Proskauer Rose minimum class rank to interview by school Forum

[Mickey Quicknumbers]

Classic. I may go watch that movie tonight.

Might just be the Cohen brother's finest. Might be.

[clintonius]

Classic. I may go watch that movie tonight.

Might just be Absofuckinglutely is the Cohen brother's finest, Academy Awards be damned. May God help those who are trying to bring Blood Meridian to film. Might be.

Just a couple changes there.

[bwv812]

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[Anonymous User]

The Law Consortium Hiring Criteria:
Boston College - Top 10%
Boston University - Top 10%
George Washington - Top 15%
Northwestern - Top 40%
University of Texas - Top 30%

I don't really have any feelings on this...just don't care I guess. But since most of TLS is secretly super concerned with prestige , I thought this was poast worthy. Though most big firms don't poast this outright, I'd imagine their hiring criteria is probably around these ranges for these schools.

Are you seriously implying that the top 15% at GW is comparable to top THIRTY % at Texas?

GW ~= UT-Austin for all practical purposes

[09042014]

The Law Consortium Hiring Criteria:
Boston College - Top 10%
Boston University - Top 10%
George Washington - Top 15%
Northwestern - Top 40%
University of Texas - Top 30%

I don't really have any feelings on this...just don't care I guess. But since most of TLS is secretly super concerned with prestige , I thought this was poast worthy. Though most big firms don't poast this outright, I'd imagine their hiring criteria is probably around these ranges for these schools.

Are you seriously implying that the top 15% at GW is comparable to top THIRTY % at Texas?

GW ~= UT-Austin for all practical purposes

OP isn't Pro Ro is

[RVP11]

GW's placement numbers = inflated by IP people

HTH.

[Scallywaggums]

I am not a know-it-all type, but...

So why, as an admittedly ignorant 0L, are you so eager to give advice to 1Ls on where to "bid" (which you somehow interpreted as "send resumes"), offering gems like "ITE don't pick and choose. Think volume, not precision"?

It's this kind of clear retardation that makes people think you should just shut up until you know something.

I assumed that because of the context and lack of knowledge. "Somehow interpreted" suggests it was a ridiculous assumption, but it's really not if you didn't know that "bid", a common word, was in this context a very specific term.

Sealocust was kind enough to correct me in a helpful manner and I apologized on both the "bid" threads I posted on.

Under that incorrect assumption, I made suggestions in line with what I'd seen on other threads. Note, "suggestions". While know-it-all types certainly make suggestions, the simple act of doing so does not in any way make someone a know-it-all.

I'm very open to corrections, which is not what I think of when I think of "know it all types".

Look, I know that those two posts on the two bidding threads wasted some folks' time, but that is why I apologized. I also realize that this "Employment" section is not intended for 0L's, but ITE it's where I've spent 99.9% of my time on TLS, a trend that will likely continue. It's a very useful information-gathering tool for someone to use before taking the plunge. There's a lot on these threads that should be read before one makes the final call, and I'm sorry if that results in you folks needing to correct 0L's from time to time.

But I hardly think posting something that I thought could be helpful constitutes "clear retardation". If I'd just sat around, passively soaking up all this information as you suggest, I would still think that "where should I bid?" was slang for "where should I send my resume?"

Stay classy, TLS... notice how no one has even begun to analyze my suggested method of addressing the comparison question, even to critique it, unless you count "you are wrong", "just quit" and other assorted belligerent insults. The only productive responses are a ways back in this thread. Pure mob mentality dogpiling as of late.

TTT-LS, please respond to my response, or an apology would work as well.

[RPK34]

GW's placement numbers = inflated by IP people

HTH.

I hadn't even thought about that. I wonder how non-IP law students place compared to peer schools.

[bwv812]

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[Scallywaggums]

How would the common meaning of "bid" be equivalent to "send in your resume?" That would be some weird slang, and should have indicated it might have a different meaning. The fact that everyone talks about bids (as opposed to the non-slang "send in your resume") would be another tip-off.

In context, if everyone's asking "X grades, X school, where should I bid?" it's not crazy to assume it means "send your resume" if you've never heard of anything else it could mean.

I've already apologized on those two threads, and I think you're making that a far larger deal than it needs to be.

