Non-menial work, 8-5, ~$60K start: possible?

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Scallywaggums
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Re: Non-menial work, 8-5, ~$60K start: possible?

Postby Scallywaggums » Wed Jun 09, 2010 7:02 pm

icydash wrote:***1) Is there a stigma in being a prosecutor, in the eyes of the non-legal world (read: potential clients)?
Would it be harder to start a business in an area where many people have been - or know someone who has been - on the receiving end of your work?


(1) I don't get the question -- Are you asking if it'd be hard to start a business when half your potential clients you put in jail?
[/quote]

Exactly.

Do you have a stigma for being the dude who fined Joey's ol' grandmamma 'cause she got caught doing something harmless yet illegal?

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Scallywaggums
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Re: Non-menial work, 8-5, ~$60K start: possible?

Postby Scallywaggums » Wed Jun 09, 2010 7:05 pm

articulably suspect wrote:To points 2 and 3:

2-Where I am at, about five years in, a prosecutor who began his legal career(right out of law school) at this particular local goverment office was making over 100K. That's a fact. I don't know if that is the case everywhere though.

3-It has happened. The main perks seem to be the flexible hours(seeing your family, leaving in the middle of the day to get your kids, etc.)


Thanks. This is really great news. Prosecutor seems to be the best answer... although based on other threads it appears that expectations of landing a prosecutor job straight out, let alone any legal job would be foolish.

icydash
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Re: Non-menial work, 8-5, ~$60K start: possible?

Postby icydash » Wed Jun 09, 2010 7:54 pm

Scallywaggums wrote:Exactly.

Do you have a stigma for being the dude who fined Joey's ol' grandmamma 'cause she got caught doing something harmless yet illegal?

Hey man, that's on the cops and whoever ratted her out. You're the last person in a long line of people whose "fault" it is more than yours that grandma got caught doing something wrong (including grandma).


I don't think there's any kind of stigma like this.
Last edited by icydash on Wed Jun 09, 2010 9:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

articulably suspect
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Re: Non-menial work, 8-5, ~$60K start: possible?

Postby articulably suspect » Wed Jun 09, 2010 9:34 pm

Scallywaggums wrote:
articulably suspect wrote:To points 2 and 3:

2-Where I am at, about five years in, a prosecutor who began his legal career(right out of law school) at this particular local goverment office was making over 100K. That's a fact. I don't know if that is the case everywhere though.

3-It has happened. The main perks seem to be the flexible hours(seeing your family, leaving in the middle of the day to get your kids, etc.)


Thanks. This is really great news. Prosecutor seems to be the best answer... although based on other threads it appears that expectations of landing a prosecutor job straight out, let alone any legal job would be foolish.


Well, it's depends on the area you end up at, so don't just take my one fact as the standard, be it starting salary or at what pace prosecutors climb from I to II, etc. Like I said, county and state salaries can be looked up. Hiring freezes are prevalnnt, however, intern and externships are too.

Prosecution can be a rewarding job, no doubt, but you my friend have put many carts before many horses. You may intern at a DA's office, end up loving something entirely different or never get the opportunity to intern or get hired on at a DA's office. There are a lot of unknowns in your future, but it doesn't hurt to start thinking about the possibilities I suppose.

Most offices will not officially hire you as a prosecutor(level I) until you have passed the bar in your chosen state. Passing the bar is a minimum quaification, but they may have you work as a clerk prior to passing the bar or give you some sort of a conditional agreement of employment, which are again...my anecdotes.

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danquayle
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Re: Non-menial work, 8-5, ~$60K start: possible?

Postby danquayle » Mon Mar 05, 2012 4:05 pm

In-house jobs like this are not too difficult to find. There are certainly jobs where you can work anywhere from 35 hours a week to 60 hours a week and make anywhere from 60k to 100k+.

Of course you get the exceptional weekend of work in any legal job...

Scallywaggums wrote:Updated, in light of responses:

3 criteria:

1) Thinking critically and creatively within a year.
2) As close to 50 hour weeks as possible. Weekend work rare.
3) A starting salary which isn't laughed at by student loans.

***NO financial help***

Options
---Hit T11-20 with no scholarship
---Or any degree of lower rank and higher scholarship.

2 Questions
1) What legal fields are a closest fit for the 3 criteria?
2) Would you favor T11-20 no scholly, or T21-40 with about 50% scholly? [My risk aversion is more toward an unsatisfactory job than unsatisfactory debt, such that I would rather have extremely good odds of landing a job that fit my needs with debt than graduate debt-free stuck in shitlaw]

New To This Thread? Summary of Subjects Covered Below:

- Clerking out of grad could be good
- Firms with 50 hour workweeks exist, but are rare
- Government: DOJ, regulatory or administrative law. All very difficult spots to land.
- The ideal end game would be starting a firm

** Public Prosecutors are the current main subject. See Page 7.

Massive schollys with top 1/3 conditionality are apparently poison. Regardless of reasons, people frequently miss the mark.

Any input would be appreciated. [Note: I am set on law, and this thread isn't just about me, so please no more advice to bail]

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Indifferent
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Re: Non-menial work, 8-5, ~$60K start: possible?

