigLaw in NYC after graduation, specifically related to employment law. Besides getting good grades as a 1L, is there anything that you would recommend that I do now? What are some good BigLaw firms that have strong employment law departments? Is it even possible for me to get a job my 1L summer at one of these firms? Any advice would be helpful. Thank you.

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Kohinoor
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Re: Black URM, 1L, NYC, T14, BigLaw- looking for advice

Postby Kohinoor » Mon Jun 28, 2010 7:49 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Hello everyone. I will be starting law school at NYU/Columbia (don't want to specify which one) in September. I want to go into BigLaw in NYC after graduation, specifically related to employment law. Besides getting good grades as a 1L, is there anything that you would recommend that I do now? What are some good BigLaw firms that have strong employment law departments? Is it even possible for me to get a job my 1L summer at one of these firms? Any advice would be helpful. Thank you.

Get good grades as a 1L.

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Re: Black URM, 1L, NYC, T14, BigLaw- looking for advice

Postby NYAssociate » Mon Jun 28, 2010 8:08 pm

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Re: Black URM, 1L, NYC, T14, BigLaw- looking for advice

Postby theghostofDrewTate » Mon Jun 28, 2010 8:20 pm

NYAssociate wrote:That's a fairly specific practice focus that I'm not sure will do you good when you start the job hunt.


Cosign. Not a lot of biglaw shops do a material amount of that work because it is so low margin. Clients just aren't willing to pay. If you do that, the best long term you could probably hope for would be Seyfarth or something similar.

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Re: Black URM, 1L, NYC, T14, BigLaw- looking for advice

Postby NYAssociate » Mon Jun 28, 2010 8:28 pm

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Re: Black URM, 1L, NYC, T14, BigLaw- looking for advice

Postby Kohinoor » Mon Jun 28, 2010 9:19 pm

NYAssociate wrote:
theghostofDrewTate wrote:
NYAssociate wrote:That's a fairly specific practice focus that I'm not sure will do you good when you start the job hunt.


Cosign. Not a lot of biglaw shops do a material amount of that work because it is so low margin. Clients just aren't willing to pay. If you do that, the best long term you could probably hope for would be Seyfarth or something similar.


And that's the other problem. Firms that specialize in employment law really aren't doing that well.

While that's true, he's a rather desirable candidate and many biglaw shops have employment law practices.

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Re: Black URM, 1L, NYC, T14, BigLaw- looking for advice

Postby theghostofDrewTate » Mon Jun 28, 2010 9:26 pm

Kohinoor wrote:
NYAssociate wrote:
theghostofDrewTate wrote:
NYAssociate wrote:That's a fairly specific practice focus that I'm not sure will do you good when you start the job hunt.


Cosign. Not a lot of biglaw shops do a material amount of that work because it is so low margin. Clients just aren't willing to pay. If you do that, the best long term you could probably hope for would be Seyfarth or something similar.


And that's the other problem. Firms that specialize in employment law really aren't doing that well.

While that's true, he's a rather desirable candidate and many biglaw shops have employment law practices.


Yeah, many do have those practices, but most of them are to support M&A. That's it. They don't hire first years for them, either, because they don't have the kind of crank monkey work that firms can make money off of first years with. Out of V50 firms, I'd be shocked if there were more than 10 entry level openings ITE. I don't know, maybe there are a few firms that hire first years because they have big practices in that area, but that door is really narrow. ITE, going into a V50 or V100 firm expecting to do labor work sounds to me like a recipe for OCI suicide, regardless of the "soft" factors involved. Step 1 - get offer. Step 2 - try to get into labor group. Step 3 - profit.

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Re: Black URM, 1L, NYC, T14, BigLaw- looking for advice

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jun 28, 2010 9:45 pm

theghostofDrewTate wrote:
Kohinoor wrote:While that's true, he's a rather desirable candidate and many biglaw shops have employment law practices.


Yeah, many do have those practices, but most of them are to support M&A. That's it. They don't hire first years for them, either, because they don't have the kind of crank monkey work that firms can make money off of first years with. Out of V50 firms, I'd be shocked if there were more than 10 entry level openings ITE. I don't know, maybe there are a few firms that hire first years because they have big practices in that area, but that door is really narrow. ITE, going into a V50 or V100 firm expecting to do labor work sounds to me like a recipe for OCI suicide, regardless of the "soft" factors involved. Step 1 - get offer. Step 2 - try to get into labor group. Step 3 - profit.

For what it's worth, I believe that this year's Orrick SV SA class consists of two 2L SAs and one or two 1Ls. The two 2Ls are in IP and employment law, respectively, and they do not have them option of changing their practice area or sampling other practice areas; Orrick was very clear that they wanted one committed IP person and one committed employment law person.

