Patent Bar for 1L SA?

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09042014
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Patent Bar for 1L SA?

Postby 09042014 » Tue May 25, 2010 3:14 pm

I'm going to be going to Northwestern next year, I have a BSEE from a good school with poor grades, 2.8. I've got two years of weak job experience.

I'm not totally sure what I want to do, but I'd be interested at Patent Litigation at a big firm.

However, I've been told that EE's at t14, did well last year with 1L employment at firms with patent departments.

Should I take the patent bar purely to help with my shot at a 1L SA? Will it help at all? I have time to study, but it costs 600 dollars, that I'll just end up paying 8% interest on for years.

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Duralex
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Re: Patent Bar for 1L SA?

Postby Duralex » Tue May 25, 2010 3:50 pm

I'd do it now and get it over with if you feel like you can, before you get any further out from your BS in time--whether or not it helps.

Also, I wish I had known that a BS was mandatory for admission to the patent bar (realistically speaking.) I'd have gone that route, or double majored. Seems odd that a MS won't do it, if you can find someone to admit you with a BA, but apparently not. I've daydreamed about doing some kind of accelerated second degree compsci BS (in person or online--I took the intro for majors at my undergrad as my lab science and got an A) but I can't imagine I'll have the steam left to do it after LS.

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Janus
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Re: Patent Bar for 1L SA?

Postby Janus » Tue May 25, 2010 3:56 pm

I was interested in taking the patent bar too. I only need one more physics course to qualify under Route B. But, then I saw various information on TLS that without a PhD firms won't hire you to do patent law even if you pass the patent bar. So, I've sort of written that off. But, I like the idea that it could help with summer employment regardless of whether you will practice patient law. I also heard that the pass rate for the patent bar is around 50%.

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Duralex
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Re: Patent Bar for 1L SA?

Postby Duralex » Tue May 25, 2010 3:58 pm

Janus wrote:I was interested in taking the patent bar too. I only need one more physics course to qualify under Route B. But, then I saw various information on TLS that without a PhD firms won't hire you to do patent law even if you pass the patent bar. So, I've sort of written that off. But, I like the idea that it could help with summer employment regardless of whether you will practice patient law. I also heard that the pass rate for the patent bar is around 50%.


I thought that the route that doesn't require a four year degree requires you to have demonstrated qualification by having made some kind of significant, recognized contribution to the field (as determined by USPTO?)

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Janus
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Re: Patent Bar for 1L SA?

Postby Janus » Tue May 25, 2010 4:10 pm

Duralex wrote:
Janus wrote:I was interested in taking the patent bar too. I only need one more physics course to qualify under Route B. But, then I saw various information on TLS that without a PhD firms won't hire you to do patent law even if you pass the patent bar. So, I've sort of written that off. But, I like the idea that it could help with summer employment regardless of whether you will practice patient law. I also heard that the pass rate for the patent bar is around 50%.


I thought that the route that doesn't require a four year degree requires you to have demonstrated qualification by having made some kind of significant, recognized contribution to the field (as determined by USPTO?)



That may be route C. There's at least route A, route B, route C, and there may even be a D.

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Big Shrimpin
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Re: Patent Bar for 1L SA?

Postby Big Shrimpin » Tue May 25, 2010 4:14 pm

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Last edited by Big Shrimpin on Sat Jul 31, 2010 9:55 am, edited 1 time in total.

09042014
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Re: Patent Bar for 1L SA?

Postby 09042014 » Tue May 25, 2010 4:24 pm

Big Shrimpin wrote:Lol.

I know nothing about 1L summer employment at patent firms. I would assume that competition for those gigs is quite fierce--even amongst the t14. But as echoed from TLS, the first summer job probably won't make or break your career (but prestige and $$$ is always #1 on most people's list, so obviously shoot for that because who doesn't like boats and hoes).

From a post-1L perspective:

As I'm sure you're well aware, if you want litigation there is usually no USPTO admission requirement unless a firm wants their associates doing a mix of lit/pros (not sure how prevalent this is, however). I passed the exam before 1L, at at least from my experience (getting off a waitlist at a school that should've flatly rejected me) it shows that you're adamant about patent law and at least willing to be open to prosecution if need be. But again, if you definitely don't want to do prosecution then I would say don't waste your time.

On the other hand, I just did the loyola patent interviewing program (bidding process only, so far). Some employers required USPTO admission eligibility (which you've got), and some did not. Does that mean that some firms hiring associates into litigation don't care at all about whether the associate might eventually get registered? Maybe. But it might also mean that some firms like associates to do a mix of lit/pros, at least initially. Or, it might mean that you pigeonhole yourself.

In sum, 1L firm hiring is going to work on first semester grades (usually, or at least in my experience). Do very well first semester. Will the USPTO reg. # help? Maybe (refer to analysis above), but it certainly won't write you a ticket to that 1L job.


I heard good things about EE's at T14's (speficially all the EE's got 1L paid work at NU, but I'm not sure how much of an exaggeration it is), which surprised me, since I can't figure the reason firms even hire for 1L summer. Before ASW, I didn't think it was a realistic goal.

Yea I know it won't write a ticket, I'm more concerned if it will help even slightly.

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Big Shrimpin
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Re: Patent Bar for 1L SA?

Postby Big Shrimpin » Tue May 25, 2010 4:32 pm

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Last edited by Big Shrimpin on Mon Jul 19, 2010 2:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Janus
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Re: Patent Bar for 1L SA?

Postby Janus » Tue May 25, 2010 4:38 pm

Big Shrimpin wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:I'm going to be going to Northwestern next year, I have a BSEE from a good school with poor grades, 2.8. I've got two years of weak job experience.

