Columbia class rank and bidding advice sought

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Columbia class rank and bidding advice sought

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 11, 2010 12:41 pm

I just got my last 1L grade at Columbia. I ended up with a 3.41. If I understand things correctly, that means I will (just barely) be a Stone Scholar for the year. I have heard conflicting things about where that places me in the class. Columbia used to say that Stone is typically top third of the class. But others have said that for the 1L year Stone is top quarter since 1L grades are lower than 2L/3L grades and the 3.410 is a fixed cutoff for Stone for all 3 years. I also got High Pass both semesters in our legal writing class for what it is worth.

To complicate things further, I had a significant upward trend in grades for second semester. I have a 3.667 for the second semester. Anyone think that is likely to help? Should I expressly mention in interviews this trend? I do think I did much better second semester because I adjusted my writing style for exams and that it wasn't just a fluke.

Any thoughts on where I fall within the 1L Columbia class with a 3.410? Is top quarter or top third a better estimate? More importantly, do I have a shot at some New York firms in the V10? Or will I be wasting bids? Should I focus on firms lower down the list? In this economy, I really don't want to end up without a summer position and I am really unsure how much risk I should take in bidding. I don't want to bid too high and get shut out. But I also don't want to miss out on some great firms if I have a shot at them.

Any and all advice is appreciated!
Last edited by Anonymous User on Fri Jun 11, 2010 3:43 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: 3.41 at Columbia class percentage and bidding advice sought

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 11, 2010 3:41 pm

I also heard Stone is closer to top quarter 1L year as well, but I too would be curious to know if anyone has any solid knowledge on the subject.

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NewHere
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Re: Columbia class rank and bidding advice sought

Postby NewHere » Fri Jun 11, 2010 3:59 pm

You have got 35 bids. Spread them out. Use some of your bids for top firms you'd love to work for, some of your bids for slightly less selective firms, etc., all the way down to the bottom of the list. (Whatever list you use, be it Vault, or a list based on of selectivity received from Career Services, or based on your own preferences, or whatever.)

I think the key is to do more firm research than you might have done in a normal year with a healthy economy. In a good economy, where everyone could count on getting a dozen offers, it was OK to do some rough research and then just see what happened during EIP. Now, it's important to make sure your resume and your interests are as compatible as possible with the firms you're interviewing with.

It's a waste to just throw darts at the list and sign up to interview with random firms, perhaps only chosen based on ranking and city. If you find something about a firm that makes it a good fit for you (a strong Employment Practice group; a market system for assigning work; an office in Kazakhstan, whatever it is that makes them sound better to you than other firms), make your choices based on that. A firm will ask you why you're interested in working for them, and an answer that makes you sound genuinely interested and makes them think that you might be an asset to them, or at least a good fit, will increase your chances of an offer significantly.

Especially firms that hire smaller summer classes place a lot of emphasis on finding the right candidates, passing up on students with stellar grades from top schools in favor of candidates who want to do the work that the firm does and fit well in the firm culture. You want to be that kind of candidate.

Don't use bids on firms you would not want to work for, even if all of your classmates do. If you know that, as great as Cravath's reputation is, you would not want to work for them, save the bid and use it on a firm that you would be happy to receive an offer from.

00TREX00
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Re: Columbia class rank and bidding advice sought

Postby 00TREX00 » Sat Jun 12, 2010 2:47 pm

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Last edited by 00TREX00 on Thu Aug 01, 2013 8:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

06132010
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Re: Columbia class rank and bidding advice sought

Postby 06132010 » Sat Jun 12, 2010 3:14 pm

damn you for getting your con law grade.

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Re: Columbia class rank and bidding advice sought

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Jun 13, 2010 6:10 pm

CLS rising 2L here in basically the same position - still have 1 grade pending, but will be somewhere between 3.41 and 3.56 depending on that grade.

Stone is almost always better than top 1/3, but never top 1/4. CLS cites it as 29% at the lowest for 1L Stone (http://www.law.columbia.edu/careers/car ... ng_and_Hon), which is consistent with what it actually was two years ago if you look at the Stone/Kent callback booklet at Career Services. Top third is a better estimate.

Also, carefully calculate your GPA. For computing Stone, they go out to three decimal places. So if you have a 3.412, you are Stone. If you have a 3.408, you are not.

My feeling is that the V10 is a reach, but it's not wasting bids. I would bid on some of the V10s that are not hyper-selective. For example, STB, Weil, Cleary etc., but not WLRK or S&C. But the bulk of your bids should be lower than that to make sure you don't get shut out. Say reach = V10, target = V50, safety = V100 (roughly speaking - MTO and Irell are V50s but that are way more selective than most V10s - vault rank isn't a perfect proxy for selectivity).

Also, work experience, whether you have a brand-name undergrad, and your interviewing skills will influence how aggressive you can be (the rising 3Ls I've talked to said people with WE outperformed their grades last year).

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Re: Columbia class rank and bidding advice sought

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Jun 13, 2010 6:59 pm

i straight up asked a career counselor once and she told me my rank, even though the school "doesn't rank." worth a shot before wasting time on speculation.

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Re: Columbia class rank and bidding advice sought

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Jun 13, 2010 7:08 pm

Stone is almost always better than top 1/3, but never top 1/4. CLS cites it as 29% at the lowest for 1L Stone (http://www.law.columbia.edu/careers/car ... ng_and_Hon), which is consistent with what it actually was two years ago if you look at the Stone/Kent callback booklet at Career Services. Top third is a better estimate.


What's the Stone/Kent callback booklet? I did EIP two years ago, and such a thing didn't exist at the time.




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