One thing I believe is that the degree to which I was at fault for commenting in good spirits in an attempt to be helpful, no matter how ignorant, is less than the degree to which you are at fault for being so vicious for such a trivial offense.

This is how people learn. Ignorant folk learn quicker when knowledgeable ones take some time out of their discussions to educate them. It's a trade off, and never before have I encountered such disproportionate hostility in any particular environment when chirping in. Heaven forbid you slow down on behalf of us 0L's who are making important decisions. I guess we should just lurk and STFU until we can piece together what things mean, while the most efficient method of learning is to understand novel things upon first encounter, rather than watching them whiz by in hopes that maybe next time there'll be more context. But then what if there isn't? Do we wait for the 3rd time? 4th?

[thesealocust]

nm

[Mickey Quicknumbers]

I guess we should just lurk and STFU until we can piece together what things mean, while the most efficient method of learning is to understand novel things upon first encounter, rather than watching them whiz by in hopes that maybe next time there'll be more context. But then what if there isn't? Do we wait for the 3rd time? 4th?

"Hi, i'm new here and don't really know much about the hiring process, what do you guys mean when you say to bid on something" could work also.

[Scallywaggums]

Sealocust, I appreciate all the help you've given me, and this is a very witty summary of the situation, not to mention a noble push to diffuse it. I am guilty as charged.

Deity or not, TTT-LS stated this:

give it up dude. These school vs. school comparative battles on TLS are all pretty much pointless. Just let it go.

my response:

"Hooooow about those who share your opinion can disregard such comparisons, and those who don't believe that shades of gray & a significant degree of uncertainty render a practice "pointless" can go on discussing the influence that various schools on one's resume might have on their job prospects."

Many of us find merit in school vs. school comparisons, and I have a sneaking suspicion that TTT-LS does from time to time as well.
If s/he does find merit in such comparisons, then it's reasonable for her/him to apologize, or at least admit that the comment was merely a "STFU", and the words were meaningless. In other words, belligerent dogpiling.
If s/he really stands by the content in the post, I am genuinely interested in why. Many Canadians would certainly hold such a position about their schools.

[Scallywaggums]

"Hi, i'm new here and don't really know much about the hiring process, what do you guys mean when you say to bid on something" could work also.

Yes, but as I've already stated, I made an assumption. It seemed like a reasonable one, and if I had been unsure I would have asked. I've already apologized. But if you'd like, here's another: I'm sorry. Still shocked at how big a deal it is.

[romothesavior]

TTT-LS, please respond to my response, or an apology would work as well.

Scallywaggums: Well meaning but naive 0L, totally overwhelmed by the data. Makes logical inferences from small slivers of data that are farcical to people who have been mired in its entirety for years. For all intents and purposes was born yesterday.

TTT-LS: Easy contender for most helpful poster and most successful law student this board has ever had the privileged to know. Multi-year veteran of law school, job searching, and this forum. As close to a deity as the internet can produce.

TITCR. Scally, you seem nice and all and I can't blame you for your curiosity and lack of knowledge... but you're starting to rub people the wrong way. In this thread alone, you have instigated or insulted two TLS legends (TTT-LS and Mallard). Just be careful what you say.

[bwv812]

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[thesealocust]

nm

[romothesavior]

Heaven forbid you slow down on behalf of us 0L's who are making important decisions.

Board index » Students and Graduates » Legal Employment » Proskauer Rose minimum class rank to interview by school

Just for the record: this is out side of the playground, champ.

Come on... please don't cast a wide net and throw all 0Ls in there. How can we possibly be expected to make an informed decision without participating in the employment threads ocassionally?

[thesealocust]

nm

[romothesavior]

Come on... please don't cast a wide net and throw all 0Ls in there. How can we possibly be expected to make an informed decision without participating in the employment threads ocassionally?

Here's the way I see it:

You're welcome to read. You're welcome to comment, hopefully with some display of understanding of the system (law school gave me a lot of time to think about this shit and introduced me to people living through it, it didn't magically make me better able to read the NALP data). You're welcome to give advice, because plenty of 0Ls are going to know a hell of a lot more than plenty of 1Ls - the legal hiring process is clearly a place with a lot of info that takes individual effort to obtain. And since in my opinion (dare I say "as objective fact") getting a job you like that launches a career you love is the whole point of deciding to go to, choosing, and attending law school I'd be shocked if 0Ls didn't actively wish to participate on this forum.

