The lowest-ranked law schools in the US

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paratactical
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Re: www.Worst-Law-Schools.com

Postby paratactical » Tue Dec 15, 2009 2:25 pm

Haven't we had this thread all ready this week?

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Philo38
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Re: www.Worst-Law-Schools.com

Postby Philo38 » Tue Dec 15, 2009 2:26 pm

www.top-law-schools-in-our-hearts.com

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vanwinkle
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Re: www.Worst-Law-Schools.com

Postby vanwinkle » Tue Dec 15, 2009 2:27 pm

davidicus wrote:There's question that still lingers in my mind - and perhaps this is part of the reason the OP posted this thread. With all of this information at our fingertips, why would someone choose to go to one of these schools? I'm not trying to insult anyone who goes there, just really trying to understand their motivation given the schools' reputations.


There's a difference between information on a particular institution being available and an understanding of that information being grasped by people.

There are people out there who think a law degree in general is a gateway to hopes and dreams, and that anyone who starts really negative talk toward them is just a naysayer who deserves to be shut out. All the information in the world won't help someone who isn't willing to receive it.

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Philo38
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Re: www.Worst-Law-Schools.com

Postby Philo38 » Tue Dec 15, 2009 2:27 pm

paratactical wrote:Haven't we had this thread all ready this week?


What on earth is your avatar? And what happened to the breasts?

acdisagod
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Re: www.Worst-Law-Schools.com

Postby acdisagod » Tue Dec 15, 2009 2:27 pm

It's actually interesting how competitive these "worst law schools" are. Median gpa's of around 3.0 would put about half my undergaduate school below their median.
Last edited by acdisagod on Tue Dec 15, 2009 2:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Burger in a can
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Re: www.Worst-Law-Schools.com

Postby Burger in a can » Tue Dec 15, 2009 2:27 pm

rondemarino wrote:
Burger in a can wrote:How did I go out of my way to make fun of those schools? What makes you think that I think any of this is humorous?


The title?

But, the truth is hilarious and people can deal with it.


I "went out of my way" to make fun of these schools by titling this thread http://www.Worst-Law-Schools.com? In all honesty, that wasn't supposed to be funny. That title was supposed to reference the idea that we always talk about the rankings for the best schools here, and I was going to talk about the rankings for the worst. How is that mocking?

If U.S. News DID rank the 4th tier, and referred to the bottom 5 as the worst, would they be "going out of their way to make fun of those schools"?

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paratactical
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Re: www.Worst-Law-Schools.com

Postby paratactical » Tue Dec 15, 2009 2:28 pm

Philo38 wrote:
paratactical wrote:Haven't we had this thread all ready this week?


What on earth is your avatar? And what happened to the breasts?


broken_image

Meh. I put them away for a while.

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dresden doll
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Re: www.Worst-Law-Schools.com

Postby dresden doll » Tue Dec 15, 2009 2:28 pm

Burger in a can wrote:
mpasi wrote:^The only thing wrong with this thread is that you didn't take into account that some students at those schools might be on TLS. :D


I would assume that if they are, they are already pretty aware of where their school stands in these rankings.

Why is this cold, real DATA so offensive? Why does it seem like people are upset that I posted some true information about law schools on a law school discussion board?


It's not offensive. People are just whining.

Burger in a can
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Re: www.Worst-Law-Schools.com

Postby Burger in a can » Tue Dec 15, 2009 2:29 pm

paratactical wrote:Haven't we had this thread all ready this week?


Which one? Sorry if I am being redundant.

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Philo38
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Re: www.Worst-Law-Schools.com

Postby Philo38 » Tue Dec 15, 2009 2:30 pm

vanwinkle wrote:
davidicus wrote:There's question that still lingers in my mind - and perhaps this is part of the reason the OP posted this thread. With all of this information at our fingertips, why would someone choose to go to one of these schools? I'm not trying to insult anyone who goes there, just really trying to understand their motivation given the schools' reputations.


There's a difference between information on a particular institution being available and an understanding of that information being grasped by people.

There are people out there who think a law degree in general is a gateway to hopes and dreams, and that anyone who starts really negative talk toward them is just a naysayer who deserves to be shut out. All the information in the world won't help someone who isn't willing to receive it.


I agree with this. Also, terrible schools aren't a total toilet . . . a few people from really really crppy schools get jobs and I think people see that and say, "if they can, I can"

Also, it doesn't help that these schools blatently mislead people, do you know how many email I have received from less than savory law schools bragging about thier amazing job rates? Hell, Cooley outright tricks people into thinking they are an elite school . . . At least part of the reason people go to these schools is because they are easily mislead, but mislead non the less.

