Who's hurting worse, big markets or secondary/tertiary?

(On Campus Interviews, Summer Associate positions, Firm Reviews, Tips, ...)
Forum rules
Anonymous Posting

Anonymous posting is only appropriate when you are revealing sensitive employment related information about a firm, job, etc. You may anonymously respond on topic to these threads. Unacceptable uses include: harassing another user, joking around, testing the feature, or other things that are more appropriate in the lounge.

Failure to follow these rules will get you outed, warned, or banned.
User avatar
Sauer Grapes
Posts: 1222
Joined: Wed Dec 16, 2009 11:02 am

Who's hurting worse, big markets or secondary/tertiary?

Postby Sauer Grapes » Sat Jun 05, 2010 4:42 pm

The employment struggles of those looking to find work in large markets such as NY, DC, Chicago, CA, etc have been well publicized. It's no secret that the secondary markets aren't exactly thriving either. However, there seems to be less news about the actual state of secondary and tertiary legal markets (as would logically be expected).

That being said, are secondary markets, on average, hurting in relative proportion to the larger markets, or are they hurting more or less? I understand the VAST majority of those on TLS are looking for big law jobs in the major markets, but for those of us that don't mind the thought of working at a national firm in a smaller market, are we equally as screwed as everyone else, or more or less so?

User avatar
romothesavior
Posts: 14772
Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2009 4:29 pm

Re: Who's hurting worse, big markets or secondary/tertiary?

Postby romothesavior » Fri Jun 11, 2010 2:29 am

I'll bump this for my good man Sauer Grapes. I'm also very interested in this.

User avatar
MorningHood
Posts: 41
Joined: Mon Sep 07, 2009 3:16 am

Re: Who's hurting worse, big markets or secondary/tertiary?

Postby MorningHood » Fri Jun 11, 2010 2:31 am

I think the only way to answer this is through published statistics... is there a place where we could find this information?

User avatar
Mickey Quicknumbers
Posts: 2177
Joined: Tue Apr 28, 2009 1:22 pm

Re: Who's hurting worse, big markets or secondary/tertiary?

Postby Mickey Quicknumbers » Fri Jun 11, 2010 2:58 am

Intuitively, it would seem that if most law students shifted to their safeties or lower for hiring based on biglaw woes, it would make midlaw for those who usually targeted/reached for it even worse than biglaw. As far as the actual shrinking of new jobs, I have no clue :(

tl;dr version: bump

motiontodismiss
Posts: 870
Joined: Wed Mar 24, 2010 8:36 pm

Re: Who's hurting worse, big markets or secondary/tertiary?

Postby motiontodismiss » Fri Jun 11, 2010 1:10 pm

Could go one of three ways:

1. Secondary markets supported themselves independently of the real estate boom. Their home industries are strong and thus are insulated from the shit economy.
2. Secondary markets barely justified their existence because of the the real estate boom. Their home industries are nonexistent and thus the market itself is decimated. OR
3. Secondary markets supported themselves independently of the real estate boom. Their home industries are also in the shit and thus are worse off than primary markets.

User avatar
romothesavior
Posts: 14772
Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2009 4:29 pm

Re: Who's hurting worse, big markets or secondary/tertiary?

Postby romothesavior » Fri Jun 11, 2010 1:12 pm

motiontodismiss wrote:Could go one of three ways:

1. Secondary markets supported themselves independently of the real estate boom. Their home industries are strong and thus are insulated from the shit economy.
2. Secondary markets barely justified their existence because of the the real estate boom. Their home industries are nonexistent and thus the market itself is decimated. OR
3. Secondary markets supported themselves independently of the real estate boom. Their home industries are also in the shit and thus are worse off than primary markets.


Rrrrreally now... The entire legal industry depends on the real estate market?

User avatar
Grizz
Posts: 10583
Joined: Mon Jan 04, 2010 6:31 pm

Re: Who's hurting worse, big markets or secondary/tertiary?

Postby Grizz » Fri Jun 11, 2010 1:15 pm

Depends on the secondary market I guess (subtle bump).

User avatar
Matthies
Posts: 1253
Joined: Fri Aug 14, 2009 6:18 pm

Re: Who's hurting worse, big markets or secondary/tertiary?

Postby Matthies » Fri Jun 11, 2010 1:38 pm

MorningHood wrote:I think the only way to answer this is through published statistics... is there a place where we could find this information?


No. The only way to answer this is by talking to actual lawyers in the markets your interested in.

User avatar
romothesavior
Posts: 14772
Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2009 4:29 pm

Re: Who's hurting worse, big markets or secondary/tertiary?

Postby romothesavior » Fri Jun 11, 2010 1:40 pm

Matthies wrote:
MorningHood wrote:I think the only way to answer this is through published statistics... is there a place where we could find this information?


No. The only way to answer this is by talking to actual lawyers in the markets your interested in.


Which I'm doing in an hour. :D I'll let you know how it goes.