Postby Indifferent » Mon Mar 05, 2012 4:08 pm

danquayle wrote:In-house jobs like this are not too difficult to find.

Orly?

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danquayle
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Re: Non-menial work, 8-5, ~$60K start: possible?

Postby danquayle » Mon Mar 05, 2012 4:09 pm

Indifferent wrote:
danquayle wrote:In-house jobs like this are not too difficult to find.

Orly?


They're not hard to find. Did I say they were easy to get? Sorry for the confusion.

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Antilles Haven
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Re: Non-menial work, 8-5, ~$60K start: possible?

Postby Antilles Haven » Mon Mar 05, 2012 4:13 pm

Hyuckles.

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danquayle
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Re: Non-menial work, 8-5, ~$60K start: possible?

Postby danquayle » Mon Mar 05, 2012 4:15 pm

Antilles Haven wrote:Hyuckles.


Now I remember why I stopped coming to this site. Enjoy your job hunt.

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Antilles Haven
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Re: Non-menial work, 8-5, ~$60K start: possible?

Postby Antilles Haven » Mon Mar 05, 2012 4:16 pm

danquayle wrote:
Antilles Haven wrote:Hyuckles.


Now I remember why I stopped coming to this site. Enjoy your job hunt.

Lolwut? I was just paying tribute.

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Indifferent
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Re: Non-menial work, 8-5, ~$60K start: possible?

Postby Indifferent » Mon Mar 05, 2012 4:33 pm

danquayle wrote:
Indifferent wrote:
danquayle wrote:In-house jobs like this are not too difficult to find.

Orly?


They're not hard to find. Did I say they were easy to get? Sorry for the confusion.

OP wrote:Re: Non-menial work, 8-5, ~$60K start: possible?

Yes, but people being hired in house by firms straight out of law school are hard to find.

mrloblaw
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Re: Non-menial work, 8-5, ~$60K start: possible?

Postby mrloblaw » Mon Mar 05, 2012 6:01 pm

Edit: Why did this get revived from 2010, again? I assumed I was responding to something at least marginally relevant.

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ggocat
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Re: Non-menial work, 8-5, ~$60K start: possible?

Postby ggocat » Mon Mar 05, 2012 6:02 pm

mrloblaw wrote:Edit: Why did this get revived from 2010, again? I assumed I was responding to something at least marginally relevant.

Yeah, I facepalmed when you said you read the first five pages and then proceeded to give actual advice to the OP. :lol:

mrloblaw
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Re: Non-menial work, 8-5, ~$60K start: possible?

Postby mrloblaw » Mon Mar 05, 2012 6:05 pm

ggocat wrote:
mrloblaw wrote:Edit: Why did this get revived from 2010, again? I assumed I was responding to something at least marginally relevant.

Yeah, I facepalmed when you said you read the first five pages and then proceeded to give actual advice to the OP. :lol:


The facepalm was well deserved.

Anonymous User
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Re: Non-menial work, 8-5, ~$60K start: possible?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Mar 07, 2012 1:07 pm

Going back to some of the original questions, I have offers from two law firms, both in small Midwest towns. Both are the biggest firms in their small cities but still small firms overall. Both offer about $50k to start, < 50 hour work weeks, and varied work assignments. These jobs aren't easy to find and are even harder to get (even if you get an SA position, they sometimes go years without hiring an SA; they are looking for a perfect fit), but they do exist. A word of caution is that a lot of the smaller firms in their areas do have an associate or two, but they make < $40k with no realistic path to partner. Small firms vary a lot, so you have to be careful.

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Re: Non-menial work, 8-5, ~$60K start: possible?

Postby Jhuen_the_bird » Thu Mar 08, 2012 1:16 pm

Scallywaggums wrote:Thanks for taking this seriously. I do not want to be a career law clerk though.

I realize I won't be in a primary market. I'd like to stay away from in-house work. I'd like to either work in Gov or for a firm that primarily represents individuals, rather than corporations. Sounds like the hours are still intense though.

So, building off this: is there such a thing as small/boutique/mid law firms in non-primary markets with an 8-6 workday, Mon-Fri?


The problem with your criteria is that law is inconsistent. Sure, some days you might be able to work 8-5 or 9-6 or even leave early or come in late if you aren't busy. But other days / weeks you might be pulling all nighters to get something done. The more substantive work you're given, the busier you will be - it takes a lot of work to travel for depositions or meet sudden deadlines, etc. You also can't control when clients are going to call and/or need something.

I suppose some bankruptcy or creditor's rights firms might have more consistent hours, but it's not super creative work - a lot of repetition. Some family law attorneys keep more set hours, but you have to just ignore clients after a certain point in the evening. Neither of these jobs are probably going to pay you $60K, though ... definitely not initially.

A lot of your "I want this type of job" that you think BEFORE law school flies out the window as a result of experiences you have / things you learn / and the nature of the economy and legal job market now.

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Re: Non-menial work, 8-5, ~$60K start: possible?

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Mar 11, 2012 10:47 pm

I get similar pay and work less than 40 hours a week. Get the pension and health care to. So yes, these positions are out there but generally are non-attorney jobs.

Also IBR PSLF, so I pay back about 1/4th of what I actually owe.




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