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Re: Black URM, 1L, NYC, T14, BigLaw- looking for advice

Postby NYAssociate » Mon Jun 28, 2010 10:29 pm

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Re: Black URM, 1L, NYC, T14, BigLaw- looking for advice

Postby vamedic03 » Mon Jun 28, 2010 10:43 pm

If OP includes ERISA in their definition of employment law - then there are more options.

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Re: Black URM, 1L, NYC, T14, BigLaw- looking for advice

Postby rando » Tue Jun 29, 2010 7:59 am

vamedic03 wrote:If OP includes ERISA in their definition of employment law - then there are more options.


Employee benefits/Tax are not even in the same ballpark as labor & employment law.

As far as I can tell L&E has been highly commodotized. Rote work dealing with EEOC and basic discrimination and harassment claims under Title VII. A lot of in-house counsel keep it in house because it is not very difficult.

I am sure there is a lot more to it that I have not been privy to and many more things that employment lawyers do, but I dont know what they are.

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Re: Black URM, 1L, NYC, T14, BigLaw- looking for advice

Postby NYAssociate » Tue Jun 29, 2010 8:38 am

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Re: Black URM, 1L, NYC, T14, BigLaw- looking for advice

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 29, 2010 10:06 am

Thanks for the replies! I am talking about actual labor &employment law related to collective bargaining, grievances, unions, discrimination, etc.

Proskauer for example is known for having a strong labor & employment division.

http://www.proskauer.com/practices/labo ... relations/

What are some other V50 firms that have strong labor and employment divisions?

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Re: Black URM, 1L, NYC, T14, BigLaw- looking for advice

Postby NYAssociate » Tue Jun 29, 2010 10:22 am

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Re: Black URM, 1L, NYC, T14, BigLaw- looking for advice

Postby theghostofDrewTate » Tue Jun 29, 2010 10:23 am

Anonymous User wrote:Thanks for the replies! I am talking about actual labor &employment law related to collective bargaining, grievances, unions, discrimination, etc.

Proskauer for example is known for having a strong labor & employment division.

http://www.proskauer.com/practices/labo ... relations/

What are some other V50 firms that have strong labor and employment divisions?


Paul Hastings might be in this group as well. Look at the attorneys in that group at Proskauer. There are only about 10 associates. I only work at one firm, so don't quote me on this, but I would guess that most of the V50 only have a handful of labor and employment attorneys and their role is likely M&A support and acting as internal counsel for claims filed against the firm. What are your plans long term?

This practice area could explode, however, if the Dems have their way with card check. Unfortunately, it would probably happen before you graduate.

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Re: Black URM, 1L, NYC, T14, BigLaw- looking for advice

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 29, 2010 10:33 am

theghostofDrewTate wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Thanks for the replies! I am talking about actual labor &employment law related to collective bargaining, grievances, unions, discrimination, etc.

Proskauer for example is known for having a strong labor & employment division.

http://www.proskauer.com/practices/labo ... relations/

What are some other V50 firms that have strong labor and employment divisions?


Paul Hastings might be in this group as well. Look at the attorneys in that group at Proskauer. There are only about 10 associates. I only work at one firm, so don't quote me on this, but I would guess that most of the V50 only have a handful of labor and employment attorneys and their role is likely M&A support and acting as internal counsel for claims filed against the firm. What are your plans long term?

This practice area could explode, however, if the Dems have their way with card check. Unfortunately, it would probably happen before you graduate.


My plans for the short-term (right at the end of law school) is to work in BigLaw in NYC. I'm mostly interested in collective bargaining, grievances, contracts, and alternative dispute resolution. This is why labor&employment law seems perfect. Entertainment law as well because of its relationship to the areas I just mentioned. I have no interest in M&A because it is too focused on finance. Ideally, after 5 or so years in BigLaw, I'd like to move in-house at a corporation.

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Re: Black URM, 1L, NYC, T14, BigLaw- looking for advice

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 29, 2010 10:38 am

NYAssociate wrote:Proskauer isn't doing well, either. This is the problem with focusing do early. Overall firm health and reputation is just as important as the strength of a specific department. Moreover, as junior associate, the former is far more relevant.


But when are you supposed to focus on a particular area then? When you go into an interview isn't it good to tell a firm you're particularly interested in them because of Division X?

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Re: Black URM, 1L, NYC, T14, BigLaw- looking for advice

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 29, 2010 11:00 am

NYAssociate wrote:I think Littler Mendelson is big in the area. Again, wouldn't work for them if I had a choice.


Just looked up this firm. They seem to focus on exactly what I want to practice. Why wouldn't you work for them?

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Re: Black URM, 1L, NYC, T14, BigLaw- looking for advice

Postby NYAssociate » Tue Jun 29, 2010 11:05 am

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Re: Black URM, 1L, NYC, T14, BigLaw- looking for advice

Postby NYAssociate » Tue Jun 29, 2010 11:08 am

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