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paratactical
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Re: www.Worst-Law-Schools.com

Postby paratactical » Tue Dec 15, 2009 2:31 pm

Burger in a can wrote:
paratactical wrote:Haven't we had this thread all ready this week?


Which one? Sorry if I am being redundant.


It's just a pretty consistent conversation here--sometimes it's Mediocre-Law-Schools.com, other times it's TTT-Law-Schools.com or what hav eyou.

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Philo38
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Re: www.Worst-Law-Schools.com

Postby Philo38 » Tue Dec 15, 2009 2:31 pm

paratactical wrote:
Philo38 wrote:
paratactical wrote:Haven't we had this thread all ready this week?


What on earth is your avatar? And what happened to the breasts?


broken_image

Meh. I put them away for a while.


Oh I didn't see the egg shell. Wowsa.

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davidicus
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Re: www.Worst-Law-Schools.com

Postby davidicus » Tue Dec 15, 2009 2:33 pm

Philo38 wrote:
vanwinkle wrote:
davidicus wrote:There's question that still lingers in my mind - and perhaps this is part of the reason the OP posted this thread. With all of this information at our fingertips, why would someone choose to go to one of these schools? I'm not trying to insult anyone who goes there, just really trying to understand their motivation given the schools' reputations.


There's a difference between information on a particular institution being available and an understanding of that information being grasped by people.

There are people out there who think a law degree in general is a gateway to hopes and dreams, and that anyone who starts really negative talk toward them is just a naysayer who deserves to be shut out. All the information in the world won't help someone who isn't willing to receive it.


I agree with this. Also, terrible schools aren't a total toilet . . . a few people from really really crppy schools get jobs and I think people see that and say, "if they can, I can"

Also, it doesn't help that these schools blatently mislead people, do you know how many email I have received from less than savory law schools bragging about thier amazing job rates? Hell, Cooley outright tricks people into thinking they are an elite school . . . At least part of the reason people go to these schools is because they are easily mislead, but mislead non the less.


What kind of person drops $100k on something without doing any real research?

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Cavalier
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Re: www.Worst-Law-Schools.com

Postby Cavalier » Tue Dec 15, 2009 2:33 pm

LSAT 75%
1. Southern University- 149

So basically 3/4 of the class is one step above being braindead.

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Philo38
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Re: www.Worst-Law-Schools.com

Postby Philo38 » Tue Dec 15, 2009 2:34 pm

Another reason is lay prestige. You can tell peple you have a law degree, that is worth something to some people. My girlfriend's uncle is going through Nashville School of Law night classes and the whole family COULD NOT be prouder of him. To them it is an amazing law school.

I really really really wanted to burst thier bubble . . . but didn't.
Last edited by Philo38 on Tue Dec 15, 2009 2:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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vanwinkle
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Re: www.Worst-Law-Schools.com

Postby vanwinkle » Tue Dec 15, 2009 2:34 pm

davidicus wrote:What kind of person drops $100k on something without doing any real research?


A Cooley Law student?

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Philo38
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Re: www.Worst-Law-Schools.com

Postby Philo38 » Tue Dec 15, 2009 2:37 pm

davidicus wrote:
Philo38 wrote:
vanwinkle wrote:
davidicus wrote:There's question that still lingers in my mind - and perhaps this is part of the reason the OP posted this thread. With all of this information at our fingertips, why would someone choose to go to one of these schools? I'm not trying to insult anyone who goes there, just really trying to understand their motivation given the schools' reputations.


There's a difference between information on a particular institution being available and an understanding of that information being grasped by people.

There are people out there who think a law degree in general is a gateway to hopes and dreams, and that anyone who starts really negative talk toward them is just a naysayer who deserves to be shut out. All the information in the world won't help someone who isn't willing to receive it.


I agree with this. Also, terrible schools aren't a total toilet . . . a few people from really really crppy schools get jobs and I think people see that and say, "if they can, I can"

Also, it doesn't help that these schools blatently mislead people, do you know how many email I have received from less than savory law schools bragging about thier amazing job rates? Hell, Cooley outright tricks people into thinking they are an elite school . . . At least part of the reason people go to these schools is because they are easily mislead, but mislead non the less.


What kind of person drops $100k on something without doing any real research?


Like I said, they are easily mislead. Cooley sends them a very shiny packet pull of fancy lawyer jobs and high rankings and they go. I'm not saying it isn't totally still thier fault for not researching it, I'm just saying it is a factor.