That being said, it's out side of the playground. That pretty much means exactly and only that if somebody who isn't a law student is wrong and gets huffy about law students saying he's wrong in the forum for law students and graduates, I will respond by saying "this is our side of the playground, champ."

*sits on top of the slide*

*wears trash can on his head*

Haha +1. And I agree. I try to be on my extra-best behavior on your side of the playground, because the primary purpose is for students.

[tbo123123]

Yet another "whats the point of all this" comment.

If we tell you that you have no shot in hell at a certain job, are you seriously that clueless that you need a chat-forum on the "internet" to make life decisions as to where your job application has a shot?

You clearly realize, if you've lived in the "real world" after around the middle school mark, that intangibles play a factor in any job hunt, may it be for NASA, the presidency, or some stupid summer associate position at a law firm.

Having said all this, what information could we POSSIBLY give you to make your life any easier? What if I told you that Proskauer interviews using a randomizer. They buy a randomizer, and they figure out what percentile they're going to interview at a certain school. Or, they use a randomizer on the actual applicant at the time of the interview using a coin flip. Or, they have statistically usually hired only certain schools.

Are you going to NOT INTERVIEW with them based on what some dumbass on the internet tells you? Are you going to NOT INTERVIEW with them if your own class standing is below their empirical hiring history? Are you going to reject PR because THEY have rejected people around your shitty class standing? Is your overall "bidding strategy" going to change because of a chat forum? Does your school HAVE a career counselor? Is your life so crappy that your career counselor is a chat forum!?

What exactly are you doing dude?!? How is any life decision you make going to alter by the SLIGHTEST by bogus information you can possibly glean from dumbasses on this forum!??

Are you going to "prepare less" about the history of PR and why you want to work there if we tell you that your odds are slim!? Shouldn't the opposite actually happen?! If the odds ARE good, shouldn't you want to do your due research anyway regardless of what the odds are?! Having aged 20 days after middle school, don't you get that you are just a number among thousands of applicants from schools all across the country for one seat on the hamster wheel that you so nuttily aspire to? In that event, if it IS a numbers game, isn't it in your best interests to play all the numbers on this bullshit roulette wheel!?

Here's what I think is happening - I think you masterbate too much. I think you wank off to the possibilities that abound if some anonymous dumbass on the "internet" tells you that you have a shot. You haven't felt "worthy" for quite some time now, and you're using law school and jobs to fill some void in your sexuality.
Well, I'm at work, engaging in time-theft, but this was fun.

[let/them/eat/cake]

Yet another "whats the point of all this" comment.

If we tell you that you have no shot in hell at a certain job, are you seriously that clueless that you need a chat-forum on the "internet" to make life decisions as to where your job application has a shot?

You clearly realize, if you've lived in the "real world" after around the middle school mark, that intangibles play a factor in any job hunt, may it be for NASA, the presidency, or some stupid summer associate position at a law firm.

Having said all this, what information could we POSSIBLY give you to make your life any easier? What if I told you that Proskauer interviews using a randomizer. They buy a randomizer, and they figure out what percentile they're going to interview at a certain school. Or, they use a randomizer on the actual applicant at the time of the interview using a coin flip. Or, they have statistically usually hired only certain schools.

Are you going to NOT INTERVIEW with them based on what some dumbass on the internet tells you? Are you going to NOT INTERVIEW with them if your own class standing is below their empirical hiring history? Are you going to reject PR because THEY have rejected people around your shitty class standing? Is your overall "bidding strategy" going to change because of a chat forum? Does your school HAVE a career counselor? Is your life so crappy that your career counselor is a chat forum!?

What exactly are you doing dude?!? How is any life decision you make going to alter by the SLIGHTEST by bogus information you can possibly glean from dumbasses on this forum!??

Are you going to "prepare less" about the history of PR and why you want to work there if we tell you that your odds are slim!? Shouldn't the opposite actually happen?! If the odds ARE good, shouldn't you want to do your due research anyway regardless of what the odds are?! Having aged 20 days after middle school, don't you get that you are just a number among thousands of applicants from schools all across the country for one seat on the hamster wheel that you so nuttily aspire to? In that event, if it IS a numbers game, isn't it in your best interests to play all the numbers on this bullshit roulette wheel!?