I'm not totally sure what I want to do, but I'd be interested at Patent Litigation at a big firm.

However, I've been told that EE's at t14, did well last year with 1L employment at firms with patent departments.

Should I take the patent bar purely to help with my shot at a 1L SA? Will it help at all? I have time to study, but it costs 600 dollars, that I'll just end up paying 8% interest on for years.


Lol.

Disclaimer: I did not apply for a 1L summer gig with a patent firm. I would assume that competition for those gigs is quite fierce--even amongst the t14. But as echoed from TLS, the first summer job probably won't make or break your career (but prestige and $$$ is always #1 on most people's list, so obviously shoot for that because who doesn't like boats and hoes).

From a post-1L perspective:

As I'm sure you're well aware, if you want litigation there is usually no USPTO admission requirement unless a firm wants their associates doing a mix of lit/pros (not sure how prevalent this is, however). I passed the exam before 1L, and at at least from my experience (getting off a waitlist at a school that should've flatly rejected me) it shows that you're adamant about patent law and at least willing to be open to prosecution if need be. Nevertheless, if you definitely don't want to do prosecution then I would say don't waste your time.

On the other hand, I just did the loyola patent interviewing program (bidding process for about 100 employers). I'm sure it will pall in comparison to the sweetness that is NU 1L OCI, but it could be an instructive data point. Some employers required USPTO admission eligibility (which you've got), and some did not. Does that mean that some firms hiring associates into litigation don't care at all about whether the associate might eventually get registered? Maybe. But it might also mean that some firms like associates to do a mix of lit/pros, at least initially. Or, it might mean that you pigeonhole yourself.

In sum, 1L firm hiring is going to work on first semester grades (usually, or at least in my experience). Do very well first semester. Will the USPTO reg. # help? Maybe (refer to analysis above), but it certainly won't write you a ticket to that 1L job.

edit: some things i forgot to add



Would it be a waste of my time to take another physics course so that I could qualify under route B? That's the impression I got from various forums. I've got a minor in physics now (20 credits and all the credits would have qualified as credits for the BS in Physics).

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Big Shrimpin
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Re: Patent Bar for 1L SA?

Postby Big Shrimpin » Tue May 25, 2010 5:38 pm

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Last edited by Big Shrimpin on Sat Jul 31, 2010 9:54 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Patent Bar for 1L SA?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue May 25, 2010 6:52 pm

Desert Fox wrote:
Big Shrimpin wrote:Lol.

I know nothing about 1L summer employment at patent firms. I would assume that competition for those gigs is quite fierce--even amongst the t14. But as echoed from TLS, the first summer job probably won't make or break your career (but prestige and $$$ is always #1 on most people's list, so obviously shoot for that because who doesn't like boats and hoes).

From a post-1L perspective:

As I'm sure you're well aware, if you want litigation there is usually no USPTO admission requirement unless a firm wants their associates doing a mix of lit/pros (not sure how prevalent this is, however). I passed the exam before 1L, at at least from my experience (getting off a waitlist at a school that should've flatly rejected me) it shows that you're adamant about patent law and at least willing to be open to prosecution if need be. But again, if you definitely don't want to do prosecution then I would say don't waste your time.

On the other hand, I just did the loyola patent interviewing program (bidding process only, so far). Some employers required USPTO admission eligibility (which you've got), and some did not. Does that mean that some firms hiring associates into litigation don't care at all about whether the associate might eventually get registered? Maybe. But it might also mean that some firms like associates to do a mix of lit/pros, at least initially. Or, it might mean that you pigeonhole yourself.

In sum, 1L firm hiring is going to work on first semester grades (usually, or at least in my experience). Do very well first semester. Will the USPTO reg. # help? Maybe (refer to analysis above), but it certainly won't write you a ticket to that 1L job.


I heard good things about EE's at T14's (speficially all the EE's got 1L paid work at NU, but I'm not sure how much of an exaggeration it is), which surprised me, since I can't figure the reason firms even hire for 1L summer. Before ASW, I didn't think it was a realistic goal.

Yea I know it won't write a ticket, I'm more concerned if it will help even slightly.


It's an exaggeration. I know well credentialed engineers and/or those with science backgrounds who struck out up and down the T14. My personal sample of well credentialed (in terms of UG, UG grades, law school, and law school grades) IP types had more people fail to get 1L SA positions than succeed.

A lot of the hype with respect to IP 1L jobs comes from the fact that they exist at all, not that they are common.

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wiseowl
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Re: Patent Bar for 1L SA?

Postby wiseowl » Wed May 26, 2010 9:46 am

at my school, people had better luck with university tech transfer type jobs and industry positions than firms. people with the patent bar struck out, and people without it got firm jobs.

i would do it more because you've got time than because it will help.

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Re: Patent Bar for 1L SA?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed May 26, 2010 12:17 pm

wiseowl wrote:at my school, people had better luck with university tech transfer type jobs and industry positions than firms. people with the patent bar struck out, and people without it got firm jobs.

i would do it more because you've got time than because it will help.


Did you mean to write that the other way around?

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wiseowl
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Re: Patent Bar for 1L SA?

Postby wiseowl » Wed May 26, 2010 1:23 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
wiseowl wrote:at my school, people had better luck with university tech transfer type jobs and industry positions than firms. people with the patent bar struck out, and people without it got firm jobs.

i would do it more because you've got time than because it will help.


Did you mean to write that the other way around?


nope. it is correct as written.

i intended it as anecdotal evidence that if it helps, it only helps a little bit.

"struck out" is too strong, as everyone i know is at least doing something this summer, but the patent bar is in no way a ticket to a $3000/wk 1L SA.




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