t4 --> fed clerkship --> biglaw?

(On Campus Interviews, Summer Associate positions, Firm Reviews, Tips, ...)
Forum rules
Anonymous Posting

Anonymous posting is only appropriate when you are revealing sensitive employment related information about a firm, job, etc. You may anonymously respond on topic to these threads. Unacceptable uses include: harassing another user, joking around, testing the feature, or other things that are more appropriate in the lounge.

Failure to follow these rules will get you outed, warned, or banned.
Anonymous User
Posts: 273256
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

t4 --> fed clerkship --> biglaw?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Feb 17, 2010 9:01 pm

I interviewed with a law clerk for a federal district court on Monday for a judicial internship, and apparently he went to a really shitty t4. Obviously this doesn't apply in the current economy, but would it have technically have been possible in a better economy to attend a t4 (one that would have left you with no shot at biglaw no matter what your grades are), do a federal clerkship (in a secondary market), and then go into biglaw in a major market? ... If this works, it seems like a genius plan for someone in c/o 2008 (or someone entering law school a couple years from now) because this dude could have technically left law school completely debt-free, spent a year clerking for a federal judge, and then ended up in the same place as a Penn grad.

User avatar
Cleareyes
Posts: 408
Joined: Thu Feb 19, 2009 5:59 pm

Re: t4 --> fed clerkship --> biglaw?

Postby Cleareyes » Wed Feb 17, 2010 9:03 pm

Anything is technically possible. Students from low ranked schools DO sometimes clerk for the supreme court. As for it being a good plan...umm..there's possibility and there's probability. It's generally not a good idea to PLAN on hitting the lotto.

transferornot?
Posts: 1
Joined: Mon Jun 29, 2009 8:44 am

Re: t4 --> fed clerkship --> biglaw?

Postby transferornot? » Wed Feb 17, 2010 9:14 pm

Cleareyes wrote:Anything is technically possible. Students from low ranked schools DO sometimes clerk for the supreme court. As for it being a good plan...umm..there's possibility and there's probability.


Wow, I didn't know that.

Cleareyes wrote: It's generally not a good idea to PLAN on hitting the lotto.


Yeah, but what if the lottery ticket was free? If you lose, you lose nothing (as oppose to the Penn student who spends $200K to attend Penn, and strikes out at OCI).

Anonymous User
Posts: 273256
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: t4 --> fed clerkship --> biglaw?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Feb 17, 2010 9:20 pm

transferornot? wrote:
Cleareyes wrote:Anything is technically possible. Students from low ranked schools DO sometimes clerk for the supreme court. As for it being a good plan...umm..there's possibility and there's probability.


Wow, I didn't know that.

Cleareyes wrote: It's generally not a good idea to PLAN on hitting the lotto.


Yeah, but what if the lottery ticket was free? If you lose, you lose nothing (as oppose to the Penn student who spends $200K to attend Penn, and strikes out at OCI).



well then you have to consider all the penn students that have great jobs and are extremely happy with what they are doing.

User avatar
Cleareyes
Posts: 408
Joined: Thu Feb 19, 2009 5:59 pm

Re: t4 --> fed clerkship --> biglaw?

Postby Cleareyes » Wed Feb 17, 2010 9:39 pm

transferornot? wrote:
Cleareyes wrote:Anything is technically possible. Students from low ranked schools DO sometimes clerk for the supreme court. As for it being a good plan...umm..there's possibility and there's probability.


Wow, I didn't know that.

Cleareyes wrote: It's generally not a good idea to PLAN on hitting the lotto.


Yeah, but what if the lottery ticket was free? If you lose, you lose nothing (as oppose to the Penn student who spends $200K to attend Penn, and strikes out at OCI).


You lose 3 years of your life and probably have to at least pay for living expenses.

Renzo
Posts: 4265
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2008 3:23 am

Re: t4 --> fed clerkship --> biglaw?

Postby Renzo » Wed Feb 17, 2010 10:45 pm

ITT: People rediscover the concept of "expected value"

User avatar
RVP11
Posts: 2774
Joined: Tue Nov 06, 2007 6:32 pm

Re: t4 --> fed clerkship --> biglaw?

Postby RVP11 » Wed Feb 17, 2010 10:50 pm

Yet another thread in which someone wants to know if there is a backdoor to BigLaw so they can avoid all the annoyance and trouble of going to a good law school or getting good grades.

There is no backdoor.

User avatar
MeTalkPrettyOneDay
Posts: 196
Joined: Mon Mar 09, 2009 6:42 pm

Re: t4 --> fed clerkship --> biglaw?

Postby MeTalkPrettyOneDay » Wed Feb 17, 2010 11:40 pm

Renzo wrote:ITT: People rediscover the concept of "expected value"
And opportunity cost :D

Re:
transferornot? wrote:Yeah, but what if the lottery ticket was free? If you lose, you lose nothing (as oppose to the Penn student who spends $200K to attend Penn, and strikes out at OCI).

User avatar
nealric
Posts: 2391
Joined: Fri Sep 25, 2009 9:53 am

Re: t4 --> fed clerkship --> biglaw?