Here's what I think is happening - I think you masterbate too much. I think you wank off to the possibilities that abound if some anonymous dumbass on the "internet" tells you that you have a shot. You haven't felt "worthy" for quite some time now, and you're using law school and jobs to fill some void in your sexuality.
Well, I'm at work, engaging in time-theft, but this was fun.

tbo123123 is rapidly becoming my new favorite poster. Did anyone see his post about math? Hilarious.

[romothesavior]

BLAAAARGH!!! ANGRY RANT!!!

tbo123123 is rapidly becoming my new favorite poster. Did anyone see his post about math? Hilarious.

This was funny, but who was it directed at?

[Scallywaggums]

Scally, you seem nice and all and I can't blame you for your curiosity and lack of knowledge... but you're starting to rub people the wrong way. In this thread alone, you have instigated or insulted two TLS legends (TTT-LS and Mallard). Just be careful what you say.

Mallard: I did not insult him, I responded to his assumption with "no", which I've already characterized as stupid apologized for it.

TTT-LS: Apparently I instigated an insulting STFU, and I am to blame?
Lets recount my instigation:

1) Mallard throws out a thought on NU50% being roughly equivalent in job prospects to CCN top 2/3
2) I disagree and post the 2009 NLJ 250 data for top 10 schools
3) People flip out: "You are saying that NU>Yale! Clerkships, PI, Gov etc.! Daaaa, you are wrong"
4) I explain that I believe it still suggests something, due to NU & Columbia tendencies to send their top students to BigLaw.
5) Amid thoughtless belligerence, to the tune of "wrongitty wrong wrong", Desert Fox and Miami Man make productive points that get to the root of why the data shown cannot be relied on.
6) I offer a more comprehensive approach: looking at the 2008 data and trying to come up with an "undesirable job placement" category, I suggest that I don't see a 17% difference, acknowledging why things may be different ITE.
7) Reactions are as if I were on a personal vendetta against Mallard, rather than genuinely curious. No one has yet even responded to that suggested method of analyzing the subject in question, not even to tell me "here's why it's a bad method", nor has anyone offered any information suggesting that Mallard's posited comparison is probably accurate.
[apparently "8)" produces a sunglasses smiley]) Amid the venomous, thoughtless "you're wrongs", TTT-LS jumps in with a 'drop it. these comparisons are pointless', to paraphrase.
9) I am insulted, because i enjoy comparisons, and feel that disagreeing with the validity of such a practice is not grounds for stifling others' engagement in it (unless they're harming people).
10) Rather than cower into a corner, I respond "How about if you think there's no point, you don't participate in said comparisons, while those who do think there's a point can participate"
11) This was responding to an insult, an insult that has yet to be defended... but spoken by a deity, so I am in the wrong.

I'm sure that, even had I tried my hardest in college, I couldn't be as successful as either of the two. But this shouldn't be a pissing contest if a n00b steps on the toes of an established great, it should be an exchange of ideas on their own terms.

I've already apologized for my childish, shoot-from-the hip without much thought reaction to Mallard, and I meant it sincerely. But I still would like a response from TTT-LS, or otherwise an apology.

[Scallywaggums]

One thing I believe is that the degree to which I was at fault for commenting in good spirits in an attempt to be helpful, no matter how ignorant, is less than the degree to which you are at fault for being so vicious for such a trivial offense.

This was used as an example of your willingness to speak and offer advice despite your ignorance, something which is evident in almost all of your posts that I've seen. These sorts of posts explain a lot of the reaction you're seeing here.

Stating a subjective belief about the difference in fault between my misstep and your insults is just that, stating a subjective belief. It is NOT offering advice. Even if it were, it is in the realm of values which I have as much knowledge of as you: none.

Let's say my mistake on those two threads was as reprehensible as you make it out to be. Why?
The degree to which it is reprehensible is the degree to which it wastes peoples' time, the degree to which it disrupts the flow of information between more knowledgeable posters.

You have been far more of a disruption by flogging me for it publicly than I ever was, so yes, now I AM offering advice: Let. It. Go.

If anyone wants to see how terribly I interrupted these threads, they are here
http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 3&t=119953
http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 3&t=119875