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Philo38
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Re: www.Worst-Law-Schools.com

Postby Philo38 » Tue Dec 15, 2009 2:39 pm

Cavalier wrote:
LSAT 75%
1. Southern University- 149

So basically 3/4 of the class is one step above being braindead.


What blows my mind is that they can still manage to get people from amazing law schools to teach there. Even the terrible schools can have a staff with an impressive pedigree.

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dresden doll
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Re: www.Worst-Law-Schools.com

Postby dresden doll » Tue Dec 15, 2009 2:41 pm

Philo38 wrote:
Cavalier wrote:
LSAT 75%
1. Southern University- 149

So basically 3/4 of the class is one step above being braindead.


What blows my mind is that they can still manage to get people from amazing law schools to teach there. Even the terrible schools can have a staff with an impressive pedigree.


Academic market. It's glutted.

Para, I adore your tar.

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MURPH
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Re: www.Worst-Law-Schools.com

Postby MURPH » Tue Dec 15, 2009 3:01 pm

maybe the OP didn't mean to be derisive when he posted this but I did when I replied. I certainly am not poking fun at the poor students who got suckered into going to Ave Maria but the owners/founder and administration of that school deserves to be ridiculed. A pizza delivery boy with almost no college education is attempting to not only create a law school but to build a small theocracy in the town in which the law school resides.

What they envisioned was an old-fashioned company town with a theocratic twist. Monaghan and Barron Collier would own everything from the local utility company to the building supply that provided concrete for wells and foundations. But the most startling part of the whole arrangement was the plan for governing the community. In Florida, developers can petition to act as the local government for a number of years while a development is under construction. Monaghan and Barron Collier began pushing the Florida state legislature to pass a law that would allow them to control the local government in perpetuity—and, according to an investigation by the Naples Daily News, they eventually succeeded. While their powers were technically limited when it came to regulating behavior, they clearly intended to keep a tight grip on community life. The original letter of intent between Barron Collier and Monaghan said the town would “allow no public activities which are offensive to traditional Christian values or which might represent a scandal to Catholic and Christian sensibilities. Thus, no topless bars, abortion clinics, ‘adult’ bookstores or the like shall be permitted.”

The thing is this school had potential just a few years ago. It had a 100% bar passage rate less than a decade ago. BUt the screwy people that run the place decided they would rather fight amongst themselves than maintain a decent school. So they bet everything on the Florida real estate market and uprooted the campus.

One current professor told me, “Our student body now is one of the four or five worst in America.” The instability has also wreaked havoc on the school’s reputation: in the 2009 U.S. News & World Report law school rankings, Ave Maria tied for last place in the peer-assessment category, the most important measure in determining a school’s standing. (The school was not officially ranked because U.S. News doesn’t rank schools that land in the bottom tier.) Meanwhile, there are signs that Monaghan’s foundation, which funds the law school and the university, is on the verge of running out of money, in part because Monaghan bet his fortune—and the future of his nonprofits—on the now-crumbling Florida real estate market

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Philo38
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Re: www.Worst-Law-Schools.com

Postby Philo38 » Tue Dec 15, 2009 3:06 pm

MURPH wrote:maybe the OP didn't mean to be derisive when he posted this but I did when I replied. I certainly am not poking fun at the poor students who got suckered into going to Ave Maria but the owners/founder and administration of that school deserves to be ridiculed. A pizza delivery boy with almost no college education is attempting to not only create a law school but to build a small theocracy in the town in which the law school resides.

What they envisioned was an old-fashioned company town with a theocratic twist. Monaghan and Barron Collier would own everything from the local utility company to the building supply that provided concrete for wells and foundations. But the most startling part of the whole arrangement was the plan for governing the community. In Florida, developers can petition to act as the local government for a number of years while a development is under construction. Monaghan and Barron Collier began pushing the Florida state legislature to pass a law that would allow them to control the local government in perpetuity—and, according to an investigation by the Naples Daily News, they eventually succeeded. While their powers were technically limited when it came to regulating behavior, they clearly intended to keep a tight grip on community life. The original letter of intent between Barron Collier and Monaghan said the town would “allow no public activities which are offensive to traditional Christian values or which might represent a scandal to Catholic and Christian sensibilities. Thus, no topless bars, abortion clinics, ‘adult’ bookstores or the like shall be permitted.”

The thing is this school had potential just a few years ago. It had a 100% bar passage rate less than a decade ago. BUt the screwy people that run the place decided they would rather fight amongst themselves than maintain a decent school. So they bet everything on the Florida real estate market and uprooted the campus.