Postby nealric » Thu Feb 18, 2010 12:25 pm

I interviewed with a law clerk for a federal district court on Monday for a judicial internship, and apparently he went to a really shitty t4. Obviously this doesn't apply in the current economy, but would it have technically have been possible in a better economy to attend a t4 (one that would have left you with no shot at biglaw no matter what your grades are), do a federal clerkship (in a secondary market), and then go into biglaw in a major market? ... If this works, it seems like a genius plan for someone in c/o 2008 (or someone entering law school a couple years from now) because this dude could have technically left law school completely debt-free, spent a year clerking for a federal judge, and then ended up in the same place as a Penn grad.


As said before, it's theoretically possible, but extremely improbable. First, it's very rare to get a federal clerkship from a T4. To the extend that it happens, it's usually one of the top 5 people (not percent) in the class. That alone would make biglaw a possibility in a good economy. If by some miracle you did get a federal clerkship in a secondary market without outstanding grades, that wouldn't necessarily be a ticket into biglaw. Not all federal clerks get biglaw offers ITE.

It's certainly not something you could realistically plan to do in advance.

User avatar
samiseaborn
Posts: 269
Joined: Tue Aug 25, 2009 9:55 pm

Re: t4 --> fed clerkship --> biglaw?

Postby samiseaborn » Thu Feb 18, 2010 1:10 pm

Did you ask the clerk who they were sleeping with? Or which member of their family was 'old friends' with the judge?

User avatar
underachiever
Posts: 401
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2007 6:09 pm

Re: t4 --> fed clerkship --> biglaw?

Postby underachiever » Thu Feb 18, 2010 1:12 pm

Hey OP lets lay off Penn...the generic T14 will do

absworkoutplan
Posts: 24
Joined: Wed Oct 29, 2008 1:05 pm

Re: t4 --> fed clerkship --> biglaw?

Postby absworkoutplan » Thu Feb 18, 2010 2:54 pm

LOL, what's wrong with Penn as an example? It seemed like an arbitrary choice on the poster's part...and probably pretty representative of the overall T14 as it's smack in the middle :lol: .

Anonymous User
Posts: 273256
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: t4 --> fed clerkship --> biglaw?

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Feb 18, 2010 8:10 pm

Cleareyes wrote:
transferornot? wrote:
Cleareyes wrote:Anything is technically possible. Students from low ranked schools DO sometimes clerk for the supreme court. As for it being a good plan...umm..there's possibility and there's probability.


Wow, I didn't know that.

Cleareyes wrote: It's generally not a good idea to PLAN on hitting the lotto.


Yeah, but what if the lottery ticket was free? If you lose, you lose nothing (as oppose to the Penn student who spends $200K to attend Penn, and strikes out at OCI).


You lose 3 years of your life and probably have to at least pay for living expenses.


Presumably if you have high enough numbers some t4 is going to want you enough to give you a living stipend (so no cost). What's 3 years of my life really worth (or to 95+% of law students)? I mean if you have a BA and your other options are either working retail or dining tables, it's not like the 3 years is a huge loss. In the end you still end up with a JD. From what looked at I really haven't seen many attorney positions for under $40K /year. So worst case scenario you would put in 3 years of your life and come out making $40K /year, which is way better then the alternative of dining tables or working retail (either option leaving you with well under $40k /year in income). Best case scenario you end up completely debt-free and making a boatload of money in biglaw. Either way, I think it's a win-win situation (unless you have some useful UG degree such as engineering), which is definitely not true for the Penn student (sorry underachiever) that blows $200K in borrowed money and strikes out at OCI.

Hell, if I had even known clerking for a federal judge was an option leaving a really low t4 when I started law school I would have hands down attended the school that the clerk I interviewed with did for free. And top 5 people really isn't anything very impressive at a lower ranked school. I mean I was top 5 people and I started at a school much better ranked then a t4.

User avatar
RVP11
Posts: 2774
Joined: Tue Nov 06, 2007 6:32 pm

Re: t4 --> fed clerkship --> biglaw?

Postby RVP11 » Thu Feb 18, 2010 8:29 pm

Anonymous User, your post assumes that you can get a job from a T4.

Renzo
Posts: 4265
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2008 3:23 am

Re: t4 --> fed clerkship --> biglaw?

Postby Renzo » Fri Feb 19, 2010 12:43 am

JSUVA2012 wrote:Anonymous User, your post assumes that you can get a job from a T4.

And that a loser who can't find a better job than working at Best Buy out of college could get a law job at all.

bigben
Posts: 703
Joined: Sat Sep 29, 2007 2:44 pm

Re: t4 --> fed clerkship --> biglaw?

Postby bigben » Fri Feb 19, 2010 2:01 pm

Renzo wrote:
JSUVA2012 wrote:Anonymous User, your post assumes that you can get a job from a T4.

And that a loser who can't find a better job than working at Best Buy out of college could get a law job at all.


Well this is silly. When it comes to getting a law job, it doesn't really matter if you got laid off from McDonald's and went on unemployment. All that really matters is your law school and your grades. Sorry if this shatters some illusion of superiority for you.

Anonymous User
Posts: 273256
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: t4 --> fed clerkship --> biglaw?

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Feb 19, 2010 2:12 pm

I know its only anecdotal, but i know somebody that:

T4 Valedictorian--->Federal Clerkship--->Now Looking for a job.




Return to “Legal Employment”

Who is online

The online users are hidden on this forum.