User avatar
Sauer Grapes
Posts: 1222
Joined: Wed Dec 16, 2009 11:02 am

Re: Who's hurting worse, big markets or secondary/tertiary?

Postby Sauer Grapes » Fri Jun 11, 2010 6:50 pm

romothesavior wrote:
Matthies wrote:
MorningHood wrote:I think the only way to answer this is through published statistics... is there a place where we could find this information?


No. The only way to answer this is by talking to actual lawyers in the markets your interested in.


Which I'm doing in an hour. :D I'll let you know how it goes.

Please do let me know how it goes/went. STL is still one of my locations of interest.

User avatar
NoleinNY
Posts: 1031
Joined: Mon Sep 14, 2009 4:58 pm

Re: Who's hurting worse, big markets or secondary/tertiary?

Postby NoleinNY » Fri Jun 11, 2010 7:15 pm

romothesavior wrote:
motiontodismiss wrote:Could go one of three ways:

1. Secondary markets supported themselves independently of the real estate boom. Their home industries are strong and thus are insulated from the shit economy.
2. Secondary markets barely justified their existence because of the the real estate boom. Their home industries are nonexistent and thus the market itself is decimated. OR
3. Secondary markets supported themselves independently of the real estate boom. Their home industries are also in the shit and thus are worse off than primary markets.


Rrrrreally now... The entire legal industry depends on the real estate market?


0L just making assumptions/observations:

Not entirely dependent. Depending on the specific market, however, it would be reasonable to imagine the health of lenders and real estate sales having a cascading effect on their legal industries.

1. Example: ???
2. Example: South Florida
3. Example: Detroit

User avatar
ggocat
Posts: 1662
Joined: Sat Dec 13, 2008 1:51 pm

Re: Who's hurting worse, big markets or secondary/tertiary?

Postby ggocat » Fri Jun 11, 2010 8:42 pm

As others have said, it likely depends on the particular area.

Anecdotally, I think smaller markets have done better. Firms in smaller markets (not even secondary markets--think 100K-300K people) near me have continued to hire normally while biglaw dramatically cut back. These firms only hire a handful of people every year, but they've continued at their normal pace.

User avatar
Scallywaggums
Posts: 249
Joined: Tue Apr 20, 2010 12:52 pm

Re: Who's hurting worse, big markets or secondary/tertiary?

Postby Scallywaggums » Sat Jun 12, 2010 9:37 pm

romothesavior wrote:Which I'm doing in an hour. :D I'll let you know how it goes.

So?


Thx ggocat.

Hopefully this bump will generate more input.

Anonymous User
Posts: 273121
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Who's hurting worse, big markets or secondary/tertiary?

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Jun 12, 2010 9:42 pm

I'm at a firm in NYC. The work here has definitely picked up since last year, according to associates I've spoken with.

User avatar
stratocophic
Posts: 2207
Joined: Tue Dec 22, 2009 6:24 pm

Re: Who's hurting worse, big markets or secondary/tertiary?

Postby stratocophic » Sat Jun 12, 2010 10:13 pm

romothesavior wrote:
Matthies wrote:
MorningHood wrote:I think the only way to answer this is through published statistics... is there a place where we could find this information?


No. The only way to answer this is by talking to actual lawyers in the markets your interested in.


Which I'm doing in an hour. :D I'll let you know how it goes.
Spill it, romo. I need to know whether STL is gonna be a viable option in a year or two. By the by, did you happen to ask your sources about any other currently relevant topics... like saaaay... the hypothetical pros and cons inherent to Bears and Wolverines?

User avatar
Grizz
Posts: 10583
Joined: Mon Jan 04, 2010 6:31 pm

Re: Who's hurting worse, big markets or secondary/tertiary?

Postby Grizz » Sat Jun 12, 2010 10:26 pm

stratocophic wrote:Spill it, romo. I need to know whether STL is gonna be a viable option in a year or two. By the by, did you happen to ask your sources about any other currently relevant topics... like saaaay... the hypothetical pros and cons inherent to Bears and Wolverines?


Romo was in killself mode earlier. Guess how it went.

User avatar
stratocophic
Posts: 2207
Joined: Tue Dec 22, 2009 6:24 pm

Re: Who's hurting worse, big markets or secondary/tertiary?

Postby stratocophic » Sat Jun 12, 2010 10:36 pm

rad law wrote:
stratocophic wrote:Spill it, romo. I need to know whether STL is gonna be a viable option in a year or two. By the by, did you happen to ask your sources about any other currently relevant topics... like saaaay... the hypothetical pros and cons inherent to Bears and Wolverines?


Romo was in killself mode earlier. Guess how it went.

--ImageRemoved--

User avatar
Scallywaggums
Posts: 249
Joined: Tue Apr 20, 2010 12:52 pm

Re: Who's hurting worse, big markets or secondary/tertiary?

Postby Scallywaggums » Sat Jun 12, 2010 10:57 pm

reddit has been breached




Return to “Legal Employment”

Who is online

The online users are hidden on this forum.