One current professor told me, “Our student body now is one of the four or five worst in America.” The instability has also wreaked havoc on the school’s reputation: in the 2009 U.S. News & World Report law school rankings, Ave Maria tied for last place in the peer-assessment category, the most important measure in determining a school’s standing. (The school was not officially ranked because U.S. News doesn’t rank schools that land in the bottom tier.) Meanwhile, there are signs that Monaghan’s foundation, which funds the law school and the university, is on the verge of running out of money, in part because Monaghan bet his fortune—and the future of his nonprofits—on the now-crumbling Florida real estate market


Its too bad Patrick Swayze is dead; it sounds like they need Dalton to show up and straighten some things out.

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rondemarino
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Re: www.Worst-Law-Schools.com

Postby rondemarino » Tue Dec 15, 2009 3:11 pm

Dominos Pizza University of Ann Arbor in Naples, Florida, FTW!

goodolgil
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Re: www.Worst-Law-Schools.com

Postby goodolgil » Tue Dec 15, 2009 3:54 pm

rondemarino wrote:Dominos Pizza University of Ann Arbor in Naples, Florida, FTW!


Can you check the status of the school relocation on the the Domino's Pizza Tracker?

Burger in a can
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Re: www.Worst-Law-Schools.com

Postby Burger in a can » Tue Dec 15, 2009 4:24 pm

MURPH wrote:maybe the OP didn't mean to be derisive when he posted this but I did when I replied. I certainly am not poking fun at the poor students who got suckered into going to Ave Maria but the owners/founder and administration of that school deserves to be ridiculed. A pizza delivery boy with almost no college education is attempting to not only create a law school but to build a small theocracy in the town in which the law school resides.

What they envisioned was an old-fashioned company town with a theocratic twist. Monaghan and Barron Collier would own everything from the local utility company to the building supply that provided concrete for wells and foundations. But the most startling part of the whole arrangement was the plan for governing the community. In Florida, developers can petition to act as the local government for a number of years while a development is under construction. Monaghan and Barron Collier began pushing the Florida state legislature to pass a law that would allow them to control the local government in perpetuity—and, according to an investigation by the Naples Daily News, they eventually succeeded. While their powers were technically limited when it came to regulating behavior, they clearly intended to keep a tight grip on community life. The original letter of intent between Barron Collier and Monaghan said the town would “allow no public activities which are offensive to traditional Christian values or which might represent a scandal to Catholic and Christian sensibilities. Thus, no topless bars, abortion clinics, ‘adult’ bookstores or the like shall be permitted.”

The thing is this school had potential just a few years ago. It had a 100% bar passage rate less than a decade ago. BUt the screwy people that run the place decided they would rather fight amongst themselves than maintain a decent school. So they bet everything on the Florida real estate market and uprooted the campus.

One current professor told me, “Our student body now is one of the four or five worst in America.” The instability has also wreaked havoc on the school’s reputation: in the 2009 U.S. News & World Report law school rankings, Ave Maria tied for last place in the peer-assessment category, the most important measure in determining a school’s standing. (The school was not officially ranked because U.S. News doesn’t rank schools that land in the bottom tier.) Meanwhile, there are signs that Monaghan’s foundation, which funds the law school and the university, is on the verge of running out of money, in part because Monaghan bet his fortune—and the future of his nonprofits—on the now-crumbling Florida real estate market


Yeah, thanks for posting that. It was fascinating, and also made me queasy. I felt awful for the faculty who tried to weather their move to Florida, and even worse for the batch of students who signed up to attend a really promising school, and then watched the whole thing fall apart in front of their eyes. The article is definitely not very objective in tone, but it certainly sounds like Monaghan is not a very stand-up guy, to say the least.

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IHaveDietMoxie
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Re: www.Worst-Law-Schools.com

Postby IHaveDietMoxie » Tue Dec 15, 2009 4:32 pm

MURPH wrote:The thing is this school had potential just a few years ago. It had a 100% bar passage rate less than a decade ago. BUt the screwy people that run the place decided they would rather fight amongst themselves than maintain a decent school. So they bet everything on the Florida real estate market and uprooted the campus.


That was a really interesting story.
I think a lot of small business is done this way in the south...control the shit out of everything, assuming that it's a zero sum game, etc. It is interesting that it was at first seen as a challenger to UM, and is now in what used to be a nursing home...


ps OP the thread in itself is not particularly derisive, but when you call it "worst-law-schools.com" you're being juvenile and cruel.
I guarantee you some perfectly normal people just assume that the closest law school that is accredited is fine for their purposes because they have ties to the area, are short on money, debt averse, etc.
Yea some don't do their research and its good to have the info on the forums in case they are interested, but don't rub feces in their face, nobody needs that.




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